SCO Attorney Declares GPL Invalid
chrullrich writes "According to heise (German, fishbait), SCO's chief counsel Mark Heise (unrelated) of Boies, Schiller and Flexner has declared that the GPL violates the US copyright law and is thus null and void. SCO's legal position is actually a little too crazy to believe: The GPL allows unlimited copies, the copyright law allows one. Therefore, the GPL is invalid. Apparently, they try to argue that the copyright law, in giving consumers the right to make one backup of their software without any permission from the copyright holder, outlaws any contractual agreement that allows users to make more than one copy." There's an Inquirer article in English. Apparently SCO is now using the Chewbacca Defense. Other SCO news: SCO reports a profit, examining SCO's contributions to Linux, an attorney summarizes the case.
I thought part the GPL was the copyright holder giving permission for people to make copies, etc..
but that doesn't make it so. Anyway, if it is invalid, then Linus should file suit immediately regarding their unauthorized distribution.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
They're trying to say that if I create something (it doesn't have to be a software program, call it a book) that I can't allow other people to copy it? What baloney!
Speed Demos Archive - Lots of speed runs!
So shareware and freeware programs have been illegal all these years... thank you so much SCO, for clarifying this point. NOT!
Seriously, there is a post every 2 days about SCO.
Because authors and publishers make a contract?
The GPL is, in a sense, also a contract. It says, "We're giving these rights to you. You don't have to agree to our terms, but if you want the rights we give to you, you have to agree to our other terms." The GPL doesn't modify copyright laws, any more than a contract an author makes with a publishing house does.
Sheesh.
Read Bujold. Free (as in
This is just so ridiculous that the only thing that keeps the sanity is that *eventually* SCO shit will tumble down - may not be weeks, but definitely a few months to a couple of years.
SCO press releases make the (former) Iraqi Information Minister look "forthcomingly honest" and makes Faux news "fair and balanced". Heck, it makes Steve Ballmer look sedated.
S
Because Copyleft isn't a Law, it's just an idea. Copyright is a law.
However, that being said, Copyleft is BASED on Copyright. What they are saying is.. no matter what the license says, you can only make one copy. Of ANYTHING.
So the Book Publishers and Authors need to start suing the printing press companies, since they give them the "right" to make copies so they can sell them.
Actually SCO's reasons for why the GPL is invalid is actually what makes GPL legally strong. It grants rights (unlimited copying and changes) that are prohibited if the user does not accept the license. Therefore, if someone makes more than one copy, or modifies the source code the defacto accept the license (or they are breaking the law).
Galium Arsenide is the material of the future, and always will be.
It's all well and good that you're tired of SCO articles, but this one is *highly* important...Important enough, I think, that the editors could "override" your Caldera selection.
/. . The future of Free Software is contingent on the outcome of this allegation.
The GPL is being formally challenged in court. I fail to see how that *couldn't* be "News for Nerds" or "Stuff that Matters". This affects *everyone* here, and hundreds of millions of people that don't read
"Mod, mod, mod...and another troll bites the dust."
Sun doesn't mind because their revenue doesn't necessarily come from Solaris, it comes from servers and support contracts. Whether they slap Solaris on a box or Linux, won't matter as long as they are still the ones supplying the hardware with redundant power supplies, fiber channel disk arrays, etc. Short term, solaris may be a little more stable for a large scale enterprise. Long term, if linux fills the gap there, they just increase their profit margin by not having to maintain their own OS.
Come to think of it, SCO's source code agreements with everyone else (including Sun and MS) are probably invalid also. This is hilarious.
I am now waiting for SCO's explanation on how code in Linux can still be a secret in spite of the fact that tens of thousands of people regularly look at it. Next, we can learn how patent law does not permit Novell to retain Unix patents when relinguishing the source code and why SCO really does have the right to keep talking about its right to the 'Unix' IP (when it is supposed to have no such right because it does not even own the Unix trademark).
What do they care about SCO Unix? I doubt they care if they sell another copy. Right now, SCO is a zombie that only exists for two reasons: (1) Sue as many people as possible and hope they win something before they're locked up in prison or the loony-bin. (2) Live-testing designer drugs.
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
Copyright dictates that *only* those who have been permission to distribute a copyrighted work may do so (Note, *distribute*, not merely copy.... copyright law is actually quite relaxed on the allowance of copying for purposes of fair use).
The GPL outlines what terms a person must agree to in order to acquire permission from the copyright holder to distribute copies of the works.
Therefore, simple failure to abide by those terms while continuing to distribute such works is plain ordinary copyright infringement.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Any software that doesn't allow one copy also has an invalid license. Ergo by preventing me by license or DRM (digital restrictions managment) from making my one copy, the license is also invalid. Not that I'm rooting for the one copy thing to knock down the GPL, I'm just saying this is a two-edged sword that could also be used against draconian liceneses and DRM measures. Regardless, this bears watching. You can't argue that it works for more than one and than counter that you mean it can work for less than one.
ext2 is available in FreeBSD, under the BSD license. SCO and even MS can take it and do whatever they want.
-molo
Using your sig line to advertise for friends is lame.
It seems to me the GPL acts as a balancer against a changing legal climate - the more "IP" friendly and less "fair use" friendly that climate becomes, the stronger the GPL becomes.
Brilliant.
It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
If the obviously brain damaged shitheads at SCO wants to play like that, fine, let them. It can work to our advantage.
Since SCO claims the GPL is invalid and therefore SCO is not bound by it, then that works both ways. Authors of the software are not bound by it either. Therefore, everyone who has ever written a line of code that is used anywhere in GNU/Linux should now inform SCO that their rights to distribute the author's code has been withdrawn, royalties for any future distribution will be required, and royalties for past distribution are now due...just like SCO is wanting to do to IBM. If they want to play games, then dammit we can play games too. Batter up!
I want a new quote. One that won't spill. One that don't cost too much. Or come in a pill.
this argument as put forward by SCO's councel seems pretty damned thin. Anorexic. Thin-sliced deli meat.
No, it's not thin, it's transparent. Invisible. Non-existant. A fart in a sewer.
I'm wondering why everyone is posting in a manner that suggests they didn't even understand the argument?
Perhaps because they do understand the argument, and the conclusion it draws is so laughably stupid it's unbelieveable.
What SCO is claiming is that since the JPL is not a recognized framework under the law
Yes, and this is the part that falls under "laughably stupid" - no contract that hasn't been to court is a "recognized framework" - but that doesn't mean that every contract that hasn't been validated by a judge is invalid.
any contradiction between the two should result in what U.S. copyright law saying winning out.
And (again) this is NOT a logical conclusion - people give up their rights in contracts every day. The NDA that SCO wants people to sign to see the alleged infringing code forces people to give up their right to free speech - does this mean that the NDA is unenforcable? Of course not.
They then further say that since U.S. copyright law allows for only one backup copy, any provision stating otherwise in the JPL is null and void under U.S. copyright law.
And this is their second unbelievably bone-headed, colossaly stupid statement.. The US copyright law allows for one backup copy without the permission of the copyright holder (and this is not entirely correct.) Note that key phrase. The GPL is exactly what gives them that permission.
Those two points, when taken together, is their argument. And contrary to what so many seem to be saying, it is a logical conclusion to draw.
It's only logical if you decide to throw away the concept that people are free to enter into contracts as they see fit - which is ludicrous.
It has NO logic behind it. At all.
it does make sense on the surface
If you define "the surface" as "believe everything they say, without applying any kind of logic-check to it at all", then you may be correct. But as soon as you decide to engage your brain, you see that it's totally and completely without merit of any kind.
... will there be a massive shift to BSD-style licenses. I like the BSD license just fine, but I'd be concerned that if the GPL is ruled invalid, that the BSD license wouldn't be valid either.
... a clear restriction, albeit a benign one), but the net effect is to allow greater lattitude for people to copy the work than the default otherwise permitted under copyright law.
Good God, don't you people think before you type? Or, more to the point, have those who have moderator priveleges today been passing the crack pipe around a little more frequently than usual?
The argument being used in this incredibly weak attempt to overturn the GPL is that it violates copyright law because the creator of the work is offering terms more liberal than copyright's default restrictions.
Now, for those slow on the uptake, what does a Microsoft site license do? Yup, it grants (in exchange for money) a more liberal right to copy than that otherwise offered by copyright law.
And, for those even slower on the uptake, what does the BSD-style license do? Yup, you guessed it again. It offers a more liberal right to copy than that otherwise offered by copyright law, just like the GPL. The specific restrictions BSD-style licenses impose are different from those of the GPL (and don't think for a minute it doesn't impose restrictions, however benign. If it didn't impose restrictions, the work would be in the public domain. Instead, you are required to maintain the copyright notice
Which part of this progression escapes you? If in some perverse miscarriage of anything remotely resembling rule of law, much less justice, the GPL were to be ruled invalid on this basis, that would spell instant death by precident to not only the GPL, but BSD-Style licenses, Creative Commons style licenses, Artistic Licenses, and, yes, corporate site licenses of the variety Microsoft, Sun Microsystems, and just about every other software company on the planet eagerly offers their customers in exchange for cold, hard cash. For about three minutes, before an appeals court slaps a stay on the judgement, hears the case, and overturns the ruling.
Any other outcome would mean we could say goodbye to the software industry, the online content industry, and probably a whole slew of other industries we're not thinking of as well, upon which copyright law touches in one way or another. Not to mention saying goodbye to 220+ years of precident.
There is absolutely no chance this argument will hold up. It will be interesting to see if any lawyers are disbarred or fined for even bringing this argument to court.
IANAL, but I am a sapient being with a three digit IQ, which is all this level of insight really requires.
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
The GPL is the only OSS license I would ever release my work under. Why the hell should I let anyone profit off of my work without giving anything back. Especialy fuckheads like you?
I should be able to release my code how I want. If you don't like it, then don't fucking use it.
If the only choice was All rights reserved or public domain, then I would choose rights-reserved over PD any day.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
"SCO's reasons for why the GPL is invalid is actually what makes GPL legally strong"
Exactly. I think this is just a floater for Boies, etc., to see how well it will fly. My bet is that the common reaction of "That's insane" will lead them to look for another strategy. Remember, they demanded a trial-by-jury. If they can test drive legal theories in the press, and gauge reaction, then that just works to their advantage.
At that point, the infringing code will be written out and the problem goes away.
===== Murphy's Law is recursive. =====
I always thought of copyright and license to be two seperate things.. I can hold the copyright, but give you a license to distrubute it anyways you feel, thats the jist of GPL..
If they are saying that copyright only allows one copy, then there's many many companies that will have issue with this.. Think of software that allows 5 copies installed... Usually, they are called 5 user, yes you got it, licenses.. Not copyright..
Slashdot is like Playboy: I read it for the articles
If the GPL is invalid because it allows multiple redistributions, doesn't that make all of SCO's UNIX licenses invalid?
Or at least doesn't it indicate that there is no good faith on their part?
LedgerSMB: Open source Accounting/ERP
now i'm not a lawyer, don't pretend to be, but it would seem that this argument would also make things like shareware and freeware illegal as well not just open source, right? any software (or song or whatever) where the creator says, "make copies of this for your friends and give them away." would be illegal? so then this interpretation of copyright law has much broader implications than open source.
http://www.popularculturegaming.com -- my blog about the culture of videogame players
well, now... finally we are getting to the heart of the matter. This latest maneuver is what this case has been about from the beginning: an attempt to kill the entire free software movement. This goes straight back to the Microsoft Halloween Letters, with the goal of finding some means of stopping Linux.
In fact, Halloween II raised the idea of pursuing exactly this: the effect patents and copyright in combatting Linux. Given the insightful analysis of one of our own, there is pretty good evidence that Microsoft is playing the wizard behind the curtain. This is precisely the arena they wanted to test Linux in.
Forget site licenses. If SCO's logic were true, and it was not possible to grant someone permission to make copies, then you wouldn't be able to authorize a publisher to make copies of your work! So basically if you own a book by an author who retains the copyright to their book, then both you and the publisher are violating copyright law!
No... Wait... That's completely stupid, too. The whole reason we have copyright is so that the author can grant the right to copy to others, and request compensation in return. Unless we required all authors to self-publish, or transfer their copyright. Which I suppose SCO thinks is the case!
So is this Heise a moron, or does he think we all are? Does he actually not realize that copyright law prohibts only unauthorized copies, and that the GPL is a document which grants authorization? Or is he just hoping we won't realize that?
Either way: This is completely stupid.
The enemies of Democracy are
A pertinent quote:
Hmm Whats this in Websters Dictionary?
\Cop"y*right\, n. The right of an author or his assignee, under statute, to print and publish his literary or artistic work, exclusively of all other persons. This right may be had in maps, charts, engravings, plays, and musical compositions, as well as in books.
ok Now lets see License...
\Li"cense\ (l[imac]"sens), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Licensed (l[imac]"senst); p. pr. & vb. n. Licensing.] To permit or authorize by license; to give license to.
Hmm, and their paying this guy as a Attorney?
CLUE FOR SCO: THE GPL IS NOT A COPYRIGHT!! It is a license between the author of said works, and user of said works.
End Transmission....
I think we (as led by mass media) are missing the point of SCO's venture. SCO's senior management are actually quite smart and cunning, and are getting exactly the results that they want (even if it will cost them the company).
The court date for SCO vs. IBM has been set to sometime in 2005. In the mean time, they have a pretty nifty scheme involving an absurd pending lawsuit, even more absurd press releases to match, Slashdot readers (&al) to provide free publicity, and gullible potential CEOs that are only asking where to send the check (and how much to put on it). 'Course, they'll stifle the use of Linux in some environments too, but hey, those are environments that probably should not be using Linux in the first place.
To put it in simpler terms - the lawsuit has nothing to do with legal issues such as license violations, copyrights etc. It's a ridiculous case that they are bound to lose, and they know it.
They are only trying to boost the stock price of their dying company long enough that their insiders can unload some shares. Sort of a highly publicised pump'n'dump scheme, if you will.
We saw the evidence yesterday, when some execs dumped some stocks (at a price higher than, say, back in May...).
Too bad this scheme is probably a little bit to the side of what the SEC normally would prosecute.
-tor