Posted by
ryuzaki0
on from the does-this-thing-ever-end dept.
T-Kir writes "The BBC has an interesting article saying that now Microsoft has had the settlement granted in the US, it still faces EU sanctions concerning software bundling (or should that be bungling?) into its OS and deliberate attempts at inoperability with non-MS server operating systems."
Tough Cookie
by
mmport80
·
· Score: 5, Informative
For those who don't know much about the EU's competition commisioner - he is a tough cookie and isn't afraid to take on large companies.
Look at what he did to Nintendo recently and also the $45bn GE and Honeywell merger - which he basically stopped - even thought the US would have allowed it. The last case shows what the competition commision thinks about "consistency".
Re:Does the EU have power?
by
BabyDave
·
· Score: 5, Informative
Could someone explain what the EU has power to do?
Seems to me like they couldn't do much...
What the EU can do...
by
MosesJones
·
· Score: 5, Informative
1) Fine MS, this could be a small amount (say similar to the $150m it fined Nintendo) or a large amount (its MS what should the limit be).
2) Reorganise the way MS products are classified which could change the way they are taxed.
3) Ban certain products from being sold in the EU.
4) Declare certain individuals to be culpable for the violations and have them subject to arrest if they enter the EU.
Quite a few other things, saying they can't do much is like when President Bush demanded the Chinese do nothing to that spy plane.... so they sent it back in crates.
-- An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
Re:Does the EU have power?
by
meringuoid
·
· Score: 5, Informative
Could someone explain what the EU has power to do? Seems to me like they couldn't do much...
They can't split Microsoft, because they're a foreign corporation. They can, however, impose conditions on Microsoft which they will have to obey if they want to continue doing business in the EU.
It's unlikely to come to a trade war; EU business is too addicted to MS software to allow Brussels to impose punitive tariffs, for instance. Chances are MS will be fined a comparatively small amount and told not to do it again...
-- Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
I don't know what you mean with "power" but the EU could eventually ban Microsoft's products in 15 countries across Europe. This would seriously hurt M$ figures.
Of course, some EU members could disobey this ban but then they would face severe penalties. It happens all the time.
Anyway, no country seems to be very happy with M$ here in Europe these days so i'd bet there wouldn't be any complains if EU comission bans M$ products.
Re:Of course
by
ninthwave
·
· Score: 2, Informative
Actually 20 countries the Irish passed the referendum which allows the EU expansion to go through. More former eastern block countries are coming in within the coming years.
-- I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said: "I drank what?" - Chris Knight (Val Kilmer)- Real Genius
EU is different from US courts
by
Alain+Williams
·
· Score: 5, Informative
M$ is not an corporation from an EU country, there is no direct economic advantage to the EU of supporting M$'s illegal activities.
The powerful EU officials are not directly elected by the populace; so they are not quite so easy to buy.
A change of administration in one EU country is not so far reaching as the change in a single country (ie the US).
Individual countries have also expressed strong interest in Open Source.
Re:Three problems
by
pubjames
·
· Score: 5, Informative
1) US courts regularly deny the authority of courts abroad
2) US courts regularly assume their rules apply abroad.
This stuff doesn't really matter but the EU is dealing with trade within the EU zone. So it doesn't really matter that much what the US thinks. And don't assume that the US can just do whatever it wants and get away with it. There's something called the WTO, which has ruled heavily against the US and in favour of the EU recently with regards to steel tarrifs. It's true that the US is a big bully, but the EU is growing and seems increasingly confident fighting back.
What they should do...
by
danro
·
· Score: 3, Informative
...is promote OSS in the EU administration and in the member states administration.
It would have the tripple advantage of:
Lower costs. (In the emedium to long run, say 2 years to break even.)
Inject some much needed energy in the IT sector.
Not take the risk of having important EU/state data held "hostage" in proprietary formats. And thus decrease the EU's dependance on a single private and unaccountable foreign entity. (Yes Bill, I am looking at you!)
...oh, yeah, and as a side effect Microsoft would loose significant marketshare in a pretty large market. But I don't think punishment should be the top priority, I would rather see them aim for less vulnerability to future abuses of the MS monopoly.
--
"First lesson," Jon said. "Stick them with the pointy end."
You see, the world's offices run on Office. Deny them that, and they get cranky. only a blathering idiot would say that.. the world runs on wordperfect. it's more adept at languages other than english.. as they tried to make it more global instead of the typical microsoft borg think.
The entire world can switch to Open Office and never even notice except for a tiny tiny TINY few that actually use that stupid scripting built into MS office. and then it's only going to annoy the morons that have too much time on their hands making a tool that is not designed for a certian job work (word and excel are NOT data collection apps.. and idiots use them that way with OLE)
If microsoft word was removed from every PC in your office and replaced with OO.o I guarentee that productivity will remain at it's current levels and nobody will really care..
I know, I've done it here. and the very few that bitched shut up after 2 days.
Re:Different point of view
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Informative
Why don't you eurotrash just come up with a better desktop OS? Sorry, I can't comment anymore. I am laughing too hard.
Re:Basically, the EU is mean to american companies
by
JanneM
·
· Score: 3, Informative
That is actually not true. Internal issues are likely not very publicized in the US, but EU has come down hard on a number of proposed mergers within EU the last few years, precisely for the risk of creating market monopolies.
As for the food issue, another poster here is quite correct that the push to ban GM foods and meat raised with antibiotics comes from the people, not from the member governments or EU itself. Another sticking point is that according to most member states' laws, all foods (from within EU or from without) must be declared where it was grown or raised, and american producers have resisted, fearing (perhaps rightly) that consumers will choose not to by american produce.
-- Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
EU Court may not approve of Commision
by
LeftOfCentre
·
· Score: 3, Informative
If commisioner Monti and his staff decide on sanctions against Microsoft, Microsoft will surely appeal to the European Court of Justice. Such a case could drag on for years, and furthermore the court has a recent history of overturning decisions made by the European Commision.
Re:Does the EU have power?
by
Roxy
·
· Score: 2, Informative
> Could someone explain what the EU has power > to do? > > Seems to me like they couldn't do much... Check out the General Electric and Honeywell merger attempt recently. The US authorities said OK to the deal, but the EU authorities refused it on anti-competitive grounds. End of merger! You gotta love a global economy...
As well as ignorant/. readers....
-- --
Roland Buresund
MBA, MCMI, CISSP
Re:Basically, the EU is mean to american companies
by
Jeppe+Salvesen
·
· Score: 3, Informative
GM food ban was to the best of my knowledge consumer-driven. Are you mad at the EU for being more democratic than the USA? There is a lot of discussion about this issue still going on, and there might be reversal later on. However, I would argue that GM foods need to be tested and monitored very carefully before they are used. They are potentially extremely beneficial, so it would be disaterous for the planet's future if they are widely adopted too soon (since that could both threaten the planet, or threaten the future of GM foods).
So - no - the EU is not essentially mean to US companies. However, it has high standards, sometimes higher than the US standards. When US companies face EU standards, they prefer to confront the standards as anticompetitive, rather than raise their own standards. That approach is much cheaper.
Slashdot Mirror
For those who don't know much about the EU's competition commisioner - he is a tough cookie and isn't afraid to take on large companies.
Look at what he did to Nintendo recently and also the $45bn GE and Honeywell merger - which he basically stopped - even thought the US would have allowed it. The last case shows what the competition commision thinks about "consistency".
Tell that to Nintendo.
1) Fine MS, this could be a small amount (say similar to the $150m it fined Nintendo) or a large amount (its MS what should the limit be).
2) Reorganise the way MS products are classified which could change the way they are taxed.
3) Ban certain products from being sold in the EU.
4) Declare certain individuals to be culpable for the violations and have them subject to arrest if they enter the EU.
Quite a few other things, saying they can't do much is like when President Bush demanded the Chinese do nothing to that spy plane.... so they sent it back in crates.
An Eye for an Eye will make the whole world blind - Gandhi
They can't split Microsoft, because they're a foreign corporation. They can, however, impose conditions on Microsoft which they will have to obey if they want to continue doing business in the EU.
It's unlikely to come to a trade war; EU business is too addicted to MS software to allow Brussels to impose punitive tariffs, for instance. Chances are MS will be fined a comparatively small amount and told not to do it again...
Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
I don't know what you mean with "power" but the EU could eventually ban Microsoft's products in 15 countries across Europe. This would seriously hurt M$ figures.
Of course, some EU members could disobey this ban but then they would face severe penalties. It happens all the time.
Anyway, no country seems to be very happy with M$ here in Europe these days so i'd bet there wouldn't be any complains if EU comission bans M$ products.
M$ is not an corporation from an EU country, there is no direct economic advantage to the EU of supporting M$'s illegal activities.
The powerful EU officials are not directly elected by the populace; so they are not quite so easy to buy.
A change of administration in one EU country is not so far reaching as the change in a single country (ie the US).
The EU has deomstrated an interest in Open Source:
EU Studies Linux Migration
Individual countries have also expressed strong interest in Open Source.
1) US courts regularly deny the authority of courts abroad
2) US courts regularly assume their rules apply abroad.
This stuff doesn't really matter but the EU is dealing with trade within the EU zone. So it doesn't really matter that much what the US thinks. And don't assume that the US can just do whatever it wants and get away with it. There's something called the WTO, which has ruled heavily against the US and in favour of the EU recently with regards to steel tarrifs. It's true that the US is a big bully, but the EU is growing and seems increasingly confident fighting back.
It would have the tripple advantage of:
But I don't think punishment should be the top priority, I would rather see them aim for less vulnerability to future abuses of the MS monopoly.
"First lesson," Jon said. "Stick them with the pointy end."
You see, the world's offices run on Office. Deny them that, and they get cranky.
only a blathering idiot would say that.. the world runs on wordperfect. it's more adept at languages other than english.. as they tried to make it more global instead of the typical microsoft borg think.
The entire world can switch to Open Office and never even notice except for a tiny tiny TINY few that actually use that stupid scripting built into MS office. and then it's only going to annoy the morons that have too much time on their hands making a tool that is not designed for a certian job work (word and excel are NOT data collection apps.. and idiots use them that way with OLE)
If microsoft word was removed from every PC in your office and replaced with OO.o I guarentee that productivity will remain at it's current levels and nobody will really care..
I know, I've done it here. and the very few that bitched shut up after 2 days.
Why don't you eurotrash just come up with a better desktop OS? Sorry, I can't comment anymore. I am laughing too hard.
Would that be SUSE Linux or Mandrake Linux you are referring to by any chance?
That is actually not true. Internal issues are likely not very publicized in the US, but EU has come down hard on a number of proposed mergers within EU the last few years, precisely for the risk of creating market monopolies.
As for the food issue, another poster here is quite correct that the push to ban GM foods and meat raised with antibiotics comes from the people, not from the member governments or EU itself. Another sticking point is that according to most member states' laws, all foods (from within EU or from without) must be declared where it was grown or raised, and american producers have resisted, fearing (perhaps rightly) that consumers will choose not to by american produce.
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
If commisioner Monti and his staff decide on sanctions against Microsoft, Microsoft will surely appeal to the European Court of Justice. Such a case could drag on for years, and furthermore the court has a recent history of overturning decisions made by the European Commision.
> Could someone explain what the EU has power
/. readers ....
> to do?
>
> Seems to me like they couldn't do much...
Check out the General Electric and Honeywell merger attempt recently. The US authorities said OK to the deal, but the EU authorities refused it on anti-competitive grounds. End of merger! You gotta love a global economy...
As well as ignorant
-- Roland Buresund MBA, MCMI, CISSP
GM food ban was to the best of my knowledge consumer-driven. Are you mad at the EU for being more democratic than the USA? There is a lot of discussion about this issue still going on, and there might be reversal later on. However, I would argue that GM foods need to be tested and monitored very carefully before they are used. They are potentially extremely beneficial, so it would be disaterous for the planet's future if they are widely adopted too soon (since that could both threaten the planet, or threaten the future of GM foods).
So - no - the EU is not essentially mean to US companies. However, it has high standards, sometimes higher than the US standards. When US companies face EU standards, they prefer to confront the standards as anticompetitive, rather than raise their own standards. That approach is much cheaper.
Stop the brainwash