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Mandrake Appealing to Community, Again
An anonymous reader writes "It seems that MandrakeSoft's short-term financial problem is worse than was thought. A new page on the Mandrake web site says: 'Everyone who is concerned with the company's future is encouraged to read and distribute the following message. In order to reach the next release, MandrakeSoft currently needs to raise cash, and quickly complete the Increase of Capital.' Darn, and I thought they were almost over this hump. Looks like a good time to help recruit Mandrake supporters for the Club."
Mandrake should either go non-profit so they can beg for money without being an embarrassment, or shut the doors.
slashdot broke my sig
IMO, Mandrake is about to get thinned from the herd. And it'll be too bad, since they've provided a lot of leadership in terms of desktop Linux, but I think we're all a lot more realistic about business realities than we were a few years ago.
Damn straight. They follow too closely in the shadow of RedHat and have no way to break even, much less dream of a profit. So appeal to the community, again, and again. It annoys me that to download Mandrake they try to force you to join Club Mandrake.
If I want to join a club, it isn't going to be Mandrake. I use Mandrake, and I actually like it quite a bit. If I were to pay for anything it'd be RedHat though. A company that can at least give me a return on what I pay for. Someone else pointed out that they should go NPO or close the doors, and they were right. I'll donate to an NPO, I buy things from a company. What do I stand to gain from Mandrake by buying? Nothing. I can just as easily use Red Hat, Debian, Slackware, or even *BSD. I'm pretty sure a lot of the target market feels the same as me.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
Giving them some cash would not be good. It would only delay the inevitable (this is not the first time they do this). MandrakeSoft is a for-profit corporation. Clearly they can't make a profit - it is time to close.
Who knows, Mandrake-the-distribution may live after MandrakeSoft dies. If it's that good of a distro (I wouldn't know, never tried) volunteers will keep it going.
You've failed to make the argument about why saving Mandrake is "the right thing".
Not everything is worth saving, and particularly not everything with good intentions. Why does Mandrake offer that is so great that it's worth dumping $4M into? And note that that $4M is not going into new development -- it's to resolve outstanding debts from all the wasted money of the past.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
By my watch, with the amount of money that Mandrake has already spent, they should have the absolute best commercial distribution of Linux available. There should be no question as to the performance of Mandrake compared to any other commercial version. They should be kicking ass and taking names. Unfortunately, the only ass they're kicking is the collective behind of the Linux community, and the only names they're taking are followed by credit card numbers.
Meanwhile, we're a non-profit company that produces the absolute best-of-class general-purpose audio compression codec in the world, proprietary or otherwise. We've been through recessions and poor economic times before; Hopefully we'll live through this one, too. Everybody and their brother has a Linux distribution; Why don't you support the smaller projects that actually make a difference?
Emmett Plant
CEO, Xiph.org Foundation
In the interests of promoting diversity in Linux choices, I can see giving a few dollars to help an otherwise viable company get over a particular rough patch.
But this doesn't seem to be the case here -- rather, it's beginning to look more and more like Mandrake will never turn a profit. This brings up the spectre of the community supporting a supposedly for-profit company via donations, which just isn't realistic. So it's not a question of the "right thing", but one of eceonomic reality.
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
The real difference here is that RedHat isn't counting on sales of CDs or, worse, the altruism of the community to make money.
Instead, they have displayed good business sense and are creating sell-able services surrounding Linux, such as training and subscriptions to time-saving services (using up2date anytime is worth $60 a server, IMO). This is working out really well for them -- they're suddenly in the black.
If Mandrake can't do the same, well, that's life. They need to either develop a viable for-profit business plan (if they want to remain a for-profit business) or work out another way to survive (go non-profit or get aquired).
That's just reality.
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
If you like Mandrake and believe in Linux then the only way to show it is by actually supporting the products to believe are valuable. Free software, unless you mean free-beer, doesn't alleviate the producers of a product or service from the realities of economics. If you do not believe Mandrake is viable, despite liking their products, then don't purchase a MandrakeClub membership or box. If you do believe in the products, then support them.
I've got a shiny new Mandrake 9 PowerPack, and I'm happy with it. I've replaced MS Office with StarOffice. Those who value the products should do the same, and those who don't value the products should not. I think Mandrake has a chance to get back into the black, and I've voted with my $.
perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
Since I regularly use Mandrake, I try to buy the distribution CDs for major upgrades. The price is well worth it, especially if you get the DVD. When I download the ISOs instead, I answer 50 or so support questions on mandrakeexpert.com for free. Since other people pay to ask the questions, this is a way I can indirectly support the product. My point is don't be a leech. If you use the product, find some way to contribute, monetarily or otherwise.
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Give a man handouts every time he asks and he becomes dependent. A little tough love a year ago and maybe mandrakeSoft makes it out okay. Sorry but are you a business or a charity?
Your project is unique, as far as I know, and genuinley useful to lots of people. I fail to see how another Linux distribution, that when I tried it (version 7.0) was more or less a RedHat knockoff, is any sort of huge benefit.
So people, if you are feeling the urge to donate to free software, give it to the Xiph guys. No matter what OS you use, OGG is available to you, and it's GOOD at what it does. If Mandrake dies, well, then they die and we are limited to only the other million and a half Linux distros. If Xiph dies, we don't get updates to Vorbis, and none of the rest of their projects come to be.
If MandrakeSoft is in such dire straights, then what's all this about? Just last week revenue was up 31%, operating costs down 42%, and they were giving themselves a big pat on the back. And now they're asking for handouts again? What?
Mandrakesoft gives you free access to download software, they freely allow a programmer to work on KDE and the Linux Kernel, they freely give you a website, Mandrake Expert, Mandrake Forum etc,
You cant donate some money to keep these free services? I guess you dont really want them.
If PS2 were giving out free games why not donate $60 once in a great while?
If you use Linux, please help development of Autopac
If you don't use Mandrake, it's not worth saving, plain and simple. If you use Mandrake, and you like it, then getting Mandrake through this rough patch ensures that they'll be around for you to use their next release.
Numerous polls show that Mandrake is the favorite desktop distribution by a wide margin, so there are clearly a lot of people who use Mandrake and like it, and if Mandrake goes out of business, they're all going to be moving to SuSE or Red Hat. Clearly, there are reasons that so many people opted to use Mandrake in the first place, so SuSE and Red Hat are going to be a step down for many.
I am a standard member of the club, and I purchased the DVD set of Mandrake 9.0, because it was worth paying for.
Replies like the one the parent poster has received are the number one obstacle to any Linux distro making it big on the desktop. "RTFM" and dumbass inside jokes are going to send hordes of potential Linux users back to Windows. Maybe you taught yourself everything by reading man pages -- well, good for you. For most people, an informative answer to a reasonable question is one of the most useful and encouraging possible resources in making the transition to a new platform.
To answer the question: nedit and xemacs are two pretty decent GUI text editors that run on Linux. nedit is probably easier to learn if you're coming from the Windows world, but if I were you I'd put the time into learning xemacs, since it's descended from emacs, which is one of the standard text editors in the Unix world.
Also do at least learn a little bit about vi (type "man vi" at any Terminal prompt) since it's a) very simple for quick, in-place editing, and b) on just about every distro of every type of Unix machine.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
when the most user friendly desktop distro is in financial trouble - you scorn them.
/. buzzwords out of this -- they are not relevant at all to the topic.
No, its a company that has a crappy business plan and is not making any money. A company asking for cash donations so it can survive a little longer is one of the dummest things I have ever heard. Maybe they should rethink their business plan instead(what a strange idea- a business that actually makes money without donations?). You are not helping out the "movement" at all- Linux does not rely on Mandrake for survival. If you want to donate your money, that is fine, but you should realize that by donating you are just throwing your cash down the toilet to enable a crappy business to survive another week.
And you should leave Microsoft, DRM, and all of the other
"The defense of freedom requires the advance of freedom" - George W Bush
I love Linux as much as anyone, but let's be realistic. If Dell had an option on their order page to pick Microsoft XP or RedHat 8.0, %99.9+ of users would pick XP. Furthermore, Dell probably doesn't want the added tech support of a Linux machine. You can't just shove someone through a three-week training course and have them fix Linux boxes, you need people with some degree of skill. I know Microsoft has used illegal tactics to award OEM contracts, which I'm sure we all hate, but in the end *most* OEM's wouldn't want the extra hassle of dealing with Linux.
And if you think the reason Microsoft dominates the desktop is marketing, you need to slow down and take an honest look at the situation. Marketing never hurts, but having an OS that can be run (and maintained) by a slobbering idiot doesn't hurt either. See also: Apple.
"God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh." -Voltaire
Nice troll, but in your ignorance, you're overlooking the good Mandrake has done for the Open Source community at large. To date, they have:
1. Donated heaps of cash to KDE developers to encourage development and keep people fed.
2. Open sourced all their software they've created in-house in order to benefit the community.
3. Provided free downloads of their distro from day one.
I'm sure there are dozens more, but first and foremost, they work for the community.
What situation? The situation that a company that has bled millions of dollars is once again asking for more cash from their captive audience? You're right, I am powerless to bail out MandrakeSoft. As far as 'following a similar route,' I doubt it. We never had millions to burn in the first place, and it's never been our goal to start a company and turn a massive profit.
I cannot and will not feel sorry for any company that burns through insane amounts of money like MandrakeSoft has. Just because they sell Linux services does not mean they get special dispensation; When they opted to jump into the corporate fray, all bets were off. You compete, or you die. It is often vicious. It is often difficult. It is often unfair. But that's the game.
The Linux world will be a poorer place without Mandrake. This call for help was directed at the existing community of Mandrake users. If you do not want to support Mandrake, then don't. But don't use your position to degrade them and discourage others from supporting them. That makes you a very ugly person in my eyes.
Call me crazy, but this isn't the first time that MandrakeSoft has done this. I think it's irresponsible. Where are they spending this money? How are they going through this much cash, this quickly?
While you may be a huge fan of the Mandrake distribution, please understand that while they're a for-profit corporation, they're playing the for-profit game. When my phone bill comes, I don't ask my friends and family to help me pay it, just because I am a brilliant conversationalist. I have my own debts, I take on my own responsibilities. MandrakeSoft is acting like a college kid, calling home for pizza money.
Imagine if all companies did this. Wouldn't you find it extremely offensive if McDonald's employees came up to you during your meal, asking you to help them out with some of their expenses?
"Hi, how are you? I hope you're enjoying that Big Mac. You know, we work really hard on the Big Mac, and we'd like to continue making Big Macs for the next few years. Unfortunately, the current economy hasn't been too kind to us, and we're feeling a little less like Ronald, and more like Grimace."
You would find it irritating. You would find it annoying. You might not ever go back there again, and you'd tell your friends about it. I'm just asking you to consider the nice little diner down the street when you're tired of being shaken down by the clown.
Emmett Plant
CEO, Xiph.org Foundation