Western Xbox Titles To Flood Japan?

Thanks to GamePro for posting an article discussing the fact that Microsoft may try to keep the Xbox alive in Japan by flooding the market in less territory-suitable, but already in-development Western titles such as Conker, Voodoo Vince, and Counter-Strike. According to the article, a Japanese retail chain "..claims that Microsoft is planning to release overseas titles in Japan without bothering to localize them for the local market - in other words, they'll release the original English version with a Japanese manual attached." The article suggests this is a sign that Microsoft may forget about the mass-market in Japan, and will be "..dropping its large-scale strategy [until Xbox 2], and concentrating on the 400,000 or so hardcore fans it's managed to scrape together over the past 16 months."

Comments

Japanese Market

[jnguy]

Microsoft is constantly making the same mistake. Because they are an american company, they can't seem to see the demands and needs of the casual japanese gamer. They made the mistake of going into Japan with out many Japanese games, hoping that localized Western games would be enough to drive the market. Another problem with Microsoft and the Japanese is Microsoft doesn't seem to understand the Japanese customs and culture. I heard from a business teacher that Microsoft would attempt to get deals and contracts signed on the spot, whereas the Japanese are used to going to lunch/dinner or something of that nature. With the failure of Xbox in Japan, I have my doubts that the next one will suceed

Re:Japanese Market

[Kamel Jockey]

They made the mistake of going into Japan with out many Japanese games, hoping that localized Western games would be enough to drive the market.

It wouldn't be the first time an American company made that mistake. I remember watching an old 60 Minutes interview in which former Chrysler boss Lee Iacocca was complaining about how their cars were not selling in Japan. Aside from the fact that Chrysler continues to be at the bottom of the list in terms of quality, Iacocca explained that they didn't bother to localize the cars they sold there at the time (that may have changed now). The cars included:

• Steering wheels on the left even though in Japan the steering wheel is on the right
• Manuals printed in English
• Speedometers and odometers which use miles even though Japan uses the metric system

I'm not sure what kind of TV system they use in Japan... I doubt its NTSC... or if its not, are NTSC TVs easy to get there? If Microsoft thinks this is going to work... past evidence will prove otherwise :)

Re:Japanese Market

[matlokheed]

Japan uses NTSC. Microsoft isn't completely clueless...

Okay. Maybe a little clueless. I have to question the sanity of any company that thinks that it's a good idea to take games that I wouldn't get in my native language and try to sell them to someone who isn't as familiar with the language.

Especially Conker. Conker is an okay game, but the reason why most people I know who played it decided to play it was because of the flavor and humor (not my style of humor, but hey). If the language barrier interfere's with that, why are they bothering to even release it?

Re:Japanese Market

[Kamel Jockey]

If the language barrier interfere's with that, why are they bothering to even release it?

Going back to my example with Chrysler, Lee Iacocca said that there was no economic incentive to localize their products to Japan because they weren't selling enough vehicles, even though the reason they weren't selling enough vehicles was because they were not localized. Essentially, it looks as if Microsoft is "selling more of the wrong thing" (Iacocca's words) before they have an incentive "to start selling the right thing."

But then again, do a lot of Japanese people understand English? My guess once again is that they don't, and as a result they won't care for games that are English-only just as most Americans wouldn't buy Japanese products that weren't localized for this country. Japanese industries (cars being the most obvious example) swept the markets here because they sold the customers what they wanted. They knew they weren't going to make it in the USA if they did otherwise. I don't understand why Microsoft is taking the opposite approach in Japan and expecting it to work. Maybe they just are not used to playing in a competitive market.

Re:Japanese Market

[Rayonic]

They made the mistake of going into Japan with out many Japanese games, hoping that localized Western games would be enough to drive the market.

I agree. The Japanese gaming populace should open their minds to new and different game types. But until that happens, you've got to feed them the same stuff they've always been fed.

Re:Japanese Market

[bobbozzo]

I'm not sure what kind of TV system they use in Japan... I doubt its NTSC... or if its not, are NTSC TVs easy to get there?

All TV's in Japan are NTSC (OR HD :) )

Also, China (and Taiwan?) were PAL, but due to VCD's, almost 100% of their newer TV's are DUAL Mode PAL/NTSC. Most even auto-detect what kind of signal is being input. Broadcasts are still PAL, but their VCD players (and now DVD) and camcorders are mostly or all NTSC. Consumers in mainland China don't have VCR's, BTW.

Re:Japanese Market

[amuro98]

I remember that...

From what I recall, though, Iacocca went to Japan and came back rather frustrated because it became obvious to him that his company hadn't even done its research about what the Japanese car market was like.

He went with Bush Sr. on that ill-fated trip to Japan, and remarked 'No wonder we can't sell our cars here - they're too big to fit on the roads here!"

Of course, that was about 10 years ago. I can tell you that Japan has gotten a LOT pickier about having products localized for their market - otherwise distributors won't even touch it.

Re:Japanese Market

[amuro98]

RE: How well do the Japanese understand English?

This depends on which market segment you're talking about.

Those involved with more technical fields, especially computers, will be a bit better dealing with English since most documentation and articles are written in English.

End users (consumers) are another matter. They have no faith in their English ability, and will insist on the product being fully localized.

Casual gamers in Japan might not take too kindly to non-localized games - even if the manual is translated. In game cutscenes, for instance, will still be in English.

To put it another way, would you be willing to play a non-localized game from Japan if it came with an English manual? What if Square just translated the manual for FFX-2 and left the in-game dialog in Japanese? My guess is you wouldn't bother. My guess is also that most Japanese gamers won't bother either.

Once again, Microsoft no baka.

Re:Japanese Market

[zonker]

umm... wow. that's a little culturally elitest... don't ya think?

Re:Japanese Market

[Anonymous Coward]

Depends on the game. I wish a lot of shmups and the like would just get sent over with an English manual so I wouldn't have to get a mod chip or buy a Japanese PS2 to play them. RPGs, yeah, that's a lot more difficult, but there are a lot of genres that, at least for the hardcore gamer, wouldn't really be so bad if you got the Japanese version and didn't speak Japanese.

Re:Japanese Market

[Anonymous Coward]

Somewhere in Japan, an idiot (maybe even almost as stupid as you are) is thinking,

"I agree. The non-Japanese gaming populace should open their minds to new and different game types. But until that happens, you've got to feed them the same stuff they've always been fed."

Saddest part is, you're both right.

Re:Japanese Market

[Rayonic]

> umm... wow. that's a little culturally elitest... don't ya think?

Only if I had said it doesn't apply to everyone else also. I would have put that disclaimer into my original post, but I can't resist trolling overly-sensitive types.

Re:Japanese Market

[Rayonic]

Ah, another overly-sensitive clod bites the dust. Hey, maybe next time you can avoid putting words in my mouth, eh?

I don't know why I keep selectively trolling you people.

Re:Japanese Market

[Anonymous Coward]

Ouch, you've hurt my feelings! Really, you have. I now see the insightfulness in your original post....oh, how could I have missed it! I will now hang my head in shame, for I shall never post again. *bites the dust*

Sincerely,

Anonymous Coward

Re:Japanese Market

[Anonymous Coward]

That's right, everybody else is stupid because you choose your words poorly. We normal folks just can't extrapolate what you MEAN to say out of what you ACTUALLY say (or don't say).

Atta boy, Rayonic! You're just the genius we've all been waiting for.

Sigh....

[Anonymous Coward]

It must be nice to be a billionaire. I mean really, Microsoft will make sure it's gonna make money, and they're sure spending it to do so, buying every good title onto the Xbox.

And in the meanwhile I continue to struggle...

Must...resist...urge....to...buy...Xbox...

Re:Sigh....

[Anonymous Coward]

X-Box sucks. Buy a Gamecube.

Hardcore fans?

[Anonymous Coward]

Or just sorry buyers?

Right back at you, Cats!

[AtariAmarok]

At least they could make a minimal effort at translation, so the American video game sentences turn into Japanese sentences which are as clunky as as "Take off every ZIG" and "all your base are belong to us".

Re:Right back at you, Cats!

[matlokheed]

They probably shouldn't have to. I'd imagine a good portion of Japanese can read English (or that's what it'd seem at least). Logos always seem to be in English and most games from Japan have English in them. The majority of imports I've gotten have had English portions or at least provided support for English.

I rarely worry about importing anymore. For the Biohazard remake (Resident Evil here), all of the voices in the game were done in English. For a game being released in Japan by a Japanese company to have English be the default language in the game says that English is probably fairly common over there.

Re:Right back at you, Cats!

[Daetrin]

Stuff written in english is popular there in the same way that stuff written in japanese and chinese is popular here. There are far more people who think it just looks cool and buy it than there are people who can actually read it. This is why you can frequently find people in japan wandering around with really obscene things written on their clothing. Likewise, i've heard stories about native language t-shirts sold to american tourists in numerous countries.

Although the level of understanding the Japanese have for English is probably closer to the American level of understanding of Spanish rather than Japanese (discounting mexican-americans for obvious reasons) it's still a pretty bad idea if the game depends on writtern text to any degree to carry the plot.

Re:Right back at you, Cats!

[zonker]

They probably shouldn't have to. I'd imagine a good portion of Japanese can read English (or that's what it'd seem at least).

i think this is kinda the point the guy who was talking about iococca is trying to make (which you seem to be falling victim to here with your comment). just saying 'hey, the japanese should like anything we've got cuz we've got good stuff. just put a pink kitten on it and push the seats up and they'll sell like hotcakes!' isn't going to make it true. hell, the japanese probably don't even know what hotcakes are.

you've got to research the market before going into it. thinking the average japanese consumer knows english and knowing the average japanese consumer knows it are two very different things. microsoft didn't do their homework, and has paid for their lack of study skills.

U.S. is Microsoft country?

[angryflute]

How is Xbox faring in Europe? If it's sinking there, too, then it looks like Microsoft will have to settle for second place in North America.

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[johndoejersey]

in the uk gamecube and x box are considerably lagging behind the ps2. Gamecube seems to have caught something of a second wind since many retailers cut 1/3 off the price of a the console. xbox - IMO seems to be a poor 3rd place.

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[WildBeast]

Well proportionately, Canada has the highest number of Xbox and Xbox Live Gamers in the world. We love the Xbox here.

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[pmz]

If it's sinking there, too, then it looks like Microsoft will have to settle for second place in North America.

I would bet that Microsoft, culturally, goes against the grain of most countries in the world. Their super-aggressive business tactics are largely a U.S. tradition that, I suspect, would unsettle many foriegn businesspeople and government officials. Suprisingly, Microsoft has managed to get whole countries addicted to its PC software, but it seems some countries are looking to go into rehab full-force as soon as possible (e.g., whole national and municipal governments are adopting or severely considering Linux)

Perhaps, one day, the U.S. will be alone in the world with its government, military, and civilian populace branded "Designed for Windows".

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[gamgee5273]

Man, that completely destroys my utopic view of Canada. I think I'll have to postpone that trip to Toronto now...

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[Anonymous Coward]

In your utopia, what console DO kids play games on? I'm curious.

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[gamgee5273]

It's sarcasm, son, I say, I say sarcasm...

I will readily admit that, by time my kids are ready to play games, I will stick with Nintendo's offerings, possibly Sony's...though I will watch, very carefully, what they play...

MS, however, has done nothing to make me think they'll ever properly support kid's games...

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[Daetrin]

Damn it! If Canada is going to be picking up more traits from the US, please don't start with a devotion to Microsoft products!

We need some kind of contaminant warning sign to hang around our (current) politics and our megacorps.

Re:U.S. is Microsoft country?

[VikingBrad]

In Australia PS2 has a much larger installed base but Xbox is almost equally PS2 in current sales.

There are about 750,000 PS2s and 250,000 Xboxes in Australia as of March 2003 see link

Cheers

VikingBrad

Adult Games/Dating Sims, Japan-RPGs,

[roka]

That's what the XBOX is missing in japan.
Western games (especially fps like CS or Quake III) are not very popular in japan

Do something that is CUTE and it will sell.

OK, I don't like M$ - so I better shut up before they do what I say.

Re:Adult Games/Dating Sims, Japan-RPGs,

[pmz]

Do something that is CUTE and it will sell.

What about a fun cross between Frogger and Hello Kitty?

The possibilities are endless.

Re:X-Box is dying

[Anonymous Coward]

/me replace Xbox with Gamecube.
You got it bro !

I may have to go buy an XBOX

[johnkoer]

I didn't know Conker had a new title out (I don't follow new game releases any more). That was my favorite game for the N64. I may just go pick up an X-Box, cuz that game was hilarious.

Re:I may have to go buy an XBOX

[Gr33nNight]

Yeah, its in development. Who knows when it will come out. Rare likes to delay titles almost as much as Nintendo.

Re:I may have to go buy an XBOX

[edwdig]

The new Conker for XBox is the N64 game with upgraded graphics, and a few things that were cut because of time constraints. The Deathmatch modes will also be playable on XBox Live.

Don't expect much more from the single player. Shortly after Conker came out, the guy who did the voices in the game spent a few weeks answers questions on a Rare fan site. He gave the impression that there wasn't much they didn't get to do. The main thing he said they were originally planning on doing but didn't was to place lots of money in hard to get places in the later parts of the game, after there was no longer a need for money.

Re:I may have to go buy an XBOX

[SuiteSisterMary]

Conker Xbox, by the way, "Live and Uncut" is a remake of the N64 with new stuff thrown in, then an Xbox Live version of the multiplayer stuff.

lol - X-Box is dying

[DrSkwid]

some people have no sense of humour

Re:lol - X-Box is dying

[Blob Pet]

What, has someone ported BSD to the X-Box?

Re:lol - X-Box is dying

[Anonymous Coward]

some people have no sense of humour

Yeah, you're totally right! They keep telling old jokes that were stupid to begin with, hoping that changing it to be about the current subject will somehow make it funny. Some people.

pffft, won't work

[JazFresh]

The USA and Europe have many many places where you can import Japanese games, because that's where many of the best games are made. But I've spent a lot of time in Japan, and I've never seen a place that sold games imported from the west.

If there's no demand, they'll only sell to a minority of hardcore gamers.

This whole think smacks of desperation.

Re:pffft, won't work

[Anonymous Coward]

I read you can get them at certain stores.. for twice the price

MS Leaving Japan...

[gamgee5273]

I knew this sort of thing was going to happen. When the WonderSwan outsells the Xbox, you seriously have to wonder if the Japanese are even interested in MS's product...which they obviously aren't. And, personally, I find the Xbox to be a major yawn-fest, wth Halo being the only exclusive worthwhile on there (and, even then, I've fooled with Halo on a friend's Xbox and wasn't that impressed).

Xbox is dying its deserved death. I, for one, know there is no way I'm buying one unless Shenmue III is an Xbox exclusive. Even then, I may just borrow a friend's Xbox to play it...

My prediction: there may be an Xbox 2, but there will not be an Xbox 3.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[Anonymous Coward]

Why is this a deserved death? I know its the popular thing to automatically hate MS around here.

I like to give MS their due on XBOX though. They came in and gave a real alternative to the stagnation thats out there. Without XBOX your choices are...
The PS2: basically more of the same no new technology or features, to upgrade your PS2 to XBOX level you have to spend at least $100 more and the HD isn't even out yet, a console that is designed to break, no digital sound chip, just nothing pushing game development or features forward, and yes it has more games, but should we really count 200 driving games as different games?
or The Gamecube: the console for people who dont like new characters or gameplay, most people agree that metroid and zelda are the best games on that platform but I already played those on the NES, SNES, N64 etc, no online play outside of PSO, proprietary everything, the REAL worst controller ever except for simple games that require only one button, media that forces developers to dumb down a game to fit on the disc, worse than the PS2 the Gamecube seems to be trying to regress gaming.

Sure MS came into game to try to make money. Thats why Sony and Nintendo are in the game too. I think the hate should be more directed at Sony, they are the evil monopoly in this marketplace. At least MS tried to win by giving more features than the other consoles. It just lost because of the EA/Sony collusion that kept the Dreamcast down too.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[PainKilleR-CE]

or The Gamecube: the console for people who dont like new characters or gameplay, most people agree that metroid and zelda are the best games on that platform but I already played those on the NES, SNES, N64 etc,

Metroid on the GameCube is an FPS, so unless there's a Metroid FPS out there that I wasn't aware of, you haven't played it yet. That being said, it may be similar to previous FPS games on the N64, I couldn't really say. Personally, the last Nintendo system I owned was an NES, so maybe I'm not as jaded as others (and if I had bought an N64 against my better judgment, maybe I would be).

no online play outside of PSO,

Which may or may not be rectified eventually. I'm not really concerned, because I'll probably connect the PS2, XBox, and GC to the home network at the same time. Besides, I don't have a single game for any of them that supports online play at the moment (or if any of those games do, I never really thought about playing them online).

proprietary everything, the REAL worst controller ever except for simple games that require only one button,

I think the worst controller for a console was the original DreamCast controller, with the XBox S controller coming up next, and the Nintendo controller coming up after that. I like the original XBox controller, and I have a 3rd party controller for the DreamCast that is usable (the controller fits my hands nice, but the triggers stick).

media that forces developers to dumb down a game to fit on the disc,

How many developers are utilizing over 1GB of space on a DVD? Most PC games are still distributed on CDs (and many on one CD at that). Most 1st gen PS2 titles were on CD as well (and some current gen titles still are, or could have been). A small DVD that stores nearly 2 GB is hardly limiting game developers, especially when every developer that went over 650 MB in the past showed they were perfectly capable of doing multi-disc titles.

worse than the PS2 the Gamecube seems to be trying to regress gaming.

If anyone's trying to regress gaming it's the developers and publishers that are willing to flood the market with crap titles. It's almost gotten to the point where I buy games the way I buy books: from only specific authors (developers) that I know put out quality titles, and occasionally taking a look at something that gets enough recommendations by people who's opinions I respect.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[gamgee5273]

But what features are they actually giving us? MS has stated, very clearly, that they aren't as much interested in getting good games to market as they are getting into the living room.

MS wants to own your entertainment venue - gaming, PVR, web surfing, digital media playback. Think about it - what does an "Xbox" mean? A "PlayStation" clearly states "play" and a "GameCube" says "games." What does "Xbox" mean? "X" sounds like a variable to me...

As for the online play - that's not a killer app for me or most of my friends. I do have an adapter for my PS2, and I have SOCOM (and I enjoy it), no adapter for my GC, though (no need - don't have time for PSO)...but it's just not a compelling thing for a console for me. If its there - cool. If not, that's fine too.

I bought the PS2 for the games library. I love my GC and its games. The graphics, when handled correctly, are nothing but beautiful - just look at Pikmin (a new game, by the way). Add the Game Boy Player into the mix, and the GC is, quite simply, the best piece of hardware on the market. No, it doesn't have Halo or GTA...but it does have some wonderful games that my wife and I enjoy playing.

Obviously, so do the Japanese. ;)

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[Daetrin]

the REAL worst controller ever except for simple games that require only one button,

Say what? The GameCube controllers has a few problems, mainly the lack of a fourth shoulder button, but it's certainly far from worst, and i certainly don't have a problem with the rest of the buttons.

The X-Box on the other hand... i tried it out at Electronics Boutique, and it really sucked. My hand started hurting after about four or five minutes of playing. The little black and white buttons were placed _way_ too close together and i kept hitting the wrong ones, or rather, hitting the right one and accidently pressing one or two others as well.

As for the games, Metroid is completly different on the GameCube, and the only other Zelda game similar to the GameCube one is the N64 one. What you feel about one generation doesn't have much to do with the next. Metroid Prime is good, though i prefered the previous metroids better, however despite really liking the Zeldas on the NES and SNES, The Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker totally sucked in my opinion. However a large majority of people seem to disagree with me on that last one despite agreeing that it's very different from previous incarnations. There are also a lot of other games that aren't just reiterations of Zelda and Metroid. I've got as many GameCube games as i do PS2 games.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[PainKilleR-CE]

MS wants to own your entertainment venue - gaming, PVR, web surfing, digital media playback. Think about it - what does an "Xbox" mean? A "PlayStation" clearly states "play"

Oh please, as much as I disagree with the original poster's points about other consoles, I can't believe how many people are willing to think that Sony's intentions are better than Microsoft's in any way, shape, or form. In fact, with their home electronics products and their already-announced plans for the PS2.5, Sony's most likely in a better position to take control of your living room than Microsoft is. Not to mention that Sony's use of CD and DVD drives in their consoles was just as much geared at making it easier for them to sell more products (music and movies) as making it easier for developers to put their products on Sony's system.

If anything, American corporations have a harder time becoming the monstrosities that Japanese (and many other Asian) corporations are, because there are many Japanese corporations competing in multiple (sometimes complimentary) markets. The US legal system likes to strike down those types of monopolies at least as much as the monopoly that Microsoft is perceived to be.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[gamgee5273]

Never said they weren't - but the potential in the PS2 isn't there yet. Sony doesn't have Ultimate TV or WebTV or its own ISP

Now, let's say Sony buys Tivo or Replay, steps up development of their Linux distro OR starts working closely with Apple (which both companies have stated there are talks going on about making the Mac and the PS work together somehow). Then they would just be missing an ISP (not that important - buy a little one or partner up with Earthlink, etc.)...then Sony would be in the position MS is in. But Sony just doesn't have the infrastructure in place to pull that off right now.

And, please remember, MS is a monopoly - even they agree with it. The legal questions surrounding them are if they are leveraging their position as a monopoly illegally.

Re:MS Leaving Japan...

[zonker]

though i'm not an xbox hater as such, i do find it somewhat amusing that yes, the wonderswan and gameboy pocket often (not always) trump the xbox in japan. for those not in tune with the sales, here's the latest figures. interestingly, with nintendo's recent gcn/gbp deal, cube sales are doing really well. hopefully it will continue...

as for the xbox-only titles, yeah, there isn't a hell of a lot of variation there for the average japanese player. especially not much in the way of rpg's (the key to the hearts of the japanese market). nor the average american player, for that matter (as i consider myself). i'm not too plussed with the majority (there are a few titles that are very tempting) of exclusive xbox stuff. when my girlfriend (ms has pretty much ignored female players altogether from what i've seen so far) starts looking at the xbox and is curious about playing some of its exclusive titles, maybe then i'll be closer to reach for the wallet...

The trick to selling in japan....

[UltimaL337Star]

-include a hentai tentacle that comes in randomly like those heads in mortal kombat -attach a color to the name like ruby, saphire and silver to the game series but since they don't like counter-strike don't make a gold which will confuse them because they'll be looking for the counterpart to silver. -include an option to ally with germany -use marketing terms like "booster pack", "only for [insert system here]", and "UATA/133". -tell them they have large penis (applies to all males)

Could be smart, could be stupid...

[amuro98]

One of the biggest complaints I hear from US gamers is how various Japanese titles are never released in the US.
I personally think this was a factor in the downfall of the Dreamcast and Saturn, as there were games that many folks wanted, but Sega refused to bring over.

So this move by Microsoft, assuming they don't just cram a Japanese manual in with the English version of the game, could be a good thing for the Japanese market - assuming any of the games heading there are of any interest to the market.

Re:Could be smart, could be stupid...

[zonker]

well... sega's problems were more than that. they needed to deal with their own management before getting really ambitious with new systems. sega largely killed sega from the inside out, not the outside in.

microsoft's situation is different. they've got money to burn and aren't afraid to do it. this seems more like the pie on the wall approach to selling a product (toss a pie and see what sticks). the likely outcome to this is that they'll realize that very little is going to stick as their are very real cultural barriers that they are overlooking and/or downplaying. the japanese may be fascinated by american culture, but it is a fickle appreciation.

your average japanese consumer 'gets' george carlin (for instance ;P ) as much as the average american joe 'gets' hello kitty. show your parents dir en gray as they look at you funny to see what i mean.