Posted by
CmdrTaco
on from the this-is-only-gonna-get-more-interesting dept.
djtrippin writes "Linus comes forth on the SCO v IBM suit and how it pertains (or doesn't, for that matter) to Linux." He definitely puts a fair amount of perspective on the whole thing. This story really is only going to get more bizarre.
Correct me if I'm wronge...
by
PapaSMURFFS
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
Correct me if I'm wronge, but isn't the SCO Group involved with several linux projects itself?
I think the one real reason for the lawsuite is pointed out in the article-->The fear of loosing the revinue from the IBM liscencing on AIX
I don't fear for IBM, even in the worst case it wont be so much affected (but I doubt that this could cost much to IBM). I fear what will come after. This insecurity is doing much more harm to Linux and Unix in general than is doing Microsoft with its "fair" antilinux campaigns.
What I fear is that a way to win the case could be IBM showing some hidden card in their software patents pool. What about something generic enough to say "I own the patents on multitasking"? or concurrent file access, or even the "while" loop, something in some way that disables SCO claims but puts on the table something big enough to be considered a threat to all the industry. Is like using atomic bombs in a war, after one of the parts uses one, all the others feel validated to do the same and we all lose.
From SCO's document: 84. Prior to IBM's involvement, Linux was the software equivalent of a bicycle. UNIX was the software equivalent of a luxury car. To make Linux of necessary quality for use by enterprise customers, it must be re-designed so that Linux also becomes the software equivalent of a luxury car.
A bicycle??!? Ok, a free bicycle...that seats as many as a luxury car, on just as comfortable seats, and has the same horsepower as the luxury car, and that comes complete with design schematics and a suite of tools that allow you to build more "bicycles", oh and you can give them away to your friends.
Oh, and now nobody is really interested in luxury cars anymore... maybe that's that's what SCO is so mad about.
--
Was it the sheep climbing onto the altar, or the cattle lowing to be slain, or the Son of God hanging dead and bloodied on a cross that told me this was a world condemnded, but loved and bought with blood.
Economic Perspective
by
EvilSuggestions
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
Just took a look at a financial site and noticed that dear old SCO/Caldera appears to have a market cap of $32.9 million today. As such, I wonder, what will be the total cost to IBM to properly defend themselves in this suit, plus the amount that they spend on "licensing" Unix from SCO? At least $32.9M perhaps? Maybe more...
Seems to me that the logical step for IBM now is to settle this suit by simply acquiring the plaintiff. Even before this suit was filed, it kinda made sense for quite a few reasons:
IBM's services division apparently loves to support old OS's and software, so the SCO support contracts would be a good match.
They would now own all the former members of the Project Monterey alliance (Sequent being the other member). No more sticky legal issues about code developed during that project.
There's the bragging rights of owning the Unix trademark. Certainly would give them a leg up marketing against Sun and HP.
-- "There is a thin line between ignorance and arrogance, and only I have managed to erase that line." - Dr. Science
Re:The crux of the article
by
ComputerSlicer23
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
Hmmm, I'm going to assume your being sarcastic, but if you aren't, and you truely believe Linus isn't his own person, and doesn't have his own opinions, you've never read Linus in the middle of his own flame wars. If you want a really good one, just look up the one he had with a Professor Tanenbaum, one of the leading authorities on Operating Systems back in 1990 or 1991. Definitely has is own opinions, not afraid to tell you what he really thinks.
Kirby
What IBM should do
by
afidel
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
is buy SCO, market cap is 25 million which is a steal to ensure the future of AIX and Linux. IBM has put untold Billions into AIX over the decades and is planning on putting over one billion into linux over the next couple years. Heck the lawyers will probably cost in the millions on this one, buy the IP and make sure they never have to worry again.
-- There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
Re:Loud-mouthed weasel!
by
jbolden
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
Well SCO is somewhat challenging that, they certainly question Linus' version of some events. For example Linus has said time and time again that:
Linux was a pun on Linix and Linus and Linix is short for Linus's Minix
SCO asserted in the suit that Linux is short for Linus + Unix.
Obviously they know the origin of the name better
(and of course Linus's version has newsgroup postings backing it up that only shows that deja/google is in on the conspiracy to defraud SCO).
This is important for SCO since they have 0 rights over Minix.
Re:Dennis Ritchie Comments and Documents from
by
Dr_Marvin_Monroe
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
In the world of biology, they call that "genetic diversity"....it helps to prevent the spread of disease and creates new and interesting patterns when combined with other genes or ideas...it also promotes evolution...which is cool.
It's also one of the many reasons my desktop doesn't get those evil bugs that seem to plague the "feedlot" computers that run Windows.
Think of my boxen here as "free range".....
Re:I told you so.
by
jedidiah
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
It's not the consumer devices that earn IBM fanboys. It's the big iron systems that have been running since before NT was a gleam in Cutler's eye. IBM is not merely limited to the XT. IBM has been contributing to the state of the art in computing since before Microsoft even existed (mebbe even Bill too).
They already have enough of a patent portfolio to make the computing industry look like Kuwait after Iraq got through with it. However, IBM has as much to lose from such a firestorm as anyone else.
Fear the man who has nothing to lose. That man is SCO.
-- A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Re:The point is something else...
by
Jahf
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
Not necessarily. If anyone has the lawyers capable of making SCO's infringement claim stick, it would be Microsoft. $1B isn't complete chump-change (even to them), especially as that's only IBM, and if it would hurt their competition, I could Microsoft doing it. Don't forget that patents (and their infringements) would transfer in an aquisition.
In my opinion, if SCO -isn't- looking for a buy-out, they're nuts. They don't have clout in the market anymore and they probably don't have the coffers needed to pursue these infringements. I'm not saying I agree with their claims, but if they are looking to get bought, it's a proven strategy to build up a portfolio of cases and then sell off to someone with more muscle.
-- It is more productive to voice thoughtful opinions (reply) than to judge (moderate) others.
Re:Who cares what Linus thinks?
by
PizzaFace
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
We could ask SCO, "fine, you've got the source, show us the alleged Unix IP-infringing code".
SCO's claims aren't limited to source code. SCO makes no claim of copyright infringement, though such a claim would be expected if source code had been stolen. SCO's complaint alleges (1) misappropriation of trade secrets, (2) unfair competition, (3) interference with contract, and (4) breach of contract. The trade secrets that IBM allegedly stole were SCO's "unique know how, concepts, ideas, methodologies, standards, specifications, programming, techniques, UNIX Software Code, object code, architecture, design and schematics that allow UNIX to operate with unmatched extensibility, scalability, reliability and security." (par. 105)
It takes chutzpa for SCO to claim that it could do things with operating systems that IBM couldn't. I predict there will ultimately be a charred and smoking gash in the land where SCO now stands.
Re:The crux of the article
by
SyFryer
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
Here is a link to said flaming in case anyone watching hasn't seen it.
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/opensources/book/ ap pa.html
HOW-TO: SCO - Linux migration
by
PiotrK
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
Could we just write:
* SCO to Linux Conversion book,
* SCO to Linux HOW-TO,
* SCO to Linux Migration Case Histories,
and start sourceforge site with all necesery scripts, etc?
Re:Mirror in case it's slashdotted
by
imadork
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
We should have a (+1, Mirror) option when we moderate. This way, people can still Karma Whore, which is of course an essential part of the Slashdot Experience, but I can filter these silly redundant posts out in my preferences.
Re:The crux of the article
by
disappear
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
Yes, it is interesting. But it can also be explained easily:
First, Linus sometimes reverses himself. That is, he says, "I was wrong about XXXXX, and it's going into the kernel now." This happens a lot.
Second, Linus has a sense of humor about himself. He knows that he's good at what he does, but he never thinks he's the best or only.
Third, just because somebody disagrees with him, that doesn't mean that Linus calles that person an idiot. Or insult them. Or threaten to sue them, as Bernstein in particular does pretty frequently.
Linus didn't go off and found his own project because he made himself too unpleasant to the people with whom he previously worked... he did it because the work was interesting to him, and he didn't know that anybody else was doing it. (Though in fact the *BSDers were at the time.)
Slashdot Mirror
Great. Where's his law degree from again?
Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
Correct me if I'm wronge, but isn't the SCO Group involved with several linux projects itself? I think the one real reason for the lawsuite is pointed out in the article-->The fear of loosing the revinue from the IBM liscencing on AIX
What I fear is that a way to win the case could be IBM showing some hidden card in their software patents pool. What about something generic enough to say "I own the patents on multitasking"? or concurrent file access, or even the "while" loop, something in some way that disables SCO claims but puts on the table something big enough to be considered a threat to all the industry. Is like using atomic bombs in a war, after one of the parts uses one, all the others feel validated to do the same and we all lose.
From SCO's document: 84. Prior to IBM's involvement, Linux was the software equivalent of a bicycle. UNIX was the software equivalent of a luxury car. To make Linux of necessary quality for use by enterprise customers, it must be re-designed so that Linux also becomes the software equivalent of a luxury car.
A bicycle??!? Ok, a free bicycle...that seats as many as a luxury car, on just as comfortable seats, and has the same horsepower as the luxury car, and that comes complete with design schematics and a suite of tools that allow you to build more "bicycles", oh and you can give them away to your friends.
Oh, and now nobody is really interested in luxury cars anymore... maybe that's that's what SCO is so mad about.
--
Was it the sheep climbing onto the altar, or the cattle lowing to be slain,
or the Son of God hanging dead and bloodied on a cross that told me this was a world condemnded, but loved and bought with blood.
Just took a look at a financial site and noticed that dear old SCO/Caldera appears to have a market cap of $32.9 million today. As such, I wonder, what will be the total cost to IBM to properly defend themselves in this suit, plus the amount that they spend on "licensing" Unix from SCO? At least $32.9M perhaps? Maybe more...
Seems to me that the logical step for IBM now is to settle this suit by simply acquiring the plaintiff. Even before this suit was filed, it kinda made sense for quite a few reasons:
"There is a thin line between ignorance and arrogance, and only I have managed to erase that line." - Dr. Science
Kirby
is buy SCO, market cap is 25 million which is a steal to ensure the future of AIX and Linux. IBM has put untold Billions into AIX over the decades and is planning on putting over one billion into linux over the next couple years. Heck the lawyers will probably cost in the millions on this one, buy the IP and make sure they never have to worry again.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
Well SCO is somewhat challenging that, they certainly question Linus' version of some events. For example Linus has said time and time again that:
Linux was a pun on Linix and Linus
and
Linix is short for Linus's Minix
SCO asserted in the suit that
Linux is short for Linus + Unix.
Obviously they know the origin of the name better
(and of course Linus's version has newsgroup postings backing it up that only shows that deja/google is in on the conspiracy to defraud SCO).
This is important for SCO since they have 0 rights over Minix.
In the world of biology, they call that "genetic diversity"....it helps to prevent the spread of disease and creates new and interesting patterns when combined with other genes or ideas...it also promotes evolution...which is cool.
It's also one of the many reasons my desktop doesn't get those evil bugs that seem to plague the "feedlot" computers that run Windows.
Think of my boxen here as "free range".....
It's not the consumer devices that earn IBM fanboys. It's the big iron systems that have been running since before NT was a gleam in Cutler's eye. IBM is not merely limited to the XT. IBM has been contributing to the state of the art in computing since before Microsoft even existed (mebbe even Bill too).
They already have enough of a patent portfolio to make the computing industry look like Kuwait after Iraq got through with it. However, IBM has as much to lose from such a firestorm as anyone else.
Fear the man who has nothing to lose. That man is SCO.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Not necessarily. If anyone has the lawyers capable of making SCO's infringement claim stick, it would be Microsoft. $1B isn't complete chump-change (even to them), especially as that's only IBM, and if it would hurt their competition, I could Microsoft doing it. Don't forget that patents (and their infringements) would transfer in an aquisition.
In my opinion, if SCO -isn't- looking for a buy-out, they're nuts. They don't have clout in the market anymore and they probably don't have the coffers needed to pursue these infringements. I'm not saying I agree with their claims, but if they are looking to get bought, it's a proven strategy to build up a portfolio of cases and then sell off to someone with more muscle.
It is more productive to voice thoughtful opinions (reply) than to judge (moderate) others.
It takes chutzpa for SCO to claim that it could do things with operating systems that IBM couldn't. I predict there will ultimately be a charred and smoking gash in the land where SCO now stands.
Here is a link to said flaming in case anyone watching hasn't seen it.
/ ap pa.html
http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/opensources/book
Could we just write:
* SCO to Linux Conversion book,
* SCO to Linux HOW-TO,
* SCO to Linux Migration Case Histories,
and start sourceforge site with all necesery scripts, etc?
We should have a (+1, Mirror) option when we moderate. This way, people can still Karma Whore, which is of course an essential part of the Slashdot Experience, but I can filter these silly redundant posts out in my preferences.
Yes, it is interesting. But it can also be explained easily:
First, Linus sometimes reverses himself. That is, he says, "I was wrong about XXXXX, and it's going into the kernel now." This happens a lot.
Second, Linus has a sense of humor about himself. He knows that he's good at what he does, but he never thinks he's the best or only.
Third, just because somebody disagrees with him, that doesn't mean that Linus calles that person an idiot. Or insult them. Or threaten to sue them, as Bernstein in particular does pretty frequently.
Linus didn't go off and found his own project because he made himself too unpleasant to the people with whom he previously worked... he did it because the work was interesting to him, and he didn't know that anybody else was doing it. (Though in fact the *BSDers were at the time.)