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W3C Web Accessibility Standards 2.0

WildFire42 writes "The W3C has released their W3C WCAG 2.0 Standards (that's World Wide Web Consortium Web Content Accessibility Guidelines) for a request for comments before it becomes a standard. I've discovered quite a variety of geeks here that may access web content in a variety of methods, from screen readers, to Braille displays, to open captioning on streamed videos, etc. Web accessibility is still in its infancy (relatively), but is becoming a concern for more people every day. Once the WCAG 2.0 becomes a recognized standard (probably sometime in 2004), it will most likely be a concern for web developers, but the W3C still wants input from the public, to get a feel of the kinds of disabilities that have not received enough focus in the 1.0 standards. More information on the Interest Group is at the W3C Web Accessibility Initiative page. Your input and insight is needed!"

36 of 200 comments (clear)

  1. Pew! by thorgil · · Score: 5, Funny

    Pew! took a while to read it.
    No wonder people don't RTFA.

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    1. Re:Pew! by RobotWisdom · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Like all W3C proclamations, this has three deadly accessibility problems:
      1. 20+ screens of meta-information before the real content starts
      2. written in an over-abstract, PhD-thesis prose-style
      3. readability is decreased by highlighting many phrases as inline anchortext (better to isolate the links at the end of the sentence or paragraph, imho)
    2. Re:Pew! by RobotWisdom · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Basically, separating the link from what it refers to is incredibly bad. It makes it harder to work out what it's referring to.

      My theory is that there's three important dimensions in labelling a link: first the topic, then the resource-type (etext, image, etc), and last the rating (good or bad).

      Topic usually doesn't change within a sentence, so I like to add a 'text button' at the end that augments the topic-info with the resource-type. [examples]

      I usually skip the rating unless it's especialy good or bad.

      If you're referring to an organisation or source of information, it's very useful only helpful to put it there.

      The problem is, you can't specify the resource type-- if it's a book-title, are you linking a full etext, or a review, or the Amazon page? For an organisation, you can guess it will be their official website, but this is not reliable. (I make an exception when the sentence mentions the resource type, like "There's a great weblog I stumbled upon...")

      If you find any inline links to be too intrusive, just set your user agent

      They reduce readability for everyone, even if the color is tweaked, so the author should look for a better way....imho.

    3. Re:Pew! by zsau · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I was thinking about it, and one comment I would have is the [comments] don't actually say what they're linking too, only what kind of content there is. Links should, and I know I don't always obey this but I will eventually, actually say what they are. Then you begin to get long things like [(dummy) etext on rabid donkeys] and by that stage, you've lost the advantage of it, and might just as well have said that you should read the (dummy) re-hashed etext on rabid donkeys, and any advantage you might still have had you've totally lost, because that's what you would've (should've) said in the first place.

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  2. Hrmm by acehole · · Score: 4, Interesting

    How about a recommendation to get rid of popups/unders?

    sounds good to me...

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    1. Re:Hrmm by Tirel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      how about you using a browser that doesn't allow popups (opera, all mozilla derivates, konqueror, all text browsers and dillo are just a few that come to mind), or if you really need to stick to the current browser, why not just use a proxy that blocks them (squid, junkbusters, proximitron, tinyproxy,... the list goes on) ?

    2. Re:Hrmm by xenotrout · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Removal of pop-ups is a recommendation of the current w3c accessability standards. Switching window focus without letting the user know that it is going to happen can confuse accessibility programs and users. I believe pop-unders are just a hack that switches focus back, so they are also not recommended.
      Very few web sites that I've seen care about accessibility standards. Very few web devs, it seems, even care about W3C standards, because they develop for browsers (i.e. IE) rather than for the web (i.e. W3C standards). Check a number of pages with Watchfire Bobby and you'll see. Even slashdot has quite a few "violations" of the WCAG 1.0 standard.

  3. Re:the internet community by cmang · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I would think the web browser developer community would do good to comply with standards more, sure.. but it's cool to see that standards are being set for a new useful generation of web interactivity (ie: the disabled-access terminals). I'd hope to see more of that sort of technology popping up in society as standards are set for making the web more accessible to people.

  4. Here's a useful tool by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 4, Informative

    If you want to test if your webpage is accessible to visually deficient people, you can ask Bobby to scan it and analyse it. Best accessibility report tool in town, I use it on all my pages.

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    "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    1. Re:Here's a useful tool by JimDabell · · Score: 3, Informative

      Of course, automated tools cannot accurately test for compliance with WCAG, Section 508, or similar accessibility requirements, merely check a few things and give pointers to the bits it cannot check.

      I've found that the Accessibility Valet does a very good job, much better than Bobby used to (I haven't tried Bobby in a while though).

    2. Re:Here's a useful tool by Aquitaine · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Contrary to the parent, Bobby is the least useful accessibility report tool in town.

      I work in an office that does accessibility reviews, and we have never used Bobby. It was bought out by a for-profit (after belonging to a NFP group for quite some time) and has more or less stagnated.

      Bobby will give you an enormous list of things to fix, but most of what it says can be ignored and it ignores most of what needs to be said.

      At the moment, our office doesn't recommend any automated accessibility checker. LIFT is better than Bobby, but there is no substitute for actually knowing the guidelines (which is not hard -- get the checklist instead of the W3C novella format).

      Or hire us to come teach you. :)

    3. Re:Here's a useful tool by malex · · Score: 2, Informative

      I also suggest LIFT as powerful tools for finding and fixing accessibility issues.

  5. Re:the internet community by Anime_Fan · · Score: 5, Informative

    Actually, this is a standard on how to create pages so people will be able to access the page even if they for some reason can't use bleeding-edge graphical browsers (blindness) or can't hear the audio of Flash animations / audio clips.

    It's a standard that tells you _how_ to use the already existing standards (such as the alt property on tags or providing transcripts to audio feeds).

    Then again, I'm sure you already knew this, and thus posted this as an AC. Still, people may not be as smart as you, so I'll post it anyways =D

  6. Article by Luigi30 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Now if only there was a standard to make Slashdot articles shorter...

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  7. Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by mrd_yaddayadda · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Some countries (UK, Australia two that I know) have some legislation in place whereby some sites *have* to be designed to meet accessibility guidelines for vision impaired folks.

    This really annoyes me. The web is a visual medium. It should not be compulsory to cater for those that can't benefit from a visual medium, in a visual medium.

    We don't have legislation to ensure that every book that is released has a braille version and a speaking book version do we? No. Why take on the web this way?

    Yes I've been hit by this myself, and it's hugely frustrating being on the end of it as a site developer having the spectre of the law raised above you...

    1. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by quinine · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Well, if you're talking about sites that provide govenment services then yes, accessability standards should be maintained. Just like if you go to a courthouse, there needs to be a ramp there for wheelchairs. If your talking about rubmyhotbutt.com, though, then I agree with you; this should not be compulsory.

    2. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 2, Flamebait

      This really annoyes me. The web is a visual medium. It should not be compulsory to cater for those that can't benefit from a visual medium, in a visual medium.

      I've worked with blind people : there's a lot of simple services and entertainments that aren't accessible to them simply because selfish brats like you say "to hell with them, this or that isn't designed for them so why should we go out of our way to allow them to access it.".

      Guess what: blind people go to art museums to touch sculptures, they go shooting at the range, they play golf, ... and they have a ton of fun doing it, just because someone a little more open-minded than you invented some gadget or method to allow them to have fun.

      I wish you'd go blind for a day, just to make you feel what it's like to be denied entertainment because of selfish people who don't give a flying fuck about anything but themselves.

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      "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    3. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by iangoldby · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think you are missing the point that the web so easily could be an ideal medium for non-visual information.

      For example, if you compare the technology required to read a paper book out loud to that required to read an electronic text file out aloud, I'm sure you will see that the latter is a far easier task. There's no reason to make it difficult, but designers do, just because they think it is more important to have a heading in their own choice of font (presented as a bitmap) than for a minority to be able to read it.

      You might also like to bear in mind that local government in the UK has a duty to make information available in a form that people can understand. That's why most leaflets tell you where to get hold of a large-print version, or in audio tape form. (Presumably your neighbour tells you this from the original leaflet if you can't read it yourself!)

      So I ask again: The web is ideally suited to avoid the effort required to make paper documents universally accessible. Why make it difficult?

    4. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by finitimi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Accessibility benefits everyone, not just the disabled. I recall back when wheelchair accesibility was first made a requirement for public places. I remember thinking to myself, "we have to spend all this money just for a few cripples?" Since then, I've raised a few children who I pushed around in strollers, and I was mighty glad for simple accessibility features such as sloping curb cuts in sidewalks.

      The w3c guidelines are mostly common-sense hints about what not to do. Many barriers to access are unintentional; the w3c is doing web developers a service by pointing them out.

    5. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by NulDevice · · Score: 4, Informative

      In the US, it's Section508 of the Americans with Disabilities Act.

      EVERYBODY and their brother gets up-in-arms about having the government legislate their web design. Nobody bothers to read this stuff.

      So here're my bullet points:

      1) s508 compliance it's only required if you're a federal government agency or contractor, and even then there are some exceptions.

      2) C'mon people, it's really *not* that hard to comply. Got ALT tags? You're halfway there. Lose the 7 layers of nested tables and nobody'll complain.

      3) it's 2003 now - the era of overdesigned websites ended with the .com crash. The vast market of consumers don't care if a site is animated to holy heck and streams ambient music anymore - It's not going to sell your product or content any better anymore than a well-designed but accessible/usable site.

      4) A site doesn't have to be ugly and nonvisual to be accessible. Proper use of CSS can give you a fantastic site that degrades nicely into a screen-reader, brailler, etc.

      5) Not every disabled person involved is a blind, deaf quadrapelegic. Some are just nearsighted folks who want to set the font size something above the Arial-submicroscopic-pt that eagle-eyed designers often use. Why not let them?

      6) There are several hundred million users worldwide who consider themselves disabled in some way. If you're selling things, would you shut your door to 200,000,000 potential customers because it's inconvenient for you to serve them?

      7) A plus to an accessible website is that it will almost always degrade well to other browsers - especially things like wireless devices and phones. Make your site accessible, and you've gone a long way towards making it mobile as well.

      8) Jeffrey Zeldman's new book "Designing with Web Standards" is an excellent resource. He demonstrates how to use current standards like XHTML, CSS to create websites that are complaint with standards, work well on the vast majority of browsers, are attractive, usable, and accessible. Definitely worth checking out, as is his website, www.zeldman.com.

      Accessibility shouldn't be considered an incovnenience - it's just good practice.

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    6. Re:Standards? Ok. Compulsory standards? Not ok. by JimDabell · · Score: 4, Insightful

      And therein lies my whole problem with this. Accessibility compliant pages are damn ugly. Almost uniformly.

      That's not true at all.

      And so what we end up doing is take a visual medium and break it for those with different needs.

      Accessible websites don't have to be ugly. What makes you think that they do?

  8. Re:Oh goody by xenotrout · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Though this was labeled as troll, and I can see why, I can also see the point in it. Some may not, so I will clarify. Microsoft's Internet Explorer web browser is horrid about complying to W3C standards, and even creates its own "standards" that some people are more likely to comply to. Maybe this wouldn't be labeled troll if the statement was more like, "This is a great development for the W3C, but seems that, unfortunately, it's not going to do much good. Microsoft has been making web standards useless ever since they 'took control' of the 'browser market,' and they don't seem to care about accessable web pages (WCAG 1.0, US section 508). I did check the document source for an accessable alternative version as the W3C standards would accept instead of the main version being accessable, but they have no alternative versions, even for mobile devices or anything."

  9. When is a standard not a standard? by bons · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When no one follows it.

    Or in some cases, when a standard is so ill-defined as to allow for multiple incompatible interpretations, making it impossible to figure out if you've followed it.

    Historically, browsers have consistantly been incompatible, plug-ins have been required to accomplish those things the browsers didn't accomplish, and the goal of content over form has been lost since the <b> tag stuck it's elbow in the <em> tag''s face.

    Web site developers, meanwhile, are not only ignorant of the standards, but would be actively encouraged to ignore them by their client even if they knew. The people who build these sites do not care about accessability any more than spammers really care about those people who get mad at the e-mails.

    At this point, testing with normal browsers has become impossible, since there are multiple versions of IE, both Mac and PC, on the streets, all of them rendering CSS differently, Mozilla has split yet again, Safari is trying to gain market share, and Opera is still causing web developers to pull their hair out.

    And now you want an accessability standard?

    I've been a beta tester. I've been a web designer. And I've had an internet account for a decade now. The industry is incapable of following the standards it currently has. It doesn't need new ones. It sure as heck isn't going to follow them. If someone needs an accessabilty guideline, they can use Section 508 for now. It'll do the job until the industry can get it's act together.

  10. The Web is not a visual medium by LiamQ · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This really annoyes me. The web is a visual medium. It should not be compulsory to cater for those that can't benefit from a visual medium, in a visual medium.

    The Web is not a visual medium. Yes, it contains a lot of visual content, but there's also plenty of text content that can be presented just fine in a non-visual manner.

    As a Web author, your role is to describe the structure of the content. If you use proper markup, such as H1 for headings and P for paragraphs, then browsers can present your content in an appropriate manner whether it be visual or non-visual.

    The Web still consists mostly of text content, and there's nothing visual about that. (Yes, I know about porn, but there's still plenty of text content even there.)

    1. Re:The Web is not a visual medium by LiamQ · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Tagging a phone number would be extremely useful for the many new smartphones and phone/PDA combos that include a Web browser. Then those browsers could allow you to easily call the number, send an SMS/MMS, or add the number to your address book.

    2. Re:The Web is not a visual medium by Rits · · Score: 2, Interesting

      HTML 2.0 and the Strict variant HTML 4.01/XHTML 1.0 (which have the same vocabulary of elements) are not so far apart. It's the crud that got inserted in between (FONT, color and align attributes) that we're better off without, now that CSS support is quite decent in 95% of the browsers used. CSS makes webdesign easier, especially when you don't have to think about Netscape 4 compatability.

      Separation of structure and style not only makes your work easier. It will also make a difference for blind users when tool builders can actually count on it.

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    3. Re:The Web is not a visual medium by JimDabell · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I'm not familiar with Goldfarb's conjecture, but the person you are replying to isn't talking about human cognition. It's about presenting content appropriately. Unless you are arguing that the same presentation is always suitable for everyone, or that you can easily convert one presentation into another, I don't see what your point is.

      Does a blind-reader really benefit from EM instead of I,

      All visitors do if the search engine they use pays more attention to emphasized text.

      or from P instead of BR-BR?

      Series of <br> elements should render as a single linebreak in conformant user-agents. Do you think that whitespace has no effect on the readability of a document?

    4. Re:The Web is not a visual medium by Tsu+Dho+Nimh · · Score: 2, Informative

      The most important visitors your site will have are BLIND. They are the search site robot, and the indexing software. A well-build page with CSS and good structure will be higher in the results than the same information presented on a page with no structural elements and just the "appearance" tags like FONT. I've tested this repeatedly over the years, and it still works.

    5. Re:The Web is not a visual medium by rshugart · · Score: 2, Informative
      Does a blind-reader really benefit
      from EM instead of I, or from P instead of BR-BR?

      Beeing blind, I feel uniquely qualified to comment here. Yes, absolutely the blind person does benefit from proper markup! In fact, if you use proper markup, you will go a long way twoards making an accessible site. Perhaps an example is in order here.


      First off, like most other blind people I know, I use IE as the underlying browser. Unfortunately at this time, its the only one that supports accessibility to any real extent for a blind person. IE actually passes all page information to a screen reader, in my case Window-Eyes, which then reformats the information into a method I can use. I can move around a page by links, headings, paragraphs, etc. Many times, for example, if I'm trying to get an over view of the page, I just jump from heading to heading to get an over view of how things are layed out, and then can read just what I want to read. If something starts to get borring, fine, just jump to the next heading. Also, Window-eyes automatically expands acronym and abreviation tags, so I strongly recomend using them. My software can even use language attributes on a page to make sure parts of the page are read in the proper language. So to summarize, proper markup is crutial. In fact, it and alt tags are my two biggest issues.


      For more info on just how this works, you can take a look at this page describing just how these navigation features work, and even download a demo so you can try it for yourself and see just how it works.

  11. Re:Another Useless doc from a Useless Comittee by LiamQ · · Score: 2, Informative

    The W3C is a consortium that includes the makers of IE, Netscape, Opera, and Safari. Check their About page and the member list.

    (I know, I've been trolled, but some might find the clarification useful.)

  12. Bandwidth and W3C Recommendations by LiamQ · · Score: 4, Informative

    The W3C should also consider the cost of bandwidth. By fully compling with their recs, each html page will increase in size from 25 to 50%.

    On what do you base this claim? In my experience, most pages that attempt to comply with W3C Recommendations use less bandwidth than the non-compliant tag soup that dominates the Web. Tag soup pages generally include useless images and bloated markup (<font>, unnecessary tables) that standards-based pages don't have.

  13. Sheesh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    >Once the WCAG 2.0 becomes a recognized standard (probably sometime in 2004), it will most likely be a concern for web developers

    Why do you say that?

    The HTML standard has been out for years, and it isn't a concern for the average web developer. Why should they start being concerned about accessibility guidelines, when right now they write pages that can only be viewed in Internet Explorer, or only after installing some sort of trojan/spyware on your machine?

    Remember when you could type in an address and not see 'Directory Listing Denied'?

  14. Re:Oh goody by slashfucker · · Score: 2, Informative

    The browser is another story. But Microsoft has had one of the industry's most forward approaches with respect to handicap accessibility since day 1.

    I'll give a recent example; in Windows XP, press Windows Key-U. Here we find Narrator, Magnifier, and On Screen Keyboard. Narrator is a very simple screen reader that is able to read dialogs and other alerts aloud. Magnifier is self-descriptive. On-screen keyboard has a fair amount of configurability. If you go to Settings>Typing Mode, it can actually be configured in a "scan and pick" mode much like the input method used by Stephen Hawking, so that a person with limited mobility can type using a single joystick button press, or any sort of "sip and puff" device connected to the gameport.

    These are just a few new features, in addition to the obvious ones listed in the Control Panel under Accessibility, and the general configurability of interface which allows people to customize in whatever way is necessary for their disability (change colors for Red-Green color perception issues, link sounds to events, etc)

    As far as the whole Standard-Compliance "Endian" battle goes, I would submit that if one looks further than IE 4 (which is only 5 years old, for chrissake) one would find that this is no longer an issue, but for anal-retentive knit-pickers. IE6 has a standards-compliant CSS2 rendering engine, which can be toggled by the HTML author by use of the DOCTYPE directive, as opposed to Nutscrape 6 which completely destroyed rendering of most web-pages by not remaining backwards-compatible.

    I would further submit that at present in the "browser market", there is NO single product which "has it all" (If you mention Opera, I have 3 letters for you - DOM). Everyone has a distinct subset of "feature nirvana", and the idea that Microsoft is culpably negligent for failing to hit the moving target of "Full W3C compliance" when nobody else can is just plain old flame-throwing.

  15. Re:Compulsory vs Voluntary, Public vs Private... by JimDabell · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I've been hearing about accessibility and other potentially imposing guidelines for quite some time, and I've always been curious: is there any plan to try to enforce the guidelines?

    There are many countries in which accessibility is a legal requirement for lots of organisations. For more information on these, please see WAI Policy.

    But speaking of the private individual, should you and I also be subject to enforcement of web guidelines even in our personal, private web space?

    I believe the most common point of view is that people who must cater to the needs of disabled people in the physical world must also do so on the WWW.

    For instance, McDonald's are legally obliged to provide bathrooms that are specially equipped for people with mobility problems, at least in the UK. However private homes aren't required to provide them. It seems reasonable to draw the line at the same place on the web - so individuals would not be required to follow WCAG (or similar), yet service providers would.

  16. Re:I think it is good. by JimDabell · · Score: 2, Informative

    But once this standard is in place, I see these interests groups going around and sueing everyone they can get their hands on.

    This is already happening.

  17. Re:Compulsory vs Voluntary, Public vs Private... by Tsu+Dho+Nimh · · Score: 2, Insightful
    "is there any plan to try to enforce the guidelines"

    Any site by an organization or company that serves the general public should comply. It's a no-brainer ... why would you deliberately create websites that only some of the visitors can use? How many potential customers do you want to turn away at the door, after spending a lot of effort to get them to the site with search engines and ads ... it might work for a trendy nightclub, but it's a suicidal tactic for a web-based business.

    I'f Timmy's Terrific Toe Jam Sculpture site doesn't want to comply, that's Timmy's right. However, Timmy will probably not get much traffic.