Vietnamese Gov't to Monitor Net Cafe Customers

echucker writes: "In a story reminiscent of a recent slashdot article about a Chinese crackdown, CNN is reporting that the Vietnamese government plans to keep tabs on users at over 4,00o net cafes there. Local officials are to report back to national authorities by July 7th on status of cafes in their jurisdiction. Better surf quick, folks!"

Comments

are we surprised?

[Sir Elton John]

Frankly, such behaviour is par for the course in the Far East. Really, we should be thankful they've permitted relatively free communication thus far, and that regions like Japan and Hong Kong manage to permit some sort of unhindered exchange of ideas. Were this story about the UK, I'd be surprised. As it is, I'm willing to chalk it up to cultural differences and let it go at that.

Re:are we surprised?

[neocon]

I'm willing to chalk it up to cultural differences and let it go at that.

Are you really? Are you arguing that because these people have a different history from ours basic ideals like free speech and the free exchange of ideas shouldn't be important to them? Really?

Re:are we surprised?

[quantaman]

basic ideals like free speech and the free exchange of ideas shouldn't be important to them? Really?

Basic ideals for who? I'll admit I don't know a ton about their cultures and I don't like the idea of them lacking these rights but they may not see it the same way. Maybe they consider it important that people aren't exposed to "corrupting" ideas, that their world would be a lot happier and more peaceful if everyone had the same basic beliefs. Those ideas may differ from our own and their motives may not be as alltrueistic as I've stated and yes I do believe that this story is a bad thing but I don't believe that's a fully valid assumption.

Re:are we surprised?

[zangdesign]

Are you arguing that because these people have a different history from ours basic ideals like free speech and the free exchange of ideas shouldn't be important to them?

Actually, to assume that they should value the same ideals as we do is arrogance at it highest level. All of our values are predicated on the fact that we are descendants (generally) of Europeans, with a strong Christian influence on our ideas and philosophy. Asians and others on that portion of the continent are descendants of a philosophy that bears almost no resemblance to ours.

It is more natural to assume that their ideals would be completely different to us. In Western philosophy, we emphasize the value of the individual, which leads to the ideals of free speech and non-violent exchange of ideas to reduce conflict. Eastern philosophies assume the opposite, that individual action disturbs the natural order and leads to conflict.

So the fact that they don't value free speech and exchange of ideas doesn't particularly bother me. Apparently, neither of those values is absolutely essential to survival as a species.

The government is destructive.

[Futurepower(R)]

It is because of government policies like this that Vietnam is one of the poorest countries in the world, with a family income of about $390 per year. When the government is so destructive, it is difficult for people to help themselves. Source: BBC Country profile: Vietnam

Quote from the article:

Some party leaders are worried, however, that too much economic liberalisation will weaken their power base and introduce "decadent" ideas into Vietnamese society.

The "party leaders" have plenty of money, of course, and they care only about themselves.

A Bit of Perspective on this Issue

[Locke!Erasmus]

It really amazes me sometimes how good we have it and how badly citizens of other countries have it.

A little over two hundred years ago, the colonists in America rose up over issues like taxation, freedom of speech, and freedom of religion...

Ok...so our ancestors (for those of us who are American) didn't have equal representation, their tea was too expensive, and they couldn't talk smack about the King...

The didn't have to put up with, and we don't have to put up with...

• The government telling us how many babies we can have, and killing any that are "unauthorized" just as they are born
• Going without food of any kind for days because the government squanders food supplies and spends all its money on bigger, badder weapons
• Forced adherence to a political ideology (well ok, the Founding Fathers had to put up with the Sedition act and were subjects to the King)
• A head of state who uses chemical weapons on his own citizens
• A state "security service" who can snatch citizens off the street and do anything with them, any time, any place, any reason, but no recourse

The lists I've just written down are obviously not meant to be exhaustive or conclusive...just put things into a bit of perspective. When citizens of other countries are treated with far less value than those of us in the developed world, why would they care if their internet activity is being monitored? I think they have far bigger issues than that.

The really interesting question for me is, what is the breaking point for each of these peoples? Internet privacy might be a big issue for us because we're well-fed (most of us) and don't have to worry about how we're going to pay for a movie ticket, but for a lot of people in other parts of the world, I think it's just a continuation of the status quo into another part of life. In fact, I'm amazed that Internet cafe's weren't monitored by nations like China or Vietnam in the first place!

I'm afraid I don't really know enough history to be able to answer that question.

Oh yes, wonderful Vietnam.

[jotaeleemeese]

As recently as 3 or 4 years ago (last time I was there) they were still burning books, harrasing prostitues (while in the mean time corrupt cops are using them to blackmail foreign tourists), and selectively destroying advertisment (lets say this week Coke was cool, Pepsi was evil).

Their naivite is typical of the technologicaly ignorant though: most Western companies used to have full uncensored access to the Internet via their corporate backbones. As far as I remember Vietnamese workers were not closing their eyes while surfing foreign media sites.

About Vietnam

[SEGV]

I haven't been there, but my wife is from there, and I've read up on the nation.

The people are conservative. They dress well, follow politics, and read a lot. And I'm talking before TV, so don't think of that excuse. They have a much higher literacy rate than other nations such as, oh, the U.S.

Maybe it's due to the general European cultured influence of France, who had colonized them. Or maybe it's the Asian mindset.

So now Vietnam follows the path of many other nations: independent nation, to European colony, to communist revolution, to market economy.

It's not there yet.

The government does watch its people. It's a communist state, like you probably imagine Russia was decades ago.

Probably they'll go through lots of corruption and mob-type stuff even after becoming more capitalist. Just like Russia is becoming, and the U.S. is now.

But don't think the people are stupid, or aren't aware of this. These things take time to change and don't happen overnight. But they will.