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Unique ID Codes for CD / DVD Manufacturers
terrymr writes: "The movie & recording industry are lobbying hard for the European Union to require all CDs & DVDs to carry unique source identifiers to aid in combatting piracy. They are also demanding tougher penalties for infringers. It seems the only people who would be hit by the ID code requirement would be the legitimate manufacturers as the pirates simply wouldn't bother."
Well...I guess this could also give Microsoft some ammunition with their claims about not being able to release the source code of certain Windows components (including the Intellectual property protection stuff) due to threats of national security. Seems that copying and file sharing really is terrorism.
Anyone have any solid facts (or at least a little more substantial than these whisps of smoke) about music and movie piracy supporting terrorism and terrorists?
"Empathise with stupidity, and you're halfway to thinking like an idiot." - Iain M. Banks
Yes, that is why all those movies are out on Usenet and IRC, to fund terrorism.
When I read last Friday's story about watermarking on all ADCs, I went and joined the EFF. People have a lot of inertia with these stories, they disapprove but find it hard to get worked up. At some point it will become so anti-libertarian, all in the name of protecting the exploitation of artists by a giant parasitic maggotlike managerial structure, that you will feel the cold restrictive hand on your shoulder day by day.
Consider joining the EFF or a similar organization today, to help them keep our freedoms on our behalf.
They will put these unique IDs somewhere on the edges of the disk. Where's my sharpie? :)
I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
It seems Philips dislikes this type of activity, and has gone so far as to disallow copy-protected CDs from using the "Compact Disc" logo. Given that they're based in the EU, I suspect they have a pretty powerful lobby there as well. I sincerely doubt that the EU would risk losing the support of one of the biggest electronics producers around - after all, one of the selling points of the European Union is that it is "business oriented". Losing the support of a major player like that is a bad business decision.
Current damages are based on how much money people make on selling the stuff. However they want that changed to the full retail price... which allows companies to set there own damages by overinflating the value of their software then giving everyone a discount.
Have a copy of 2000 Enterprise server, your why not just give your house to Bill!
James
if waterproofing is able to survive, say,
a MP3 192 kbit/s rip, I suppose that the
waterproofing of CDs can be heard on
normal Hifi gear. Let's go back to vinyl or tape then...
Google passes Turing test : see my journal
So, I'm all for the BSA enforcing Microsoft's licensing rigorously. Together with the antitrust and un-bundling pressure on Microsoft, this may lead to a more competitive market again.
This is a tricky and dangerous detail. Right now, if Microsoft rips of a GPL program, they may get penalized based on the money they have made from it. Under these proposed rules, Microsoft could rip off GPL programs with impunity because their penalty would be nil (since the GPL retail price would be zero). This is clearly not acceptable.
If we are going to have penalties on copyright infringement, they should be based on a percentage of the net worth of the infringer, not on some imaginary retail value dreamed up by a marketing department. That way, the penalty is comparably painful to whoever infringes.
I really don't see what putting an ID code is going to do here. Sony music traces pirated CD key to Virgin records... what then?
The only way I think it could be useful is if you have readers/cd players which also keep track of the keycode, maybe are hooked up to the Internet etc.. and report you...
I think it's an interesting question, if you were the HEAD of a record company what would you do? If you embraced the Internet and mp3s, are you a visionary or are you just openning yourself to rampant piracy and going to get burned? Does copy-protection technology actually work? or does it only play into Orwellian fears? I've thought about it at times, if you had the intellectual property rights to all of Frank Sinatra's songs for example, what do you do??????
They have to legislate for something that CD/DVD makers should be doing on their own initiative, for their own good?
They can't track it back to the actual purchaser, instead they'll just know that Best Buy Store #768 sold it to an anonymous pirate?
In the EU, you don't have to be a law enforcement organization to carry out a search order?
The courts will assume you actually own the copyright just because you claim to, so that you can file false claims against someone just to fuck with them?
They're suggesting giving police powers to the the alleged victims? ("more powers by copyright holders to seize and preserve evidence of piracy")
Remind me not to visit europe anytime soon.
"feeds a growing black economy in which criminal networks use piracy to fund other activities such as drug dealing, arms trading, money laundering and terrorism."
I'm sure it happens - the simple fact is these organizations need money and will do whatever illegal activity is neccassary to fund their operations, or whatever can make them the most profit... but here is the sticking point. How much do you think these people realy make of of pirated software? MOst of the stuff I have seen sells for 4-5$. Not really a big deal when you consider other likely sorts of income - drug dealing (I believe a 1kg of cocaine fetches 100,000$ anymore) extoration, blackmail, etc. Can you see Tony Soprano talking about their new 'cd pirating scheme?' Consider the taliban/al qaeda (sp?). Most of the funding for those two organizations (besides legit taxes) occured from A.) Opium B.) Donations from wealthy businessmen - Oil Money. Never forget, the vast majority of funding for most middle eastearn terrorist groups is from oil. Remember that the next time you go to fill up the SUV.
This is probably just FUD. Most of the people doing this are people who are just trying ot earn a quick buck, but this doesn't preclude the possibility of it happening. Anymore it seems that you throw the word 'terrorist' into anything and you have a good chance of getting people to side with you.
The main example provided by the Motion Picture Association is a "DVD-R factory" that produced Spider Man and Star Wars copies.
But this is not a factory with professional DVD-burners. This is just a guy who bought 30 DVD-writers at the computer shop around the corner - just as you and I could do. I am afraid that some day we will end with a unique ID on our DVD and CD writers at home just to protect the copyrights.
Just as with the prohibition in the 1930s we have here laws that are far outside acceptance by the general public. All those measures won't stop the main problem (in this case: overpriced CDs) and in fact it only helps the mob.
Whether you choose to apply [copy]right to copying or distribution, in the end it does not matter. It is a question of having a control point. Which simply does not exist. Either you try to stop copying in the devices that can make digital copies (any gadget with a CPU or a DSP on it) or you try to find a point in the distribution chain where you can stop the distribution (such as a directory maintained by companies like Napster or AudioGalaxy).
The problem in either case is that the potential control points are beyond reach of national legislation. Sure, you can impose restrictions on digital devices and try to prevent imports of devices that break those restrictions. However, this is not enforcible internationally. All it takes is a single digital copy that finds its way into the Internet. Once the first copy has been made, it can be distributed en masse.
Then it becomes a question trying to find the control point for preventing its distribution. This is even more hopeless. Sure, you can go after the Napsters of this world but that won't stop the distribution. People will just find other ways to share and you can't go after every citizen who does so. It would simply be infeasible.
So, let the legislators have their little dreams. They are fighting against wind mills.
The movie industry will be the next one to feel the cold winds. Pretty soon full movies will be as convenient to swap as mp3's are today. While people will still go to theaters to see the movies on wide screen, VHS and DVD rentals and sales will suffer. Sill, record breaking mega budget movies may soon be a thing of the past, too.
In the end, I think, the non-copyable and non-distributable commodity is the artist itself. No-one can duplicate the creativity of a person. Hopefully this will eventually lead to the artists having more control over their works. The business model certainly could be envisioned and it would be more artist-to-consumer without unnecessary middle men.
"I have opinions of my own, strong opinions, but I don't always agree with them." -- George H. W. Bush
Universal Music is announcing a recall after it was discovered their latest batch of CDs were mysteriously encoded with the unique ID: H1LL4RY-R0S3N-15-054M4-B1N-L4D3N-IN-4-P16-5U1T
This quote, "use piracy to fund other activities such as drug dealing, arms trading, money laundering and terrorism." cracked me up.
I was under the naive impression that drug dealing and arms trading were highly profitable, I thought money laundering was used to hide the massive ammounts money those actvities generated.
It's now obvious to me that file sharing and pirate CD's in flea markets are really just a front to pay for unprofitable activities like drug trafficing and arms trading.
Come on guys, at least try to make up convicing FUD.
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I've heard some dumb things in my day (such as college students getting drunk only to bounce on their beds and fall out the window) but this is beyond my comprehension.
/.ers know very well they'd go after anyone they could. It's a cartel / monopoly. They don't have to worry how many customers they piss off at this point.
..."
I am in full agreement with harsher penalties for mass producers, but this isn't what would happen if the MPA, BSA, or any other organization got what they wanted. Often times it is a large piracy ring the companies go after, but
So basically it sounds like CD's and DVD's will becoming with a SID (Source ID) which will identify the factory that made it. How is this supposed to help prevent piracy? Suppose I'm churning out masses of DVD's in Germany. Ok... they know which plant the DVD came from. So fucking what? If the truth is being told they more than likely won't know which store I even bought the original disc from. Not to mention it wouldn't be hard to buy a disc from someplace like Norway, which isn't even a member of the EU, and have either a different SID or no SID.
Something tells me this whole SID thing is not to prevent or track piracy, but to keep small DVD / CD producers from being a threat with even more rules and regulations.
From the article:
The software and media groups also want the process of being granted civil search orders (known as Anton Piller orders in the UK) to be made easier and cheaper throughout the EU. Some countries already make the process relatively easy, said Peets, but not all. "In some member states it costs 100,000 euros to obtain a search order, and in others it can take months to process the request, by which time there could be a leak," she said.
What is wrong with that? It seems like Peets wants to be able to barge into any house he or his cronies choose to look for pirated material. The US would do good to have a large fee to obtain a search warrant. Maybe the government / police / corporations would think twice before applying for a warrant.
Also from the article:
"Pirates are using the Internet to download illegal copies of movies and then burning them onto CD-ROMs or DVD Recordables,
Jesus Christ in a furnace! What if somebody used bi-pedal motion to smuggle a DVD across the street for a neighbor to copy! We must act quickly against this "walking" lest piracy run rampant! Quickly, start putting the plant ID on all shoes made so we can stop piracy and make sure nobody makes their own shoes!
Everytime you look at porn a devil gets their horns.
Well, the question is a good one, so I won't ridicule you for asking it. But the answer may not be as reasonable as either of us would like, mind you.
First, there is the element of whether there are many "self-respecting" courts left in this country. Plus, the fact that M$ judge shops whenever it can. Add the two together.
Then, you have scenarios where it approaches (but doesn't reach) plausibility that there might be a big difference. For instance, the walmart price might be $80, but if the illegitimate copy bumped you over a 50 seat limit, for instance, M$ might be able to claim that they tend to get much more for a contract of that size. How much more could they claim? I dunno, maybe not much more. Maybe alot.
The point was, they have more leeway to decide what the fine would be, rather than it being fixed.
Maybe you should read a little bit more about the Columbian drug lords. They aren't funding attacks in the US, but what they do to maintain control of the drug fields looks like terrorism to me. Kidnappings, assasinations, bombings, etc. Of course, the right wing paramilitaries do some of the same things, so I guess you could say Plan Columbia funds terrorism as well. I don't have an axe to grind on this issue, but it bothers me when people ignore evidence to make a political point.
As far as pot goes, I agree 100%. But haven't some of the domestic whacko groups funded themselves through homegrown crystal meth labs?
It shouldn't be suprising that lawbreakers do illegal things to make money.
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-- Colonel Adolphus Busch
Next time I go to the shop to buy a CD or DVD I will have to show my ID which will get registered?
Maybe give a sample of my DNA? Or a license agreement signed in blood?
When I give sell or give away any of my CDs or DVDs I will have to inform some representative of the music industries there has been a change of ownership?
How long will it take before musical instruments are being forbidden? Their sole purpose is to play music and most of the music being played may in fact be reproductions!
"Sir, you are violating copyrights. Put down that saxophone and step away from it! Do not play another note or we WILL shoot you!"
The next step is to force manufacturers to only build devices that will reject media without the source tag. Of course this is just to protect us consumers from pirated media, which "have inferior quality and may damage your equipment", as the warnings on VHS tapes tell us.
So what does that mean?
- The "professional" pirates will find a way to spoof or simply copy these codes
- The Slashdot crowd will tweak their players so they can play copied media
- And finally, the man in de street will be able to do none of these things. Yes, finally the media companies successfully prevented him from playing that copied CD that his neighbour made for him. He will also be prevented from making copies for himself, thus being deprived of his fair-use rights, not through direct legislation but through a back-door, in the name of combatting piracy.
It gets worse if this happens, and you can bet it will: isn't the RIAA already pushing for equipment to detect and reject unsanctioned material? So what about those people that create music themselves? Now, just like the old days, they need to go to Big Record to produce their music, or obtain one of those codes.
Laws demanding this code is the first half, Laws demanding equipment to look for these codes is the second. Both will bring control of all content we will be allowed to see or hear, back with the corporations.
A slightly pessisistic and even paranoid outlook perhaps?
If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
When it comes to tagging EXPLOSIVES to identify the source, oh, no, it would cost money and it wouldn't work ( http://www.speedsite.com/~ccohen/taggants.htm ; http://www.speedsite.com/~ccohen/taggants.htm ). But when it comes to stopping kiddies from copying MUSIC, no effort should be spared...
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
1.Price
2.Availabillity
3...uh. I can't think of anymore..
Assuming noone is making a point of civil disobedience, the reasons to CONSUME a pirated disc are few. If someone doen't want to pay for a software program or crappy music by one of today's artists, they will get a pirate cd, or make one themselves.
That's where availabillity comes in. If someone can't find Nick Drake's Pink Moon at their small town Walmart, they can get it over the net.
None of the arguments used by the *IAAs target either of these, because it makes pirating THEIR fault. (Too much $$/not enough content & We don't bother to keep that in stock/ Are you sure you don't mean Nick-elback?)
Either way, consumers are NOT being served.
They're talking about having every CD manufacturing plant put a plant ID into every CD they make, so that illegal CDs can be traced to the plant where they were manufactured.
The idea here is to be able to trace a CD back to the plant where it was manufactured, so that large-scale pirates can be stopped.
How long until we're able to copy the unique ids?
This way when they *find* a pirated CD, they can know what CD machine made it, "ahh, cd duplicator # 14652, we sold that to ... ahh, the russian mafia".
This is how piracy works: BMG needs 100,000 of Britneys new cd ... they call up factory X and they say yeah, we can produce 100,000 cds in two weeks. But the factory lied -- they can really make 200,000 cds in two weeks -- and they *DO*. BMG gets its 100,000 cds, and they've got 100,000 cds to sell. BMG pays 1$ a cd (max), but the "counterfit" ones are identical to the real ones and they can sell them to some shady characters for *alot* more.
And if it's not the same factory producing the pirated cds, its people using the factories machines at 2:00am in the morning. Russian mafia guy takes a janitorial or security job at factory X and when everyone goes home, he and his buddies run off cds to sell :)
I believe that CD pressing machines cost the order of 6 or 7 digits. Your street punks selling cds on the corner cant afford these machines. Right or wrong, the RIAA wants to find out where the cds are being made. Although Im sure they will use this ID in some sneaky way later
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