Visiting the World, as a Geek?

Han Onymous asks: "In nine months my contract as a research assistent at my Alma Mater will come to an end. It will not be renewed, I don't want it to be anyway. But outside the economy is too ill to welcome me. I am young. I am healthy. And I want to see the world before I've got the wife and the kids and the double mortgage. I have no money saved, and I don't plan to save some until then. What can a skillful geek (electrical, electronical and software engineer, speaks three languages fluently) like me do to see the world. Volunteer ? Working for a multinational with exchange programs? Something with no connection at all to the tech world? Please share your experience."

Comments

merchant marine

[Shadow Wrought]

One of my Grandpa's buddies did an around the world tour by getting a cabin aboard a merchant marine ship.

It was super cheap and he got to spend a week or so in all sorts of different port towns. I have no idea whether it would interest you or not, but I contemplated doing it before I met my fiancee.

BTW, the guy who did this was 83!

So you don't necessarily have to do it while you are young;-)

Change your plans and save money!

[Ichoran]

Money = flexibility. You have nine months. If flexibility and adventure are important to you, save some now. Whether you end up in the Peace Corps or whatever, it will help give you room to breathe.

Teach English

[RealAlaskan]

If you LOOK american [1], you should be able to teach English in Taiwan. You could make a bit more than enough to live on, and living somewhere is far better than being a tourist there [2]. My inlaws have been trying to get me to do that, but I'm making significantly better money here. I suspect that you could do the same thing in Japan, and most of the Orient.

If you are looking for technical work which will further your career, things may be a little harder. I know that the big investment banks have operations around the world, and use lots of expensive IT, and lend people between countries at least occasionally. This is a bad time to be looking for that kind of job, though, and if you want to have a life, and see your surroundings, you don't want to work there.

[1] You don't have to BE a native English speaker, just look like one. If you look Chinese, you will have a hard time convincing the locals that you speak proper English, even if you grew up here and speak no Chinese!

[2]If you want to learn about the place, rather than simply see the sights and move on.

I can't believe this-

[purduephotog]

- Hey, it's simple. Really. Book a flight overseas. Pick a return date. Figure out what to do once you get there and just DO stuff. There has GOT to be somet things you'd like to see- Eiffel Tower, Louver, Rome, etc- you know what you WANT to do, so go do it!

I did the same thing, disappeared for a month. Hooked up with total strangers for a couple of days. Drifted apart. Took pictures

No one can make a trip but you- and if it doesn't work out you'll have only your geeky self to blame rather than that 'stupid slashdot crowd'. Figure out what you want out of life and do it, or do you have absolutely no iniative?

I can only speak in negatives...

[I Am The Owl]

But don't do something tech-related. You have the rest of your life ahead of you to do that. Do something you've never done before and probably won't have another chance to. Several people here have suggested that you go to a foreign country and teach English; I concur with this sentiment. It seems like an excellent way to see the world.

All in all, it's not unlike college: do it because it's a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, not the beginning of the rest of your life.

Yes, you are being cynical

[kvn299]

I served in the Peace Corps in the mid-90s. Although I do admit these are extraordinarily dangerous times, there were plenty of dangers in the world during that time as well. In addition, I recently spent two years traveling all over kingdom come. There were lots of dangers, but what I gained by traveling far outweighed the risks involved.

Upon returning home to the US after Peace Corps, I never felt more unsafe in my entire life. In Cameroon, my host country, my neighbors looked out for me. If something bad was going to happen it would most likely be someone pointing a gun at me and taking my money. If you did what was asked, then you were OK. They weren't doing it for kicks.

In the US, my chances of dying in a car crash were much higher compared to the chances of that happening in Cameroon. Or someone might break into my house and shoot me just for the hell of it... etc. etc. Have you been reading the papers lately???

These times *are* dangerous. But you shouldn't let fear prevent you from experiencing everything the world has to offer. A little common sense during travel goes A LONG LONG WAY in increasing your safety.

Go live and stop hiding in your house.

Commendable!

[pvera]

My hat is off to you sir.

I was going to say go for something unrelated, but there's plenty of volunteers working on normal average stuff that anyone can do. If you want to do good, volunteer in something that allows you to use your specialty.

For example, if I were a linux guy, I would find one of the groups that collects old hardware, reconditions it and deploys it with Linux at places (wherever) that cannot afford new computers and/or Windows. If you can do that and train a few locals too you will be making greater impact than volunteering for the Peace corps and handing out leaflets on birth control, vaccines, etc.

The reason I recommend you to pick something that allows you to use your experience is because you don't want to be left out of touch with your field for over a year (this would literally mean professional suicide for an IT person). If you are in IT and you spend a year making old and tired hardware work, you will hone your skills while you do something good, and it will even make good resume fodder later down the road.

Me? If I was single and felt like doing so, I would find a Spanish-speaking country and volunteer to teach programming and "Nerd English" to junior high kids (those of you that, like me, are not native English speakers know what I am talking about). To me teaching is the most challenging and rewarding occupation I could think of when salary is not an issue.

Re:Get some credit cards

[swordgeek]

Rather than modding this down, I'll reply.

What you propose will either (a) not work, or (b) get you into deep legal trouble, at least in the US, Canada, and as far as I know, all of the UK.

If you have $20k in cash and $20k in debt, you have a net worth of $0, which won't get you approved for a mortgage on that apartment. Business or residential, you'll still need that mortgage, and the banks WILL find your debt.

Unless, of course, you're planning on hiding it from them. Then you'll be committing fraud, and you still won't get away with it.

Forget this advice. Just go travelling!

Re:Peace Corps

[Wyatt Earp]

Now is just as safe as before, as long as you stay on a mostly beaten path.

I went to Isreal during the first intifata and in '94 right after the Jewish settler shot up the mosque. I stayed in the far north of Isreal when Hezbollah was all fired up. It was safe. Honestly, even in the recent bombing frenzy in Israel it's still a 1 in 100,000 chance of being geeked.

If one has some common sense about traveling and where not to go, it's pretty safe to travel the world.

Don't go to Afghanistan, Iraq, rural southern Phillipines, rural former Eastern-Bloc nation, rural former Soviet Republic, don't get off I-90 between Spokane and Missoula at night, or if you don't look Aryan, don't go to rural Columbia, don't hook up with Shining Path leaders in Peru.

If one has some common sense, don't worry about it.

I stayed on the beach in Tel Aviv for 3 weeks, people told me not to do it, but if you take some precautions and avoid gettin' plastered, it's safe as anything.

Terror can happen anywhere on Earth. From Finland to Belfast to gas stations in the DC metro area to a night club in Bali, a 85% Hindu island.

The secret is to be careful out there.

How fucking depressing

[NineNine]

if you put it off you probably won't get around to it until retirement.


WHY? Why does everybody have this mindset that there's no choice after college except to get a boring job in a cubicle, get married, pop out kids, buy a big house, and hopefully, have enough time and money at the end to sit on your ass for a few years? That's so fucking depressing. You've only got one shot at life, and it may not be long. You never know. If you think that the rest of your life will be so bad that you won't get to do what you want to do (or at least, not for another 40 years), then you need to rethink things. Hell, just watch Fight Club a few times and *think* about it.

- From a person living a very unusual, fun, and rewarding life (ie: not a lemming)

Re:How fucking depressing

[geekd]

Amen, brother!

So many people get trapped into doing what they are "supposed" to do. Society pressures you into it. RESIST!

There's nothing wrong with marrige, children and home ownership, if that's what *you* want.

Think for yourself.

Hell, I'm married, and I'm in escrow on my first house right now. No kids, though, and we probably won't have any. No patience for 'em.

I spent almost 10 years trying to be a rock star before I got tired of being poor and got a real job. If I'd never tried I would have regretted it for the rest of my boring ass life.

Travel the world, dude. Travel for as long as you like. There will always be a job for a man of your skills when your ready (if your ready) to settle down. Jesus, 3 languages and how many tech skills? Write your own ticket.

Do what you want. But make sure it's what *you* want, and not what you're *supposed* to want. That's all I'm saying.

Re:How fucking depressing

[Parsec]

Well said, sir!

To Han Onymous (and everyone else):
Socrates said "The unexamined life is not worth living." I don't think he meant us to just examine it once and decide. You have to examine every day and ask if this is the path you want to be on. You have to always be open to new ideas. If you're not growing, you're decaying.

Re:How fucking depressing

[DNS-and-BIND]

Well, there's a downside to it, as well. Hedonism is fine, but when you're pushing forty and you still haven't heeded the biological urge to reproduce, you'll feel regret. Besides, if you wait that long to have children, you'll be sixty by the time they get out of school. Hedonism inevitably leads to ennui. Friends move on. Passing yourself on to the next generation is the only way to achieve immortality.

Of course, YMMV. I was lucky enough to have a generally positive family, who actually gets together on the holidays and vacations together once a year at grandpa's expense. I can understand how those who had crappy families would want to stay as far away from that experience as possible by immersion in pleasure-seeking.

Re:Peace Corp

[bugnuts]

If I were modding, I'd mod you up, dan.

But there's one big, nasty assumption you're making when you say Which story would you rather tell your grand children: '... and our database design was better than everyone elses' or '... and there I was in my fox hole with bombs exploding all around me ...'?

The assumption you're making is that you'll live to have grandchildren if you have bombs going off around you. I would say that now might NOT be the time to join the military, unless you honestly want to see action. Most geeks I know don't "take orders" very well, and aren't very keen on shooting at others, unless they're driving a remote-control joystick-driven bomb with cool graphics and lots of 'splosions.

Re:Peace Corp

[Dolly_Llama]

Most geeks I know don't "take orders" very well

This is a common excuse for people reticent about joining the military. The obvious response is 1) You take orders regardless of whether they come from a sergeant or your shift manager at the Taco Bell. Live with it. 2) Someone has got to be giving the orders, so if you think you can do better, get yourself some stripes or a commision and try it yourself tough guy. Seriously, the military is only as good as its personnel. It needs smart kids (geeks even) as much as it needs stereotypical grunts. The majority of manpower aren't people shooting, but supporting those who shoot.

Re:Peace Corp

[Ian Bicking]

You take orders regardless of whether they come from a sergeant or your shift manager at the Taco Bell. Live with it.

If your shift manager tells you to do something against your judgement or your ethics, you can always quit. You can't quit the army, and you can't refuse to do what they tell you. The worst things done by humans have always been done under orders.

Personally, I believe I am responsible for what I do, regardless of who tells me to do it. When you volunteer yourself into a coercive situation, you have handed your soul over to another's judgement. Maybe you think the people you take orders from are going to be good caretakers of your will and your soul, but that's one hell of a risk. Do you really know them that well? Do you even know who the hell they are? It's a long chain of command, and in any situation it's hard to know where it ends... do they even tell you where the command comes from? Do they ever tell you why? Are you willing to live blind?

When you spend your time playing games and doing busywork this doesn't much matter. I wouldn't bet on irrelevence anymore, though.

You are very, very wrong.

[raehl]

I did pretty much everything in high school except music and drama, and I loved it. I got to do some really cool stuff, event went to DC for a week and met a buncha real politicians. (They look like real people up close!)

Now, don't get me wrong, I spent my fair share of time in front of the computer too, but if oyu'er not doing sports, or part of student council, or on the debate team - what are you doing with your free time? Drinking?

Frankly, I had a lot more fun in high school than my friends who spent most of their time high.

Oh, and there's one other very good reason to get into college:

I got to go to Europe for a YEAR because I got into college and knew some German.

Re:Peace Corp

[Ian Bicking]

Those caught doing unethical or downright criminal acts are held accountable. Think Mi Lai or Nuremburg.

Funny you should mention My Lai. From this article:

The My Lai massacre. On March 16, 1968, US soldiers from the Americal Division slaughtered 347 civilians--primarily old men, women, children, and babies--in the Vietnamese village of My Lai 4 (pronounced, very appropriately, as "me lie"). The grunts also engaged in torture and rape of the villagers.

Around six months later, a soldier in the 11th Light Infantry Brigade--known among the men as "the Butcher's Brigade"--wrote a letter telling of widespread killing and torturing of Vietnamese civilians by entire units of the US military (he did not specifically refer to My Lai). The letter was sent to the general in charge of 'Nam and trickled down the chain of command to Major Colin Powell, a deputy assistant chief of staff at the Americal Division, who was charged with investigating the matter and formulating a response.

After a desultory check--which consisted mainly of investigating the soldier who wrote the letter, rather than his allegations--Powell reported that everything was hunkey-dory. There may be some "isolated incidents" by individual bad seeds, but there were no widespread atrocities. He wrote: "In direct refutation of this portrayal is the fact that relations between Americal soldiers and the Vietnamese people are excellent." The matter was closed.

To this day, we might not know about the carnage at My Lai if it hadn't been for another solider who later wisely sent a letter to his Congressman. (Twenty-five years later Powell gave an interview in which he not only failed to condemn the massacre but seemed to excuse it.)

Though some of my faith in humanity was restored when I heard a historian note that by the end of the Vietnam War pilots were refused en masse to run bombing missions over North Vietnam, having destroyed all plausible military targets. (The military is working hard to make sure something like that can't happen again, e.g., military drones)

What bothers me about the military is there is no accountability when it comes to its past. What happened to the people who ordered LSD testing on soldiers? What happened to the people who used chemical warfare in Vietnam (Agent Orange)? What about the person who wrote the manual to teach the Latin American soldiers to torture? What does it mean that someone who tried to cover up My Lai has become Secretary of State? I don't know what has become of all the past military criminals, but it doesn't seem like much -- and anyone who joins the military now doesn't really know what they are going to be asked to do, or what the ultimate intentions of the leaders are. But past performance gives a pretty damn good idea.

And what you do in the military isn't about stupid shit like illegal monopolies. You can do wrong on a scale not normally possible in our everyday lives. Let's be honest: you can do evil. And you might not even realize it... when you flip the switch that drops the bomb, do you know if your cause is really just? Do you know who you are killing? Are you ready to kill a child? Are you ready to kill a mother? Because the military is killing a lot of children and mothers these days, and if the bombs start falling on Baghdad, the number of innocent dead is going to skyrocket, no one can deny it. Are you ready to be part of that killing machine?

It's one thing to bet your own life on a cause, but the military gave up that a while ago -- American soldiers die in accidents, not battle. Now they're betting other people's lives on it. The moral weight of killing is far heavier than the moral weight of dying. I'm not a Christian man, but I have great respect for the teachings of Jesus -- I think we all know on which side of the bomb he'd be on when it falls from the plane, and I think we'd all know which person would receive his blessings.