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Slashback: Disclosure, Maricopa, Telecoms

Slashback tonight with another round of updates and errata regarding recent Slashdot stories. Read on for more on domain slamming, the process behind fixing and revealing the recent OpenSSH vulnerability, early photography, and a special note for residents of Maricopa County, Arizona.

Quick work by smart people. ciaweb writes "The OpenSSH group has revised its security advisory about the recent OpenSSH vulnerabilities. In it, they describe their decision-making process for releasing the bug information. It is interesting to contrast their procedure, which appears designed to maximize user protection, against Microsoft's, which appears to maximize Microsoft's protection."

Pardon me, sir, would you mind if I SLAMMED THIS HAMMER ON YOUR FINGERS?! D0wnsp0ut writes "I thumbed through my mail today and found what appeared to be a renewal notice for my domain. This one came from "Domain Registry of America." Verisign attempted something similar back in March and Bulkregister.com fought back and won an injunction, against the mailings. So watch out if your domain is getting close to expiring. I talked to my registrar (Register.com) and they're aware of it.
I'll scan the letter but have no place to post the pictures. Can anyone lend some bandwidth?"

Half the world has never eaten a Krispy Kreme donut, either. cshirky writes "I've just written an essay on the phrase ' Half the world has never made a phone call'. It's more 'voice telephony-y' than the usual telecom stories here, but after seeing the interest in media and the market that surfaced during my /. interview, I thought it might be of some interest."

Please stop sending my money to Redmond, OK? TrumpetPower! writes "All that brouhaha over Maricopa County's policy prohibiting companies or persons convicted of antitrust violations has had an effect. I just received the following note announcing a public forum scheduled for this coming Monday.

You recently inquired about the County's use of Microsoft products and the manner in which we license their software. We appreciate your interest in the County's technology plans. To provide a forum in which to discuss our technology direction and address any questions you may have, we will have Information Technology staff members available to meet with citizens at 8:30 am on Monday July 8th. The meeting location will be the County Administration Building at 301 W. Jefferson in Suite 420. Please RSVP your attendance so we can ensure that adequate facilities are available for the meeting.

Thank you for your inquiry,
Paul Allsing
Deputy CIO
Maricopa County
301 W Jefferson, Suite 420
Phoenix, AZ 85003"

Ah, but what about the first annoying family photographer? 7h3_B055 writes: "Contrary to this article on Slashdot claiming the first photograph was created in 1826, much evidence is pointing to the fact that the Shroud of Turin may have been an earlier example (substantially earlier) of photography using ingredients as basic as egg-white for treating cloth (the photopaper) and urine for developing it. The camera itself could have been a simple box with a hole in it and the exposure time would have been lengthy."

Of course, there are a lot of theories about the Shroud of Turin, and a google search is likely to intrigue you for days.

67 of 208 comments (clear)

  1. if i were a county office, by RumGunner · · Score: 5, Funny

    i certainly wouldn't have my offices in suite 420.

    or maybe i would.

    1. Re:if i were a county office, by commonchaos · · Score: 4, Interesting

      a quick google search found a page on the meaning of 420.

  2. Domain Registery of America Letter by Masem · · Score: 5, Informative

    I've gotten both the Verisign and the DRA letter, and after reading both in light of the Veresign suit, the DRA letter is VERY clear that submitting the form back to them will switch your registry to them; this is printed on the front of the letter in the same type as the rest of the page. In the Verisign case, the transfer statement was printed on the back of the letter in fine print (with no indication there was something on the back). While somewhat tacky, I don't think DRA is in the wrong here, compared to Verisign.

    --
    "Pinky, you've left the lens cap of your mind on again." - P&TB
    "I can see my house from here!" - ST:
    1. Re:Domain Registery of America Letter by Dr.Dubious+DDQ · · Score: 3, Informative
      I don't think DRA is in the wrong here

      Actually, I think they very well may be. Where did they get the address to send the advertisement to? I'm assuming the same place they got the expiration information - whois.

      Most whois servers have a notice like the following, I've noticed:

      "Any use of this data for any other purpose, including, but not limited to, allowing or making possible dissemination or collection of this data in part or in its entirety for any purpose, such as the transmission of unsolicited advertising and solicitations, is expressly forbidden without the prior written permission of (Registrar). By submitting an inquiry, you agree to these terms of usage and limitations of warranty."

      My registrar's whois database has this notice. I got one of verisign's sleazy notes as well (though I knew what it was, at least.) If I get one from DRA, I'll be complaining...

    2. Re:Domain Registery of America Letter by billn · · Score: 2

      Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. At least he's got a pair big enough to put his name to his post. =)

      --
      - billn
    3. Re:Domain Registery of America Letter by fliplap · · Score: 2

      Actually, you're wrong. I know exactly where they got the info, they got it from the WHOIS database, but you have nothing to complain about. You see

      "ICANN contracts mandate each Registrar to sell bulk whois data to anyone."

      Most registrar don't tell you this because if they did, hey, they'd lose money right? But if you use a decent registrar or read the ICANN agreement you'd know it. You can also opt out of it. Most sleazy registrar require you to write in or otherwise take a stupid amount of time todo it. Thats why I like gandi.net they're run out of france and have a big paragraph explaining it and radio buttons where the default is opt-out

  3. 'Half the world': Quantity _does_ matter by brendano · · Score: 2, Insightful
    o snapshot of telephone penetration matters, because the issue is not amount but rate. If you care about the digital divide, and you believe that access to communications can help poor countries to grow, then pontificating about who has or hasn't made a phone call is worse than a waste of time, it actively distorts your view of the possible solutions because it emphasizes a statist attitude.


    Wrong: it doesn't imply hopelessness, but rather encourages us to take action to change. Do you think that Kofi Annan wants us to throw up our hands and not care about the rate of improvement? No! By recognizing the magnitude of the problem, we can realize how important <i>more</i> improvement is. Just because things are improving doesn't mean we shouldn't be concerned about the huge inequalities that exist.
    --
    -Brendan
  4. Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fission by ashitaka · · Score: 5, Informative

    From the linked evidence website...

    One theory is that Jesus became pure energy and the radiation burned the image into the cloth. This isn't a far fetched theory really. We don't know how He resurrected. As the theory suggests, He could have transformed into a form of energy. Einstein's famous equation E=mc2 tells that matter can become pure energy. In fact this is the same concept of an atom bomb - matter becoming pure energy using radioactive material as a catalyst.

    This is evidence???????

    --
    If you don't want to repeat the past, stop living in it.
  5. Re:Great news for Linux! by Wildcat+J · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I'm really really really excited to hear about that New Mexico county that has a rule against using Microsoft software.
    I think we had this problem last time this subject came up, but Maricopa County is:
    • in Arizona
    • the 4th largest county in the US
    • home of Phoenix, a major metropolitan area
    Otherwise, I agree with your sentiments. As someone who grew up in the area, I just wanted to defend my turf ;)

    -J

  6. Exactly! by PhysicsGenius · · Score: 3, Funny
    There's also a very shallow learning curve! And I'd like to reiterate your point about the upgrade treadmill--I've had my kernel installed since...gosh, it must have been mid-June when I d/l'd and compiled this baby. And XP's latest patch came out what, last week? HAHA, M$ SUXORS!

    It'll also be pretty sweet when all that GPL'd, SouthWest-oriented county management software can finally get used. It's been ramping up in usability on SourceForge for literally months and it's time to give that stuff a spin around the block!

    It's a great time to be a Linux fanatic!

  7. Actual crucified foot, my ass by dstone · · Score: 2

    From that crucifixion photography link, the site shows us a very modern, very clear, very unrealistic (in my opinion) photo of an actual crucified foot (near the bottom of the page). Is it just me, or does that just look too nice and neat with carefully arranged (but not too messy) bright red blood? Thankfully I'm no expert on the subject, but it just looks so 'perfect'. Nice clean, attractive foot, nice rustic piece of timber (artistically angled for composition), artsy clouds in the background, carefully spread bloodflow on feet and wood, etc.

    One obviously questionable assertion that they try to pass off in the details makes for a whole site of suspicion.

  8. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Wildcat+J · · Score: 5, Informative
    The paragraph that follows amuses me too:
    What makes this theory eerily realistic is that when the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were bombed in World War II, there were some walls left standing. Etched on those walls were shadows of spiral staircases, statues, and even people. Hypothesis is that the atomic explosion etched the shadows of images onto the walls. So if matter becoming pure energy, such as an atomic blast, can etch images onto a wall, it is not far-fetched that Jesus's resurrection could have done the same thing to The Shroud - if he produced some kind of energy of some sort in the process of resurrection.
    Hypothetically speaking (because I find the idea, to quote Mike Tyson, "ludacrisp") if Jesus were the energy source that etched this image on the linen, he wouldn't cast a shadow, now would he?

    -J

  9. I am *truly* sorry about that... by realgone · · Score: 5, Funny
    The shroud article's paraphrase of one Dr. Nicholas Allen:
    He said all one had to do was suspend a corpse for three to four days in sunlight.
    I'd like to formally apologize to Sears Photo Studio for ever having complained while sitting through those family portraits back in the '70s. In retrospect, you were surprisingly gentle with me.
  10. Re:Great news for Linux! by Wildcat+J · · Score: 2, Informative
    An AC sez:
    well, it may be among the largest, but probably NOT among the most populated. I suspect one of NYC's 5 counties to be the most populated.
    You're welcome to suspect that, but you'd be wrong. Maricopa is fourth, and grew at a pretty healthy rate of 4% from April 2000 to July 2001. New York's Kings county is seventh, by the way.

    -J

  11. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by _Sprocket_ · · Score: 5, Funny


    One theory is that Jesus became pure energy and the radiation burned the image into the cloth.

    ...

    In fact this is the same concept of an atom bomb - matter becoming pure energy using radioactive material as a catalyst.


    "Yea. I knew Jesus. Nice guy. Real concern for his fellow man. Kinda quiet. But boy... once you set him off... what a temper!"
  12. as a physicist and a geek.. by RumGunner · · Score: 2

    i find the equation "E=mc2" extremely funny.

  13. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Ten+Pound+Pussy · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...if Jesus were the energy source that etched this image on the linen, he wouldn't cast a shadow, now would he?

    Jesus is a vampire? Does that mean if you take communion, you become a vampire? I can't believe the church doesn't advertise this. I'm on my way to mass.

  14. Vermeer: First Photographer by sjbrown · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ...or perhaps first "camera"

    I recently saw a TV segment about research showing that he quite likely projected an image onto canvas using a lens, then painted or sketched the projected image.

    He probably wasn't the inventor of the technique. I believe it was called a 'camera obscura'.

    Just found a link, thanks to Google:
    Vermeer's Camera

    1. Re:Vermeer: First Photographer by nfras · · Score: 2

      Research deos show that it is very likely that Vermeer used the camera obscura to obtain an image. He would be in a darkened room with an image projected on to the canvas. On some of his pictures details are "out of focus". However, you can hardly call what he did a photograph as all he did was use the camera obscura to obtain the basis for a painting. Had he chemically burned the image onto the canvas then you may have a case for an early photograph.

      --
      You call me a pedant? I prefer the term "correct"
  15. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by i_am_nitrogen · · Score: 3, Funny

    Wow, that's really inane. Now I know why people some peole call some Christians morons... I'm a Christian myself, but I have had little awareness of all the hilarious "evidence" out there... Amazing that people think a big ball of radiation could walk out of the tomb and talk to Mary Magdalene...

  16. Detailed analysis of the exploit? by MrHat · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Disclaimer: I don't want to know this so I can run around and r00t a bunch of machines. I'm genuinely interested, since the flaw wasn't immediately apparent to me when I glanced at the patch a few days ago.

    With that said - does anyone have an analysis/description of where in the source the overflow was actually exploitable? I followed the auth_chall2.c call path fairly far, and didn't manage to find where nresp > 100 would actually overflow. It doesn't seem to be exploitable in the xmalloc() immediately following the patch, unless I really missed something. I didn't trace into openssl, so if it's an interaction between the two libraries, I wouldn't have hit it.

    Hints, pointers, source snippets? All are appreciated. :)

    1. Re:Detailed analysis of the exploit? by larry+bagina · · Score: 2, Insightful
      here's some code that was posted to bugtraq:

      sshutup-theo.tar.gz

      See here for the corresponding message.

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    2. Re:Detailed analysis of the exploit? by BJH · · Score: 5, Informative

      My take on the problem (no guarantees, this may make you bald, blind and impotent, etc. etc.).

      The problem lies with the xmalloc line in:

      if (nresp > 0) {
      response = xmalloc(nresp * sizeof(char*));
      for (i=0; i < nresp; i++)
      response[i] = packet_get_string(NULL);
      }

      Basically, the sizeof(char*) will return 4 on a normal x86 machine... which means that if nresp is greater than one-fourth of 0xffffffff (UINT_MAX), i.e. over 0x4000000, then you overflow xmalloc(), which is just a wrapper function for standard malloc().

  17. I know I can't be the only who thought of it by aTMsA · · Score: 4, Funny

    I think the first thing(s) i would try to clone if i could would be anything resembling human DNA in the shroud. It would be hilarious if some blond/black chinese guy(or even girl) come out of the clonation!

    1. Re:I know I can't be the only who thought of it by Rombuu · · Score: 2

      The guy's name was Jesus bin Joseph.. he was born in the Middle East... I'd be more shocked if said experiment worked and you got a Northern European.

      --

      DrLunch.com The site that tells you what's for lunch!
  18. So which is it? by 1010011010 · · Score: 2

    So did he have any broken bones, or not?

    In "Carrying the cross" --
    Christ's broken nose is attributed to the impact of his face hitting the ground as he fell while carrying the cross.

    In "Death" --
    The Gospel of John concludes that paragraph saying, "this was done so that scripture would be fulfilled that not one bone of His body be broken." And indeed, throughout the entire passion of Jesus, despite the extraordinary atrocities done to him, not one of his bones were broken.

    I's like to touch on a point not raised by the Shroud site. It stands to reason that Jesus was circumcised, being Jewish. so, when he rose to heaven, did he leave his foreskin behind?

    --
    Napster-to-go says "Fill and refill your compatible MP3 player", which is a lie. It's not MP3. It's WMA with DRM.
    1. Re:So which is it? by 1010011010 · · Score: 2
      Hehe!

      Naturally, the power and popularity of relics was dependent upon the saintliness of the original "owner." The ultimate source of relics, of course, was Jesus himself. But there was just one problem: it is clear in the New Testament that after his resurrection, Jesus was "carried up to Heaven." Thus, there just wasn't any possibility of a church acquiring Jesus' head or foot, as happened with various saints. For the most part, the only Jesus relics available were things like his crown of thorns, his robe, his sandals, or even pieces of the "True Cross."

      But then some astute theologian - or was it a businessman? - realized that not all of Jesus' body could have been actually transported up to Heaven. Jesus was, after all, a faithful Jew, and as such, he would have been circumcised like every other boy. So where was his foreskin? Whatever happened to that bit of divine flesh?

      And thus began a search for a very odd "Holy Grail" which resulted in not one, but up to a dozen different holy foreskins, each competing to be the genuine article. Of course, one presumes that they could not all be genuine and I am not aware of anyone who tried to argue that the unusual bounty was a miracle akin to the loaves and fishes.

      http://atheism.about.com/library/weekly/aa051000 b. htm
      --
      Napster-to-go says "Fill and refill your compatible MP3 player", which is a lie. It's not MP3. It's WMA with DRM.
    2. Re:So which is it? by dstone · · Score: 2

      did he leave his foreskin behind?

      Sure. Along with baby teeth and pounds of dead skin, shed hair, and toenail clippings.

      Not to mention countless gallons of solid and liquid waste.

  19. SuSE on the OpenSSH Vulnerability. by AgTiger · · Score: 5, Informative

    Anyone who runs SuSE Linux from version 6.4 through version 8.0 inclusive may be interested in this.

    SuSE's "SuSE-Security-Announce" mailing list released this post today regarding their response to the OpenSSH vulnerability. It contains a ton of information, and FTP links to update your OpenSSH packages for the aforementioned versions of SuSE's distribution.

  20. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Alien+Being · · Score: 4, Funny

    Why naturally Sherman, you have heard of "Critical Mass" haven't you?

    -Peabody

  21. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Ryan+Amos · · Score: 2

    This is assuming that the shroud even depicts Jesus. It seems one has to use circular logic to prove this (i.e. assume it is Jesus to prove it is Jesus, much like the problem with proving the existence of God.)

    Besides, everyone knows we only discovered nuclear fusion in the 1940s. Sillies.

  22. nose bone? by timothy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    isn't the nose only cartilaginous, rather than true bone?

    Seems like a technicality either way, but still ;)

    My mom's nose was once broken by (someone else's) ski pole. They didn't even stop to apologize, which did not please her.

    Best book I've read on the SoT is the one by (iirc) John Heller, quoted on some of the sites I've seen today ...

    timothy

    --
    jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
  23. snatching domain snatching by ProfKyne · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I talked to my registrar (Register.com) and they're aware of it.

    That's interesting, I have a letter from Register.com asking me if I want to extend my domain name term. But my registrar is easyDNS.com.

    I'm not kidding, I have it right here.

    --
    "First you gotta do the truffle shuffle."
    1. Re:snatching domain snatching by ceejayoz · · Score: 2

      Yeah, Register.com has been doing it recently too. p.s. easyDNS rocks :-)

  24. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Bitsy+Boffin · · Score: 2

    Now we know how the phrase "Jesus Christ" came to be a term of awe, or frustration or anger, as in... "Jeesus Christ! Look at the guy explode !" :-)

    --
    NZ Electronics Enthusiasts: Check out my Trade Me Listings
  25. Not all by jcsehak · · Score: 3, Interesting

    My domains are registered through Go Daddy. I used them because they were cheapest and a friend recommended them to me. To date (several months), I have recieved no spam from them other than a notice warning me about Verisign's nasty renewal notices, and a recent notice about how they're making domain transfer free. Also, my normal flow of spam didn't noticeably go up after registering. So while I'd agree that most registrars are scumbags, I gotta say I'm very happy with Go Daddy. So far, at least.

    --

    c-hack.com |
    1. Re:Not all by ceejayoz · · Score: 2

      Best registrar I've worked with is easyDNS - very good service, and their online domain management? OMG! My DNS changes are active within 15 minutes, it's sweet. :)

  26. not to mention the AMOUNT of energy... by josquint · · Score: 2

    OK...
    if a pure matter to energy conversion took place...

    Energy = Mass(Speed of light)^2

    Assume a 90kg person, and C= 2997992458 m/s

    Energy = 90kg(299792458m/s)^2

    Energy = 90(8.9876e16)

    Energy =5.3925e18 kg-m/s or 163,410,032,498,000,000 kilowatts

    SO in short, that shroud wouldn't have an image burned in, the shroud (along with a good deal of the surrounding tomb and Pilate's Guards would have been vaporised. :) ... the problem when applying human logic to Devine events...

    1. Re:not to mention the AMOUNT of energy... by rlp · · Score: 2

      Using a different conversion I get:

      (Assuming 50 Kg converted to energy)
      Conversion factors & Constants
      1 joule = 10000000 erg
      C = 3 x 10^10 cm/sec
      1 megaton-tnt = 4.18 x 10^15 joules

      E = mc^2

      E = 5x10^4 g * (3 x 10^10 cm/sec)^2
      E = 5x10^4 * 9 * 10^20 ergs
      E = 4.5 * 10^25 ergs
      E = 4.5 * 10^18 joules
      E = 1077 megatons-tnt !!!

      --
      [Insert pithy quote here]
  27. Shroud!! by logicnazi · · Score: 2

    No it is pretty clear the shroud of turin was constructed in a similar (but more complicated) manner as rubbing a pencil over a sheet of paper held on top of a credit card. In other words they put the shroud on top of some statue and then imprinted that on the shroud.

    The only reason someone would claim the shroud was a photograph is because it is a negative image like negatives are. In no way shape or form was a picture taken involving pinhole cameras and the like. I mean good photosensitive materials were a long way in coming still.

    --

    If you liked this thought maybe you would find my blog nice too:

  28. Maricopa going open source (or whatever) by The+Bungi · · Score: 4, Informative
    For all of you Linux/BSD advocates that are obviously droooling over this oh-so-cool-good-vs-evil "stuggle"... I can categorically assure everyone that this will never happen. Never.

    As someone who regularly consults at the county , city and AZ state agency level, I hate to inform ya'll that this is very much a Microsoft kinda town. Yep, you heard it here first.

    Further, Maricopa county is small potatoes when compared to the state and city agencies/IT budgets. Scottsdale's (one of the valley's cities) CIO probably has four times the dough than the dude that runs the county's boxen. Not to mention Phoenix city proper. And Tempe, Chandler, Mesa, etc. etc. Oh, and the state government.

    And of course, government agencies are the least prepared to transition an existing employee base to a brand new technology paradigm, regardless of the cost benefits this might theoretically bring (or how supposedly easy it is to switch to Linux/KDE/OSS Office suite).

    Sorry, I had to break the news.

    1. Re:Maricopa going open source (or whatever) by geekoid · · Score: 2

      secerla counties in California would fit the description you gave, but about 4 years ago they switched to BSD and or Linux. The transition was as smooth as any windows upgrade. "Retraining" took almost no time.
      Considering how far the UI has come, its only got to be easier to migrate.
      As soon as someone with political power ralizes its there ass if MS screws up, the tend to rethink things.
      What do you think would happen if the BSA showed up at the mayor's office to check there lisences?

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  29. Are you out of your fucking mind? by Kombat · · Score: 3, Insightful
    You're obviously not a parent. Policing your children? Duh! Hello! McFly!?! That's what parenting is. What, you think kids are born knowing right from wrong, and parents are just supposed to stay out of the way and occassionally put food on the table? What friggin' world are you living in???

    When will people realise that the way to help your child grow up safely is not to forbid things Gee, maybe the same time they realise that if a pair of minors wants to have unprotected sex, then that's their business. I.e., NEVER, HOPEFULLY, BECAUSE YOU'RE TALKING FUCKING STUPID.

    Hey Genius, we're talking about minors here, doing illegal things. It's one thing if you want to try and make a point about the futility of the war on drugs among adults, and the government's assault on civil liberties by trying to regulate activites exclusive to one or more consenting grown ups, but geez, kid, get your head out of your ass and use some common sense. We're talking about kids here. I know in your little fantasy world it's the 10-year-olds who are hacking out the planet-saving patches keeping this fragile society together, while the Ph.d educated engineers at Microsoft scratch their heads in awe, so this may surprise you: kids DON'T know it all. Kids need guidance. They need discipline. And, to borrow a phrase from my father, as long as you're living under my roof, eating my food, and using my phone, you're going to follow MY RULES

    Good Lord man, you take this all kids are good and can be trusted thing too far.

    --
    Like woodworking? Build your own picture frames.
    1. Re:Are you out of your fucking mind? by Reality+Master+101 · · Score: 2

      Word up, brother. In fact, I just ranted about this myself. If I may quote myself, "Where does this bullshit come from that 'they're just going to do what they're going to do anyway, and there's no way to stop them, so you might as well let them do whatever they want'?".

      --
      Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
    2. Re:Are you out of your fucking mind? by G-funk · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hahahaha! You (and probably your father) are an idiot.

      I know in your little fantasy world it's the 10-year-olds who are hacking out the planet-saving patches keeping this fragile society together, while the Ph.d educated engineers at Microsoft scratch their heads in awe

      What the fuck are you talking about? Who said anything about patches, or little kid geniouses or anything like that?

      Were you even reading my post? The fact is You cannot stop your children from doing things they want to do. You know this. your parents tried it, and you did them anyway. So did your friends. All I said was that reaing your childrens' diary (a lot of my female friends had parents who liked to do this), reading his email, listening in on his phone calls, and stealing his pager and deciphering his "code talk" are not the way to go about things.

      Policing children is not what parenting is about. Parenting is about _RAISING_ children, and teaching them: teach them how to make their own decisions about what's right and what's wrong, because by the time their desicions are life-threatening (unprotected sex, dui, drugs) they're going to make their own decisions wether you like it or not. Telling them what to do and what not to do is of course good - expecting them to do it "because i said so" is a fruitless and potentially damaging way of things.

      Kids need guidance. They need discipline

      I never said otherwise. And I never said kids can be trusted to do the right thing. But that doesn't make it right to go through their personal things looking for evidence just in case.

      --
      Send lawyers, guns, and money!
    3. Re:Are you out of your fucking mind? by geekoid · · Score: 2

      Amen, Brother.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    4. Re:Are you out of your fucking mind? by The+Grey+Mouser · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hey Genius, we're talking about minors here, doing illegal things. It's one thing if you want to try and make a point about the futility of the war on drugs among adults, and the government's assault on civil liberties by trying to regulate activites exclusive to one or more consenting grown ups, but geez, kid, get your head out of your ass and use some common sense. We're talking about kids here. I know in your little fantasy world it's the 10-year-olds who are hacking out the planet-saving patches keeping this fragile society together, while the Ph.d educated engineers at Microsoft scratch their heads in awe


      I think the original posters' point is that children should be allowed to mistakes. Even dangerous ones, on occasion. A sterile, overprotective environment is anathema to a child's intellectual development. Indeed, this is observed in all primates, not just humans. The idea, I think, is to equip the child as best you can; to instill judgement and sense into their inchoate minds. Yes, punish them when they screw up. Yes, instill a healthy (not iron-fisted) discipline so they can grow up respecting themselves, and make intelligent choices. And, yes, sadly, you have to let them fall down once in a while. The risk you take in doing so is an investment in the child's psyche. Growing up is dangerous---it has to be, I think.

      But where did you pull that 10-year-old hacker thing from, anyway? That was quite the non sequitur...


      And, to borrow a phrase from my father, as long as you're living under my roof, eating my food, and using my phone, you're going to follow MY RULES


      Well, that's fine. However, if you've done a proper job, one day your child will ask you where those rules come from, and their justification. You owe it to them to have a thought-out answer.

      Cheers,

      Michael

  30. Phoenix residents-- this is your chance... by VValdo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If you live in the Phoenix Metro area, this is your big chance to make a great impression, show interest in your local government, and learn something too -- I mean, this is great-- the people who make important decisions about the county's technology are going to be LISTENING to you-- aside from the inevitable rips on Microsoft (easy to do), be sure to play up the cost-benefits and reliability of Linux and *bsd as viable alternatives. Have some printed materials (or CD-ROMs?) to give out.

    If you seem too fanatical or "out there", you may scare them off-- it's easy to dismiss a lunatic, even when they're right. So please don't dress like Obiwan ;) A well-thought out, reasoned discussion about the benefits of open source software may make a tremendous difference if you can reach the right people and they are truly open to change.

    Good luck everyone! Let us know how it works out Monday! Someone call the Arizona Republic and New Times. (And be on the lookout for a counter-offensive from Microsoft).

    W

    --
    -------------------
    This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
  31. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Tokerat · · Score: 2

    if Jesus were the energy source that etched this image on the linen, he wouldn't cast a shadow, now would he?

    No, but he could have left burn marks...

    Granted this makes their explanation of shadows and Hiroshima completely unfounded, but it still doesnt' eliminate the possibility. Personaly the image looks rather unasthetic to me.. is it proportional? Has this been measured?

    --
    CAn'T CompreHend SARcaSm?
  32. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by ceejayoz · · Score: 2

    Are you thinking what I'm thinking?

    Yep... that Mediterranean Sea's looking a lot more suspicious now...

    ;)

  33. register.com guilty too by YeOldeGnurd · · Score: 2

    Yeah, that's right, register.com may be "aware" of other slams, but they are at least as bad. In fact, they are the only registry that has attempted to trick me into a "renewal" slam. I got the official-looking notice referring to my 5 domains just last week.

    --
    ...Nothing interesting here. Just move along...
  34. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by slickwillie · · Score: 2

    Are you talking about the Shroud of Turin or the Shroud of Urine?

  35. Early photography by rnturn · · Score: 4, Funny
    ``the Shroud of Turin may have been an earlier example (substantially earlier) of photography using ingredients as basic as egg-white for treating cloth (the photopaper) and urine for developing it.''

    Now while I'm wondering how someone decided that oysters were edible, I can wonder how someone figured out 2000 years ago that urinating on an egg-white soaked cloth would produce an recognizable image. I know that things like gun cotton and Bakelite were discovered by accident but this egg-white thing I'm finding a bit hard to believe. But I would sure like to see a Mel Brooks bit on that historic moment.

    --
    CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
  36. Krispy Kreme by BlueFall · · Score: 2, Funny

    Half the world has never eaten a Krispy Kreme donut.

    Is that by weight? ;-)

  37. the word "may" by fishbowl · · Score: 2

    I'm glad there's going to be a hearing (re: Maricopa) but I believe that everyone there will simply be clarified on the spirit of that law, which is to give the County a means to unilaterally sever a contract IF THEY WANT TO, and establishes some reasonsble grounds to do so, probably limited by what's appropriate to the State constitution.

    I don't read the statute as a binding mandate on the county to stop doing business with a contractor, but rather, as an escape valve that they may exercise if they so choose.

    I suspect that everybody who shows up Monday will be told as much, if the matter is even addressed. I'll try to be there...

    --
    -fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
  38. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2

    Yeah, but isn't the image on the shroud a negative?

    --
    When information is power, privacy is freedom.
  39. Maricopa Meeting Help by tickticker · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Hello, I am a member of PLUG and have RSVP'd for the meeting and was going to post a request to the slashdot community for documentation on successful conversions from M$ to Linux, including articles or links to sites, so I can go armed with some facts on government conversions including military, local, state, federal, school systems (many of our school systems in AZ use the same rules for contractors as the county does), etc. For instance, about those schools in the northwest that converted their labs recently. thanks, just reply to this thread and i will keep an eye out for it, or email me at the above address.

    1. Re:Maricopa Meeting Help by Quila · · Score: 2

      Why not a conversion to Apple? Gartner just showed a very low TCO in a study in Australia, and they're a lot easier for mediocre admins to keep straight.

  40. Re:Shroud evidence: Jesus underwent nuclear fissio by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2

    How much different is that from the Moses talking to a burning bush?

    --
    When information is power, privacy is freedom.
  41. Re:Great news for Linux! by Quila · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Microsoft is probably not a direct contractor to the county,

    MS likes to think its EULAs are binding contracts. Therefore, if the EULAs are valid, then there is a contract between the county and MS. Conclusion: Whenever someone in the county installs any MS product, MS is de facto a contractor.

    Alternate conclusion: MS wants its products used, and has to admit the EULAs aren't binding contracts in order to not be considered a contractor. All EULAs are then admitted by Microsoft to be invalid.

  42. Re:Great news for Linux! by tagishsimon · · Score: 2

    Alternate conclusion #2: Microsoft is a supplier. Suppliers supply goods. Contractors supply services.

  43. Newsflash: by Aapje · · Score: 2

    Jesus suffered from obesity. He ate far too much radioactive fish. The evidence: the lake was so polluted that you could walk on it.

    --

    The Drowned and the Saved - Primo Levi
  44. Re:It's JEBUS by danro · · Score: 2

    And yet he didn't vaporize most of the middle east during his e=mc^2 ascent to heaven. (70kg matter makes a _lot_ of energy...)

    Truly miraculous ;-)

    --

    "First lesson," Jon said. "Stick them with the pointy end."
  45. Re:Great news for Linux! by Quila · · Score: 2

    The point is that MS and other software companies are trying to deny they are suppliers of goods. That would imply a sale, which would give the consumer rights under law, and they don't want that. They are instead saying they are implementing a licensing program where there is a license (contract) between the consumer and the vendor to use the software. They are therefore contractors.

    This actually falls within one of the parts of TCO that I've heard mention here. A careful company would have the lawyers review every EULA very carefully for every piece of software installed by every employee. The reason being that an employee would be entering the company into a legal contract (click-wrap) without prior legal review.

  46. Krispy Kreme donuts by Luyseyal · · Score: 2

    as an Austinite, it's my duty to profess the truth: Round Rock donuts are better.
    And now, back to your regularly scheduled surfing...
    -l

    --
    Help cure AIDS, cancer, and more. Donate your unused computer time to worldcommunitygrid.org. Join Team Slashdot!
  47. Re:Maricopa's Policies by SEWilco · · Score: 2
    Policies like this?

    Chapter 11.28
    Suspension And Debarment Of Contractors

  48. Maricopa letter translated by r_j_prahad · · Score: 2

    You recently inquired about the County's use of Microsoft products and the manner in which we license their software.

    You got my ass raked over the coals by the Board of Supervisors. Goddamned Linonuts.

    We appreciate your interest in the County's technology plans.

    I'm damned tired of you taxpayers poking your nose into how I waste, errr I mean spend, your money. If you'd all just die now, it would make my career that much easier.

    To provide a forum in which to discuss our technology direction and address any questions you may have, we will have Information Technology staff members available to meet with citizens at 8:30 am on Monday July 8th.

    I'm gonna have enough MCSEs at that meeting to outnumber you commie hippy Linonuts two-to-one. And Microsoft plans on having every OEM and VAR in the valley there too.

    Please RSVP your attendance so we can ensure that adequate facilities are available for the meeting.

    I'm making sure that most of the audience will be Microsoft shills, and the place will be so crowded by sunrise you won't even get inside. There'll be enough of us make you look pretty stupid if this gets on TV. But it probably won't.