The Perl Journal On The Ropes

rochlin writes "Looks like The Perl Journal might not make it up for air after all. This blurb is on their website. 'Time is running short and we need your help if The Perl Journal is to get another chance at being the real deal. As of a couple of minutes ago, we only have 881 subscriptions and the deadline is fast approaching. Please subscribe now. It only costs 3 cents per day to get the best Perl coverage anywhere.'" They need 3,000 subscribers to move forward.

Comments

3 cents per day?

[Prince_Ali]

That is pretty cheap, but I don't need 30 3 cent charges on my credit card every month.

Just Die Already

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry for the doom and gloom, but Perl.com has pretty much nailed down the business of keeping Perl users up to date with news and events. There doesn't appear to be a need for the Perl Journal anymore, and no one is going to subscribe with real cash after the debacles of the past couple of years.

$12 a year

[LeapingGnomeArs]

Hmm, $12 a year, same price as a subscription to Wired. Now I wonder, which will you get more info from that will actually help you in your job? (hint: the journal)

Re:$12 a year

[e2d2]

Hmm, $12 a year, same price as a subscription to Wired. Now I wonder, which will you get more info from that will actually help you in your job? (hint: the journal)

Yeah, But which one can you KILL a man with because of all the advertisements? (hint:wired)

Perl Monks!

[Mithrander]

Who needs Perl Journal when there's Perl Monks? Great resource!

I'm still waiting on one unfulfilled subscription

[CresentCityRon]

I really enjoyed the orginial rag. I have all the issues and they are fun to flip through even today.

I have a problem with my original subscription just vanishing in the middle like it did. Normally you would get some crap alternate magazine when your magazine hits the dirt. But instead I get the offer of yet another subscription that could fizz out.

I think I'll wait and buy the back issues. At least I know they'exist.

Re:I've been at odds with CMP ever since BYTE

[Anonymous Coward]

yea, right. Last time I paid for my Perl journal subscription, they got sold to earthweb, took my money and refused to send a magazine, refused to return calls, refused to return email. Why should I re-subscribe to a magazine thats till owes me a years subscription?

How could it work?

[ageitgey]

From the website:

Well, sort of. We need your help. TPJ is totally reader supported. To provide TPJ to you, we need 3,000 subscribers. Bean counters and suits being what they are, our bosses won't let us publish the e-zine if we don't have enough subscribers. It's as simple as that.

3,000 readers * $12.00 subscription = $36,000 yearly income before taxes and bandwidth costs.

How could they survive on that? You couldn't even pay one decent perl programmer to write articles. Who is paying all the "bean counters and suits"?

maybe expand coverage to Ruby and Python

[raistlinthegreat]

Python and Ruby are becoming more and more popular. especially Ruby has many fans who came
from a Perl background.
maybe "The Perl Journal" should be a "Ruby, Perl, Python" Journal.

Re:maybe expand coverage to Ruby and Python

[Masem]

To some extent, I'd agree with this, or at least expanding the idea of a magazine to cater to the cross-platform scripting language, which includes, but not limited to, perl, python, tcl, ruby, and so forth. All the major non-scripting programming languages have significant journal support, but typically these languages are limited to sys admin magazines (I've seen a lot of scripting basics appearing in tLinuxJ/LinuxMag; heck, wasn't TPJ part of SysOp mag at some point?). More so, nearly all of these languages work with HTTP/CGI, XML, and other newer technology, so there is certainly some commonality amoung them.

Heck, add some sh/bash programming into that as well. Those aren't just for sysops anymore!

I'd even include adding language toolkits like PHP that are still scripting languages but for a specific application (in this case, web delivery)

Of course, I'm sure there are those that only want to read about perl, or only about python, etc. Of course, some magazines that proport to be just about a certain language typcially get a lot of sidetracks in them as well (for example, the C/C++ UJ often has an issue on Windows programming about once every 6 months, which gives no benefit if you aren't doing Windows programming). I'd argue that you provide columns on those and then give some good general columns (such as writing consistant UIs across platforms, securing scripts, using new techs & TLAs in these languages) and you'd have a pretty damn tight magazine. Call it "The Scripting Journal".

Re:maybe expand coverage to Ruby and Python

[eddy the lip]

I'd like a perl only magazine - I used haunt the local comp bookstore everytime I knew a new TPJ was coming out. I like dead-tree publications, and I honestly don't understand the "why pay for something I can get free online" crowd for the whole list of usual reasons.

But, I'm not signing up for TPJ this time around. Why?

1. the way it suddenly vanished last time, to be replaced by SysAdmin subs. I've picked up a couple issues of SysAdmin, and it never had enough that was relevant to me.
2. I respect everything Jon Orwant has done to keep TPJ alive, but the light descriptions I've heard of the new TPJ just doesn't sound like the publication it used to be.
3. (much to my chagrin), I'm not doing much perl work lately, which means it would be in the strictly recreational category for me. If I had time for recreational programming these days, that would be great. I don't.

Strangely enough, for these reasons (especially the last one), I probably would subscribe to "The Scripting Journal." It would have some perl in it it give me that warm fuzzy feeling, and enough other stuff that I do currently work with daily to allow me to justify the time. I enjoy scripting languages, so something like that would be a nice combination of work and play. I fear it's never to be, though, and that I'm stuck with online-only publications.

Perhaps more sponsorship is the answer, such as..

[joshua404]

Change the publication's name to..

Microsoft .NET Presents The Perl Journal

no?

It's a problem of skiddish subs.

[Lumpy]

I know that I wont subscribe just to see my subscription fizzle out like last time. and i am sure there are many others out there who also are feeling the same way.

TPJ was awesome, the problem is that how things ended before is making a whole bunch of us not wanting to take the plunge but stand back and watch.

yes It's only $30 some odd dollars.. and to most here they burn that much lighting their Illegally Impotred Cubans.. But to the very few of us who are the working poor and can make $30.00 pay for lunchs for an entire week while eating better than the sod's who blow $30.00 a lunch.. I'm not gonna risk it.... not until I see they are actually alive.

Who is paying all the "bean counters and suits"...

[peterdaly]

In a word: Advertising.

Most magazine subscriptions costs just barely, if at all, cover the mailing costs. With an online magazine like this one, fixed costs are a little different, but I am sure they are still planning to rely on advertising to plug the money gap.

Hell, I have a couple "newstand" magazines which the publishers send to me for free to get the ads in front of me, since I fit a valued advertising demographic for them. Think about PCWeek and stuff (are they still around?) I used to get a mailbox full of free computer trade rags each week pro-bono.

-Pete

Why the journal is dying...

[pongo000]

I am an active Perl developer, have been for several years. All the information I need is available on-line: PerlMonks, newsgroups, etc. I have never run across a question I've had that hasn't been asked by someone else, in one form or another.

So give me one good reason why I would choose to spend my hard-earned dollars on a resource that is (1) dated as soon as the PDF hits the mailbox and (2) replicated by on-line resources?

To support the Perl movement, you say? I do that already by teaching others about Perl. That is my contribution to the world of Perl: My time in exchange for evangelization, certainly a cause Larry Wall would find acceptable.

I'm sorry, but in this day and age where information is abundantly available on the 'net, I see journal publication (dead-tree or on-line) as a poor, not-profitable business model. The idea that profit can be made from information is becoming obsolete, especially in the IT world (unless you have control over proprietary information, like Sun or Microsoft).

BTW, I'm using the term "profit" loosely here, to simply mean money available from revenues that can be put back into the business. Nothing in this post is meant to reflect upon the business motives of any of the TPJ organizers.

Re:Why the journal is dying...

[aengblom]

So give me one good reason why I would choose to spend my hard-earned dollars on a resource that is (1) dated as soon as the PDF hits the mailbox and (2) replicated by on-line resources?

Depends on how you answer these questions:

• How much is your time worth?
  
• Might the Perl Journal save you $12 of time per year?
  
• Might the Perl Journal teach you something in high-quailty (read, short and easily understandable) fasion that is worth $12 during that year. More importantly, might that lesson not only intersted you, but allow you to never need to ask that question.

Author of comment has no knowledge of Perl or Perl Journal, but believes in the value of high quality content.

Re:Why the journal is dying...

[Dog and Pony]

I agree with you. I don't need it, for the same reasons, and I support the community the same way as you do.

Still, I subscribed. Why? Well, partly because $12 is no cash, even for someone that doesn't have a lot of it.

Also, I like the idea that people try to get money for what they do online instead of using banner ads. Even though a lot of great people put their, often superb, content online for free, that is not an option for some. And I do respect that. I'd rather pay for some content that I might like than have it soiled with banner ads. If I don't like it, fine, I'll stop paying.

I strongly disagree that the dead-tree business is going away though - there is always room, and I think will always be for books and papers. For one, although they are possible to take with you on the toilet and to bed, they are not comfortable. Hell, it isn't even comfortable reading from your laptop when sitting in your favourite chair.

All in all, people that write and provide content should be rewarded. Some with money, some with tolerating their stupid ads, and some with credit (maybe the greatest currency of them all). Which they want, is up to the provider.

But of course, everyone wants the free lunch. Even when the grouceries to make the meal costs (like bandwidth, servers and time). *Sigh*

No, you don't have to do what I do. But what I do, I do with open eyes, and because I a) want something, and b) support something. Maybe a poor choice, but at least I will know.

Re:Why the journal is dying...

[rochlin]

What's in TPJ that isn't available free on the net? Articles by people who know what they're talking about like Lincoln Stein and Randall Schwartz (instead of 1 paragraph blurbs). Articles that give detailed examples and code commentaries (I learned much more about how to generate Excel worksheets from Perl than I could get from the relatively thin, informal docs - an unfortunate CPAN tradition).

I'll grant that it's not a good sole source for recent news, but for actually learning about something you didn't know (didn't know existed sometimes) in a much more friendly format than a POD, TPJ is just the best source. I subscribed before and I tried to subscribe to this new edition (and I posted this thread on /.)

Save Perl

[rigmort]

Please don't turn Slashdot into a begging site. Next thing you know we'll be Saving Karyn here...

Re:perl suxor

[OrangeSpyderMan]

It will never die, if it is still in your heart.

Kewl. Embedded Perl. :-)

Re:I'm still waiting on one unfulfilled subscripti

[elmegil]

I'm thinking you didn't pursue your money very far then. The original subscriptions were honored by the transition to TPJ as a section of SysAdmin. Quite honestly, the transition sucked for a number of reasons, and that's why the partnership ended up failing. But the original subscriptions were honored for anyone Jon could track down (which basically means anyone who bothered to email him asking what the deal was).

Don't be so quick to show your rich tastes.

[Inoshiro]

If you were living in Canada, that'd be over $55,000.

To put this in perspective, you can live a decent life in a nice house that you are paying off for $18,000 a year (yes, that includes internet access, food, utilities, etc).

Even after taxes you still have 10-15 grand to just piss away! I know that some US centres are very expensive to live in (NYC, Boston), but is everywhere in the US so damned expensive that you can't live on less than an appreciable fraction of a million dollars?

TPJ-"Thank you sir, may I have another?"

[fence]

I just signed up for TPJ pdf subscription, even though I got burned on the magazine subscription.

I was a subscriber to the TPJ mag since issue #3, and had just sent in my payment for three more years when I received a notice that they were discontinuing The Perl Journal and would begin sending me Sys Admin mag instead to finish out my subscription.

Received one Sys Admin mag in the mail, then nothing...What a deal.

So, I must be a glutton for punishment to send them MORE money, but I really enjoyed TPJ's content and was usually able to apply something from each issue to my daily work.

Twelve bucks a year is a pretty good investment for quality content that TPJ has provided in the past.

CMP deserve no pity - let them squeal

[ites]

They killed BYTE magazine and ran off with the subscription monies.
I'm not surprised they are having trouble now.
And I'm not moved in the least.
Sorry for the journalists, but your company stinks.
Come on, Perl Journal, it is time to go away.

TPJ is well worth saving

[jacobito]

Yes, you can find volumes of Perl help online. There's still something to be said for well written and well edited articles by credentialed authors. If you haven't read the Perl Journal before, have a look at the archives before you shrug and move on. You may find that the magazine is worth it after all.

old media model not working ...

[beanerspace]

There is an interesting article over at HealYourChurchWebSite describing how a local newspaper in the D.C. area has turned from free content to subscription only access. In the blog, the author complains that the local paper suffers because the content is not compelling, but rather a rehash of AP and Washington Post stories.

Could this be the problem with the Perl Journal? Are they really only offering a rehash of articles you can find at PerlMonks, PerlCircus and other online news/user sources? Look at two titles from Fall 2002.

• Parsing RSS Files with XML::RSS
• Does SOAP Suck?

I mean, can't I get the same skinny the first topic from XML.com and the other from Scripting.com?

Or is it because Perl itself has reached a plateu? I mean, other than ActiveState, who's doing anything innovative and hot with regards to Perl development tools on a commercial basis? I mean aside from the obligatory Shareware editors?

Perhaps it because much of the "action" is occuring in the Open Source arena, such as the CPAN and SourceForge that leave the Perl Journal much less to write about than they did 10 years ago?

I mean I'm sorry to see it go, but I can't honestly say I'm going to be handicapped without it.