I have to salute you. For the first time in recent memory, someone's made a legitimate "the record companies are out of touch with technology" post. This isn't just a "I'm not getting free music, so the record companies suck" post, but a good point.
Or Just In Case You Decide On Accuracy
by
Anonymous Coward
·
· Score: 5, Informative
The article doesn't know when it's going to happen.
After Spetmeber is the msot definite term used.
It "MAY" be sometime next year.
Lot different than "at least next year." Makes it sound lik it's two years away or something.
HA HA EUROPE J00 SUX0R!
by
AvantLegion
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
(waits for someone to mod "Troll" before even reading)
It's too bad that licensing has been so difficult for Apple in Europe. It seems like this will be a roadblock for any kind of digital content distribution service.
If you accept flat-rate, simple click-and-download content distribution as the future, then it is obviously necessary to re-think the "every little European country is licensed differently" international licensing model.
Otherwise, imagine some of the weirdness you could pull off... imagine remotely accessing a machine in Finland, using that machine to download from Apple's store at a cheaper rate than your home country, and then downloading from the Finland machine to yours. I'm not familiar with the security measures that might combat this, but I imagine any that are in place could probably be circumvented.
What about a Canadian store?
by
Drakonian
·
· Score: 4, Informative
Probably not a priority - it took FOREVER to get a Canadian Apple Store.
-- Random is the New Order.
No good music in Europe?
by
Trurl's+Machine
·
· Score: 4, Funny
from the there-is-no-good-music-in-europe-anyway dept.
The problem is not that European music cannot be sold in iTunes Music Shop, the problem is that the Europeans cannot buy anything in it (regardless the country of origin). Actually, iTunes MS is full of European music (at least if you count Britons as Europeans, which is sometimes a matter of debate).
"imagine remotely accessing a machine in Finland, using that machine to download from Apple's store at a cheaper rate than your home country, and then downloading from the Finland machine to yours. "
This would probably be countered the same way that it is being handled now to prevent people from buying music this way from Finland by routing through a US American server--by checking the credit card address.
Thus, if your credit card has a home address in Estonia (and a Credit Card *is* required to use the store), then you won't be able to use the iTunes store through Finland after Finland is included in the plan or through the United States today.
Imagine that. I mean who would have thought the record labels, of all people, would have a problem with being unable to agree?
--
Karma: The shiznight, mostly because I am the Drizzle.
Overblowing it a bit?
by
Llywelyn
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
This is blatant hyperbole.
Windows access is relatively critical, but only from the perspective of competing with whatever MS manages to cobbel together that actually has a chance of competing (I haven't seen anything yet) and will likely have very little to do with the long term life-and-death of the project as it stands now (the record companies seem happy with the deal, and so long as they have the big-5 and the big-5 remain profitable, Apple will probably not have to float the store).
International access, on the other hand, is in no-way critical to whether the project succeeds or whether Apple succeeds. The problems are the laws in other countries which are not conducive to this kind of pricing scheme, as well as the international contracts and licensing issues surrounding distribution of media.
If Apple and the big-5 are having trouble with it, so will anyone else who wants to expand across country boundaries.
Thus, the two *most* critical issues for the iTunesMusicStore, at this stage, are:
1) Getting more labels aboard (they seem to be doing an admirable job at getting this set up).
2) Getting iTunes ported to Windows (once again).
These would be the "logical next steps" to remain in front of the pack. International access is more of a nicety that is not overly critical for their success (though I'm sure they want to do it as quickly as possible--more profits are never a bad thing).
I can't believe how this is feasible for them. From my POV, they're loosing money here all this time the iTunes store isn't running in Europe. I think they'll have a lot to explain to shareholders, eg. 'Why didn't you pursue this business model as soon as it showed it's potential?'.
-- fucktard is a tenderhearted description
Reading the article...
by
squiggleslash
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
...it appears to me that Apple has made the somewhat common mistake of treating Europe as a country. It isn't. It's a collection of countries with a growing trade-orientated body joining most of them in some fields but by no means all. It's almost as absurd (I said almost) to treat Europe as a country as it is to treat "North America" as one.
Apple would do well to look at rolling out iTMS in individual countries rather than attempt to do this as a bloc. Other international retailers, such as Amazon (which has amazon.co.uk and amazon.de) have already learnt this lesson, and built successfully upon it.
-- You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
Re:Reading the article...
by
ChuyMatt
·
· Score: 5, Interesting
Um... as one who just came back from an EU country and visited the EU buildings themselves, not to mention studying my brains out about it, this is just what the EU is for. to be treated like one *financial* country. What is more, having total-european standards for every shared product is a major part of that. With that goes the using of standard policies on things such as copyright and telecom and such. In practice, it is a tad more complicated, but that is just because their policies are more French, ie: artist work integrity centered instead of focus on profit and poorly worded royalties contracts. Probably something like the % that goes to the actual artists are what is holding this deal back.
Re:Reading the article...
by
squiggleslash
·
· Score: 4, Informative
Copyright is more than financial, and the EU hasn't yet achieved a single-financial state of being. Britain, for instance, doesn't even share the same currency as its neighbours, which is fairly specific.
More to the point there are as many, if not more, legal systems in Europe as there are countries. That, when it comes to copyright, is a much bigger issue than the financial union, even if moves towards economic union inevitably infringe on some of these issues. Contracts signed in one country usually have no bearing on any others unless the artists and publishers have specifically negotiated the contract that way. You can't, in the US, sell exclusive rights to a copyrighted work to one company in Virginia and another in Florida, but you can in different parts of Europe.
Long term I don't doubt the borders will be blurred. But Apple has made the mistake of believing that those borders are already blurred enough, and they're not, and the EU is still very much a union of seperate countries: the commonalities are still very much the exceptions, not the rule.
-- You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
Re:Is it the pricing?
by
commodoresloat
·
· Score: 4, Funny
Actually, it's the drugs; the licensing thing is just a cover. No, really. Apple got wind of the fact that most Euros are covered in cocaine. Macs are supposed to be associated with hallucinogens, not stimulants.
Yes I agree. The company is downright beleagured!!!
Take what they can get
by
fingers1122
·
· Score: 5, Insightful
The record labels should take whatever they can get. Basically, they have two options:
(1) Get some money when people legally download songs.
-or -
(2) Get no money when people download songs illegally with p2p clients.
The record companies are getting greedy; they should take what they can get and be happy!
this *will* hurt the music inductry
by
mousehouse
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
the failure of the music business to get a grip on new models of doing business is, again, shocking. i'm having a hard time coping with it!
(a)
for one, the record companies themselves have made these completely different contracts by country. in order to maximize profits they have agreed on different pricing per country. i understand that there are legal differences, and that from a legal point of view the contracts are difficult and different also but anyways. i feel that the record companies should make a move towards apple (and maybe others as well) to set this up.
(b)
the prices of CD's is very high here in Europe. partly that is because of higher taxes, but the biggest cut still goes to the record companies. this encourages p2p filetrading as all internet-literate people *know* how much a CD is in the US.
(c)
the failure to give the rest of the world the same access to (legal) onlne music *will* hurt the music industry. because of all the different legal systems it is nearly impossible to go after the big traders, unlike the RIAA in the US. the situation in Est-European countries is even more difficult!
my guess is that apple would do wise to crack the European market one-by-one and force the record companies to come up with a solution on their end (by forcing 1 pricing schema!!!). start with the UK and Germany (big markets and easier law). Move on to the other ones, eg. the countries where apple stores are in place so you are a legal entity already.....
Re:European Music Store, what about individual one
by
pnjman
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
Would it not be better to combine all the stores into one huge store and so expose these smaller artists to a much wider audience rather than the big 5 labels just pushing the latest teen act?
5 million isn't good enough for them?
by
chia_monkey
·
· Score: 4, Insightful
I find it odd that the initial success of iTMS here in the US isn't good enough for the EU to say "ok, they were a good test bed. We let them take the risk, now we'll jump on". What exactly are they waiting for (aside from what the article says...which I think is just a bunch of sad excuses).
I also find it ironic that in that very article, they're talking about how the P2P networks are trading thousands of tracks per day, thus people aren't buying CDs. Um...hello...doesn't it just seem like common sense to hurry up and get this set up so you can get SOME money?
--
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang
The inability of the record monopolies to embrace the internet strikes again!
The article doesn't know when it's going to happen.
After Spetmeber is the msot definite term used.
It "MAY" be sometime next year.
Lot different than "at least next year." Makes it sound lik it's two years away or something.
It's too bad that licensing has been so difficult for Apple in Europe. It seems like this will be a roadblock for any kind of digital content distribution service.
If you accept flat-rate, simple click-and-download content distribution as the future, then it is obviously necessary to re-think the "every little European country is licensed differently" international licensing model.
Otherwise, imagine some of the weirdness you could pull off... imagine remotely accessing a machine in Finland, using that machine to download from Apple's store at a cheaper rate than your home country, and then downloading from the Finland machine to yours. I'm not familiar with the security measures that might combat this, but I imagine any that are in place could probably be circumvented.
Probably not a priority - it took FOREVER to get a Canadian Apple Store.
Random is the New Order.
from the there-is-no-good-music-in-europe-anyway dept.
The problem is not that European music cannot be sold in iTunes Music Shop, the problem is that the Europeans cannot buy anything in it (regardless the country of origin). Actually, iTunes MS is full of European music (at least if you count Britons as Europeans, which is sometimes a matter of debate).
"imagine remotely accessing a machine in Finland, using that machine to download from Apple's store at a cheaper rate than your home country, and then downloading from the Finland machine to yours. "
This would probably be countered the same way that it is being handled now to prevent people from buying music this way from Finland by routing through a US American server--by checking the credit card address.
Thus, if your credit card has a home address in Estonia (and a Credit Card *is* required to use the store), then you won't be able to use the iTunes store through Finland after Finland is included in the plan or through the United States today.
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
...record labels being unable to agree...
Imagine that. I mean who would have thought the record labels, of all people, would have a problem with being unable to agree?
Karma: The shiznight, mostly because I am the Drizzle.
This is blatant hyperbole.
Windows access is relatively critical, but only from the perspective of competing with whatever MS manages to cobbel together that actually has a chance of competing (I haven't seen anything yet) and will likely have very little to do with the long term life-and-death of the project as it stands now (the record companies seem happy with the deal, and so long as they have the big-5 and the big-5 remain profitable, Apple will probably not have to float the store).
International access, on the other hand, is in no-way critical to whether the project succeeds or whether Apple succeeds. The problems are the laws in other countries which are not conducive to this kind of pricing scheme, as well as the international contracts and licensing issues surrounding distribution of media.
If Apple and the big-5 are having trouble with it, so will anyone else who wants to expand across country boundaries.
Thus, the two *most* critical issues for the iTunesMusicStore, at this stage, are:
1) Getting more labels aboard (they seem to be doing an admirable job at getting this set up).
2) Getting iTunes ported to Windows (once again).
These would be the "logical next steps" to remain in front of the pack. International access is more of a nicety that is not overly critical for their success (though I'm sure they want to do it as quickly as possible--more profits are never a bad thing).
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
fucktard is a tenderhearted description
Apple would do well to look at rolling out iTMS in individual countries rather than attempt to do this as a bloc. Other international retailers, such as Amazon (which has amazon.co.uk and amazon.de) have already learnt this lesson, and built successfully upon it.
You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
Actually, it's the drugs; the licensing thing is just a cover. No, really. Apple got wind of the fact that most Euros are covered in cocaine. Macs are supposed to be associated with hallucinogens, not stimulants.
Yes I agree. The company is downright beleagured!!!
The record labels should take whatever they can get. Basically, they have two options: (1) Get some money when people legally download songs. -or - (2) Get no money when people download songs illegally with p2p clients. The record companies are getting greedy; they should take what they can get and be happy!
the failure of the music business to get a grip on new models of doing business is, again, shocking. i'm having a hard time coping with it! (a) for one, the record companies themselves have made these completely different contracts by country. in order to maximize profits they have agreed on different pricing per country. i understand that there are legal differences, and that from a legal point of view the contracts are difficult and different also but anyways. i feel that the record companies should make a move towards apple (and maybe others as well) to set this up. (b) the prices of CD's is very high here in Europe. partly that is because of higher taxes, but the biggest cut still goes to the record companies. this encourages p2p filetrading as all internet-literate people *know* how much a CD is in the US. (c) the failure to give the rest of the world the same access to (legal) onlne music *will* hurt the music industry. because of all the different legal systems it is nearly impossible to go after the big traders, unlike the RIAA in the US. the situation in Est-European countries is even more difficult! my guess is that apple would do wise to crack the European market one-by-one and force the record companies to come up with a solution on their end (by forcing 1 pricing schema!!!). start with the UK and Germany (big markets and easier law). Move on to the other ones, eg. the countries where apple stores are in place so you are a legal entity already. ....
Would it not be better to combine all the stores into one huge store and so expose these smaller artists to a much wider audience rather than the big 5 labels just pushing the latest teen act?
I find it odd that the initial success of iTMS here in the US isn't good enough for the EU to say "ok, they were a good test bed. We let them take the risk, now we'll jump on". What exactly are they waiting for (aside from what the article says...which I think is just a bunch of sad excuses).
I also find it ironic that in that very article, they're talking about how the P2P networks are trading thousands of tracks per day, thus people aren't buying CDs. Um...hello...doesn't it just seem like common sense to hurry up and get this set up so you can get SOME money?
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang