GTA Creators Push Limits With Manhunt

Thanks to IGN PS2 for a new, screenshot-toting preview of Manhunt, the forthcoming "brutal urban videogame" produced by the developers of the Grand Theft Auto series. This previously secretive, potentially controversial title starts you, completely defenseless in Carcer City, where 'the Director' has sprung you from Death Row and "...populated [the city] with psychopathic gangs hired for the sole purpose of finding and slaughtering" the player. The piece muses that this "third-person perspective stealth game" seems to be "...much darker, more disturbing... than Grand Theft Auto, which offered seasoned comic humor and parody to counter the bloodshed and chaos."

Comments

Survival Horror...Made From PEOPLE

[Babbster]

This is a great idea for a game. While it's clear that the stealth elements are lifted from the many stealth-based games that have come out since Metal Gear Solid, the game sounds like it's shooting for more of a Resident Evil meets Escape From New York aesthetic - except that you're fighting the living instead of the undead and you probably don't have to rescue the president. Given the descriptions of how enemy detection is going to work (by hearing them), I'd imagine that there are going to be a lot of enemies standing still, sitting, etc. right around a blind corner. As long as the control isn't handled like Resident Evil (mush), this sounds like a game I could get into.

I will note that I certainly hope that they have enough system overhead left to provide real-time DTS sound (something the Playstation has to do in software, as opposed to the Dolby Digital 5.1 in hardware on the Xbox). They mention in the article that they haven't decided between Dolby (Pro Logic, I presume) and DTS, but it seems like a no-brainer if you've got the resources available - if you're going to have a game where sound has a lot of influence, being stuck with one matrixed back channel would be sad, especially since Rockstar did a pretty good job with the DTS in GTA:VC.

As far as controversy goes, that's just inevitable and I'm sure it will be welcomed by Rockstar/Take Two's marketing department since they can save money on advertising. While we've been killing humans in video games for years, the ever-increasing fidelity of said killing is going to continue drawing the ire of the "parents should be able to ignore their kids' hobbies" lobby, desipte the fact that every uproar ends up selling more games.

In short, I'm looking forward to finding out if Rockstar can redeem themselves in the controversial game arena (outside of the GTA series) after the debacle that was State of Emergency.

Re:Survival Horror...Made From PEOPLE

[irc.goatse.cx troll]

I dont know about revolutionary. Thats the basis behind multiplayer games currently -- In counterstrike, I hear your footsteps from the other side of a wall, so I shoot the wall and hit them before they even know where I am. Even back in the quakworld/tf days you'd hear your enemys from around corners and know what to expect (You hear a rocketlauncher, you know theres a soldier coming. Hear an assault cannon, know theres a hwguy.)

As far as AI targeting humans based on sound, PodBot for counterstrike does that currently, as does the halflife grunts I believe. Hell, Doom's monsters could activate based on sound.

It is a nice feature either way.

Re:man

[Anonymous Coward]

Did your parents take away your copy of the game or something? Because this seems like a heavily biased bunch of crap.

On a technical level the GTA3/Vice City games are absolute masterpieces. They excel at simulating full, living environments in 3D, with both detailed exteriors and interiors, and a large amount of vehicle and pedestrian traffic.

In terms of gameplay, the missions are laid out logically, and the addition of effectively simple cutscenes to move the plot along in between creates an smoother, more cohesive experience. There are multiple things to do aside from main quests, both which are time consuming and fun, such as finding all the bonus jumps in a car, uncovering tons of secret items and challenges, and the aforementioned free-roaming kill-fest.

These titles bring everything from the first two games in the series into 3D. The killing sprees and mission based plot progression were both in the first two, and were very entertaining. The addition of a fantastic engine, decent graphics and too many other beneficial aspects to mention (good soundtracks, interesting and funny characters, etc. etc.) is in no way making these two games the "worst gta games yet".

Obviously they are not for everyone. Obviously they are not for you. Go whine to another forum about how your import copy of the latest japanese dating sim didn't make it through customs, and lay off the titles you're obviously to immature to comment on.

Controversy...

[Gothic_Walrus]

It's already apparent that this, much like GTA3 and Mortal Kombat before it, is going to make overprotective parents and bored Congressmen wig out and try to ban video games as a whole. Just remeber: the rating system is there for a reason. A lot of people I know could care less about the ratings, but games like this aren't meant for seven year olds. If people ignore the ratings and buy the game for their kid themselves (as most parents would have to do, considering its rating), they can only get mad at themselves for being irresponsible and not checking the game out prior to purchasing it. In any case, the bottom line should be:

You should be monitoring what your kid does in their free time. If you're offended by the game, don't buy it for your kid. It's that simple.

Re:Controversy...

[clambake]

You should be monitoring what your kid does in their free time.

Spoken like somebody who doesn't have kids.

Likewise, spoken by someone who SHOULDN'T have kids.

Re:Controversy...

[gumpish]

Just remeber: ...the rating system is there for a reason.

Not to mention the name of the game.

Manhunt.

Not to be confused with "Fluffy Bunny in Magical Kingdom" or "Mario Party 8".

Parents who buy their kid Manhunt and then complain about the content should be bitchslapped.

Re:Controversy...

[Lord_Dweomer]

"You should be monitoring what your kid does in their free time. If you're offended by the game, don't buy it for your kid. It's that simple."

Just out of curiosity, what do you consider then to be an appropriate age for a kid to make their own decision about what games they buy? Because not all parents buy games for their kids, many kids buy them for themselves. And you can't always control your kid, particularly in the latter half of their teens.

One man's trash is another's Sunday afternoon

[Chartreuse_Zergling]

I'm going to take the bait and ask what "is" wrong with that, from an ethical standpoint? I think killing is killing whether done for duty, profit, or fun. Killing is bad. Simulated killing, however, lacks the real-life consquences of suffering and death. What's the difference between playing as a gangster in a crime sim or a playing a soldier fighting a "justified" war, i.e. Desert Combat? The virtual motive?

Granted, I'm not saying that a serial killer sim would be fun, in reality serial killers tend to be pyschopaths and focus on weaker victims. And there are already games that allow behavior similar to a serial killer, like Postal2 and GTA3. However, acting uber-violent in these games doesn't add to the gameplay or help you complete the game, aside from maybe gaining extra points.

There maybe existential ramifications in guiding a make-believe character in a make-believe world, but you do the same thing as a spectator when you read a novel or watch TV.

Games don't help people become better axe-murderers. They already were.

Linearity concerns me

[robson]

What made GTA3 & GTAVC great were their open environments wedded with non-linear game-play. Everything I've read about Manhunt suggests it's far more linear, leading me to believe that Rockstar North may not have learned from its successes. :(

Rockstar v. Miyamoto

[superultra]

I hope that the games.slashdot crew is well versed enough that I don't have to go and link to a gazillione interviews with Miyamoto on why GTA3 and its kin aren't great for the industry. Manhunt only proves that violence without purpose in games is only escalatory. So Manhunt sells billions of copies. What subject content does Rockstar tackle next? There's not much left beyond the prison brutality espouged in Manhunt's (now defunct) promo website.

Meanwhile, in the other corner, we have Miyamoto who's busy making the Amelie-inspired Pikmin 2 and a revamp of Pac-Man. I think this represents the beginnings of a rift in the gaming industry. Rockstar and everyone trying to copy them on one side, and luminaries like Miyamoto, Spector, Wright, etc on the other side; essentially, people who see purpose-less violence as self-defeating.

Here's the paradox: if GTA3 and Manhunt are "art" as nearly every video game enthusiast espouses, then it does - as art is prone to doing - affect the way we think. If that's the case, then why not examine it? I am by no means suggesting that games like Manhunt should be legislated, but I think it's extremely naive of gamers to assume that GTA/Manhunt does not change our social consciousness. Shouldn't we then be concerned about its effect, be it good or bad?

Every Manhunt/GTA-esque game casts a vast shadow on the game industry that obscures gems like Pikmin or Viewtiful Joe or Animal Crossing. Those are the games that should be on the forefront of the industry, not GTA or Manhunt. "Everything is permissible, but not everything is beneficial." Merely because we can makes games like Manhunt doesn't mean we should.

Re:Rockstar v. Miyamoto

[BenSnyder]

Essentially you're right. I read the IGN article about Manhunt and thought two things: first, you'd have to be a psychopath to feel like you could derive true pleasure from playing the game and two, I bet it's fscking brilliant. But let's be honest. This game is for people who have parties to watch "Faces of Death". I'm sure that it's of the highest quality though, I mean, once you buy into the whole death-with-glee thing.

However, I'm actually cool with a game like this out in the public arena. Violent warlike games do for game technology what porn has done for video technology. It's pushes the limits. And this is a good thing because it breeds things like the mod scenes for Half-Life and UT2003 among others. And I know there are people at universities right now who are working on mods of UT2003 to bring new gameplay types to the table for educationally minded purposes.

It's not that far removed from how WWII advanced aviation. We wouldn't air travel available to us in its form today had it not been for technological advances made during war time. Similarly, we won't have the diverse range of gaming options available to us in the future without growing technology through what is essentially simulated war.

I'm not arguing against you, I'm just pointing out the silver lining in the blood-drenched clouds.

Re:Rockstar v. Miyamoto

[superultra]

Your post is what I'm talking about. It's as naive as "the media" to merely accept GTA and Manhunt at face value as being not wrong as it is to accept it at face value as being wrong. "The media," or more apt general society overall, refuses to look beyond the surface at video games for their true potential.

Meanwhile though, 99% of all gamers are so ignorantly defensive of games like GTA and Manhunt, throwing around words like free speech and the like, that they refuse to examine the potential effects of those games on general overall society.

I suggest there's a middle ground. There is a place and room for games like GTA3, but to merely say that they don't affect the way we think or view the world is just plain ignorant. If it is an art form, as you suggest, then it also has the potential to change the way people think. Shouldn't we then also be concerned if there is an 8 year old playing Manhunt? Yes, yes, the parents. So if the parents don't feed their children, or they neglect their children, to whom does the responsiblity fall? General society. Likewise, if a parent doesn't give a damn that their 10 year old kid is playing a game with prison rape and sexual brutality, shouldn't the rest of us care?

What can we do, as a society, to prevent that kind of thing from happening? I worked in an EB, and 4 out of 5 parents didn't give a damn what their 6-16 year old kid played. You can't tell me that thousands of 10 year old children playing games like Manhunt and GTA3/VC won't have a general effect on society. If you can tell me that, then this isn't art. It's mere shallow entertainment, and in that case who cares about a stupid little game is legislated?

I can hear it in your head; you're already coming up with those brisk gamer arguments against censorship etc etc. What I expect of the game industry and enthusiasts is to start thinking - not even doing anything, just thinking - about the effect that their creations have on people and society in general.

MANHUNT PREVIEW IN GTA!!!

[AlexMax2742]

1. Start up your PS2/PC with GTA3/GTA:VC
2. Find the cheat codes for you resepective ssystem that enables 'Pedestrians have weapons', 'Pedestrians riot' and 'Pedestrians hate you'
3. Enter cheat codes
4. ???
5. Profit

There you go. And you didn't even have to wait for an official demo/release.

Re:this really sounds like a dumb idea.

[Babbster]

Sure, and Nintendo should stick to Mario sequels, Sega should only put out Sonic games and Konami should never release a game without "Metal Gear" in the title.

It's always amazing to me that with all the calls for fewer sequels and more original games, there are people out there actually clamoring for developers to do the same thing over and over and over again.

Re:Might be a good game...

[GrimSean]

Well, speaking as a guy who sells games to said parents, I think you'd be surprised how many of them just don't seem to give a crap. I've had parents buy GTA 3 (both original and Vice City) for their under ten children. I tell them "Sir/Ma'am, this game isn't suitable for a young child - it has depictions of violence and adult situations" to which I get the reply "It's a video game - how bad can it be?". The strange thing is I've yet to get a returned game on the grounds that it is too violent, which leads me to believe these kids either aren't being supervised, or the parents just don't care.

It's kind of sad in a way, but what can I do? If I don't sell the games, the store goes out of business and I don't earn money.

I'm also going to assume that someone is going to bring up the ESRB rating system. Parents don't notice that (I'm serious). I've been asked why games aren't rated with the same system as movies (an idea which appeals to me), and "What does this 'M' mean?" - the system doesn't seem to be intuitive enough for people to understand at a glance (reinforcing my belief that most people are mostly stupid).