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More Thoughts On How to Wire Senegal

An anonymous reader submits "Last month Slashdot published a story on the Peace Corps' plans to wire Senegal. Now Peace Corps Online has published an article by a volunteer who taught computers in West Africa for two years who recommends that the White House's Digital Freedom Initiative abandon the Western paradigm of 'a computer on every desk' and borrow a lesson from telephony in third-world countries. Since a residential telephone line is a luxury item in West Africa, the 'communication center' has flourished as a private business even in the smallest of towns where it generates profits while sharing the high cost of telecommunication among the whole community. This user model coupled with deregulation of VoIP can be the key to implementation of computer technology in poor countries."

22 of 182 comments (clear)

  1. No kidding by toygeek · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Trying to put a computer in every home? Try getting clean water in every home first. For now lets work on that. We can put in computers once we can help them READ.

    1. Re:No kidding by Daniel_Staal · · Score: 5, Insightful

      And what better way to help them read but to give them the Internet?

      Seriously. Do a google search for home-made water filters, see if there is anything they could use. Or on learning to read.

      Info can help anyone. They may not use it the way you expect them to. How about using it to work around the corruption in the local school system? Or to just decrese its cost? (A good high school may not even be avalible in some villages.) Let them decide if it is worth using.

      --
      'Sensible' is a curse word.
    2. Re:No kidding by cperciva · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's not quite that simple. Internet access has some demonstrated benefits in the third world -- if a community has access to the internet, they immediately gain access to information which would be too expensive to provide them with otherwise. Information like how to recognize and treat disease, when and how best to plant their crops, et cetera.

      Putting a computer in every home in the third world is absolutely unnecessary at this point; but putting a computer in every community has benefits far exceeding those which could be obtained by spending a similar amount on a water supply.

    3. Re:No kidding by aengblom · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Trying to put a computer in every home? Try getting clean water in every home first. For now lets work on that. We can put in computers once we can help them READ.

      This is such a tired argument. Yes, choosing between water and net access, I'd choose water. But, there is a balance.

      Just because there are homeless in the U.S., doesn't mean we should all give up Internet access. (We should find a way to fix that problem, but...)

      Guess what, the portion of the population that CAN read can benefit through Internet access. More to the point, that portion of the population, can bring less-well-off up. Can improve efficiency of operations and bring in NEW things to TEACH.

      --


      So close and yet so far from the world's perfect ID number
    4. Re:No kidding by Dark+Lord+Seth · · Score: 1, Insightful
      Seriously. Do a google search for home-made water filters, see if there is anything they could use. Or on learning to read.

      Your point being? I can google for the construction of thermonuclear weapons, does this automagically mean that I can build one from stuff sold in local stores? I can already imagine myself going to the supermarket for some stuff... "Excuse me, where do you people keep the weapons grade plutionium? Do I get bulk rates for orders over 200 kilograms?" I somehow doubt that would work. Heck, even most water-filters I can't make simply because I won't have a clue where to buy certain parts (We don't have many stores that are common in the US), what those parts are called in dutch and similiar problems.

      So instead of just giving them damned water filters you're going to give them the internet? Good luck, I'm sure they would love to spend AGES trying to find something of which they don't know the exact name in their language, but they do know what it does and how it looks like. That is, if they are literate and aren't dying of various diseases. Also, considering even well-educated people fck up terribly from time to time, would you also be willing to man their service desk?

      The internet is a lovely medium, yes. However, it's completely useless to a developing third world country. If people are so desperate to lay down internet, why not start at home first? How many villages/towns are their that still don't have ANY broadband possibilities? How many telcom monopolies are ruining the net for nearly anyone? How about creatives solutions for the legendary expensive "last mile" ? First improve at home. Experience the things you can only do by trying. Learn from mistaken around here so when finally the time is there, you can do developing countries in a nice, clean and simple way.

      Also, what use is it to LEARN to READ on a WRITTEN medium?

  2. erm.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    In impoverished countries, why don't they just feed these people instead of trying to get them to try q2 deathmatch? Who cares about this shit?

    I'd say FEED ME before FRAG ME any day.

  3. How about tackling that AIDS thing first... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I swear, the priorities of Governments...

  4. Amen by Gefiltefish11 · · Score: 4, Insightful


    A computer on every desk does indeed sound like somebody has warped priorities.

    Let's look into getting the infant mortality below 20% first.

    1. Re:Amen by silas_moeckel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Can be get the birth rate down while we do that? You have to have an infant mortality rate of 20% when you have pople having 10 children. Think Zero to low population growth this is what gets you into problems of starving less mouthes to feed = more food up to a point. Of course you need to couple this with taking care of the AIDs infection rate. How about handing out condoms, norplant getting a few computers in and showing them how to do the fresh water think in 3 easy lessons on cdrom?

      Oh for the religious pople that got Africa into the baby boom. I realy dont care that sex that isn't to produce a baby is imoral in your views that nice you have as many as you want now just dont let the rest of the world help you please it's your own fault but some of us feel sorry for your starving dieing children whoes fault is not there own there parents listen to religious zelots.

      Can you tell I dislike organized religion? Well I'll work on that one I'm sure they will forgive me if I truely repent now lets hold our breath untill that happens. Oh look the light the light yes it does burn.

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
  5. Priorities by rf0 · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Computer on every desk? How about getting everyone a desk first? Or prehaps decent housing to put the desk in? Or decent medical care? Or water and food? Surely that sort of thing would come first?

    rus

  6. Computers in Africa by chunkwhite86 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Having lived in Africa for a short period, I can say that "a computer in every home" is NOT what those people need.

    To repeat some of the previous posts, they need clean water, food, medical supplies, and other basic humanitarian goods.

    This is not to say that they have no use for computers. For this is certainly not the case. Something along the lines of an internet cafe (but not so trendy) is what they would benefit from. Just as the article says, the people can share the cost of an inexpensive comm link. Combine this with a few donated PC's running Linux and bingo - the towns people will begin to become computer literate.

    These people have a genuine desire to learn, but things like this must fit within the economic and humanitarian reality of their locale. A "community" net enabled PC would fit the bill nicely.

    --
    I'd rather be a conservative nutjob than a liberal with no nuts and no job.
  7. stop patronizing Africans by tintillon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I was in Tanzania last month. As the story says is the case in W Africa, community internet access is very popular. Its patronizing and simplistic to assume that just because these are poor people, they have no other needs than food/water (as other posters have commented). If nothing else, in the Maasai village I was staying in, people were using the internet to get farming/weather information that was otherwise unavailable. More relevantly, they were trying to contact the Houston company (http://www.tgts.com) that was shooting the leopards, lions and buffaloes on their land without permission. They were also starting their own school, using internet as a tool. All of this can be seen in a community context, which might explain why community-level internet access might be successful.

    Done right, technology will provide the information that will allow people to help themselves - much better than the normal aid dependency syndrome.

    Reply to another comment: I don't think Quake is so exciting for Maasai who have to kill a lion with a sharp stick before being allowed to marry.

    1. Re:stop patronizing Africans by HBI · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I had a friend named Martin who was an expatriate from Sierra Leone. He worked with me at IBM. Talented guy, college educated. He spent a lot of his time rounding up junk computer equipment (what we'd consider junk) and shipping it to Sierra Leone. He'd go back and visit occasionally.

      I asked him - if people can use these computers (implied literacy and education), then why can't they form up a westernized culture and enrich themselves, at least to the extent of getting decent housing and food self-sufficiency. His answer was that the lacking required factor was law and order. The leaders fleece the country, selling off natural resources at cut-rate to benefit western corporations. Eventually the enraged local youth (of a political bent) get fed up and revolt, and stuck in the middle are all the regular people of which this mythical culture would be fashioned.

      What's the answer, I said. He shook his head. He does what he can.

      --
      HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
    2. Re:stop patronizing Africans by xcomputer_man · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I completely agree.

      I am from West Africa (Nigeria in particular) and it irks me every time I see one of these morons talk about the place like it's a hapless mass of poor, depraved and illiterate morons fighting with each other all the time. It is for the same reason I refused to go see Bruce Willis' Tears of the Sun.

      You only need to get to some areas of Lagos where there are approximately 5 to 10 cybercafes PER BLOCK to understand what the hell is going on. Since the launch of mobile telecoms in Nigeria, the country has had by far the fastest cellphone industry growth rate ever recorded, injecting $1 billion into the economy within the first year alone, and leaving the 2 or 3 providers struggling under demand.

      The point is people need to communicate. Africans are a very smart set of people (just compare the average knowledge/IQ of an american high-schooler to that of a Nigerian high-schooler and you'll see what I'm talking about). And even the illiterate ones still frequent cybercafes to send email and use VoIP phones to communicate all over the world.

      I could slap the face of anyone who makes retarded comments as "let's teach them to READ first" or rubbish like that.

  8. The comunity "Computer & Comunications" idea.. by nickgrieve · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The community "Computer & Communications" idea is fantastic, not only does the cost get shared on a user pays basis, it also brings together like minded individuals where they can teach/learn from each other, rather than struggle to learn alone.

  9. Re:Joko Clubs by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Having lived in Africa most of my life, I'd like to point out just how silly the parent's viewpoint is.

    It is perfectly reasonable to give them what resources we can; just because
    they are short on food doesn't mean that they can't use the internet to
    perhaps announce what's happening to food shipments (bandits, floods, bad
    roads or any other reason) or to request what's needed most or even to try
    to up revenue (such as tourism) or improve financial communications.

    The funny thing: most food shortages in Africa are manmade. Most of Africa
    is not starving, and where they are starving there are other problems
    causing the starvation which might well be alleviated by better literacy,
    better communications or even just better infrastructure in general. Lord
    knows a little useful agronomy online might help, or online diagnostic
    information, or online purchase rather than having to go a week without
    someone's labour JUST so that they can go far enough to buy whatever it is
    that they need.

    Sure, it would be more useful if they all had doctorates in CS and were working
    out of their mahogany offices; can't you imagine how useless the internet is
    for actually organising things people need? Haha, the very idea.

    Guess what: people in africa use wireless telephony. They aren't just given
    it; they USE it. It's made a lot of activity a lot more efficient.

    Go ahead, great dictator, tell people on the other side of the world what
    problems they have or don't have, tell them what they need and don't need.
    They will quite rightly be sickened and disgusted by your blind arrogance. Chances are, you're behind a firewall or proxy, or clicked the Back button to accidentally reuse a form. Please try again. If the problem persists, and all other options have been tried, contact the site administrator.

  10. Food IS more important, but ... by dimension6 · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Upon reading many peoples' response to the wiring of 3rd world countries, I don't think that everyone is considering all of the benefits that the Internet may bring to the people (mostly indirectly). Regarding business Internet usage, there is no denying that the Internet has proven to be an indispensable tool that both saves money and time in the long run. I think that setting up Senegalese companies with connected computers will help out the people in the long run. With proper communication, it will be possible to give food to those who really need it with far more efficiency.

    Contrary to what many of you believe, Senegal is not one of the most impoverished nations in Africa (try Sierra Leone)...

  11. Band-aid approaches don't work by siskbc · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Trying to put a computer in every home? Try getting clean water in every home first. For now lets work on that. We can put in computers once we can help them READ.

    As much as I applaud foreign aid, the way we've been doing it DOESN'T WORK. When we go in and feed people, guess what happens when we leave (and leave we will!)? They starve again. If anything, they're worse off, because they've gotten used to a steady stream of aid.

    This is why we need to educate them, and computers is a good way to provide maximum education/$. Right now, in the third world, there is no meritocracy - so there are, quite likely, very intelligent people who don't have any means of improving themselves. However, they could do very well with some investment in education in these countries.

    So, what we need is to educate the populace while we feed them. Give them a chance to learn either a trade skill, or to go to university. Then, the educated can help rebuild the country. Admittedly, computers aren't the sole answer to this, but it would be a part. Those who have the intelligence and literacy would be able to teach themselves, and as other posters have said, Google is a better textbook than nothing for schools that lack resources.

    Yes, Africa needs food....but it might need civil engineers even more. That's why we need to work really hard to educate them. If you wait to educate until no one is starving, no one will ever be educated and everyone will starve when we stop spoon-feeding them. That's why it has to be a concerted effort.

    --

    -Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat

    1. Re:Band-aid approaches don't work by bfields · · Score: 2, Insightful
      As much as I applaud foreign aid, the way we've been doing it DOESN'T WORK. When we go in and feed people, guess what happens when we leave (and leave we will!)? They starve again.

      On the contrary, what I've always been lead to understand is that most starvation is due to temporary, local situations--war, natural disaster, whatever--so most food aid is to communities that can normally feed themselves but that need aid to survive through just a few months.

      --Bruce Fields

  12. Some specifics about Senegal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    It's certainly true that people can get too carried away with high-tech needs when low-tech needs are unmet, and I agree about the importance of health issues. But it's also true that westerners make too many blanket assumptions about Africa. Look at Senegal specifically -- here's some good info: these stats. All those comments below about how they can't read over there are pretty uninformed. Literacy is over 50%.

  13. Just say no to Pox Americana by dunng808 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    This user model coupled with deregulation of VoIP can be the key to implementation of computer technology in poor countries.

    Who is regulating VoIP? To what specific problems does this phrase apply?

    I don't see where the Digital Freedom Initiative wants to put a computer on every desk. In fact, their agenda sounds pretty much the same as the proposed alternative, namely to leverage the Internet cafes already there.

    When you're talking about computers in Africa, every city is a village.

    This is a nice line. Nice in the style of political campaign slogans. Bumper Sticker Verbiage. All I get from it is that Africa is behind in computer technology.

    The Peace Corps has got to stop acting like Christian missionaries. The way to help African countries is to help those who manage the country. Let them manage their own lives. The conservative politics of the current administration assume that we Americans -- including the Peace Corps. -- are better equipped to run things than the people we are supposed to be helping. That approach is doomed to fail -- see the history of colonialism.

    I was especially offended by the pro-commerce tone of the DFI web site. Classic conservatism, use taxpayer's money to further "private" enterprise:

    The Digital Freedom Initiative (DFI) will help meet the challenge by promoting free market based regulatory and legal structures and placing volunteers in businesses and community centers to provide small businesses and entrepreneurs with the information and communications technology skills and knowledge to operate more efficiently while competing in the global economy. These objectives can be achieved in partnership with U.S. business entities whose voluntary, innovative and entrepreneurial participation in the DFI provides access to new markets and competitive opportunities for developing products and services in emerging economies.

    Whatever happened to population control, sanitation, natural resource management, and basic education? Since when is it my government's job to help business entrepreneurs in other countries get to market? So Walmart can sell more cheap clothes? The Peace Corps needs to get back to basics of helping to ensure a fundamental level of safety, health, and liberty for every human being.

    Fear Pox Americana.

    --

    Gary Dunn
    Open Slate Project

  14. George Washington by cybercuzco · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Every time i read something like this i think of George Washington, the man who would not be king. The more and more we see of democracies, the more we see how hard it is to start them up (at least starting through a violent revolution) without the leader of that revolution seizing power and smashing the democracy. We can thank Washington for our stable democracy(the man, not the city ;-) .

    --