Slashdot Mirror
Slashback: Hawash, Monomania, Rocketships
Yes, charges are nice after six weeks of unexplained incarceration. purdue_thor writes "The various news agencies (CNN, FoxNews) are reporting that after being held for six weeks, software engineer Mike Hawash has finally been charged. His detainment as a material witness and subsequent incarceration without formal charges was discussed previously on /. Friends of Mike Hawash have created a website to publicize his case and have released a statement regarding the charges."
Randolpho adds "The Free Mike Hawash website has released the following affidavit (PDF file) received from the Federal Terrorism Task Force. The affidavit states that Hawash traveled to China in 2001 with several co-conspirators 'in an attempt to enter Afghanistan to fight against United States forces.'"
This just in from the cork-topped bottle. danny writes "One of the disadvantages of living in Australia is that my review copies arrive late. But my review of Google Hacks may be of interest, even after honestpuck's earlier review."
Free as in books. Author John F.X. Sundman writes: "PDFs of the complete Acts of the Apostles and Cheap Complex Devices are available for free download from wetmachine.com under the Creative Commons license."
And Robotech_Master writes "Remember the Honor Harrington CD-ROM, which Baen packaged with its most recent Honor Harrington book? The one that included over three dozen e-books and came with explicit permission to copy and share but not sell?
Well, Baen's done it again. The new CD comes with the fourth book in John Ringo's Aldenata trilogy, Hell's Faire . It includes still more free e-books, mp3s, and even a D20 Aldenata roleplaying game in electronic form. The book hits the stands this month, and the ISO is already available on-line. (Scarywater guy, please take note. :) Download it, burn it, give it to your friends...or buy the book and support one of the most Internet-clueful publishers out there today."
Free as in "you pay money." An anonymous reader submits "The original Douglas Adams Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy, was first a book, then a radio series. Adams edited both. All 7 hrs and 30 minutes of the Radio series have been released by the BBC in MP3 CD format. If you only caught the TV series this is a must."
I wish more audio books would arrive like this (compressed, so as to occupy fewer disks), though I'd choose a better method of audio compression ;) If you want to hear the HHGttG, though, a few minutes on Google will probably turn up some fan sites with recordings from the BBC broadcasts. (innocent whistling)
Yeah, but there's no Epcot Center. Sacarino writes "Las Vegas is *almost* on par with Disney now. The regularly-updated Monorail Society website has tons of pictures of the progress. Vegas' monorails are the same type as Disney's (Bombardier Mark VI), only with inwardly opening doors... slick! Also mentions the old MGM-Bally's monorail that's getting absorbed into the new automated network."
Is this what Microsoft thinks of viral licensing? Vagary writes "One of my friends just got a Microsoft router and asked me to check the security features for it. The ping denial doesn't work, which is good because a port scan found some pretty interesting things, including this string in the TCP/IP fingerprint: 'i586-pc-linux-gnu'. Does that mean Microsoft must provide Linux source to purchasers of this product?"
Can anyone confirm, deny or explain this interesting claim?
Click here to discuss the size of a fictional spacecraft ... photozz writes "The infamously slashdotted site comparing the relative sizes of several hundred starships from various Sci-Fi series has been mirrored to a somewhat more robust server. So cool. It's in draggable format, so you can put King Kong on top of Deep Space 9 and re-create a dream I had last night......."
You are doing a disservice to those who live with real memories of what being "disappeared" really meant. This guy is being held, and charged, on really indisputable evidence, and it is a matter of public record. The fact that he worked in your beloved computer industry does not change these facts. Take your whining elsewhere.
taken! (by Davidleeroth) Thanks Bingo Foo!
HH was a radio series first, then a book.
I recommend "Don't Panic" for the whole story...
Great. Glad to hear that you know so much about the case. Could you perhaps share with the rest of us this "indisputable" evidence?
-- MarkusQ
I've always agreed to the concept of voting with my wallet. If I don't the a company I don't buy their products.
The reverse of that is of course, companies that have a clue(tm) get my hard earned cash.
I picked up the new John Ringo book this Sunday and wrote John Baen a thank you e-mail on Monday.
As a matter of minor irony, if they hadn't had the CD in the latest Honor Harrington, I wouldn't have read the first John Ringo book, and wouldn't had subsquently dropped $25 for the latest. But, so far the e-book thing is working well for me. Ten of the last fifteen books I've purchased have been electronic versions from Baen online bookstore.
*A)bort, R)etry, I)nfluence with large hammer.*
Oh, so he is An Offical Enemy of the State, I say send him to Guantanamo and lock him up for life - due process? Pfth, who needs it.
Considering he went to Hong Kong and associated with 5 people who were trying to fight with the Taliban, it doesn't look to good for him.
Moral of the story, don't help terrorists!
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
Nonetheless, I'm going to withhold judgement on the Mike Hawash case, because at this point, assuming the evidence is as presented in the articles I have read, there certainly sounds like enough, that with some dotted I's and crossed T's, adds up to at least probable cause. I just wish our government would abide by its own rules in the way it prosecutes cases like this, and just show the evidence that lead them to make a detention in the first place. If the guy is really a flight risk, or potential danger to others, and there isn't enough to hold him on, then they could have him followed and monitored until the evidence is available, the same as is done with other criminals and potential criminals. I worry about all the exceptions that are made for terrorism, when increasingly, membership in certain non-terrorist organizations, or computer crimes, or other "mysterious" or "destructive" behavior seems to get bunched in with terrorism.
I'll be the first person to tell you that terrorism is never legitimate, and always criminal, and that we should arrest and prosecute and punish terrorists and attempted terrorists to the fullest extent of the law, and Americans who travel to fight in illegal combat with other terrorists get no sympathy from me. But how can we use different standards of evidence and prosecutorial conduct for cases that we don't _know_ are terrorism until they have gone through the courts? Due process doesn't mean due process when we feel like it - it applies to all citizens and residents, and even others within our borders.
If he is not a U.S. citizen and/or is committing acts that demomonstrate a lack of allegiance to the U.S., I don't see why he should be treated as such.
He is a U.S. Citizen, idiot.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
You'll find you can't drag the buildings/ships/monsters in the browser who was forced to change their logo at the request of a certain GODZILLA who just happens to appear in the comparison.
Coincidence? I THINK NOT!
I'm not defending the six weeks of "unexplained incarceration" (nice objective terminology there, there was an explanation, he was being held as a material witness which is not a new practice -- okay, maybe I am defending it a little bit), but if the guy was trying to wage war against his country's military, then in *any* country, you'd expect him to be arrested and charged. (Note: in China or Cuba, you're lucky if you are only sent to jail for speaking out against your government. Some people just get shot.)
I don't see why he should be entitled to special protection just because he's a software engineer or for any other reason. I don't care if he has friends!
This reminds me a lot of the Randal Schwartz trial (although let me be clear that I'm not saying Randal committed treason! I'm just talking about popular software types being charged with crimes). While I don't know all of the facts, it always seemed like people are especially ready to jump to the defense of someone, even without all of the facts, just because of their professional standing. This seems particularly true of people in the computer industry. (Maybe that's just because I tend to read technically-oriented forums like Slashdot.)
Anyway, treason is treason, alleged crimes are alleged crimes. It shouldn't matter if the guy was a software engineer or a shoe salesman.
Victory! Isn't that what every one wanted, for Mike to be charged or released? So now he's charged. And he's in some deep shit too.
> The ping denial doesn't work, which is good because a port scan found some pretty interesting things, including this string in the TCP/IP fingerprint: 'i586-pc-linux-gnu'. Does that mean Microsoft must provide Linux source to purchasers of this product?
Answer: No.
I'm 99% certain that you've misinterpreted nmap's output. When nmap doesn't find a matching fingerprint, it displays the parameters in a parsable format used in nmap-os-fingerprints. More recently (i.e. not originally, but it's been this way for some time), nmap also prints out the OS it was compiled on (presumably to weed out any OSs that mangle the data and prevent bad fingerprints from being distributed with nmap.) This information is printed out in a line like:
SInfo(V=3.20%P=i586-pc-linux-gnu%D=4/29%Time=3EAF1 974%O=-1%C=80)
I'm guessing that this was seen and the submitter jumped to conclusions... At any rate, I believe they'd be required to give source (if they changed it) to anyone per the GPL.
At any rate, I believe they'd be required to give source (if they changed it) to anyone per the GPL.
Slightly wrong. They don't have to change it one bit to be required to give away the source.
I have been pwned because my
ITYM "Jim".
Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
Are criminals who happen to be techies now lesser criminals or better humans because of this?
Dude, he's not necessarily a criminal. He's a *suspect*. And the constitution has clauses that protect people from being improperly incarcerated; the big deal is this: the US is being fucked over by our own government. We are losing our constitionally-guaranteed rights to a bunch of morons who courted Saddam Hussein 20 years ago (while he was gassing Iranians), and now are suddenly outraged because he *might* have chemical weapons?!?!?
No fucking way! We stand up for our rights, right here, right now. We tell them they will not take another one of us without due process.
We take our country back.
If Hawash is guilty, let it be proven in a court of law, the old-fashioned way.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
King Kong is not smaller than a B2 bomber. I remember clearly that in Godzilla vs. King Kong it was an even fight in height and weight.
Also, there are too many Star Trek ships on that chart. Star Trek sux. There are some Star Wars ships, but where's the death star? Where's the star destroyers? Did I miss them?
Also the SDF-1 Macross is still missing. I am of the opinion that in a 1 on 1 fight the Macross can beat any other single starship of any category. The Valkyries will dominate!
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
An AMD engineer would never have done anything like that.
"The New American Gulag Archipelago."
That shows an ignorance of history and the crimes of the Soviet system.
In the 19th century the Czarist Russian government deported around 1.2 million prisoners to Siberia.
After the Revolution the labour camps in Siberia were closed down. These were later reopened by Joseph Stalin and opponents of the regime were sent to what became known as Glavnoye Upravleniye Lagere (Gulag).
Large numbers of people living along the western frontier of the Soviet Union (Georgian, Ukranian, Baltic) and Chinese and Koreans who lived along the eastern border were deported to Gulags in the interior just before the outbreak of WW2.
Others were sent to labour camps because of their religious beliefs including Catholics, Baptists and members of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.
It is estimated that around 50 million perished in Soviet gulags between 1930 and 1950.
I know it's fun to consider the United States as bad as the Soviet system.
But it's not at all accurate.
All of the people killed in all the wars with the United States since 1776 don't add up to the number of citizens killed by the Soviet Union.
If the United States had a "Gulag Archipelago" then there would not have been a 9-11 or Oklahoma City bombing. All of the fringe people in the US that might do something like that would in in a chain of prisons in Alaska, dying by the millions. Or maybe they'd be in prison being tortured with psychiatry like Communist systems are so fond of. Or maybe they'd have thier hearts and livers sold to the highest bidder.
[Lyle] You'll be given cushy jobs!
[Crowd] Monorail! Monorail!
--Simpsons episode 9F10
Since the U.S. defeated Iraq, and MS defeated the U.S., I think we can safely draw the conclusion that Microsoft is a tougher, more ruthless enemy than Saddam Hussein.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
All your rights are belong to U.S.!
-- John Ashcroft
Nothing to see here; Move along.
I am not claiming there is a black and white delineation between peacetime and wartime, but there is a black and white delineation between a suspect picked up on US soil and a guy with a gun picked up in the Afghan mountains. If somebody is determined a "spy" or enemy combatant on US soil, I believe that determination should be made using our courts and due process, not summarily made behind closed doors, allowing the military to dispose of them as they please. I don't give a fuck if the Supreme Court upheld doing it once in WWII, it's still wrong. If the person is so clearly a spy, we should be able to prove that in court, THEN execute them.
The scariest part of that 43 page affidavit is where some of the evidence came from. On page 7:
Since when does the FBI collect trash as evidence based on the recommendation of a random neighbor? Or is this a special exception since it contained, huge shock, Arabic writing?
More on page 36:
So, let's get this straight. The first neighbor called the FBI because he recognized that one of the people who had been arrested had been to Hawash's house. That, I can almost understand, especially if there was media attention from the first arrests (seems likely).
The second neighbor, on the other hand, called the FBI because.. why? Let's see, first, Hawash spent more time at home after 9/11. Gee, yes, that's suspicious, only like 80% of the people I know decided to spend more time with their family after that. And second, he wasn't as friendly as usual. But gee, huge tradgedies usually make people so *cheerful*, what could be his problem?
Then, when the FBI actually followed up on this inane call, they found that he started attending a Mosque, dressing in "eastern" clothes, grew a beard, and became withdrawn from his neighbors, in turn associating with other Muslims. Gee, that certainly sounds like he found religion, doesn't it? And while that's arguably not the brightest thing to do, last time I checked it wasn't illegal, even if it's an officially unpopular religion like Islam.
This whole thing is sick. Yes, there's other evidence in there that links him to the other people, that's fine. I'm not saying he's innocent. But the fact that the points above, particularly the 'second neighbor', made it into the report is just wrong.
Would Benjamin Franklin have been arrested as a terrorist if he were alive today!
No, he'd have moved to another country like the pilgrims did. Duh.
If this keeps going, the Chinies might endup having more freedom that the folks inthe USA.
I severely fucking doubt it.
'Standards' in computing only impress those who are impressed by things like 'standards'.
>>Hawash's neighbors became suspicious after the September 11 terrorist attacks and called the FBI, according to the affidavit. One of the neighbors said Hawash, who worked for Intel, was "spending more time at home following September 11, 2001" and "was not as friendly as usual."
Given the rampant anti-Arab sentiment after 9/11, is this any surprise?
Basically, from what I can glean from the news sources, this guy was the perfect example of an immigrant who "made it" and became an exemplary American citizen. He's married to an American (a Christian, according to the WSJ), owns a house, has kids, and is a trusted member of his company (Intel) and is preety much an ideal upscale, upstanding citizen.
Basically, there was a bunch of disgruntled outcasts in the local area who wanted to "go fight the US on behalf of the Taliban", the FBI nabbed them, then nabbed him too because he employed one of these miscreants, and because he traveled to China. Then, it looks like they held him for 6 weeks without charges until they could dig up something to charge him with. Understandably, this whole process has pissed off many of his friends, and scared his family senseless (having an armed squad of guys descending on your house to grab everything after the head of the household has been carted off to jail is not a fun experience.)
Is he innocent? Is he guilty? Well, that remains to be seen. But clearly, he's not another wanna-be Taliban drifter like John Walker Lindh or Richard Reid, or a short-term agent like Mohammed Atta. On the face of it, it smells like another witchunt, like what happened with the Chinese guy (Wen Ho Lee) that worked at Los Alamos until they decided to charge him with treason...
--you'd have to lock up a boatload of US government employees then. Frankly, I wish "we the people" could. Al queda and the bin laden networks were trained and supported for years by the US government. All those caves and bunkers we are blowing up over there got built by the bin laden construction company, financed by combined joint US/saudi funds. The KLA went over night from being labeled a "narco terrorist" gang to "good allies in our fight against "whomever". They said it was milosevich, I say it was to consolidate some drug smuggling routes and grab some mines. Same with some bosnian muslims. Same with a lot of central american goons. And it's still going on, last week a very under-reported story, something like 57 top US companies all getting little joke toy fines for "trading with the enemy",iran, whomever, the "axis of todays badguys" list. None of those CEOs are locked up. I'm sure big fat campaign contributions and serious cash under the table has nothing to do with it. The elite try to not eat their own, they are content with being predators on the herd. Once in awhile they will sacrafice one of their own, that's about as far as it gets.
Naw, the government/corporate cartel is a big fat hypocrite. They can pick and choose and change their minds daily, anyone else is forced to be psychic. We were shipping cash-43 million or so- to the taliban when they were actually destroying poppy fields, whoops! That sure didn't set well with the CIA drug smuggling cartel. Now our "allies" in what used to be called "the northern alliance"-those were the "commies" before and the "bad guys", remember?-well, those guys now have a bumper crop of opium, with supposedly the US all over ashcanistan. Funny how that stuff works, yes? It never really dawned on those in the crooked shadow government, being the chronic serial liars they are, that someone else might actually not lie, and really do what they said they would do, that the taliban would actualy DESTROY the 100 to 200 billion a year opium poppy crop, they thought they would play act at it, like they do in south america with coca. Now that don't excuse any other heinous bogus stuff the taliban did, but destroy that poppy crop they almost completed.
Funny how all the top US administration guys from the twig on down all got long, well established close and complex business ties with the wahabists, isn't it? See any of those bozos getting arrested? Nope, because they are "the government" now and they can "change their minds" and you can't. They can "support" some nation or faction one day, the next day call them "terrorists" and if you as joe peon supported the same exact guys previously now YOU can be a terrorist while joe government just "changed it's mind".
Fat, foul, vulgar stinking hypocrites. Saddam Hussein, old time, long time serious CIA asset, they used him on contract as a hitman, that's how he got his start. He was supported fully for more than a decade, then he just got double crossed by bush 1. That's what really happened. Once saddam was no longer usefull to the goon faction, he got automagically turned into the "badguy". Sure, he was ALWAYS a badguy, so what does that make guys in our own government who worked with him and supplied him all those years, and why ain't they in jail? Oh ya, they can change their minds, they are the "elite", VIPs, *you can't* though.
Sorry, the US government and it's "law and intelligence" divisions are the biggest hypocrites and liars you'll ever meet, at least up into the upper management level I mean. The grunts just follow orders, same as any other regime on the planet. That's why they are using a lot of the same police saddam was using, the same police who dragged people into saddams prisons, who tortured people and killed them, now they are "good guys", on the US taxpayer payroll now. We did that after ww2, operation paper clip, bring over all the foul and disgusting german nazi scientists they could get their hands on, they become "good citizens" magically, got put on the payroll.
Hy
Would Hawash rather be tried under Treason charges?
...
Fro those of us who dont remember wwII
a citizen can be tried fro treason on grounds of takign up arms against the US..
The treason trial and charges are conducted by the military..
and you either get life or hanging..
Hawash should thank himself that he is in FBI custody as a Material witness
He could be in a military brig instead..
Don't Tread on OpenSource
And it's only a few steps until Kevin Bacon is locked up.
"Times have not become more violent. They have just become more televised."
-Marilyn Manson
Would the RIAA people please look at the sales figure of Baen and get a freakin' clue?
--
Mad science! Robots! Underwear! Cute girls! Full comic online! http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/
"Actually, he was held without charge but with the public's knowledge. The parent post is right, this isn't even close to being disappeared,"
Actually, the government wouldn't even admit that they had him for several weeks. And he certainly wasn't given access to legal representation. Then the government declared a fair bit of the information surrounding his case was "secret" and therefore did not have to be revealed in court.
Except for the "never seen again" part, that sounds pretty damn close to "disappeared" to me.
And now that the time initially set by the judge was about to expire, and the court would likely set him free, the feds have charged Hawash with every crime the can think of (If he were a little older, no doubt he would also be charged with the Lindburgh kidnapping) figuring that they can hold him for another year before it is even likely to come to trial.
Then, in 6 months or so, they might offer him a plea bargain "he can't refuse", all the while making noises about executions, life imprisonment, taking away his family's citizenship, etc. Then, once they extort a guilty plea from him, he won't even be able to appeal!
I don't know what we have here, but it sure ain't justice.
You make some interesting arguments regarding some events you seem to have imagined in your head, but they have very little to do with the actual case of Mike Hawash. Reading the links provided would easily show that.
1. There was no explanation. Through unknown channels, stories appeared in the press about how he was held as a material witness, but Mikes friends and family got no answers to any inquiries about his status. Also, unless he is called to testify in some case, which nothing seems to indicate will happen, the "material witness" label was phony.
2. "in *any* country, you'd expect him to be arrested and charged" Did you miss that the main complaint here is that he was not arrested and charged?
3. Nobody is asking for him to get special treatment. Just his constitutional right to a fair trial, like all other Americans.
4. Are you under the impression that anyone is holding up China or Cuba as models for better legal treatment? Or are you saying that as long as the US is marginally better than the most oppressive regimes on the planet, we should not complain?
5. The crime he is charged with seems to be that he travelled to China and back. Nobody is even alleged to have been hurt by these actions.
Even if he is guilty, which would be very unfortunate especially in this case, that is entirely beside the point. The important point here is the loss of rights under which US citizens can now be detained in this manner. This is what people are protesting, and the point stands that this is a serious problem whether or not he is actually guilty in this case.
Sadly, if it turns out that he is guilty, then many people will forget the important point here - because they will inevitably confuse the concept of defending his basic rights (that all US citizens are supposed to share), with the concept of defending him.
"What are you talking about? After the the reds siezed power, they executed a large number of people they felt were enemies of their new state. And let's not for get Stalin. He'd have to rule a hell of a long time to kill millions of people one at a time. "
You are intentionally missing the point. A common tactic.
The point is that things start small, with fascism such as we are experiencing. Every "victory" over the 20th century that Ashcroft scores emboldens and justifies what he will do next.
Pointing out the horrors of an unrelated social movement is another diversionary tactic. Yes, the Soviet Union was bad, wicked bad. It is also dead. The Mongols were bad. Nazis were bad. McVeigh was bad.
But the present bad, the Fascist takeover of the U.S., is something we can do something about. They are, as someone mentioned, repealing the 20th century in its entirety -- civil rights, control over corporate power, ecologically sane policies... Racism and religious hate has become de rigeur as a not-so hidden justification for what we are doing now. Father Coughlin would be applauding.
Just because we have not killed millions -- yet -- does not mean we will not. Remember (or rather we DON'T) that the U.S. killed two million in Vietnam. We do have a record of ideologically justified slaughter. We just butchered thousands of soldiers in Iraq based on a set of outright lies created outright by Bush's Project for a New American Century thinktankers.
It just depends on who's getting killed. And who cares about them. If a white man from a nice town blows up a Federal building, the members of his ideological movement (militias, christian and otherwise) are not arrested en masse and sent to Cuba. Nothing happens to those loons at all.
But if members of a brown people worshipping a different god blow up a building, the Constitution is ignored, due process is shut down, and we invade countries ('cause they LOOK like the bad guys, all brown, mustached, and worshipping Satan). And we cheer this on, 'cause we must trust our leaders, who have out best interests at heart.
Unless they are a Democrat. Then, during wartime, say when the President is trying to find and destroy the enemy with no friendly media coverage, the Governent is EVIL, and the President can be harrassed with lawsuits, calls for his assassination (shout out to G. Gordon) are ignored by the FBI, and an impeachment can be ginned up on a denial-of-blowjob charge.
Back to point. Big evils can start small, and this, what Ashcroft is doing, is evil on a scale that can compare with any fascist takeover in history, from Caesar to Mussolini. The manner of the change is completely different from case to case. History never repeats itself.
But methodologies do repeat. What we have is, in no particular order:
- identification of an exterior enemy. whether the threat is real or faked up is irrelevant.
- the insistence that previously held rights be surrendered for the safety of all. logic has no sway -- fear is the trigger. well-fanned fear.
- identification of the leader with the heroism of the armed forces.
- elimination of any oversight over the actions of the executive.
- elimination of all public records of the actions of the executive.
- insistence on obediance in the smallest things from members of the elected legislature.
- establishment of government control of the major media. in the present case, it isn't necessary, because the rightist press has become loudspeakers for the executive.
- elimination by whatever means of alternative press, by physical or other means. marketing is one of those means. disinformation is another.
- demonizing foreign countries, pandering to common hates and ignorance (yes, France, Germany, etc).
- commingling the exective government with corporate business power. This was Mussolini's fascism: he at first called it "corporatism", amazingly enough.
- demonizing and
Don't confuse defending the man's rights with defending the man. Maybe he is guilty, but that doesn't make the lack of due process any less noxious. Remember, the rights to due process are your rights too, and that of every other US citizen. You want to excuse this incident because he is guilty? Fine, just don't complain next time its you held without due process for something you didn't do.
I'm rather taken aback at the idea that antitrust legislation is abused. AFAIK it's only been used against bonafide damaging monopolists, and it's worked rather well at busting up until now.
Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
Actually, that is incorrect. Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there.
Learn to Improvise
What seems to have drawn attention to the group was that the group, not including Hawash, were found practicing with guns in a gravel pit in Washington State on September 29, 2001. This discovery cranked up a major FBI effort. After a while, the FBI had two informants in the group. The members of the group, other than Hawash, were indicted last October.
These guys aren't big-time terrorists. They come across more like a bunch of bozos. If they'd achieved their goal of going to Afghanistan to fight on the Taliban side, they would have been just a few extra guys with guns. They didn't even get that far. All they really did was go to China for three weeks. Some of them made it to Bangladesh. Then they turned around and came back to the US. Thus, they're not charged with treason, only "conspiracy to levy war against the United States".
Ultimately, the courts will have to sort out who did what here.
"When four sit down to talk revolution, three are fools and the fourth is a police spy."
I won't even try to address all the comments here -- they represent a wide spectrum of opinion.
/.ers:
...)
I'm Steven McGeady, I know Mike, and I have this to say to
You have absolutely no reason to consider Mike Hawash innocent of the charges being levelled against him -- no reason except one: the implied social contract present in our society that if *you*, or someone you love, was accused of a terrible crime, that other citizens would withold their judgement until all the facts came out.
All the liberties we enjoy are based on this social contract, in all its parts -- I don't condemn you because of the way you look, how you pray, or with whom you associate.
Recall that the Complaint -- the affidavit that we posted willingly on the "Free Mike Hawash" website -- is the U.S. government's side of the story. Mike has not been given a chance to tell his yet. I don't know the answers, nor does anyone else.
Mike doesn't deserve a free pass because he's a software engineer, because he's Palestinian, or because he's my friends. If he is proven guilty, then he will pay the price.
But I hope that this audience, more so than many others, will not judge him because of facial hair, based on scant but one-sided evidence, or because of his faith.
You are right to be skeptical. But you can contain both skepticism and a presumption of innocence, in the same way you can contain skepticism both toward those of us who believe the charges will ultimately prove groundless, and those who find sinister motives hidden among weak and circumstantial evidence.
S. McGeady
(dammit, now I've blown my (weak) pseudonym -- time to sign up for a new account
The material witness statute is intended to cover people important to an investigation who represent a substantial flight risk. If you have read the affidavit (I did), you will see that Hawash put all his goods and possessions in the hands of his wife and prepared for her a power of attorney. This certainly suggests that he was more of a risk of flight than an ordinary married man with children. Furthermore, the material in the affidavit discusses a trip to China, allegedly with anti-U.S. co-conspiritors. Again, reason for concern about flight.
Though Hawash was held for a while as a material witness, he has now been charged, as required by the law. I have a somewhat icky feeling about the material witness laws, but as far as I can tell, this is a case where the system worked. The government had to present evidence to indict him, and is doing so. Hawash will have his day in court, which is what he's entitled to.