CFP 2002 Wrapup

Roger Clarke is an computer scientist who attends many of the CFP conferences, and more importantly for our purposes, takes notes. His notes for this year's conference make good reading and cover a wide variety of issues that Slashdot touches upon. Privacy, biometrics, domain names, the digital divide, intellectual property, it's all here. NTK this week has a nice quip on the conference: "And the more the CFPers confer, the more they seemed to realise that Hollywood is going for the hat-trick: taking away freedom, privacy *and* computers. Pretty impressive. But only if they manage it."

Comments

first post?

[LighthouseJ]

probably not

Re:first post?

[Anonymous Coward]

i was about to ask the same thing

Re:first post?

[LighthouseJ]

Hey, what do you know, it's my first first post. I've broken my first-post cherry.

Firstey Postie

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't forget not to comment this week, folks!

You Win!

[Anonymous Coward]

Give this man a coupon for a free penis!

ATTN: MODERATORS, MOD THIS UP. TIA!!

[Anonymous Coward]

T(H)GSB [slashdot.org]

Last Chance to See! The final opportunity to discuss this before the lights go out [slashdot.org]

Questions? There are answers here! [slashdot.org]

Saved for posterity, from a discussion about the new subscription system:

... while I don't mean to dismiss the value
of comment posters, the percentage of readers
that read comments is small. Yes comments draw
readers, and keep them coming back. But half
of readers don't care! An accepted story
submission provides a benefit to hundreds
of thousands of Slashdot readers. A Score:3
comment is read by 1/50th of that. So if we
decide that an accepted story submission is
worth 1000 page views, you would need to post
perhaps 50 Score:3 comments to affect the
same number of people :)

A statistic in the hand of the ignorant is more dangerous than a gun in the hand of a child. Malda's dismissal of the importance of comments [slashdot.org] reflects on the inability of Slashdot's "editors" to understand the way communities work.

For the record, my feelings on the Slashdot Subscription Embroglio rests firmly in the uninterested. I have almost zero opinion on the final outcome of subscriptions. I love Slashdot, and will probably subscribe at some point to support the site, but the details are dull (to me).

Says Rob Malda, "... while I don't mean to dismiss the value of comment posters, the percentage of readers that read comments is small. Yes comments draw readers, and keep them coming back. But half
of readers don't care!" In that case, Slashdot would be much better served by dumping the flaky and irritating overhead of a DB server and filling the pipe with a longer "Favorites" list--which, essentially, is what Slashdot is once you strip away the comments and comment posters. This is where a meaningless SQL query puts dangerous statistics in the hand of the ignorant. If Malda thinks that he can divine real knowledge from a SELECT query, he is sadly mistaken. While I do not doubt the validity of the numbers, I seriously doubt the validity of his extrapolation of the data. The ebb and flow of a community cannot be read from the tea leaves of an Apache log file.

This easy dismissal of the value of the only providers of interesting and insightful content on Slashdot is offensive. Thus, I propose a small revolt. The (Hopefully) Great Slashdot Blackout.

T(H)GSB will be during the week of April 21 through April 27. Easy to remember, the full moon in April falls on the 27th. During that time, I will not be posting, nor will I click through to read the comments from the home page. I will become as Malda's idea of the typical Slashdot reader. I will provide no new content (neither comments, nor story submissions--although I'm not much of a story submitter).

During that week, I'd like to see if Malda sees Slashdot become a better place, or if it becomes the Hallowed Shrine of Troll. I'd like for the logs to be revisited and new queries run. And, I'd like for the "editors" to really see what the true value of Slashdot is--not the sum of click-throughs and page-views, but the sharing of knowledge and dissemination of information; the passing of experience from the more to the less.

This is where the (Hopefully) comes in. This is only meaningful if enough free content-providers (i.e., comment posters) agree to go along and participate. If there is only me and a handful of others who cease normal activities during that week, it will be pretty meaningless. Barely a dent will be made, and Malda and the other "editors" will never realize the incredible value they receive from comment posters.

To spread the word, I'm changing my sig to link to this journal entry. If you would like to help, you can link to this journal from your own sig, or you can simply resolve to enter into a voluntary one-week blackout. Pass the word. This will only work if a goodly number of comment posters participate.

To summarize, if you wish to participate, during the week of April 21 through April 27

• Do not click through from the home page to the comment page
• Do not post any comments to stories
• Do not submit new stories

A useful HTML link to this journal entry (69 characters, should fit in most sigs). You'll probably have to unfungle it after the lameness filter gets through with it:

<a href="http://slashdot.org/~rho/journal/5872">T( H)GSB</a> Apr 21-27

Last Chance to See! The final opportunity to discuss this before the lights go out [slashdot.org]

Questions? There are answers here! [slashdot.org]

Its cool that someone is doing this

[wrax]

Because if they wern't then we would all be in the dark about these issues.

Re:Its cool that someone is doing this

[Anonymous Coward]

sarcasm aside, it doesn't hurt that more and more people are getting involved in these issues and trying to push towards a better tommrow -- even though most people aren't really *doing* anything - just talking about it all...

_
WINDOWS USERS CLICK HERE!

Re:Its cool that someone is doing this

[artistlile]

I too am so glad to see that someone took some notes. Alot of good brainstorming and information sharing happens at this conference but it seems that little gets shared with the public which is sad.

One of the reasons I didn't attend was that there tends to be such a pessimistic air about issues discussed there. I know things can be bad but surely we can make them better!

In retrospective, I am sorry I didn't attend this year though. It's not good to just stick one's head in the sand and think that good things will just happen. And being a hacker/geek/artist type, the program just didn't grab my interest much. But I missed seeing friends there and getting the scoop on current issues which is something that generally happens outside of the program/talks.

The part on the DMCA seems important and I want to find out more about all the issues that surround it.

Thanks again to Roger for posting his notes. I really appreciate you taking the time and effort to share. It's acts like this that give me hope.

-lile

hacker artist
lile.com

Re:Its cool that someone is doing this

[Anonymous Coward]

GOD the visual design of YRO sucks almost as much a Jon Katz!!!!!!!!

HAHAHAHAHA!

[Anonymous Coward]

The Hopefully Great Slashdot Blackout is a completefailure!

HAHAHAHAHA!

I know!

[Joe the Lesser]

"Hollywood is going for the hat-trick: taking away freedom, privacy *and* computers"

They are so right. Like, Brad Pitt was just at my house, and he took my computer, installed video camaras, and enslaved my children!

He's so cute though...

Re:I know!

[trezor]

Ofcourse he was. But there's one thing I don't get. Maybe he explained this to you, and in that case you might inform me.

The MPAA and RIAA says we don't buy the product but a license to the use of the content. So we don't actually own it, we just own the right to use it, under their terms. Isnt that sweet? :)

Sweet because that would imply that if I loose a CD or a DVD that would mean I should get a new one for free, right? I mean, I got the right to view the content, right?

If I wasn't getting a new one for free, that would conclude I actually bought the product, not just a license to use it.

So in order for the MPAA and RIAA to validly claim that we only buy our license to view the content, any dealer would be obligated to give us a new copy for free, if we loose or damage ord CDs and DVDs, right? (And he should ofcourse be given a refund for the lost/faulty product)

I think this claim makes sense.

Re:I know!

[Nogami_Saeko]

Sure, but what they'd say is something to the effect of "the license fee is $0.01 - the other $14.99 is for media and shipping and handling".

But I tend to agree - if I purchase something, it's MINE, regardless of what the "license" says, and I can do what I want with it.

Re:I know!

[NoMoreNicksLeft]

In which case, instead of $1 billion of losses annually (or whatever it is they claim), it's more like $50 million worth of losses due to piracy?

They can't have it both ways.

CFP?

[Anonymous Coward]

Cunning First Post?!

Probably not. Anyway, check this beauty out!

I wish I could afford to buy that to my lair in the basement.

Need to do more than complain

[00_NOP]

Hackers/computer users need to remember that Hollywood and the entertainment industry employ thousands - if not millions - and generate huge revenues for the US. If we want to complain about the media industries taking away our freedoms then we have to have an alternative business plan that will assure John and Joanna Doe that we are not destroying their livlihood in the name of our freedom. For them, freedom from want and hunger is pretty important too.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Anonymous Coward]

You could have said the same thing about slave trade.

John and Joanna should have thought twice about working for an unethical entity.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[cduffy]

There's a demand for content, so the content creation industry will survive. As long as people (or hardware manufacturers, or someone) pays for content, there will be a content creation business. If that business doesn't look much like it does today, and some people lose their jobs in the transition (which is not to say that there are more jobs available in one form than another -- but transitions are always painful)... well, too effin' bad. It's not the job of Congress, the courts or anyone else to assure anyone a profit, simply because they've made one before. Would you complain about the livlihoods of buggy whip manufacturers and suggest that an alternate business model be found for them before the automobile could be sold? Would you moan about how many people are employed making buggy-whips, and how much revenue is to be lost? Because that's roughly what you're doing.

"Freedom from want" is not a freedom at all. "Freedom from want" means having something -- which (if you can't provide this "freedom" for yourself) means having something given to you, which means having someone else be forced to give you something. That's not any variety of the freedom I love. Anyhow, if John and Joanna can't keep their jobs making buggy whips, they can get new jobs building cars -- and if they're too inflexible to do that, screw 'em.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Hostile17]

For them, freedom from want and hunger is pretty important

This argument is Red Herring. Everytime some new technology comes out which allows consumers to duplicate content (radio, cassette tape, VCR) the content providers cry to the courts that this new technology will destroy thier business. The providers lost thier battles, and in fact the opposite happened, they made billions more dollars in the new markets. I don't see how it would be any different today.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[White Roses]

So very sorry, I wasn't aware that playing DVDs on my Linux box or copying CDs to my computer's hard drive were cutting in to their revenue stream. I mean, really, I thought purchasing their CDs and DVDs was helping them make money, not the other way around.

And don't we already have laws in place crimializing file sharing? Copyright laws? Funny, if they can't adequately prosecute people under the existing laws, that's their own fault, not the law's.

Frankly, it's not their content they're protecting, it's their outmoded business model. Their content is already protected by a myriad of laws. Yes, they need to make money, and yes, the artists need to have their work protected. But the current run of laws which are ostensibly for the latter, are really for the former, and make no mistake.

Allowing me to play DVDs on my system of choice, or copying my CDs to my computer for my personal convenience, while not my right per se, is actually in the best interest of the companies currently trying to outlaw such things, because it makes me more likely to puchase more of their product.

Region encoding and broken audio formats aren't protecting the artist from illegal copying. A bit-wise copy of some media on to other media can't be stopped, it simply has to be caught, which takes money and effort which the MPAA and RIAA aren't prepared to put forth, because laws are cheaper and require less effort to purchase. In any case, these two methods are merely for the protection of a business model. A bad business model, some may argue. The business model is dying, and rather than coming up with something else, the business is alienating it's customers with draconian tactics. Ultimately, these tactics will cut into their revenue far more than copyright infringements will. Selling one copy to an infringer is better than not selling any to people who despise you.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Anonymous Coward]

Not Exactly. They need to come up with an alternative business model that all ows them to take advantage of the medium. This does not mean they need to buy a stack of legislation and turn computers into TV 2.0. It is not our responsibility to make their money. They provide a product, and if we like it , we can buy it.
I worked for 4 years in the movie/tv business, and I guarantee that most of the people in that industry are perfectly capable of crossing over into other fields. Well, maybe not Actors, but the below the line technicians are some of the most resilient problem solvers I have every met.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Glytch]

Flash back a century. "Motor car owners need to remember that horse-buggy makers and the horse-buggy industry employ thousands - if not millions - and generate huge revenues for the US."

Or maybe a bit earlier? "Electric lightbulb users need to remember that oil-lamp makers and the oil lamp industry employ thousands - if not millions - and generate huge revenues for the US."

Get the picture yet?

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Liberal Mafia]

Let's keep in mind that John and Jane Doe support the entertainment industry with their purchases -- and that they will also be supporting it with their tax dollars if federal laws are used to prop up an industry that is becoming obsolete. They have the right to say "No".

No one concerned themselves with these alleged problems when the automobile destroyed the horse-and-buggy industry.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Anonymous Coward]

You have to keep in mind that freedom does not include job security. It isn't my responsibility to ensure that each company in the country does enough business to keep its employees on the payroll; that's the responsibility of each indivudual company. My right to transfer music to my computer to a CD precludes their job safety.

It may seem ludicrous at first, but apply it to some other examples. Should you be forced to give up other rights so that some people can stay employed?

Re:Need to do more than complain

[00_NOP]

This and all the other attacks on my original posting miss the point. Existing technologies - VCRs etc - were attacked by the industry and, yes, the industry had to learn to live with it.
But the difference this time is that hackers and users are demanding the right to copy these things for free and pass them on to whomever (see RMS's comments on MP3s in the O'Reilly Free as in freedom).
Who is going to make Star Wars if it is legal and moral for one person to buy the DVD and rip it and distribute it to all their friends?
As for the comment that legislators don't have a role in ensuring that any particular industry does or doesn't make a profit - who are you kidding? What are the laws on dumping all about then? And drugs? All drugs...
It's fair enough for the so-called libertarians to advocate anarchy but that is not the society that most people want to live in.
Oh, and by the way, if you were going hungry you'd pretty soon revise your view on what constituted freedom...

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Hostile17]

But the difference this time is that hackers and users are demanding the right to copy these things for free and pass them on to whomever (see RMS's comments on MP3s in the O'Reilly Free as in freedom).

This is not true, most of us are not advocating the elimination of copyright law. What we want is "Fair Use", there is a difference, although niether the RIAA nor MPAA seem to know it.

Who is going to make Star Wars if it is legal and moral for one person to buy the DVD and rip it and distribute it to all their friends?

This is exactly the argument made against radio, audio tapes and the VCR. None of that gloom and doom came true. Sure a few people did make copies of albums/movies and gave them to friends, but most people didn't. Most people legally bought and rented the content. Most people are honest and do the right thing.

Oh, and by the way, if you were going hungry you'd pretty soon revise your view on what constituted freedom...

This is a silly statement, if I were going hungry, I would not re-evaluate my definition of freedom, I'd get a job.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[NumberSyx]

If we want to complain about the media industries taking away our freedoms then we have to have an alternative business plan that will assure John and Joanna Doe that we are not destroying their livlihood in the name of our freedom.

Look at the Porno industry, they've made billions of dollars a year from the internet since the beginning. Heck there were BBS's making money on porno in the 80's. Thier secret is very simple, are you ready, here it is;

"Provide a good service or product for a fair price!"

I have to say though, it is not my job to come up with new and inovative ways for the media giants to make money. That is why all those CEO's make the big bucks. As we use to say in the Army "Lead, follow or get out of the way!". These people need to adapt to new technology, either by coming up with new ways to use it, or by copying another successful model. If they can't do this, then they don't deserve thier 7 figure income and if the Board of Directors keeps CEO's like this around, then the comapny deserves to die. This the nature of capitalism.

Re:Need to do more than complain

[Anonymous Coward]

The motion picture industry generates about $35 billion in US GDP annually (according to the Dept. of Commerce).

The information technology industry is worth ~$700 billion in GDP annually.

Which industry should we be more concerned about?

Re:Need to do more than complain

[stagmeister]

"Hackers/computer users need to remember that Hollywood and the entertainment industry employ thousands - if not millions - and generate huge revenues for the US."

The reason that they generate just so much $$ is because they have such a tight grip on intelectual property -- if they didn't have as much control over how music, movies, screenplays, books, etc. are used in other mediums (i.e. people quoting sections of books, using music as background for short films or commercials) then they would make 10% of the money that they currently do.

OH MAN!

[Burritos]

I just let loose a big giant load into my diaper!
Oh man I just took the largest piss ever into my diaper. Oh man damn I have a huge ass erection I think I'm just going to have to jack off to this CPF 2002 Wrapup immediately!!

Orwell Awards

[bmw]

Some of you may find this amusing. I discovered it at the bottom of the CFP 2002 notes. My personal favorite is John Ashcroft for Worst Public Official.

In other news, the Department of Redundancy Department has found Roger Clarke guilty of abusing title tags.

Re:Orwell Awards

[Anonymous Coward]

John Ashcroft should get some fat Arab cock stuffed up his puritan ass.

Hollywood's Hat Trick

[Devil's BSD]

And most people (of course, not us ./'ers) are going for it lock, stock, and barrel. Good thing this conference keeps us informed.

Lerning from Skylarov...

[martissimo]

Associated Events
EFF Pioneer Awards

Norwegian teenager, Jon Johansen, and Writers of DeCSS (which makes it possible to play encrypted DVD movies on a Linux machine). Because of the corporation-protective and person-abusive provisions of the DMCA Act, he was advised not to risk arrest by coming to the U.S. for the ceremony

guess the U.S will start having to ask for extradition on foreigners who seek to allow fair-use now.

Re:Lerning from Skylarov...

[56ker]

"he was advised not to risk arrest by coming to the U.S. for the ceremony" - if he had any sense he'd have worked that out for himself already without having to be told it.

I knew it!

[Sweet Buttery Anus]

Rob Malda: Sexual Harrasser

Re: I knew it!

[Anonymous Coward]

Aren't you the least bit concerned that you've given Mr. Malda the grounds for filing a libel lawsuit against you? I believe this clearly falls outside the realm of protected speech.

Re: I knew it!

[Sweet Buttery Anus]

He's a public figure and therefore parodies are fair game, stupid douchebag.

Re: I knew it!

[Capsaicin]

How is he a public figure?!

TGSB

[Anonymous Coward]

Please don't post before reading this

private identification

[mmphosis]

Here is an idea to create "private" identification cards. Using our computers, we often create certificates and awards of merit for people. I propose simply creating our own id cards for ourselves. These are not forgeries and they are not in anyway fraudulent because the identification cards we create are our own totally original works.

I know of someone who is without a valid drivers license because a certain government department requires a "breeder" card to issue a new drivers license. This person applied for the breeder card in the state of their birth where there is currently a strike by the government workers. The person is stuck because the state of their birth won't issue a birth certificate unless the person succumbs to a medical emergency in a foreign country. This person has had a warning and a US$70 fine for driving without a valid driver's license because of bureaucracy in this matter.

This person has decided to leave the State of Fear and take some responsibility and use some imagination and create their own driver's license. Of course, the Dept. of Motor Vehicles of various organizations will still have to approve such a card but in the meantime the "private" drivers license will be shown to interested law enforcement officers.

I invite the "many" lawyers to offer help in this matter.

Re:private identification

[NoMoreNicksLeft]

A breeder card? What, they insist he get a Heterosexual License?

Yeh, I show my Disneyworld Mickey License to cops that pull me over too. They laugh and chuckle, then tell me that if I don't waste any more time in handing over my REAL license, they won't penalize me for it.

National ID cards and credit cards?

[bmw]

Does this scare anyone else?

Proponents argue that digitizing the nation's social security card system to resemble a credit card system, and creating one national information database, are needed to protect against terrorism. Critics argue that such a tracking and/or monitoring system would violate the core freedoms of the nation's citizens and that what is needed is better procedures among agencies and standardization of data entry.

Our current system for credit cards is horribly insecure. A 12-15 year old child has no problem acquirring and using stolen credit cards. I know, because I used to be one of those children. Credit card fraud is remarkably easy. Combine this with the dangers of having an international database containing all this sensitive information and we have a serious threat on our hands. The risks involved here are astounding.

Shut up AC Fag!

[Dick Veiney]

motherfucking armchair lawyer, eat a dick.

Quote from the article

[crankyinmv]

Looks like it was a very interesting conference. One theme which especially disturbed me was the public/private partnerships involved (see the BCC section). A couple of scary examples from Florida would be its attempt to mine out its DMV records to marketers, and the use of subcontractors to "scrub" the voter roles for convicted felons (sorry, I have no specifics).

And now for the quote:

He was scathing about the claims of vendors of 100% accuracy, and of the ease with which John Cleese, in drag, had no difficulty getting through a facial recognition checkpoint.

I'm glad to see he's still getting work.

WAFFLES!

[Anonymous Coward]

Hi there. Today, I want to talk about a subject near and dear to all of our hearts.

WAFFLES.

There are many types of waffles. Some are belgian, some are fruity, some come from Waffle House and taste like baked shit. Some have sugar in them, but it's rumored that this is a European Communist Plot to make everybody fat. Some are "Eggos", which you are supposed to "Leggo". Some are cheap and generic, others cost upwards of a thousand dollars for a single helping. There are those you eat plain, and others go better with toppings, such as powdered sugar and Maple Syrup.

My favorite type of waffle is Belgian with fruit and stuff on top. Now that's a fucking good waffle. But there are other options... in fact, there's something for everyone!

Yes, waffles. A timeless American tradition.

WA-WA-WA-WAFFLES, EAT ONE TODAY!

This has been a presentation of the National Waffle Council.

The Ketchup Avisory Board. Garrison Keillor

[Anonymous Coward]

GK: .....brought to you by the Ketchup Advisory Board.

TR: These are the good years for Barb and me. I went on a new sleeping pill and now I don't wake up at midnight with grass stains on my pajamas. My neck pains went away when I started buying shirts with an 18 ½ inch collar. The guy whose cat died when she crawled down our dryer vent finally settled with our insurance company and stopped sending us hate letters. And Barb went on one of those TV reality shows in which you tell the most intimate details about your life and she won an all-expenses paid trip for two to the Pacacadawakahuhumama Hotel in Honolulu. We should've been happy. But the first night, I found her on the balcony looking out over the sea and sobbing quietly to herself. (SS SOFT WEEPING) Barb --- what's wrong, honey? It's paradise. We're supposed to be happy. .

SS: Oh, Jim. I feel so fat in that swimsuit.

TR: Oh------ you look okay.......

SS: You don't think I'm fat?

TR: (PAUSE ONE BEAT) No, not at all. Robust, yes. Not fat.

SS: I am fat, aren't I. I better go get myself a muu-muu. And go on a diet of taro roots.

TR: You look fine. Better than a lot of gals I saw out there today. But if you're self- conscious, maybe we should wait until after dark.

SS: I took off my towel and everyone looked away so fast you could hear their vertebrae snap. All those babes with the great tans and the tight butts and me and my saddlebags. I felt like a woolly mammoth in a herd of gazelles. And I should've expected it. My astrology forecast said, "People are looking at you and pointing."

TR: But usually those just say something like, "Enjoy your life and get more rest."

SS: Mine was very pointed. ----Do you realize I was the only woman at the luau whose grass skirt had an elastic waistband? Oh, Jim. I have to go on a diet. But it's so tough.

TR: Evidently, yes.

SS: My body and my fat seem like really good friends. And I'm worried about the side effects of diet pills. Hair loss, mood swings, violent flatulence ----

TR: I think what you really need is ... ketchup.

SS: Ketchup?

TR: Ketchup enhances any diet ?? without noxious emissions. And
ketchup has natural mellowing agents, so you'll be able to relax, and
realize that for a woman your age, you're still quite a looker.

SS: Oh, Jim, you smooth talker you.

RD: A day in the tropics, going scarfless and capless.
You and your true love and some friends from Minneapless.
Good things are flowing like ketchup on pineapples.

GK: Ketchup. For the good times.

© Garrison Keillor 2001

They know things we don't?!

[Anonymous Coward]

... legality of the many acts since 11 September 2002 ...

Uhm.

So, what is the alternative?

[KlomDark]

I, like most people, am totally against these new draconian methods being proposed to keep people from ripping and sharing digital music.

I don't think laws of this nature are the answer to this problem, and I don't think laws should be created simply to preserve a dinosaur business model.

I also don't think that the music companies are in any way fairly reimbursing the actual artists for their creations. I think the music companies are raking in far too much money for what they do, but that's debatable.

What I'd like to see is: What IS the alternative proposal from the technical people? Not saying that we have to keep the music publishers afloat. A new business model could simply be that the musicians directly distribute their music over the internet - you buy your music directly from them.

But, what keeps someone (besides personal honesty) from giving a copy to all their friends? I don't see a way. But it would really suck if even the actual musicians don't get paid for their work.

I don't have any ideas, does anyone else?

what they don't realize

[PaddyM]

is that I would rather they never produced music again (OMIGOSH), than take away my computer.

If the RIAA can't make any money in music, maybe they should STOP MAKING MUSIC! AND LEAVE ME ALONE. They should be paying me to store their crap on my hard drive. It's a seller's market in real estate, I hear.

And I enjoy music a lot. But not as much as reading this "great" site from MY own computer.

Bruce Sterling's speech from CFP 2002

[jonkl]

Sterling's speech is posted on the Viridian Design web site, specifically here.