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Transmeta OK'd for Mira Displays
viewstyle writes "eweek is reporting that Transmeta's Crusoe chip has been approved by Microsoft for use in the Mira smart displays -- a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace."
Microsoft has been showing less and less interest in being an exclusive "partner" with our good friends at Intel... Maybe MS is taking the Tel out of WinTel.
anyone heard of Centrino? I think the crusoe is definitely a niche market, due to its low power consumption, but the centrino and mobile athlons are much more powerful . . . i hardly think they're being edged out of the market
Yeah, just the way Linux is "edging out" Windows as a desktop OS, or intelligent comments are "edging out" mindless Linux zealous idiocy on Slashdot.
Maybe "eeking out a small chunk of a large market and managing to stay afloat."
x86 is only one processor supported by the Mira platform.
To say that Transmeta is edging out a giant like Intel who has the PXA255 is just wrong. Transmeta doesn't have any edge in this market whereas Intel certainly does.
I have been pwned because my
Microsoft's company partnering with Linus Torvalds's company... hee!
Honey, I shrunk the Cygwin
The Transmeta chip being approved for use in one device hardly qualifies as edging anyone out of the mobile chip market, much less "further" edging them out. Besides, what do we (read as: geeks) have against AMD? I thought we liked them, no?
Don't count out Intel quite yet. The Pentium-M is still one of, if not the best mobile pure x86 processors out there. The rumor that Intel is additionally working on an ultra-ultra low-power version of the chip(600mhz, smaller L2 cache) would further prop themselves up in the Mira market, with their brand name tagging along for the ride. Transmeta has had a lot of problems so far breaking in to the US market, and I don't see them winning that easily so soon, especially with Chipzilla on the lookout.
With the dot-com bust giving Transmeta a hard time, an approval by Microsoft could be just what they need to get back on their feet and out of bankruptcy.
Maybe this will be a lesson learned for the GNU/Linux community as well, to support the companies that use open source and contribute back to the movement. Everyone's all about freedom, but nobody seems to want to pay the price for it. Apparently Transmeta has seen this and is moving on to greener and more friendly pastures. Good for them I say, and I'm looking forward to the product.
Think about that the next time you Bittorrrent the latest release of Redhat instead of purchasing it. What would you do if they decided to switch over to Microsoft? You'd all be screwed then.
... edged right out of their tiny 15% and 80% market niches. Tremble, AMD and Intel, tremble.
It's like having VPN from anywhere in your house. It sounds like a dumb idea and for 95% of the people out there it probably is, but for the 5% who are left it is a real great technology.
It's laptop power without the heat and power consumption of a full-blown system.
I have been pwned because my
Does Bill Gates know that Linus Torvalds works for Transmeta?
Wherever you go, there you are!
What they're talking about here is giving the display some processing power of its own, so that it's more like a laptop that runs a terminal off of your main computer. If you're doing something on it, it won't cause your main computer to slow down (much), whereas the smart display uses a lot more of your computer's resources. Doesn't sound like a huge deal to me, except that it should be cheaper and more portable than a laptop.
Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
-- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.
It seems like this question has been asked several times in this thread.
e valuation/news/fromms/mira.asp
Here's the short version:
Mira (Smart Display) is a small, tablet-like device that becomes a remote terminal to a Windows XP machine. It uses wireless networking to create a Virtual Private Network (VPN) with the XP host. When connected, the Mira device can use all functions of the host PC.
Here's Microsoft's version:
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/Embedded/ce.NET/
I have been pwned because my
Common, the association between Transmeta and M$ isn't that new. Who was one of the major investor in Transmeta ??
M$ co-founder Paul Allen.
What they need to do is forget about getting their brand name out there. Just get the chips into the devices and let the ODMs worry about their own brand name. Especially for a thin client like Mira, processing power is the least of the problems; any chip will do. Transmeta will never win going head to head with Intel in the consumer market. They've got to make their chips attractive to ODMs and that's through pricing and production capacity. Unfortunately Transmeta fails it on on both accounts.
I have been pwned because my
the thing reads like a press release, for crying out loud! not only are relatively minor points blown out of proportion in terms of significance (wow, transmeta gets approval. big deal.), but old information and disinformation are used alongside statements that really don't make much sense.
case in point:
A smart display requires a PC running Windows XP to operate and monopolizes the PC while it runs. A Tablet PC serves as a stand-alone computer.
If Transmeta can push the Crusoe into both smart displays and the Tablet PC, the feat will be proof that the market sees the Crusoe both as an embedded and as a general-purpose CPU. Over time, Intel Corp.'s Pentium series and Advanced Micro Devices Inc.'s K6 processors have been forced out of general-purpose PCs and notebooks and into the engines driving embedded devices. But the Crusoe still powers several Japanese ultralight notebooks.
a. thanks for dumbing down the definition of "smart display." thanks also for restricting its relevance to the article and parties involved. 8P
b. if transmeta gets its pizacrap crusoe into smart displays and tablet PCs, it gets its chip into smart displays and tablet PCs. that's all. if it works _well_ in both, and sells _well_, _then_ the market will be saying something.
c. sorry man, this is really bothering me: pentiums and the k6 line were "forced out" of the general PC segment because NEW, TASTIER and BETTER processors were introduced by their makers. for crying out loud, it's not like they were dumped from the PC market because of transmeta (ABANDON SHIT!).
d. BUT THE CRUSOE STILL POWERS SEVERAL JAPANENIAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAAA! wtf? the statement following the previous one makes it seem like the crusoe is the little mac of the mike tyson's punch out of the processor world. it outlasted everyone else! including intel and amd! it powers JAPANESE NOTEBOOKS!
that's because transmeta hasn't put out anything else that can best the line it's been offering. yeah, they're small in terms of size n power draw, and yeah, i'd like them to succeed cause you know, they were all ooohh-oooohhh! mysterious before they launched (remember their website?). but anyone with a modicum of literary aptitude should be able to read this article for what it is: big. donkey. dong.
Since when does Microsoft "approve" what hardware can and cannot be used with its software?
...
Oh, wait
Barclay family motto:
Aut agere aut mori.
(Either action or death.)
Intel has the new XScale, and AMD has their Alchemy processors (MIPS32) for the Mira displays. AMD demoed the Mira running with the Au1500 recently, and ran better/faster than the PXA stuff from Intel. I saw it, it was reasonably cool.
The sad thing is, they're just re-inventing X-terminals. Mira is just a dumb display, the magic still happens on some big, beefy iron in the background. Everything old becomes new.
I don't get this "smart display" business. It sounds like a display with a CPU, some memory, and a wireless network interface, and a battery. In other words, it is a full-blown computer. Maybe (probably) the operating system is crippleware, but it sounds to me like you could put some proper software on there and use it like a wireless X11 terminal. Bonus: remote X11 users don't "monopolize the PC while they are running".
So far in 2003, Transmeta has reported a net revenue of $6 million. (these numbers taken from Transmeta press releases)
These numbers are paltry compared to the industry giants Intel and AMD (especialy Intel), but they do reflect stability and massive growth since Q1 2002. No, Transmeta is no direct threat to Intel or AMD, but they deserve to be taken seriously nevertheless. The underdog is always forced to innovate, and market hype can swing an extra $2 to $3 million in revenue towards a company like Transmeta. Remember, we all laughed at AMD, too.
As for all of the negative comments, cmon, what do you expect? This is Slashdot afterall, and the creator of Linux works in a rather prominent role at Transmeta. This is exciting and encouraging to us Linux geeks.
Your even-handedness and actual knowledge of the issues at hand are confusing and disconcerting to me. Are you sure you're on the right website?
I have been pwned because my
The price gouging of their hardware, however, is just too much to bear. They are great for people that need them for very specific purposes (much like Linux, as a matter of fact), but the price of the hardware is just way too much for me.
The net revenue for Transmeta in 2002 was $14.1 Million (1.5 Q1, 6.4 Q2, 6.3 Q3).
Unfortunately, revenue only tells part of the story. Transmeta's net loss for the fiscal year ended 12/31/2002 was $110 million (source http://biz.yahoo.com/p/t/tmta.html)
I think Transmeta's a great company... just want to make sure we paint the complete picture here: they lost about $100 million last year, and their stock is worth a little $1.00.
Compaq just has a habit of making laptops that overheat, and attempting to beat the customer into submission with sluggish support people who make you go through the whole rigamarole every time the box breaks again.
I had a PIII laptop a few years back that went in for service five times (and cost me about two man-weeks of support phone calls). I finally gave up, and sent certified letters to the president, and VP of the laptop division. A couple of days later (I lived in Houston at the time), the laptop division guy called, apologized and sent us the next model up (with DVD upgrade, faster CPU though it was a Celery that ran cooler) the next day.
I won't complain too much, because I'm still using that same laptop. Though the battery life is slightly less than 23 seconds, on a good day. (Ok, seriously, the battery lasts about 20 minutes, and never did much better than that, even when new.)
By the way, the C3 chip produced by VIA Technology will do the same job just as well.
Going for the mobile market is indeed a mistake.
They went for the blade-server market, which was not a mistake.
Embedded (under certain circumstances) is not a mistake either, but it's a very competitive market.
They've ignored the quiet PC market, and that was a huge mistake.
OK, here comes the clarification. The power savings of TMTA chips don't matter much for mobiles, because the power profile is dominated by the monitor and other devices, not the CPU. The one advantage the chip does offer for mobiles is low heat disipation, but they didn't pitch that. Instead, they marketed enhanced battery life and when that (predictably) didn't materialize, they started to look like Enron execs.
The power savings matter a great deal for server farms, because when you jam 1000s of CPUs into a room, all those watts add up quickly, and you also reduce the cost of cooling the room. In general, when TMTA's chips are scattered all over the place, the heat dissipation and power savings don't matter that much. When the chips are packed together in small spaces, then it matters, which brings us to...
...The quiet PC. The low heat allows TMTA chips to run FANLESS. This wasn't emphasized enough by their marketing or engineering departments, and as a result there are virtually NO PCs being made with TMTA's chips, and there are no inexpensive motherboards using a TMTA chip. That market has been conceded entirely to VIA's mini-itx boards. This is a real shame, because apparently the TMTA chips can (in theory) perform better than VIA's chips and do so without a fan. Also, TMTA squandered its geek appeal by making it very difficult for anybody to experiment with their chips. I haven't seen any SBCs with a TMTA chip in them for under $600. The chip itself is available for $90 in single units, but there is nothing to plug it into. Since Intel chips cost about the same, I don't see any argument for why TMTA can't get somebody to make inexpensive MoBos. That is an oversight that must be corrected.
If you look at the mini-itx.com site, you'll see that most of the projects are hobbiest kitsche. I imagine that most of the projects at the original Homebrew Computer Club were like that too; but one of them was the first Apple. Unless TMTA gets its /\55 in gear, it will end up like Zilog instead of Motorola.
It's very, very ironic that Linus works for a company that has failed so miserably to understand the importance of hackers and the "garage" in driving the industry. I haven't heard him say anything about advocating within TMTA to make their hardware more open. Notice, I mean open in the sense that you should be able to buy components separately and tinker with them; I'm not asking TMTA to give up any copyrights or patents.
For example, in theory, you can emulate any CPU by writing your own code-morphing software. Now, I defy anybody to find the documents that tell you how to do that.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
In the case of Intel and MS, both Intel and MS want there to be active competition for the other. Hence MS will support competitors to Intel in order to drive down CPU prices, and Intel will support Linux in order to drive down OS prices. Both will support a multiplicity of mobo makers, hard drive makers, video chipset makers and anyone else in order to keep those areas as low-priced commodities. I suspect that the current duopily in the graphics chipset market is causing both of them some concern. If either Nvidia or ATI win the bulk of the market then they will be able to start charging proprietary prices (to some extent they already are at the higher end) and thereby take away money from both Intel and MS. From the POV of ATI and Nvidia of course they want lots of competition for both Intel and MS, which helps to explain why both of them are taking the trouble to support Linux when the Linux share of the desktop graphics market is still under 1%.
Paul.
You are lost in a twisty maze of little standards, all different.