MacAddict Tracks Down eBay Scam Artist

OS24Ever writes "A future high school history teacher, Jason Eric Smith, sold an 867MHz PowerBook G4 on eBay right before finals. He found out the hard way that people are out there to rip you off, and he went to great lengths to catch this guy with the help of Mac heads everywhere. A great read and agreat way for us little guys to get back at these scammers."

Comments

A smart mob / posse?

[certron]

I think this is interesting for the sole fact that a whole lot of people who owe no direct kinship to each other elected to cooperate for a common cause.

I was listening to a presentation about different pagan holidays, and one component of one of the rituals was to honor / remember your ancestors. What made me remember this was that the presenter said that the ancestors didn't have to be biological, instead could be cultural, intellectual, or spiritual ancestors.

In this case, it seems that these 'artificial' families are willing to stick together and cooperate on a common goal, even if they themselves will not directly benefit. I suppose this is just a regular community, with enough people in it that a few would be motivated to assist. Then again, I could just be amazed by my own insight, marvelling at a fact that others have known for ages, and so think that I am smarter than I actually am. :-)

I'm sorry - but he was an idiot in the first place

[Dark Paladin]

I sell things on Ebay as well (usually old games that I'm done with) - and I don't do COD. Paypal - sure. Checks and money orders, but I wait until they clear before they ship.

I know we should be more trusting of people, but I've become convinced that 20% of the population is made of Assholes that can be trusted only as far as they can be shot.

Still, I have to admire his spirit tracking the guy down - if nothing else, that's one less asshole to worry about. Only 1 billion to go!

The broken window theory

[Fished]

One of the things he mentions is tha tthe FBI and Secret Service were not interested in anything less than $5000. Chicago police just weren't interested... This brings up something called "the broken window theory." It goes like this: some socioligists whose names escape me observed that, as long as no window was broken in a building, they tended to stay unbroken. However, as soon as one was broken, if it was not repaired every window in the building would be broken in a couple of weeks.

The idea here is that, by ignoring small crimes, the police miss chances to prevent big crimes. The funny thing is that the people wanted for "small" (I don't think of $3000 as small, but that's just me) crimes are often pulling the same scam again and again - but no one ever turns them in. These "small" scams can add up to really large amounts of money and become big ones.

A few years ago, we had a homeless man who we gave a household job to steal a check out of my wife's checkbook. We only found out when we got a call from the grocery store, asking if we had actually written the check. Of course we hadn't -- the reason the grocery store had called us was that the guy had pulled the same stunt, at the same grocery store, seven times before. No one ever pressed charges. Well, we pressed charges, and it turned out the guy was also wanted for 10 counts of car theft, forging, fraud, etc. etc. ad nauseam. The really nauseating part? The police never followed through on our theft and forgery complaints, even though this guy had dozens of similar complaints against him.

So, the bottom line in my not so humble opinion is that, if you want to prevent crime, you don't need to outlaw guns or anything: just start enforcing the laws you already have.

Re:The broken window theory

[psxndc]

This is also know as the tipping point. There is X point in a relationship where going just beyond that point causes a dramatic shift in that relationship. Example: Say crime in CityX is 5%. 6% is the tipping point such that if crime stays at 5% it will remain 5% indefinitely. By inching that percentage up 1% to 6% for some reason the reality is that crime will jump to say 12% the year after it hit 6%. It's just a weird phenomenom that has to do with people's perception of a reality becoming a self fulfilling prophecy. More info can be found here

psxndc

Re:Would a Windows User?

[MoneyT]

Mac users are very protective of their computers, and will go to great lengths to ensure that people don't steal them. Theres a similar story floating about how one person had their mac stolen from thier house and used tibuktu and some funky apple scripts to trace the mac to a house. Long story short, police show up, find stolen computers, guy gets his computer back.

Just cause PC users are accustomed to losing money in bad investments doesn't mean that mac users are.

[Yes, that last statement is a troll]

Mod Parent Up.

[Fished]

You know ... you've really got a point there. Maybe if we weren't putting all our law enforcement dollars into trivial, non-violent drug "crimes" (or would be non-violent if they weren't illegal) we would have time, money and energy to pursue things like theft, fraud, forgery, utterance, grand theft auto, etc.

Never thought I'd see an Insightful AC.

Re:Mod Parent Up.

[glesga_kiss]

And Budweiser wouldn't be to pleased with any legalisation. They are a primary contributor to Partnership for a Drug Free America.

Isn't it ironic, don't you think? ;-)

Reminds me of New York

[Dark Paladin]

As I seem to recall (and people from New York feel free to correct me on this), one of the things that Rudy Guiliani [sic] did was have the police start ticketing people who jaywalked.

The result? Overall reduction in crime - since if you were going to be caught for the little things, odds are you were going to be caught for doing a big thing (selling drugs, etc). And it made the police highly visible - and the one thing I remembered from my old criminal law classes (before I ditched law) - the likelyhood of getting caught for a crime is a far greater deterance than the punishment of a crime.

I have to agree - if we have a system that busted people for crimes - regardless of the "level" (no, I'm not suggesting death penalties for jaywalking, calm down, or a police state - just if a crime is obviously committed, like a bike theft **cough**like I went through once**cough**), go after it. Odds are, it would do more good in the long run by nipping these "small time" crooks in the bud before they ever become "big time".

Re:Reminds me of New York

[lysurgon]

Actually the Guiliani directive to crack down on "quality of life" crime went way further back than jaywaliking. In fact the aggressive prosecution of jaywalkers (and the outlawying of dancing in unlicensed city bars and clubs) is really where he went over the line.

The basis of the quality of life program was to try to move in and bust kids writing graffitti, homeless people loitering and especially low-level drug dealers. Beat cops had previously been instructed to avoid drug deals for fear of corruption.

The numbers largely speak for themselves (though there's a strong case that improved economic conditions do as much to deter crime as incresed police presence), but because of endemic flaws in the police system (e.g. a certain amount of ingranced racism) the whole campaign caused a lot of acrimony.

People (more often than not minorities) were being stopped and shaken down for guns and drugs illegally, but since these shakedowns seemed effective, the department allowed it to go on. The high-profile beatings and killings of minorities around the city was causing a lot of civil unrest. Thankfully, since 9-11 the relationship between the police and the people of the city seems to be back on track. Too bad it took such a tragedy to set things right.

Repeat article, sort of?

[Greedo]

Sounds a lot like this guy's story.

Basically, stolen iBook has dynamic DNS and Timbuktu (VNC-like app) installed on it. Owner notes when stolen computer is logged into the net, runs Applescript to help track it, recovers it.

I think I read about this on /. back in January.

Re:Awfully dangerous

[stratjakt]

>> And in a perfect world, they would have people assigned to this sort of thing, and enough of them to do something about it in a timeful manner.

In a perfect world, there would be no cranks or nutjobs who spend all day having the local cops run errands for them or otherwise bother them with trivial bullshit.

I'm not saying this guy is one, but we have a bitchy old crank down the street who calls the cops every time a kid cuts across her lawn on the way home from school.

I had the cops come to my door 5 nights a row at my old townhouse because the neighbour kept reporting my car as a 'suspicious vehicle parked out in front'. Luckily I work for a company that sells software to police, and my local county in particular, so the problem quickly went away.

Then there's the drunks who go out and pick a fight, get their asses kicked, then show up at the station wanting to 'see the guy locked up'.

And everyone who gets the short end of the stick on a business deal wants the cops to do something for them.

My point is, forget the fact that there's an overwhelming amount of crime for a cop to be able to deal with each incident in a timely manner.. Theres so much bullshit and whining, they never get to the real incidents. And when they do, their hands are so tied with beurocracy and paperwork and bullshit procedures that you aren't going to see your 'eye for an eye' instant gratification.

As I mentioned, I write and support software for the public safety industry. I can dial in to any one of hundreds of our CAD (Computer Automated Dispatching) systems and see the ratio of cranks/whines to actual incidents is literally 100:1.

In a case like this, if you have the evidence of who ripped you off and how, it's much better to get a lawyer and drag it into a civil court.

Disclaimer: Noone has more disrespect for cops than me, I work with 'em every day. There are many incompetent, arrogant, power-tripping douchebags with a gun and a badge out there. But they do have a pretty much impossible job to do. They write so many speeding/seatbelt tickets because thats all the system lets them do effectively.

Re:Awfully dangerous

[sweetooth]

This is flawed logic. By going after the big criminal you look good and stop one or two big thefts. If you let the small time fraud cases go you can ultimatly be letting a larger amount be stolen. The fact that it's taken in smaller amounts doesn't make it any less of a crime. In fact if you read the article you would see that the individual committing the fraud in this case was committing $10,000 in fraud that day. How many other times had he done this? Probably quite a bit. Is it worth it to go after one $100,000 fraud case and not 5 $3,000-$6,000 dollar fraud cases that may ultimatly add up to >$100,000? If small time criminals find out that as long as they keep the dollar amount down they won't be investigated by the police, they are basically provided incentive to continue committing the crimes in those small amounts. Over time it can add up to a lot of money. They are also likely to tell other people about it and the trend can increase.

Re:Who's the scammer here?

[tdrury]

You are right that it is against eBay policy to sell off eBay - it's categorized as Fee Avoidance.
This often occurs when you list one item on eBay and in the description you claim to have more that you are willing to sell. You are skirting the Listing Fee which is against eBay rules.

However, you are allowed to cancel an auction at anytime - at _any_ time. It seems a little unfair but it does have legitimate uses. Often sellers will list an item locally (paper,signs,etc) as well as on eBay. If the item sells locally they can cancel the eBay auction by cancelling all bids then cancelling the auction (you must cancel the bids first or else the high bid at the time you cancel the auction does win the item).

Remember - no bidder has won the auction until the auction ends. There is no contract until that time.

Come and visit us on the Trust & Safety (Safe Harbor) boards. These sorts of issues get brought up daily.

I am an eBay junkie.

Los Angeles, too

[clem.dickey]

San Francisco is well-known for tolerance of illegal parking. About 25 years ago the SF police wanted higher wages but were forbidden to strike. One day the police protested by ticketing all illegally parked cars, especially those around City Hall and the local newspaper offices. That night the Chief of Police appeared on local TV to apologize for the unprofessional conduct of his men!

By comparison, there were - and are - Los Angeles suburbs in which police will ticket a car parked facing the wrong direction. The police infer that something illegal must have happened to place the car in that position.

This difference broke the Patty Hearst case. While the Symbionese Liberation Army held Patty Hearst in San Francisco, police and FBI had no luck finding her. Then the SLA moved to Los Angeles - unfamiliar territory for them. They parked a van in a red zone, which would have been no big deal in SF. Police arrived to ticket the van, determined that it was stolen, and caught or killed a large part of the SLA.

Re:no police force

[moosemoose]

well it was a rant and i do agree that some sort of structured law enforcement is desirable. but i think the two points that i wanted to make were (1) that behavior in our society is for the most part not moderated by the existance of police. in other words, most of us would continue to not murder and rape in the absence of a police force and conversely, those who do murder and rape today do not seem to be particularly deterred by the existence of the police and (2) small local groups (ala the post in question) seem to be more effective than large 'crime fighting' organizations. in the recent case of the theft of credit information of 30,000 people, the thieves were caught not by the police but in effect by the credit reporting agencies (after $2.7 million stolen). according to the news reports they would still be doing this today if they hadn't gotten greedy and started downloading 15,000 reports at a time. i used to practice law and i can tell you from personal experience that the police do not concern themselves with the small victim. steal 50% of a poor person's possessions and you get no police action. steal 1% of a rich person's and you get the crime lab.

ebay's safeguards MY ARSE..

[matt_wilts]

Here's the response I got from Ebay when I thought I detected shill bidding:

To: Matt {matt_wilts}
Subject: Re: Possible shill bidding on auction 1235911285 (KMM28339167C0KM)
From: eBay UK Investigations {ukinvestigations@ebay.com}
Reply-To: eBay UK Investigations {ukinvestigations@ebay.com}

Hello Matt,

Thank you for writing to us.

I sincerely apologize for the delay of this e-mail and hope that it did not cause you any inconveniences!

I have investigated your report regarding {{ insert user id }}, and can understand how this would be troublesome.

Please be assured, if a violation of eBay policy has occurred, we will take the appropriate action in accordance with our site policies. Such action may include issuing a warning, temporary suspension, indefinite suspension or terminating the membership.

Due to eBay's Privacy policy we are unable to provide information regarding the details of another user's account. We are equally
concerned about violations on the site, and will thoroughly investigate each report we receive. However, the details of our actions cannot be
disclosed with third party members. Please remember that this is for the protection of all eBay users.

We appreciate your assistance in keeping eBay a fun and safe place to trade..

I hope you have a wonderful week!
Regards,
Darcy
eBay UK SafeHarbour
Investigations Team

Must be some new use of the word "safe" that I've not yet come across...

Matt

Re:Wouldn't work.

[Edmund]

Depends on the laptop. IBM laptops are well-known for being notoriously hard to crack. The passwords are stored on a seperate flash RAM chip on the motherboard, which is backed by a CRC checksum. In addition, the password is replicated on the hard drive, and when the BIOS password is set the exact same password is set on the hard drive.

If you simply wiped or tamped with the data on the chip, the CRC check would fail and the laptop would refuse to boot. Even if somebody managed to bypass the BIOS password by obtaining a "virgin" password chip (i.e. one that has no password set and a checksum to reflect that), they would still be unable to access the hard drive because they lack the password. If the hard drive was put into another computer, it would come up with a controller failure without the password.

Note that there is a way to circumvent this. You could buy a third party security chip (several companies sell them) and solder it in place of the original one. Then you simply toss out the original hard drive.

Apparantly a talented man from Australia has figured out exactly how the passwords are stored/encrypted on the chip and built a simple serial circuit and program combination to read it. The schematics and software are freely available on his website, and the idea is that you build the circuit, read the contents of the chip, send him the dump and pay him money to recover the password from inside the binary dump. This allows you to keep the hard drive.

Unfortunately, I don't have the URL of his website off-hand. If anybody has used his services, does it actually work? :)

- Ed.