Posted by
CmdrTaco
on from the standardizing-on-no-standards dept.
Corrado writes "According to this article over at Linux Box SuSE Is "Reevaulating Our Relationship" with SCO Group. There is also a reference to this article in wired about OSS developers rallying behind IBM. The best line of the article is "Eric Raymond called SCO's move 'deeply stupid...'""
It is ironic that Caldera's last stand in Linux territory, UnitedLinux, is losing support because its only potential source of income (licensing and suing for license violations) seems to have its sights on milking IBM and Linux itself. Am I smelling mismanagement? UnitedLinux could have actually migrated SCO from UNIX to Linux, but instead now they're going to have to either convince companies to not migrate to Linux, or convince judges that Linux is a derivative of UNIX, and start charging license fees.
-- Slashdot: Where people pretend to be twice as smart as they really are by behaving like children.
Re:Irony
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Insightful
UnitedLinux could have actually migrated SCO from UNIX to Linux, but instead now they're going to have to either convince companies to not migrate to Linux, or convince judges that Linux is a derivative of UNIX, and start charging license fees.
But of course. They want licensing fees because they want to have a viable business model. Sure,
they are going about it in a rather heavy-handed
way and sure, they'll fail. But migrating from
UNIX to Linux is a good way to guarantee failure
for their business. People do not make money
giving away something for free. Now, you can
sell consulting, but that's a low margin business.
And something that they probably aren't set up to
do properly.
They don't have to convince judges that Linux is 'a derivative of' UNIX. At least not for patent infringement lawsuits. With patents, you are still infringing even if you independently come up with the same idea. This is one reason why patents suck when applied to software, where coming up with new ideas is not the difficult part so much as the implementation, even though patents may give a net economic benefit in other fields of endeavour.
That's a little bit like saying that all a company needs to do is release one of their software products under the GPL and magically, any other party can then put that company's code into a GPL product and it's legal.
It's not at all like saying that. It's saying that if you hold a software patent, and release an implementation of that patent under the GPL, everybody who uses the GPL can use your patent. If they have patents that cover Linux, and they ship linux under the GPL, they've given free license to their patents, but if they have other patents that aren't implemented in linux, then other companies/people still have to arrange for licensing.
Unless SCO/Caldera put the code in question into the Linux software base themselves, that sorts of claims are groundless.
They didn't have to put them there, they just had to ship them. By redistributing them they agreed to the terms of the GPL implicitly.
Doesn't appear that way?
by
manyoso
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
SuSE, "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community."
So, how do you interpret this to mean that SuSE is backing out of UnitedLinux?
Re:Doesn't appear that way?
by
einhverfr
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
SuSE, "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community."
The article is very vague and so are the statements.
My guess is that SuSE is attempting to use what leverage they have to affect a change in the direction of United Linux and SCO. My guess is that SuSE in its statements is also attempting to speak to the other UL parners as well.
This does not mean that they have made a decision one way or another. But they may be consulting with Turbolinux and Conectiva as to options for ditching SCO. That will be about time;-)
They'd be making the right decision in pulling out of UL. From my own personal experience working _at_ IBM, I can tell you first hand the commitment they have towards the Linux community is very real. Conversely, I don't think the Linux community has anything to fear by putting their support behind Big Blue.
Its pretty obvious that SCO's recent "Hail Mary" play is falling flat on its face..Rather than adapt their business model, they're executing one last, desparate attempt to stay in business without a viable customer pool.
Sad, when you get down to it. The suits at SCO are going to run that company into the ground.
-- Bowie J. Poag
Re: company tries to stay in business
by
Black+Parrot
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
> So SCO is enforcing their IP. It's their call what they open source not IBM's.
Their business model isn't sound in the current environment. Only those vendors who sell UNIX to support their underlying hardware business are hanging in there right now.
And even those businesses' days may be numbered, unless they can convert themselves into service companies. It's getting hard to justify buying a Sun instead of an Athlon.
-- Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
Re:Which Article Did Slashdot Editors Read?
by
Gleef
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
We all read the same article. SuSE said it supports the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux, but left out any indication of support of the actions or current composition. They also said they were reevaluating their relationship to the SCO group and that:
SuSE's VP of Corporate Communications. Eckert confirmed that the "relationship with the SCO Group" was in fact the UnitedLinux consortium aarrangment[sic].
So they are reevaluating their membership in the UnitedLinux consortium, as that membership is their primary (and perhaps only) relationship with SCO Group. I'm sure if SCO were to leave the UnitedLinux consortium, SuSE would be happy to stay.
1) Try to choose working with as many partners as possible in a spirit of cooperation.
2) Do not reap the PR benefits, nor spin the relationship strongly in the public eye at all.
3) Allow some partner to control the spin to their own agenda (in this case Caldera/SCO).
4) Eventually find that the partner has taken a (to SuSE's viewpoint) incredulous stand. Publically state that they do not agree.
5) Partnership and sails of other company deflate/dissolve.
SuSE is a somewhat naive company in the way it forms alliance, makes choices, etc. They do not believe in strong spin or overbearing marketing. They do not believe in half-truth statements or downplaying their competitors. There may be exceptions to this (there's no single decisionmaker running the whole show), but as a general rule it holds.
When I was there, it was fairly common for them to observe a sharply competitive move and collectively shake their heads. They _do_ believe in making better products, so this kind of competition is welcomed with open arms, but patent lawsuits are viewed in this sort of way I see as typical german: "This is not good."
All in all, I have to say I saw this as the eventual outcome of United Linux. I see SuSE and Connectiva as technology leaders, with Turbo and SCO/Caldera ultimately hamstrung by the strange politics/business of their leadership. The former can make a solid partnership, no doubt, the latter pair do not belong in the same ship.
-- -josh
Re:Typical SuSE
by
Hambone.dk
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
"Translation: they are not an American company."
And don't I wish there were more companies with similar attitudes. When it comes to business ethics, American companies aren't exactly the most shining examples...
The end of Unix? (Not *nix)
by
GrenDel+Fuego
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
This makes me start to wonder if this might be the start of the finish for the Unix codebases.
SCO is threatening to cancel IBM's license to distribute AIX. They have the ability to do this since they own the rights to the original Unix codebase. Could it be very long before they start going after the other Unix vendors?
Sun, SGI, IBM, and other Unix vendors are already throwing their support behind Linux in a lot of ways. Perhaps this will give them the added incentive to finally throw full support into Linux, in order to avoid being subject to the whim of a failing company that may or may not decide to blackmail them.
Of course, the end of Unix has been predicted for many years now, so maybe this will turn out to be nothing.
Re:Oh the irony...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Insightful
Wow, what a troll. Either that or you've got quite the ego to think that you're smarter than ESR. Like him or not, what reason do you have to think that ESR is "deeply stupid"? And if you don't, then it isn't very ironic for him to say SCO did something deeply stupid, especially when I think most people would agree they have, if for no other reason than taking on IBM in the courtroom is fraught with peril.
The SCO suit is an example of what happens to former SCO technology development partners. Its perfectly reasonable to view a frivolous lawsuit like this as an indication that SCO is not a safe company to collaborate with. UnitedLinux members: watch out.
First TurboLinux implodes. Now SCO's starting to sue companies who they once looked at as partners, and in the process they're alienating pretty much any and every UNIX related sales opportunity they once had (not to mention they're probably making it tons more difficult for resellers to sell their wares).
That leaves Conectiva and SuSE, at least for now. The rest are business partners who are putting their names behind the UL effort, but many of them are on the "will SCO sue them next" list. Yeah, I'd like to go to a party where I know there's a good chance a certain jerk will want to pick a fight with me. No thanks...
The UnitedLinux effort, for all its hype and all the hope people (some, at least) put in it, is no doubt bruised all over the place by SCO's recent actions. And the incorrect perception that SCO owns UnitedLinux can't be helping the other Linux players who are participating in the project. I can only guess that some folks think SuSE and Conectiva are also evil, if only by association.
It's unfortunate that nobody at SCO thought about the trickle effect and what this lawsuit would do to its former allies "downstream". They've pulled some really stupid stuff in the past, but I truly think this time they've outdone themselves.
UnitedLinux may very well be a sinking ship.
Thanks for nothing, SCO.
Re:Which Article Did Slashdot Editors Read?
by
jeffasselin
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
"Accordingly, we are currently reevaluating our relationship with the SCO Group," Seibt continued. "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community."
That's certainly NOT how I read it. He said he was supporting the ideals and goals which would be completely different from actually saying he'd support UnitedLinux itself.
On the contrary, it seems to me that he purposefully avoided saying that he supported UnitedLinux. This is political-talk, didn't you learn how to decode it at school?
-- If he explores all forms and substances
Straight homeward to their symbol-essences;
He shall not die.
UnitedLinux is a scam
by
zbik
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
What does UnitedLinux have to offer as Yet Another Distribution? They aren't promoting any new ideas or technologies; their only selling point is to be a "single stable, uniform platform for application development, certification, and deployment" (UL FAQ). In other words, they offer no value unless they become a monopoly. Why on earth would we support a free kernel monopolized by a proprietary distribution? Far better to throw your support behind Gentoo, Debian, or Mandrake. We don't need another RedHat.
In other news, the dinosaurs...
by
expro
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· Score: 4, Insightful
Um, where was the open source version of Windows that Microsoft had to compete against?
In other news, scientists proclaimed that dinosaurs died because they were no longer adapted to the environment, and then refused to accept that their huge skeletons and the large quantity of other life forms they consumed proved otherwise.
Re:SCO sues IBM
by
molarmass192
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
Along the same vein, ten years ago, I would never have believed that I'd be rooting for MS to die off. Ten years ago I was rooting for MS to put the hurt on IBM. Funny how things develop over time. However, I'm 100% behind IBM on this SCO thing! Ironically, if IBM managed to earn it's way back into my good books, it makes me wonder what I'll think of MS 10 years from now.
--
Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws-Plato
Re:Oh the irony...
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
Being able to code libraries well does not necessarily mean you also have great wisdom about licensing schemes. I'll give him credit for intelligence in the area of coding, but not for understanding real world mechanics of people/capitalism/socialism/software. In many peoples thought (mine included) he's "deeply stupid" in this area. That doesn't mean he isn't intelligent in the area of coding, but almost all folks see of him these days is preaching in the area that many him as "deeply stupid".
I think that poster like most folks will give him credit for his contributions with the GNU libraries, but that does not equate to him being a philosophical guru about licensing and the future of software. The problem is, he thinks he is.
The thing that worries me
by
rudy_wayne
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
It happens over and over again. These stupid lawsuits never turn out the way they should.
What SHOULD happen: Small Scum-Bag Company A, with very little in the way of legitimate product or profits, files a ridiculously stupid lawsuit against Big Deep-Pockets Company B.
Big Deep-Pockets Company B uses their comsiderable financial and legal resources to win the case, crush Small Scum-Bag Company A and obtain a court ruling that deters future stupid lawsuits by other small scum-bag companies..
What ACTUALLY heppens: Big Deep-Pockets Company B doesn't want to be bothered, so they have their insurance company send off a nice fat check to Small Scum-Bag Company A, which now is flush with cash and able to pursue other victims with its stupid lawsuits.
Re:This saves me from dropping SuSE
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
"and have just installed "SuSE Linux Office Desktop""
Why bother?
Why bother running linux if your going to run a proprietary version of Wine, use a proprietary tool to Admin your system, and then run some proprietary MS apps on top of it all.
Seem completely stupid to me and you'd just be better off running Windows.
If this is the future of linux its doomed. You see that don't you? You can't just get a little pregnant and the path of distros like Suse's Office desktop, Lindows, and Xandros leads to a place worse then where we are now with MS.
During a talk here in Oxford University's computing lab, Eric Raymond proclaimed that "UNIX died because it was closed-source", and then refused to accept that Microsoft's multi-billion dollar success suggested that otherwise.
It's true, it's just incomplete.
Unix died because it was closed source and internally competitive. It fractured into a slew of islands of mutually incompatible enhancements, none of which, with the possible exception of Solaris, had sufficient momentum to stand alone.
By contrast, Microsoft, being closed source and a unity, is motivated to converge rather than diverge its OSes, so it doesn't fragment its' user base.
In fact, if SuSE would this opportunity to jump ship from UnitedLinux and form a partnership with RedHat instead, we could see a major revolution in Linux corporate use.
RedHat has tons of corporate experience, is great with GNOME, and has the US market pretty firmly. SuSE is great with KDE, has a goodly amount of corporate experience, and does a good job on the European market. Both are open-source friendly (although Yast is not open-source and SuSE CDs are not available for free download, IIRC, so SuSE might need to open up a bit). If RedHat and SuSE were to combine their experience, pool their technical resources, and start a combined marketing blitz, I think it would be highly effective at jump-starting widespread corporate acceptance of Linux.
Mandrake would have also made a suitable partner, but unfortunately, their current financial troubles make me think they'll be hitting the ground hard soon. A shame - I've head good things about them.
-Erwos
-- Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.
Re:Which would be better...
by
tloh
·
· Score: 3, Insightful
I'm sorry, but did I miss something here? Why does everyone think SuSE is quiting UnitedLinux? How does "*reevaluating* our relationship with the SCO Group" get universally interpreted as "unconditional withdrawl from UnitedLinux"? If I'm not mistaken, the SuSE guy also said: "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community." To me, it seems like SuSE is sending a subtle message to the other members of UnitedLinux, urging them to adopt their own posture toward SCO. I mean, it seems childish for SuSE to quit on account of one rogue member. Doesn't the rest of UnitedLinux stand to loose much more from loosing SuSE than keeping SCO? Perhaps I don't understand the group dynamics involved in a collaberation like UnitedLinux, but the impression I get from reading the threads on this story make it seem like individual members of the consortium, for the most part, do their own thing....hardly a good way to accomplish a *United*anything.
--
Stay sentient.
Don't drink bad milk.
Re:Bad news.
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 1, Insightful
It is always a good idea not to be associated with Caldera, or anyone who with a straight face is against the GPL. Now they learned -- although Red Hat learned this 9 years ago!
Ok, it's been said that M$ actually doesn't do anything more than "wound" a company that it feels is a threat or has something it wants. Then they just sit back, wait for it to get financially desparate and buy it up for a pitance.
So, this could be analogous of a Shark and a diver. The shark doesn't rush in and start chomping on the diver. Instead the shark stealthfully attacks the diver from beneath, takes a sizable bite, then backs off. Now all it has to do is is wait a short while until the diver bleeds out and then it can eat at it's leasure without fear of getting damaged by a thrashing victim. Much in the way M$ does financially to it's competitors.
Now, one could say that SCO viewed it self as a diver in hostile waters, surrounded by sharks. So, they take out their knife and slash at the biggest shark they can (IBM) but in doing so the end up cutting themselves. Now the slash is called David Boies and this cut, along with IBMs legal team will bleed out SCO in court costs and attorney fees. Seems that once again SCO leadership has misjudged their environment and is destined to bleed themselves out.
IBM, if they have any desire to appropriate any of SCOs patents, will merely wait for SCO to become so weakened and despararte that when the time is right they can swoop in for the kill (a buyout at a fraction of what SCO may have thought possible).
Meanwhile all the other players in the water, that being United Linux/SuSE, the OSS devs/community, and just about everyone else are all climbing out of the this particular pond to watch SCO thrash around as the IBM bigfish circles around and around waiting for the right moment to make the kill. Don't be surprised if one of those that sought safety in the boat finds a long stick to give a push or two to keep SCO from coming to the surface.
In the meantime, if one listens carefully, they will probably be able to hear Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer snickering in the distance.
Re:Please mod parent up...
by
KeensMustard
·
· Score: 2, Insightful
So, when evaluating a new cart model, do you base you opinion on a car built 5 years previously? How about we make judgements on Linux by using Linus's orignal code? FYI: FreeBSD is now up to 5.0, where have you been??
Slashdot Mirror
If SuSE drops out, do the "UnitedLinux" gang have anything left? Isn't UnitedLinux based upon SuSE 8.1?
My Greasemonkey scripts for Digg &
It is ironic that Caldera's last stand in Linux territory, UnitedLinux, is losing support because its only potential source of income (licensing and suing for license violations) seems to have its sights on milking IBM and Linux itself. Am I smelling mismanagement? UnitedLinux could have actually migrated SCO from UNIX to Linux, but instead now they're going to have to either convince companies to not migrate to Linux, or convince judges that Linux is a derivative of UNIX, and start charging license fees.
Slashdot: Where people pretend to be twice as smart as they really are by behaving like children.
SuSE, "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community."
So, how do you interpret this to mean that SuSE is backing out of UnitedLinux?
SuSE (Software Und SystemEntwicklung) is German.
They'd be making the right decision in pulling out of UL. From my own personal experience working _at_ IBM, I can tell you first hand the commitment they have towards the Linux community is very real. Conversely, I don't think the Linux community has anything to fear by putting their support behind Big Blue.
Its pretty obvious that SCO's recent "Hail Mary" play is falling flat on its face..Rather than adapt their business model, they're executing one last, desparate attempt to stay in business without a viable customer pool.
Sad, when you get down to it. The suits at SCO are going to run that company into the ground.
Bowie J. Poag
> So SCO is enforcing their IP. It's their call what they open source not IBM's.
Their business model isn't sound in the current environment. Only those vendors who sell UNIX to support their underlying hardware business are hanging in there right now.
And even those businesses' days may be numbered, unless they can convert themselves into service companies. It's getting hard to justify buying a Sun instead of an Athlon.
Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
So they are reevaluating their membership in the UnitedLinux consortium, as that membership is their primary (and perhaps only) relationship with SCO Group. I'm sure if SCO were to leave the UnitedLinux consortium, SuSE would be happy to stay.
----
Open mind, insert foot.
1) Try to choose working with as many partners as possible in a spirit of cooperation.
2) Do not reap the PR benefits, nor spin the relationship strongly in the public eye at all.
3) Allow some partner to control the spin to their own agenda (in this case Caldera/SCO).
4) Eventually find that the partner has taken a (to SuSE's viewpoint) incredulous stand. Publically state that they do not agree.
5) Partnership and sails of other company deflate/dissolve.
SuSE is a somewhat naive company in the way it forms alliance, makes choices, etc. They do not believe in strong spin or overbearing marketing. They do not believe in half-truth statements or downplaying their competitors. There may be exceptions to this (there's no single decisionmaker running the whole show), but as a general rule it holds.
When I was there, it was fairly common for them to observe a sharply competitive move and collectively shake their heads. They _do_ believe in making better products, so this kind of competition is welcomed with open arms, but patent lawsuits are viewed in this sort of way I see as typical german: "This is not good."
All in all, I have to say I saw this as the eventual outcome of United Linux. I see SuSE and Connectiva as technology leaders, with Turbo and SCO/Caldera ultimately hamstrung by the strange politics/business of their leadership. The former can make a solid partnership, no doubt, the latter pair do not belong in the same ship.
-josh
This makes me start to wonder if this might be the start of the finish for the Unix codebases.
SCO is threatening to cancel IBM's license to distribute AIX. They have the ability to do this since they own the rights to the original Unix codebase. Could it be very long before they start going after the other Unix vendors?
Sun, SGI, IBM, and other Unix vendors are already throwing their support behind Linux in a lot of ways. Perhaps this will give them the added incentive to finally throw full support into Linux, in order to avoid being subject to the whim of a failing company that may or may not decide to blackmail them.
Of course, the end of Unix has been predicted for many years now, so maybe this will turn out to be nothing.
Wow, what a troll. Either that or you've got quite the ego to think that you're smarter than ESR. Like him or not, what reason do you have to think that ESR is "deeply stupid"? And if you don't, then it isn't very ironic for him to say SCO did something deeply stupid, especially when I think most people would agree they have, if for no other reason than taking on IBM in the courtroom is fraught with peril.
The SCO suit is an example of what happens to former SCO technology development partners. Its perfectly reasonable to view a frivolous lawsuit like this as an indication that SCO is not a safe company to collaborate with. UnitedLinux members: watch out.
First TurboLinux implodes. Now SCO's starting to sue companies who they once looked at as partners, and in the process they're alienating pretty much any and every UNIX related sales opportunity they once had (not to mention they're probably making it tons more difficult for resellers to sell their wares).
That leaves Conectiva and SuSE, at least for now. The rest are business partners who are putting their names behind the UL effort, but many of them are on the "will SCO sue them next" list. Yeah, I'd like to go to a party where I know there's a good chance a certain jerk will want to pick a fight with me. No thanks...
The UnitedLinux effort, for all its hype and all the hope people (some, at least) put in it, is no doubt bruised all over the place by SCO's recent actions. And the incorrect perception that SCO owns UnitedLinux can't be helping the other Linux players who are participating in the project. I can only guess that some folks think SuSE and Conectiva are also evil, if only by association.
It's unfortunate that nobody at SCO thought about the trickle effect and what this lawsuit would do to its former allies "downstream". They've pulled some really stupid stuff in the past, but I truly think this time they've outdone themselves.
UnitedLinux may very well be a sinking ship.
Thanks for nothing, SCO.
That's certainly NOT how I read it. He said he was supporting the ideals and goals which would be completely different from actually saying he'd support UnitedLinux itself.
On the contrary, it seems to me that he purposefully avoided saying that he supported UnitedLinux. This is political-talk, didn't you learn how to decode it at school?
If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
What does UnitedLinux have to offer as Yet Another Distribution? They aren't promoting any new ideas or technologies; their only selling point is to be a "single stable, uniform platform for application development, certification, and deployment" (UL FAQ). In other words, they offer no value unless they become a monopoly. Why on earth would we support a free kernel monopolized by a proprietary distribution? Far better to throw your support behind Gentoo, Debian, or Mandrake. We don't need another RedHat.
Um, where was the open source version of Windows that Microsoft had to compete against?
In other news, scientists proclaimed that dinosaurs died because they were no longer adapted to the environment, and then refused to accept that their huge skeletons and the large quantity of other life forms they consumed proved otherwise.
Along the same vein, ten years ago, I would never have believed that I'd be rooting for MS to die off. Ten years ago I was rooting for MS to put the hurt on IBM. Funny how things develop over time. However, I'm 100% behind IBM on this SCO thing! Ironically, if IBM managed to earn it's way back into my good books, it makes me wonder what I'll think of MS 10 years from now.
Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws-Plato
Being able to code libraries well does not necessarily mean you also have great wisdom about licensing schemes. I'll give him credit for intelligence in the area of coding, but not for understanding real world mechanics of people/capitalism/socialism/software. In many peoples thought (mine included) he's "deeply stupid" in this area. That doesn't mean he isn't intelligent in the area of coding, but almost all folks see of him these days is preaching in the area that many him as "deeply stupid".
I think that poster like most folks will give him credit for his contributions with the GNU libraries, but that does not equate to him being a philosophical guru about licensing and the future of software. The problem is, he thinks he is.
It happens over and over again. These stupid lawsuits never turn out the way they should.
What SHOULD happen:
Small Scum-Bag Company A, with very little in the way of legitimate product or profits, files a ridiculously stupid lawsuit against Big Deep-Pockets Company B.
Big Deep-Pockets Company B uses their comsiderable financial and legal resources to win the case, crush Small Scum-Bag Company A and obtain a court ruling that deters future stupid lawsuits by other small scum-bag companies..
What ACTUALLY heppens:
Big Deep-Pockets Company B doesn't want to be bothered, so they have their insurance company send off a nice fat check to Small Scum-Bag Company A, which now is flush with cash and able to pursue other victims with its stupid lawsuits.
"and have just installed "SuSE Linux Office Desktop""
Why bother?
Why bother running linux if your going to run a proprietary version of Wine, use a proprietary tool to Admin your system, and then run some proprietary MS apps on top of it all.
Seem completely stupid to me and you'd just be better off running Windows.
If this is the future of linux its doomed. You see that don't you? You can't just get a little pregnant and the path of distros like Suse's Office desktop, Lindows, and Xandros leads to a place worse then where we are now with MS.
During a talk here in Oxford University's computing lab, Eric Raymond proclaimed that "UNIX died because it was closed-source", and then refused to accept that Microsoft's multi-billion dollar success suggested that otherwise.
It's true, it's just incomplete.
Unix died because it was closed source and internally competitive. It fractured into a slew of islands of mutually incompatible enhancements, none of which, with the possible exception of Solaris, had sufficient momentum to stand alone.
By contrast, Microsoft, being closed source and a unity, is motivated to converge rather than diverge its OSes, so it doesn't fragment its' user base.
In fact, if SuSE would this opportunity to jump ship from UnitedLinux and form a partnership with RedHat instead, we could see a major revolution in Linux corporate use.
RedHat has tons of corporate experience, is great with GNOME, and has the US market pretty firmly. SuSE is great with KDE, has a goodly amount of corporate experience, and does a good job on the European market. Both are open-source friendly (although Yast is not open-source and SuSE CDs are not available for free download, IIRC, so SuSE might need to open up a bit). If RedHat and SuSE were to combine their experience, pool their technical resources, and start a combined marketing blitz, I think it would be highly effective at jump-starting widespread corporate acceptance of Linux.
Mandrake would have also made a suitable partner, but unfortunately, their current financial troubles make me think they'll be hitting the ground hard soon. A shame - I've head good things about them.
-Erwos
Plausible conjecture should not be misrepresented as proof positive.
I'm sorry, but did I miss something here? Why does everyone think SuSE is quiting UnitedLinux?
How does "*reevaluating* our relationship with the SCO Group" get universally interpreted as "unconditional withdrawl from UnitedLinux"? If I'm not mistaken, the SuSE guy also said: "That said, we want to very clearly and unequivocally voice our support of the ideals and goals of UnitedLinux and the Linux community." To me, it seems like SuSE is sending a subtle message to the other members of UnitedLinux, urging them to adopt their own posture toward SCO. I mean, it seems childish for SuSE to quit on account of one rogue member. Doesn't the rest of UnitedLinux stand to loose much more from loosing SuSE than keeping SCO? Perhaps I don't understand the group dynamics involved in a collaberation like UnitedLinux, but the impression I get from reading the threads on this story make it seem like individual members of the consortium, for the most part, do their own thing....hardly a good way to accomplish a *United*anything.
Stay sentient. Don't drink bad milk.
It is always a good idea not to be associated with
Caldera, or anyone who with a straight face is against the GPL. Now they
learned -- although Red Hat learned this 9 years ago!
Anti-Marketing at it's finest!
Ok, it's been said that M$ actually doesn't do anything more than "wound" a company that it feels is a threat or has something it wants. Then they just sit back, wait for it to get financially desparate and buy it up for a pitance.
So, this could be analogous of a Shark and a diver. The shark doesn't rush in and start chomping on the diver. Instead the shark stealthfully attacks the diver from beneath, takes a sizable bite, then backs off. Now all it has to do is is wait a short while until the diver bleeds out and then it can eat at it's leasure without fear of getting damaged by a thrashing victim. Much in the way M$ does financially to it's competitors.
Now, one could say that SCO viewed it self as a diver in hostile waters, surrounded by sharks. So, they take out their knife and slash at the biggest shark they can (IBM) but in doing so the end up cutting themselves. Now the slash is called David Boies and this cut, along with IBMs legal team will bleed out SCO in court costs and attorney fees. Seems that once again SCO leadership has misjudged their environment and is destined to bleed themselves out.
IBM, if they have any desire to appropriate any of SCOs patents, will merely wait for SCO to become so weakened and despararte that when the time is right they can swoop in for the kill (a buyout at a fraction of what SCO may have thought possible).
Meanwhile all the other players in the water, that being United Linux/SuSE, the OSS devs/community, and just about everyone else are all climbing out of the this particular pond to watch SCO thrash around as the IBM bigfish circles around and around waiting for the right moment to make the kill. Don't be surprised if one of those that sought safety in the boat finds a long stick to give a push or two to keep SCO from coming to the surface.
In the meantime, if one listens carefully, they will probably be able to hear Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer snickering in the distance.
So, when evaluating a new cart model, do you base you opinion on a car built 5 years previously? How about we make judgements on Linux by using Linus's orignal code?
FYI: FreeBSD is now up to 5.0, where have you been??