China Concerned About Internal Copyright Infringers

sfled writes "Audience members at a recent movie preview had ID card numbers stamped on their theater tickets, were videotaped entering the lobby, and had to part with cellphones, watches, lighters, etc. as they passed through a metal detector. Why the big fuss? Because China's movie makers, artists and other creators of intellectual property are finally realizing that China's content-piracy industry doesn't just target imported movies, music, etc. Story at The New York Times, "free" registration, etc..."

Comments

Re:They need to enforce their laws for both

[commodoresloat]

I'm not sure why the above is insightful -- what is the link between pirating American movies and stifling Chinese creativity? I'm not sure whether them cracking down on piracy of American movies would have any effect whatsoever on their own "fledgling media."

Re:you won't hear me crying

[commodoresloat]

Billions of dollars have been lost (or should I say stolen) from American companies because of chinese piracy. Considering how badly the economy is doing now, that doesn't make me feel too good.

Yeah I'm sure we'd all be much better off economically if Hollywood billionaires were a few billion dollars richer. In any case, the idea that piracy in China represents "theft of billions" from American companies is pretty ridiculous since it assumes the people who buy pirated videos there would pay much higher prices for the "real thing." Probably a few of them would but I doubt you'd see billions if piracy in China suddenly stopped.

Re:you won't hear me crying

[Mmmrky]

This is been covered many, many times before, but:

1. If I pirate a movie I gain a movie (surprise!). Net change in company's revenue: 0.

2. I don't buy or pirate movie. I gain no movie, and company gets nothing.

3. I steal a physical copy (DVD) from company. Net gain for me: 1 movie. Net loss to company: cost of producing said DVD.

4. I buy the movie. I get a movie. They get my money.

Pirating (not that I endorse it) only causes a real loss if you would buy it if you couldn't get it illegally.

This will be great.

[fmaxwell]

Now the average, urban, Chinese person (who has a yearly income of about $800) can stop buying cheap pirated movies and can, instead, spend a week's wages to buy a commercial video. That is, provided he/she was not planning to squander that money on food, clothing, or shelter.

Those living in rural areas, where the per-capita income is about 1/3 that will just have to sell a family member into slavery if they really want that video.

Maybe before whining about the evil Chinese pirating videos and software, you should consider what their incomes are compared to ours.

Re:This will be great.

[fmaxwell]

Movies are a luxury item.

And, as we all know, only rich people deserve "luxury" items. Poor people in second and third world countries should just eek out a pitiful, impoverished existence, devoid of even the simple pleasure of seeing a movie. How dare they want more than that from life?

You make it sound as though they are a life necessity more important than food, clothing or shelter.

That's the point: They are not more important so the people of China, by and large, will be deprived of them if piracy is substantially eliminated.

Re:This will be great.

[fmaxwell]

Every time something like this comes up some ignorant USian says something like "The yearly income is $x, why would they spend $x/10 for a $item?"

When a U.S. firm exports a video tape or DVD to China, they expect to be paid in U.S. dollars by the importer. They don't give a rat's ass about the cost of living in China. Do you think that MGM will sell a $20 DVD for 44 in China (because China's per-capita income is 1/45th of that in the U.S.)? Do you think that Microsoft will sell them Windows XP upgrades for $4 (US retail of $180 divided by 45)? Do you honestly believe that U.S. firms will sell below their costs?

By your argument, buying a chocolate bar in China would cost about the same as buying a DVD in the US.

As a percentage of income? Probably so if it's a Hershey's or Nestle's chocolate bar. That's why they manufacture their own chocolate bars, paying the going wages in China rather than paying for chocolate bars produced by U.S. workers.

You cannot spend $50 to produce a product in the U.S. (where it sells for $100) and then sell it for $2.22 in China to make up for the per-capita income difference.

P.S. Don't call me "ignorant." As shown above, I am both more knowledgeable and more intelligent than you are.

Most pirates aren't Chinese

[NewsWatcher]

I was waiting for the inevitable Chinese people don't care about piracy, everything from fake watches to Windows are available in the streets of Hong Kong.
Does it not seem weird that most people here defend KaZaA et al as an opportunity to distribute material, but point an angry finger when Chinese people make copies of US films?

Just because they steal with a camera, and you steal with software doesn't make you any less of a pirate.

So lets get off the anti-Asian rants and show a bit of consistency. Either both are bad, or both are a chance for artists to reach an audience they otherwise would not.
Of course, IMHO they are both pretty insidious.
Has the intellectual moral high-ground stopped me downloading? Umm....I best not answer that.

Re:you won't hear me crying

[Henry V .009]

3rd - depriving of profit is not "stealing"- it's depriving of profit.

Points 1 and 2 are right on, but I have to disagree with the above.

Our society gives authors and creators a sort of 'implied contract'; they create, and we grant them copyright. Sure, no one signs anything, but none of us signed the constitution (which grants copyright authority to Congress) either. There are certain social obligations that everyone is bound to, whether or no they agree. In effect, you (through your legal institutions) have promised copyright, and in return the author has created something. Once the goods have been delivered, you are at least somewhat obligated to fulfill your side of the deal. Breaking this social contract is slightly different than merely depriving a corporation of profit. You can't give the author back their lost effort. On the other hand, I deprive McDonalds of profit every time I drive by their shitty restaurant and thank god that I'm not stopping.

Hypocrisy?

[chris mazuc]

It seems that despite almost no support on slashdot of any other intellectual property protection scheme, when it's the Chinese pirating American stuff it's a horrible crime. But when it's Americans pirating anyone else's works, including those by other Americans, it's something that should be protected. Make up your goddamn minds people! I personally think that the United States government has it's collective head up it's ass, but the premise for copyright is very well intentioned: give the producer of a work a temporary monopoly for their contribution to society. Back on topic... when you can honestly say that you support the MPAA, RIAA, and every other four letter organisation ending in AA it'll be fair for you to say that the Chinese pirates are wrong, but for the moment I suspect that most of the people posting about the evils of China are guilty of the same crime they are condemning.

Such eloquent arrogance :)

[Zemran]

I think that they think there is a difference between Chinese culture (including their films) and the hollywood pap. When using internal flights in China I have to watch Chinese films (the only time I watch them) and I am often surprised at how good they are. If I were Chinese I would be proud of the Chinese film industry. I would also want to protect it.

I do not think it is really posible to protect a film as it has to go public at some point or it serves no purpose. At some point the film will get into the hands of the ripper, he will get the first release and have it on sale as quick as the original reaches general release. He normally has Hollywood films before they are released but that is because there are more crooks in Hollywood.

The Chinese do more to combat the rippers than the Americans do, but there is less respect for IP and more of an attitude of product in China. If Hollywood would sell a good product at a fair price the rippers would be out of business.

As for the valuable creative works, they are already doing it and they know that soon Hollywood will rip their ideas off just as they have always done in the past. Like with Yojimbo = A Fistfull of Dollars and Seven Samurai = The Magnificent Seven (I know Akira Kurosawa was Japanese but the point is still true). I think the most insulting thing is that Hollywood does not even make good copies of other peoples work.

Fledgeling?

[jesterzog]

There are more than a billion people in China. On what basis do you consider the Chinese movie industry "fledgeling"? Is it the fact that you never see any?

I guess you probably consider the Indian movie industry as fledgeling too, for the same reasons.

Re:you won't hear me crying

[ahfoo]

No kidding, theft has to be the most abused concept of the latter half of the twentieth century.
I'ts not just IP either. Think about what we've gone through with welfare. It took forever to get to the point that welfare moved from these welfare stores of the thirties with their dehumanizing proselytizing to food stamps to simple cash payments. Once the stigma was finally being stripped away the rhetoric immediately turned to THIEVERY! Those fucking thieving nigger bitchez is stealing frum our fragile economy. Dear Lordy, them thieving snakes are gonna kill us all!
Now nevermind that the money that disappeared from a bankruptcy like Enron could have supported hundreds of thousands of crack dependent welfare moms who could have at least been there for at home watching the kids instead of taking some menial position outside the home to gratify the expiatory fantasy of the revenge seeking TV audiance.
And nevermind the fact that the scandanvian nations are total welfare states. That's not thieving because everything is "fair" there.
Now we've gone from mothers caring for children as thievery to accessing information as thievery.
I don't believe the Chinese are sincere about this crackdown on intellectual property because the Chinese intellectual tradition is a tradition based on a surprising degree of anonymity in authorship. One can argue that this is a product of political expediency, but over so many centuries that seems to be a bit of a stretch. Moreover, many truly proud Chinese authors have historically denied their authorship because they felt it was the honorable thing to take a humble position with regards to their authorship even when there was abundant evidence attributing their work to them.
And then there's this thing about the adoption of open hardware cores and the Dragon CPU. That doesn't go well with a new hardline attitude towards intellectual property.