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Phoenix 0.4 Released
Clark Kent writes "Mozilla's little brother browser,
Phoenix, has reached
version 0.4. New enhancements include themes support, type ahead find, and
number of improvements to pop-up blocking, toolbar customization, and tabbed
browsing, as well as the usual bug fixes.
Get it here."
Has anyone noticed a real speed improvement over Mozilla (when only the browser is compiled in)?
{{.sig}}
Why should I switch from IE?
(Because it is Microsoft is not a valid answer)
What makes Phoenix so cool that I should bother with it?
Compare things like features, security, and resource usage.
Um.. well see, it comes with one BUILT IN, in case you didnt notice, in the upper right hand corner.. of course, it doesn't have all the features that I personally never used in the "real deal" google toolbar (pagerank, highlight, etc), but maybe that's what you crave. But for a quick search it's certainly handy.
Joseph?
From their FAQ: (http://www.mozilla.org/projects/phoenix/phoenix-r elease-notes.html)
*************
17. "Phoenix is getting bloated. I knew it would happen."
Phoenix is not getting bloated. Its download size is going down, for one thing. As stated earlier, the time to do the heavy lifting, feature work and redesign is early in the development cycle. That's where we are now -- this is 0.4, folks!
We're working hard to improve our support for extensions to reduce bloat. Without extensions support, we'd be pressured to include the add-ons in the default build.
I can't really tell you about Phoenix's features, etc as I'm about to start my download after I finish typing this comment, but I've been running Mozilla as my primary browser for a couple months now and it's quite nifty.
What I can tellyou is that no matter what anyone tells you about a browser, you won't be able to really appreciate what makes it great without trying it yourself.
Russ
Information doesn't want to be anthropomorphized anymore.
The post suggests that theme support is new to 0.4. That's probably my fault for a not-as-clear-as-it-could-have-been release note. Phoenix uses XUL. Part of XUL is that the browser GUI is styled using images and CSS. That makes any XUL-based product "skinable". This is the first release of Phoenix where there were a number of completed themes available but it is not the first release with support for themes. Theme support is a byproduct of the decision to build the UI with images and CSS (XUL). For more information and discussion of Phoenix themes and other Phoenix issues check out the MozillaZine Phoenix forums.
--Asa
Trolling using another account since 2005.
1.Your privacy can be assured. Tommorows EULA may want you to do a lot of things which you may not like. if you dont like privacy, then ignore this point. ;-). you will be making so many people on slashdot happy. They have given you +interesting karma. C'mon pay some back. Use phoenix. Better still use beta find bugs, report them. By helping in this effort you will be helping the common user. You will be helping freedom.
2.Free. Well since you bought win, it dosent apply maybe
3.Popup Blocking. If you say it dosent annoy you to have popups i think you are lying. I know you will say that third party programs are available, but many of those programs have spyware.
4. Security -> This was your question right? Well mozilla also may have some security issues, but going by record IE security issues have been far more alarming.
5. Conscience-> We all have one. I think you also do
6. Cool ness -> you gf comes and sees the dragon, my o my after boring netscape and IE logos you will show people u use the cool new browser.
7. Ego kick -> ever tried compiling a tough to compile software and see it run. I did kde 3.0beta, that to on solaris with most libraries missing. was real pain... but when it worked the ego kick was great. IE cant even come close to it.
My Aurora : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o91ZsGwJYyg
FB : https://www.facebook.com/TanveersPhotography
The Realistic Internet Simulator (Macromedia Flash required)
You get one built in and you can populate it with about 150 additional search engines by going to mozdev.org and installing additional mycroft plugins (they're very tiny, give it a try).
--Asa
googlebar
I tried it on Phoenix 0.2 and it worked. Not sure if it will on the newer versions. I heard there are problems with installing it on certain platforms as well.
People using Gentoo should check this link, it works great on my computer after I created a link to the 'missing' libc6-library.
As for memory footprint and speed: Yes, Phoenix *definitely* is a lot better, even compared to optimized builds (i.e. homecompiled with optimalisations, as Gentoo does)
Every expression is true, for a given value of 'true'
What a fast release cycle this has, certainly compared to Mozilla!
Phoenix is young and moving fast. The release cycles have averaged a couple weeks. Development is progressing really fast, though. That's because XUL is an extremely easy and fast environment in which to build applications and the two or three developers building Phoenix are the top XUL hackers on the planet (the guys that invented XUL). The Mozilla application framework has also seriously matured, making it much easier to build these kinds of appa. Scores of great reusable widgets, an awesome rendering engine, a top notch neyworking library, and a great security library give you all the pieces you need to assemble a variety of web-enabled apps. Check out mozdev.org for dozens of great XUL-based projects.
--Asa
I don't think themes should be included in a lean & mean browser.
"themes" aren't included in Phoenix. Phoenix has one UI (which is defined in part in images and CSS). The nature of the UI makes it possible for other people to easily create new styles or themes (images and CSS). Phoenix contains a trivial amount of code to manage the install and uninstall of themes but the themes themselves are 3rd party components and are not "include in" Phoenix.
--Asa
Phoenix should really ship with that extension, it's just great, you can do *EVERYTHING* with tabs with that extension.
A small comparison on my computer, which is an AMD Duron 750 with plenty (768 MB) of SDRAM-133. I'm running Gentoo 1.4 (GCC 3.2), so the Mozilla build is optimized. I'm running Phoenix 0.4 and Mozilla 1.1.
Startup, when both programs have been started before (e.g. large parts are probably cached in memory). Used my digital clock for this so, it's not that accurate, but a good indication:
Mozilla: 5-6 seconds
Phoenix: 1-2 seconds
Memory usage after startup, using google.com as homepage (measured using top):
Mozilla: Physical memory in use=24 MB (of which 15 MB is shared)
Phoenix: Physical memory in use=19MB (of which 12.5 MB is shared)
After browsing some sites which I will mention here so people can reproduce this if they want:
nu.nl, slashdot.org, tweakers.net (which is heavy on javascript), kde.org, tomshardware.com, cnn.com
FYI I don't have Java or Flash plugins installed, so Flash banners do not have influence on the Mozilla memory footprint.
memory usage is:
Mozilla: RSS=33 MB
Phoenix: RSS=25 MB
Not to mention that Phoenix feels a lot faster and more responsive.
So yeah, even an optimized Mozilla can't beat Phoenix by far. Go try it sometime if your biggest gripe about Mozilla is that it's a) slow and b) uses too much memory.
Every expression is true, for a given value of 'true'
apt-get install googlizer
or
http://packages.debian.org/googliz
Slight modification to make it work for everything2 compliments it well.
~.~
I'm a peripheral visionary.
1. Mozilla interface feels "heavy" and slow. The buttons just feel "heavy" to me. IE6 feels light and it looks like a Windows program. Plus, it loads more quickly.
2. Google toolbar. Yeah, I've used the mozdev one... and it's just not as impressive. I cannot do the following with the Mozdev bar:
3.Edit button. Again, a feature that rocks. I'm not sure how many people use this, but as a web developer, I do on pretty much a daily basis. Example: I need to pull a table from a website I'm working on. One click and the whole HTML source is loaded up in Dreamweaver MX and I'm working on editing the HTML. No FTP'ing the file down and then finding it on my hard drive. I just pull it straight from IE.
4.View Partial Source. Once again, mostly a web developer tool, but an invaluable one at that. I highlight any part of the page, click "View Partial Source", and I'm staring at the source code that created that part of the page. This is part of the IE5 Web Developer Tools add-on, and it works fine with IE6. I also use Images List to see all the images and their sizes in a certain page. (Not sure if Mozilla has that.)
As far as popup blocking goes, I use AdSubtract. Once again, I cannot recommend this highly enough. In addition to blocking popups, it blocks ALL advertisements. Plus, you can tell it to turn on/off Javascript, cookies, referrers, and pretty much anything else on a per-site basis. Just add the URL to the list and check which things you want to block, and you're set. It's configurable via your systray. This program is awesome.
Here's my page that demonstrates exactly what AdSubtract does. It's so much more powerful than what Mozilla does that I'm amazed more people don't talk about it.
I suppose I should add the usual disclaimer that I don't work for any of the above companies, etc. I'm just a PHP/web developer. I thought I should add my reasons for not using Mozilla, though, just so you can have both sides of the story. I'd also hope that any Mozilla developers reading this (Asa?) will take this story into account when it comes time to figure out what features should go into the next version of Mozilla. The features I use in IE may be some of the more obscure ones, but until I see functional equivalents in Mozilla, I won't be switching.
Simpli - Your source for San Jose dedicated servers and colocation!
That I was testing some of our sites with a fellow employee, when after a while he seemed puzzled as to why one of the buttons didn't seem to click (Mozilla doesn't seem to like myform.button.value, you have to put document.myform.button.value). He seemed visibly surprised when I told him I wasn't using Explorer. Then I showed him reading down a web page, right clicking on links where they loaded in tabs in the background... then going and reading each of the pages afterwards. Plus right clicking on tabs to instantly close them. He was very impressed.
Even though Phoenix is faster and more stable than Explorer, I found the only real way to switch was to delete all the Explorer icons from the desktop and the taskbar. Otherwise some old habits are too hard to break!
Phoenix combined with Privoxy (plus the occasional run of AdAware)... the currently unbeatable combination on WinXP.
Phillip.
Property for sale in Nice, France
So when Phoenix 1.0 is finally released, we will be able to fight communism in covert operations, counter the plans of the evil Murdoch, get to save our clumsy friends and build bombs with a refrigerator or a flamethrower with a vibrator ?
Cool ! Phoenix Foundation really rules.
Side joke :
Q:how many 't's are there in "MacGuyver" ?
A: 76 : "ta ta ta ta ta ta ta
tatata
tatata
tatatata ta ta ta
tatatata tatata tatata tatata tatata tata..."
How to make a keyword search? Simple!
Search for a word on google (or any other search engine). Our word ="xyzzy".
When you get the results, add the resulting page as a bookmark.
Open "Manage bookmarks". Open properties of your new Google bookmark. The Location will look something like:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=xyzzy
Now replace "xyzzy" in your bookmark with "%s". The result should look something like:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%s
Now you just add your keyword in the bookmark/properties field saying "Keyword:". We put "g" there.
Done! Click OK.
Now you can search google for xyzzy by entering "g xyzzy" in your location field.
This works in both Mozilla 1.1+ and Phoenix 0.3+. It might even work in earlier versions.
--
"I'm surfin the dead zone
In the twilight, unknown"
First off, tabs, greatest thing on earth.
They are cool. I'll bet you dollars to donuts that IE7 has them.
My Karma: ran over your Dogma
StrawberryFrog
I have a 200mhz laptop w/ 96 M ram, and a 1.4 ghz desktop w/ 256M ram.
On the laptop,
Mozilla: Painfully slow
Phoenix: Usable
On the desktop:
Mozilla: The best browser I have ever used
Phoenix: Not sufficiently faster to make up for the fact that I can't search google straight out of the address bar.
microsoftword.mp3 - it doesn't care that they're not words...
Did any other mozilla users notice tabs behave consistently in Phoenix? You can not only middle-click on links to open them in a new tab, but also on bookmarks!
Now I'd just like the same behavior on form buttons...
"And like that
Just for reference, the computer I'm using is a Thinkpad P2-233, 288mb RAM, 512mb pagefile and a 10gb IBM 4500RPM HDD, running Windows 2000 Pro SP2.
... but when it reacts more sluggishly still than Netscape 4.79, I think I'll wait a while before using it as my primary browser.
All times are the average of three or four tests, eyeballing the clock.
Startup Time
Netscape 4.79: 4s
Phoenix 0.4: 10s
Slashdot Homepage Load Time
Netscape 4.79: 1.5s
Phoenix 0.4: 2.5s
RAM Usage (with only Slashdot Homepage loaded)
Netscape 4.79: 8012k
Phoenix 0.4: 20,182k
Now, don't get me wrong, I think that the fact that the Phoenix people are trying to make a slim browser is great!
(BTW, this is the main reason I don't use Mozilla... it's a DOG on this machine. Even IE's kinda slow.)
I just tried Phoenix 0.4, and really like it, even over Mozilla. But because I really like Mozilla's email program, I won't switch to Phoenix until and unless Mozilla Mail is offered standalone from the browser. There's no sense in using Mozilla Mail and not using Mozilla's web browser... most of the stuff needed is in memory, so I might as well use it!
Here's hoping Mozilla is split up into separately installable components in the future. I have no desire to go back to any of the other email programs I've ever used (Outlook, Outlook Express, Eudora mostly).
Good job on Phoenix though, very cool!
"And like that
Use the damn built-in Windows MIME types!
Often, this is because of a misconfigured web server installation that doesn't recognize the .zip extension and send the application/zip media type. It may send the older media type application/x-zip-compressed or the generic application/octet-stream; Windows doesn't find an association for either of those types.
On the other hand, IE will sometimes ignore the media type and use the file's extension instead. This is part of what led to the <iframe> vulnerability, which Nimda and Klez exploited
Will I retire or break 10K?
You could always try reading the release notes
Its knows issue # 2
I understand the motives of the Phoenix community: I'd love a leaner, faster Moz. But aren't we risking losing both Phoenix and Moz if we split into two separate projects?
... We also believe Mozilla, in general, is going in the wrong direction in terms of bloat and UI, and see no reason for our releases to carry those connotations.
First, few will contribute to or implement Moz if it looks like (and appearances count) its own developers and users are abandoning it.
Second, does mozilla.org have so many resources that it can be safely split between two projects? Either we have sufficient resources or one gets shortchanged.
Finally, isn't a lack of long term commitment to a product exactly what corporate IT fears about open source? Shouldn't we take extra steps to avoid the appearance of that problem?
Per the FAQ, and in many other places, the Phoenix developers definitely seem to intend to separate themselves from Moz:
it's not Mozilla. It's backed by mozilla.org, sure, but with each milestone you'll see it further diverge from Mozilla.
It's worth noting (again) that when you choose "block images from server", it still *downloads* the image, it just doesn't *show* you the image. This, I think, defeats most of the purpose of blocking images. Cast in a vote for bug 94118 in bugzilla if you think it's worth changing too.
Something on a blacklist is considered unacceptable, to be boycotted, or censured. A whitelist is the opposite -- something to be accepted. Since Phoenix can be set to block all popups (everything is blacklisted by default), the user then adds sites to the whitelist. A site on the whitelist will be allowed to have its popups show up. This is handy for sites that use popup windows legitimately.
In Phoenix, when a site attempts to launch a popup window, an icon shows up on the bottom. When clicked, the site can be whitelisted.
http://mozillako.hypermart.net/ieskin/
After installing it, you'll be surprised at how much "faster" mozilla seems.
The wheel is turning, but the hamster is dead.
The Phoenix project may be a wonderful thing, but from the home page I can't tell why, or whether I want to use it. At least it mentions what it is in deep geek.
Too many open source projects assume that those who read their home pages already know what the project is for, or know why they would want to use it.
I would ask open source project folks to at least put a short description of their project (with minimal cryptic references to geek acronyms) and also a list of reasons as to why one might want it.
Computing today is too wide a field for all of use to keep track of every acronym and every open source project, so a web page that says "this is a better BLURP, using FARGLE and the new XVC standard" is pretty useless.
After all, what good is it to put a lot of work into a project if you keep away a lot of users by inadequate "marketing." If you want your work to be used and appreciated by lots of people, tell us what it is and why we want to use it!.
The only good weather is bad weather.
I still use Mozilla most of the time, because I use Mozilla Mail as my mail client, but I have been using Nightly builds of Phoenix from time to time, and I have to say I'm impressed. With the Tabbed browsing extensions and Optimoz installed I think it is the best browser I have come accross.
I think that Phoenix is more than a good web browser though, I think it is nothing less than a complete vindication of the Mozilla project. Pheonix shows that all of the time put into Mozilla has not just produced bloat, it has also produced a code base that is useful enough to make something extremely efficent and effective, extremely quickly.
It is also very good to see something come out of Mozilla that isn't just an unbranded version of Netscape, and I would like to see more of this. Given the work that is going into producing the GRE (Gecko Runtime Environment) which aims to make a distribution of the bits of Mozilla that are used by everything, so that programs can be linked against it without needing the whole broweser suite to be installed, I think that Pheonix and other apps like it (a mail reader and all the rest) could be the future of Mozilla.
Mozilla 1.0 was both a Monolithic Communications Suite and an application framework, and Phoenix has shown the power of that frame work. I would like it if Mozilla 2.0 was just a framework, but it was released with a set of standalone programs that worked well together, but could be used equally well seperately, and I think it would do Mozilla's credibility a lot of good if it was something that definately isn't Netscape.
I wonder if anyone at Mozilla.org is thinking like this.
psr --History is ending.
I think by "any browser" he meant "any browser worth giving two shits about."
python -c "x='python -c %sx=%s; print x%%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))%s'; print x%(chr(34),repr(x),chr(34))"