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Linus Says Pre-2.6 is Coming
gomoX writes "As seen on C|Net , Linus has announced that the pre-2.6 series will be starting in early July. Despite not having been able to meet the release goal for 2.6 in June 2003, the next stable version is not as far away as you may think. You can take your guess based on the fact there was a 9 month period between first test version of 2.4 and the official release of 2.4.0 on January 2001."
In fact, 2.5 isn't that bad right now... certainly, it would be crazy to use it on a production system unless you really know what you're doing[1], but it's quite usable, and the scheduling has really improved.
;)
[1] in which case you probably wouldn't use it on said production system...
So what's the easiest way to use new versions, use something like Gentoo or Linux From Scratch? Jonah Hex
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So what hot new features can we expect from the new 2.6 Kernel
Even the regular Gentoo kernel has a lot of extra patches in it, including the O(1) Scheduler, and Low-latency scheduling; works great for me.
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate.
I am using a rock solid 2.5.70 since its released and its performs just great! And having Morton and Torvalds at OSDL is a good thing (tm) :)
--
One by one the penguins steal my sanity...
Your "Overt Sauce" model is clearly breaked ! Windows has been way beyond 2.6 (3.1 to be exact) since what ? 11 years ?
KernelTrap is running a story on an interview Alan Cox gave at LinuxUser & Developer Expo 2003 in Birmingham, U.K. A summary of Alan's talk is also available.
not to be nitpicky or anything, but technically, shouldn't future versions of linux be referred to as GNU/SCO?
Microsoft deserves to be raked over the coals, and the government IS out to get you.
That doesn't mean that the editors aren't lazy and slower than sloths, though.
-- Darl McBride
What they don't get in timeliness they make up for in volume (dupes).
My question is this:
There was some hesitancy, upon the official release of kernel 2.4, based upon some bugs etc...
I'm wondering, does the kernel - generally speaking - get more and more stable. For example, will the first release of 2.6 be more stable than the first release of 2.4. I realise that there are new additions to the kernel, and with that new problems will probably emerge. However, comparatively speaking, does it make sense that the kernel's evolution will lean towards stability with each release in the cycle, or will it generally be unnoticable?
Just curious.
This wasn't just plain terrible, this was fancy terrible. This was terrible with raisins in it. - Dorothy Parker
I have absolutly nothing to add of a technical nature to this story, so I will delude you with a rambling trip down memory lane (comprised completly of anecdotes from 2.2).
;)
My first taste of linux was phatLinux on my brand new p2-400 (128MB of pc 100 ram I liked). 3 months later I had built a sub 400 dollar computer to play around with and bought (yes paid money for) Linux Mandrake 6.5 from Wal-Mart. From there I began learning about this kernel thing (and my joys when I found make menuconfig and make xconfig, have you ever tried make config? ewww...) Well that went fine and fun, I added options, made modules all the fun stuff you do, but it was still in the same 2.2 vein that came with mandrake. Then 2.4.0 final was relased and I compiled and installed my first new kernel. Everything was new and faster. DevFS was a godsend, the ppp and bsd compression routines made my modem fast (or somthing I went from 2.5 kb/s downloads to 5-6 kb/s after recompiling). Since then I have also come to love dri, premptive and low latency patches, and all these other backported goodies. I am waiting on 2.6 final before I play with any of the new features (I didn't play with 2.3 or 2.5). Ok I am done. And I didn't even mention Gentoo... oh wait... damn.
There is nothing wrong with being gay. It's getting caught where the trouble lies.
Me neither, but the new scheduler is nice, POSIX ACLs look sweet and ALSA included in the main kernel release, and the cryptoapi. Plus all the incremental upgrades to drivers etc.
Also, modules names have (I think) changed, so a change in the init scripts would probably be useful. It depends on your distro though - I'd say distros like Slackware and Debian will have guides or automated tools for migration. Commercial distributions will probably have to release a new version (RedHat 10 ? Gods).
Although maybe I'm wrong, I never managed to get a working 2.5.x kernel on my Debian box =)
The Windows kernel hasn't changed significantly since the NT4 -> Win2K change. The biggest improvement in the XP kernel was pre-faulting the pages of large processes. Meanwhile, in 2.6, the block I/O layer, VM layer, scheduler, and sound system are brand new. And the whole kernel was made preemptible! Shortly after 2.6, ReiserFS 4 (which looks very promising from initial benchmarks) will be released. In all, 2.4 -> 2.6 will be like NT4 -> XP!
PS> Before anyone bitches about rewrites being a bad thing, look at things this way. Such extensive changes are necessary for the continually growing range of systems Linux is expected to run on. 2.0 and 2.2 were greatfor single CPU servers, or SMP machines with only a few processors. 2.4 is very usable for heavy-duty machines with many more processors. 2.6 (along with the changes that help interactivity) will make an excellent kernel for desktop machines and workstations. In 2.8, the focus will be on optimizing the core algorithms to run on large-scale NUMA machines.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
Kernel is as stable as the rocky mountains. Been compiling Mozilla non-stop in gcc for the last 3 hours with no problems.
It'll be nice when it finally comes out, because I'll be able to point people doing audio work to Linux. Right now I have to say "well, Linux is better than Windows for this, but only if you apply the low-latency, pre-emptible kernel, and variable HZ (with HZ set to 1000) patches," which is a bit more involved than most people who are just doing audio work want to deal with. Once 2.6.x comes out I can just point them to the stock kernel.
10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
Also, the old OSS modules are still in the kernel. I haven't tried them in 2.5, and they are marked with a big DEPRECATED, but they're still there.
Note, of course, as I've said elsewhere, you do need the new module-init-tools; I'd imagine that would be the most likey reason you'd have trouble getting a 2.5 kernel working, followed closely by an out of date/broken driver.
"You can take your guess based on ....
No you can't. Linus has always maintained that a kernel will be released "when it's done". Why would he change now?
Dude - do you what the word guess means?
guess - a. To predict (a result or an event) without sufficient information. b. To assume, presume, or assert (a fact) without sufficient information.
I also agree - NOT insightful.
Well, the nanosecond patch is critical for make on fast computers, since it uses filesystem timestamps. If you're running gentoo on a brand new desktop it might be a good idea.
The fbdev patch reduces the size of the framebuffer, so if you like framebuffered consoles, it will reduce your kernel size.
If you have multiple processors, the Shared page table patch will help reduce page table sizes, and thereby improve performance, marginally. More RAM = more file cache / less disk paging; shared data -> higher cache coherency = faster kernel performance in memory mapping.
Additionally there seems to have been some mucking around with tweaking the adaptive scheduler so X gets more time when it needs it. The performance metrics have been kind of squishy, but the general consensus is that X and related 'interactive' processes are more responsive.
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I played around a bit with .71-.73, but the big thing that got me was that my mouse speed in gnome was sped up by about 10x over 2.4. I had to set the accel down to the lowest setting in gnome to make it usable, compared to about the 25-50% setting with 2.4. Of course, there is no similar setting for GDM.
I'm guessing this is due to the new keyboard/mouse modules, but who knows. Hopefully this is one of the things that will get shaken out when 2.5 and 2.6 become more mainstream and the KDE/GNOME folks set things up to work nicer with the devel kernels.
Don't forget merger of larger projects into the kernel, namely:
CryptoAPI
IPsec
ALSA
XFS
No more patching the kernel/building module packages for those features!
Also, improved latency with (O)1 Scheduler and other I/O performance tweaks will be native to the kernel.
There's a lot of complaining about code-freezes for the kernel not being code-freezes. People gripe about major changes being introduced in the last days of the development version.
I think the problem is the standard explanation of 'even kernels are production, odd kernels are development.' Whether he says so or not, it's clear that branching to an even version does not mean that it's a production kernel...branching to an even version begins the code freeze. Up until they call it 2.6, there's going to be large changes to the codebase. Once Linus calls it 2.6, everyone knows they can't put in major changes, but basic bug-fixes only. Therefore, it's never until a few months (or a year) after the even series starts that it's really a production kernel.
Software development managers would hate this...lots of kernel developers hate this...but love him or leave him, that's how Linus works.
I'm sure I'm not the only one who's wondering if Reiser 4 will go into the stock 2.6! So: does anyone know?
Basically, Slashdot has a story comment system that sorta resembles boards as well as a story submission system that sorta resembles a moderated topic list.
It isn't a messageboard site though.
--- Ãther SPOON!
What about that? Will we be finaly able to switch kernels without a reboot?
:D
I could google for it, but hearing peoples' comments about these things is much more interesting...
Looking for people to chat about multicopters, coding, music. skype: gtsiros
What's the name of the new filtering tool that will "obsolete" iptables?
t my mouse speed in gnome was sped up by about 10x over 2.4
great news! 900% speedup from Linux kernel 2.4 to 2.5.75
Does nobody even know how their system works anymore? xset people! xset!!
These vaporware announcements must stop. Already since Linus announced this I have noticed a drop-off in downloads of the 2.4 kernel.
:)
These anti-competitive practices need to be stopped. A kernel-lead developer such as Linus should have to compete on the same level as everyone else for his kernel to get used.
I recommend "Ask slashdot (http://ask.slashdot.org)", which is sort of a newbie forum for stupid questions that can be solved with google. So, like, post all your issues, such as:
"How do I mod my xbox"
"Should I overclock my CPU"
"How do I make everything more faster"
and,
"This question is just begging to have all replies start with IANAL"
Join the club!
Tired of legitimate data sources? Try UNCYCLOPEDIA
Been compiling Mozilla non-stop in gcc for the last 3 hours with no problems..... ./configure has just about finished! And who said you needed the latest hardware?
on my 486. Oh look -
You are in a twisty maze of processor lines, all alike.
There is a lot of hype here.
Well crap...just this morning I updated to 2.4. Now I can't feel all cool anymore.
I have a girlfriend whose name doesn't end in
What happened to devfsd and lvm? I know they were talking about replacing lvm, and I was wondering if the new code is in place?
Also, I read somewhere that the developers were unhappy about devfsd, since 'nobody was using it'. I'm using it, so I'm hoping they don't remove it.
Je ne parle pas francais.
I've been hearing though other channels that the IDE layer rewrite improves the IDE subsystem to the point where SCSI emulation won't be needed to drive an IDE CD burner. Can anyone confirm or deny this? If so, this will probably become my main reason to switch to 2.6 (although there are quite a few secondary ones too). Thanks linux team (and IDE rewrite folks)!
"Can't you see that everyone is buying station wagons?"
You are correct in assuming you don't need ide-scsi to emulate a SCSI host for burning cdroms in 2.6, but it has nothing at all to do with the IDE rewrite.
2.6 has support for queueing "generic scsi" commands through the block layer, using the same mechanism and transport as the regular read/write file system requests. So we can overload the sg (scsi generic) SG_IO and provide the same functionality for non-scsi attached devices (such as atapi burners). With a recent cdrecord, you can give the device with -dev=/dev/hdc for instance.
Additionally, cd burning is now zero copy. The user space data buffer is mapped directly into the kernel for the dma operations. DMA is supported on a 4-byte boundary, where 2.4 and previous has required sector alignment (512 bytes) for any atapi dma operations.