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UK Home Office plan: ID Chips in Everything

LauraLolly writes "The BBC ran an article on how booksellers in the UK hope to use Radio Frequency ID chips to report on the entire life cycle of a book, including ownership and second-hand sales. There were throw-away lines about how the Home Office plans to use these chips in all goods, and their current use in U. S. libraries. And you thought that voluntary medical chips were bad..."

18 of 213 comments (clear)

  1. Buy your books... by danamania · · Score: 5, Funny

    Buy a book legitimately

    walk out of the shop

    take it home
    microwave it on high for 15 seconds

    enjoy :)

    a grrl & her server

    1. Re:Buy your books... by Alsee · · Score: 3, Funny

      Buy a book
      microwave it on high for 15 seconds


      Damn it! Now I have to go out and buy a new microwave.

      My course book Blasting and Demolition came packaged with sample materials.

      -

      --
      - - You can't take something off the Internet! That's like trying to take pee out of a swimming pool.
  2. Hmm by NiftyNews · · Score: 4, Funny

    They plan to put them in everything, eh?

    So where can I buy ID chips for my ID chips? "This ID chip belongs to NiftyNews, please don't spoof me."

  3. All goods by MarkusQ · · Score: 3, Funny
    ...Home Office plans to use these chips in all goods...

    That should be fun. Even assuming that "all goods" excludes things like food, there are still a wide range of products that I sure wouldn't want to track.

    --- MarkusQ

  4. Please, not more of this crap... by slipgun · · Score: 5, Informative

    The UK government already want to put something in your car which tracks your movements (and there is a camera system which more or less does just that on the M25). The police are already entitled to break up a meeting of more than three people on a whim (Prevention of Terrorism Act 2000). They can see what you are looking at on the net, they control who gets to own weapons (apart from criminals, of course). And now they want to control what books you can read. (No, I know that this article didn't mention that, but seriously, of course they're going to try and do it if they think they can). Blunkett is a dangerous man, and I am so afraid of what this government is trying to do that I am going to be voting for The Other Lot next time round.

    I am really starting to hate what this country is becoming. Is it any better over your side of the pond? Failing that, maybe it's time to move to the Far East...

    --
    SpamNet - a spam blocker that really works
  5. Re:What's up, doc? by Lemmy+Caution · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The real logic behind this, ultimately, will be to allow book publishers - and, ultimately, the producers of anything - to collect royalties for each resale. Mark my words, this is exactly what this is about.

  6. Actually I didn't think that by Henry+V+.009 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I didn't think that voluntary medical chips were that bad, actually. There are different reasons to give up privacy. We can give up privacy for commercial reasons (all the supermarkets nearby where I live issue frequent shopper cards so they can monitor everything I buy -- I hate it). We can give up privacy for law enforcement reasons (depends on how much you trust your government). And there are a myrid of other reasons we can give up privacy.

    I don't think that anything that encroaches on privacy is automatically bad. In fact, I'd have to say that encroachmetnts on privacy are only generally wrong because the possibility of demonstrable harm as a result of invasion of privacy can generally be shown to be a real possibility.

    In specific cases I can support a mass (usually voluntary) invasion of privacy.

    Police states are generally bad because of the baggage that comes along with them. Abuse of power, lack of freedoms, what not. They aren't bad because of the two words "police state".

    If technology has progressed far enough to give us the positives of very effective law enforcement and monitoring without the baggage, well more power to it! As a first step, I would support voluntarily allowing tracking systems to be implanted (or worn like ankle bracelets) for the purposes of more effective protection from murders and kidnappers and what not. I think that our government's legal systems -- though not nearly perfect -- have progressed far enough to permit systems like these to be used without bringing along the baggage of fascism and totalitarianism. There is no possibility that they would be 100% effective, but neither would they be ineffectual.

    1. Re:Actually I didn't think that by ciole · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If technology has progressed far enough to give us the positives of very effective law enforcement and monitoring without the baggage, well more power to it!

      Also being against murder, i can see where you're coming from. However, "very effective law enforcement" is bad to the extent that laws are poorly written, oppressive, or otherwise unjust. We need limited means of technological enforcement of crimes until the laws that define them are deserving of "very effective enforcement".

      There's a reason the abolition movement was closely tied with the (then illegal) Underground Railroad. If people-chipping tech had been available back then, social forces for change would have been greatly hampered. No Frederick Douglas, for example, whose freedom was a result of breaking an unjust law. Remember forced sterilization in VA? Japanese internment? This was all within the last hundred years - many people now living remember these things. i expect that the War on (Some) Drugs will come to be seen the same way. Technology in law enforcement is a major threat to our civil rights.

      Now, your post was pretty reasonably written, as you said, "depends on how much you trust your government". But how much can one trust a government in principle?

  7. "Ownership" of goods by Graspee_Leemoor · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They can't make it illegal to take out or destroy the chip without seriously changing the way things are sold.

    Right now, if I buy a book I can quite happily rip the cover off and even re-bind it with all the pages in the wrong order if I want, it's my book.

    Are we heading for a future where nothing is ever owned ?

    This computer game is yours, but you aren't allowed to reverse-engineer it.

    This book is yours but you're not allowed to tamper with its chip.

    This movie is yours but you're not allowed to watch it in company, or more than once a month.

    This CD is yours but if you want to put it on your mp3 player you have to pay again.

    This TV programme is being beamed at you, but if you watch it you have to watch all of it, including the adverts.

    Do you see how close we are ?

    graspee

    1. Re:"Ownership" of goods by brunes69 · · Score: 3, Informative

      Except in communism, nothing is owned, but everything is free. We are heading to where nothing is owned, but everything is rented.

  8. More info on RFID Tags by bihoy · · Score: 3, Informative

    The Fowler Company, makers of the TagLogic RFID Tagging System says on their product page:

    Tags retain data for a minimum of 10 years, and have a minimum of 100,000 read/write cycles. They are impervious to electrical noise, magnetism, dirt and grime and all but the most extreme temperature conditions.

    Apparently these devices can withstand temperatures of up to 105C!

  9. Look, let's get this straight, once and for all: by Rogerborg · · Score: 3, Insightful
    • Information is not an object. Tagging it is an attempt to turn it into an object. Tagging of data adds a false layer of psuedo-reality with the clear intent to turn information into property, to restrict it and to create an artificial market. Tagging of data is inherently bad.
    • A physical object like a book is a unique entitry. It can be bought, sold, owned, given, lent... and stolen. Tagging it just helps to identify that it's a particular object (which it is). It's neutral information, with no inherent evil purpose.

    Tagging a physical book is not sinister, it's not anti-privacy, it's not 1984. Nobody is going to care - ever - that you bought the latest Pratchett, then sold it to your friend, who donated it to a charity shop, who then sold it to a guy who gets drug conviction. There is no nightmare "Enemy of the State" scenario, because it's small potatoes. What this tagging is for is exactly what it say it's for: to identify specific objects to help convict habitual or large scale thieves. That's all it will do, and that's good, because it means those of us who do pay for books won't have to pay for the stolen ones too.

    I guess if we don't have at least one anti-privacy conspiracy story on a weekend, we have to find one, huh?

    --
    If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  10. News at 11: Illegal oven found in hackers lair by zenyu · · Score: 4, Funny

    Police say the felon heated his books to
    200C to disable the rights management chip.
    [Ad]
    Police say he provided the illegal heating
    service to as many as 10 other criminals
    and this is his third strike.
    [Ad]
    His previous two convictions were for reading texts that were no longer in print and removing
    jingle players from books to block part
    of the advertizing.
    [Ad]
    His crimes are estimated to have cost 15 Billion dollars in lost revenues according to The Corporation(TM).
    [Ad]
    The death penalty has been granted, but the judge has reserved the right to choose the method. His trial is scheduled for Sept of 2008.
    [Ad]
    This station is a wholly owned subsidiary of AOL-Time-Warner-Microsoft-Disney(TM), which is a wholly owned subsidiary of the US-UK Government(TM), which is a wholly owned subsidiary of The Corporation(TM).
    [Ad]
    All rights reserved.
    [Ad]

    1. Re:News at 11: Illegal oven found in hackers lair by Thing+1 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Police say the felon heated his books to
      200C to disable the rights management chip.

      The chips work up to an extreme of around 105C, which works out to be 221F (cool converter here ).

      All they have to do is double the extreme, and then the book will burn prior to the chip.

      I wouldn't have known this if not for Ray Bradbury . Thanks!

      --
      I feel fantastic, and I'm still alive.
  11. 18 years late... by The+Monster · · Score: 4, Insightful
    take it home microwave it on high for 15 seconds
    Be arrested for circumventing protocols designed by the Ministry of Truth to facilitate 'recall' of books in need of 'correction'...

    After all, the UK is Oceania, isn't it?

    --

    [100% ISO 646 Compliant]
    SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.

  12. Pay up! by faring · · Score: 3, Insightful

    And once the Movie/Book/Music publishers can track second-hand sales of their products, any guesses as to how long it would take before they start demanding royalties on those sales as well? I'm betting you could measure it in nanoseconds.

  13. Re:Look, let's get this straight, once and for all by hughk · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Nobody is going to care - ever - that you bought the latest Pratchett, then sold it to your friend, who donated it to a charity shop, who then sold it to a guy who gets drug conviction.
    Then why record which book I have bought and who has bought it later? Perhaps somebody might care that I have a copy of the Koran and the Los Alamos Primer? A word and a number, Farenheit 451.
    --
    See my journal, I write things there
  14. The Ultimate Goal by DarkHelmet · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I think the ultimate use of this isn't finding out the life cycle of books, but to track the momvement of information itself.

    Imagine what it would be like if a copy of The Anarchist's Cookbook was tracked to everyone who owned a copy of it. The book is Flagged (much in the same way as a slashdot post) as offensive, and the owner of the book is given a point against him.

    Combined with implanted medical chips, this could be a nightmare. Too many "bad points" on the medical chip, and then you're stopped at airports and train stations.

    But this could be taken to the next level as well. What if you're applying for a job as a teacher, and they see that you like pornography a little too much? Or if you read books about bringing back corporal punishment? They'll either refuse to hire you, or fire you on the premise that you *might* either have sex or hit one of your students.

    That's the ultimate goal, overall. Seek out all the "bad" people before something happens. Make anyone with different ideas public outcasts. Turn everyone into either corporate or government conformists.

    It's never, EVER going to work. True Deviants and terrorists always know how to get around these sorts of things. Information will always be free... if you know where to look for it. The goal is to keep as many people in the dark of that fact.

    But when I think of a motto for these people, I think of a line from the movie Sneakers to justify them:

    "No more secrets, Marty."

    --
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