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New Nano-ITX 12cm Motherboards

Posted by michael on from the cute-and-cuddly dept.

Kris_J writes "mini-itx.com have exclusive pictures of VIA's new 12cm x 12cm motherboard standard they're terming 'Nano-ITX'. VIA have removed the legacy ports, moved to mini-PCI and SODIMMs and now a new batch of custom PC projects can be produced where previously there wasn't quite enough room for the motherboard. I already have an idea..."

63 of 439 comments (clear)

  1. Government doing the right thing for once... by Bame+Flait · · Score: 5, Funny

    VIA have removed the legacy ports, moved to mini-PCI and SODIMMs

    Good thing Sodimmy is no longer illegal.

  2. Photos? Don't bother. by zedmelon · · Score: 5, Informative

    The idea is pretty interesting. I can only hope that it turns out better than this article suggests.

    The pics are arranged in a three by three grid, but don't bother. Pics one and two are decent, three is okay, and nine is passable, but the rest are so blurry that once you've heard the board is 120 mm square, they're nothing you can't get from just viewing the thumbnails.

    :\

    --
    Mom says my .sig can beat up your .sig.
  3. Ah-ha! by tds67 · · Score: 5, Funny
    VIA have removed the legacy ports, moved to mini-PCI and SODIMMs...

    So that's where Sodimm Hussein has been hiding! It's now the mother of all boards!

  4. Bring back the serial port! by grub · · Score: 4, Insightful


    VIA have removed the legacy ports

    I wish these companies would leave just a single RS-232 or RS-422 port. Sometimes you need a simple serial connection to connect through if the network is down. The lack of serial also limits the use for these boards for controlling other pieces of hardware if embedding is your thing.

    Maybe an online petition to bring back the RS-232 is in order :)

    --
    Trolling is a art,
    1. Re:Bring back the serial port! by a_ghostwheel · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That is why you have mini-PCI there - just install appropriate card.

    2. Re:Bring back the serial port! by grub · · Score: 4, Insightful


      Just get a USB->RS232 cable.

      That's another layer of complexity. It may work fine for Rube Goldberg but the less things to break, the better.

      --
      Trolling is a art,
    3. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Milican · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I agree, expecially on the embedded side. Also, a USB to RS232 adapter would not work because 90% of the time you need more than just transmit and receive. The control lines for serial are just as important if not more so. Perhaps just a header (just nine pins) not the full blown connector would work. Oh well, on the PC side RS232 has pretty much gone the way of the dinosaurs. I suspect in another decade the embedded world will have done so as well.

      JOhn

      --
      Campaign for Liberty
    4. Re:Bring back the serial port! by capsteve · · Score: 5, Informative

      use a keyspan usb-to-serial adapter.
      that's what mac users have been doing for years...

      --
      three can keep a secret, if two are dead - benjamin franklin
    5. Re:Bring back the serial port! by drsmithy · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Of course, an old computer will most likely have a serial port. This will however change in the future when the computers released 'today' without ports(a network card though, there's still hope...) become old, and people want to leech the data stored on them. Or maybe rebuild them or whatever.

      By the time serial ports or -serial converters really are rare, the market who actually use such devices will be even more of a niche than it is now - and the people in it will have been intelligent enough to have preserved appropriate methods of accessing their archaic peripherals.

    6. Re:Bring back the serial port! by semanticgap · · Score: 2

      Size is not the problem - look at Cisco devices, a lot of them now have RJ45 as the serial connector.

      I agree, a serial port is needed - I'd like to run UNIX on one of those things, and I'd like a serial console. In fact, if they had a board that had no video and just serial, that'd be grand, I'd buy one.

      --
      grisha.org
    7. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Zathrus · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Maybe an online petition to bring back the RS-232 is in order :)

      I know this was tongue in cheek, but please... RS-232 hasn't disappeared in any way, shape, or form. Virtually every PC motherboard out there still has at least one (and usually two) serial ports. About the only ones that don't are the Abit MAX series (which has removed all legacy ports), this one, and some miniITX form factor boards.

      If you need a real serial port, then just avoid buying one of the 1% of boards that doesn't have one.

      Every time a story is posted to /. about a board that doesn't have serial the RS-232 freaks crawl out of the woodwork. If you're smart enough to know all the uses for RS-232, then you should damn well be smart enough to buy the right board.

      Oh, and I like serial too... my remote control is programmed via it (although it works fine w/ a USB->serial dongle if needed).

    8. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Demodian · · Score: 2, Interesting

      One thing most people do not consider in removing direct "legacy devices" from the motherboards is that USB->RS232 adds an extra programming layer for embedded applications that would have a much easier time dealing with directly with the normal RS232 logic. Granted, DOS is a thing of ancient history, but it was easy to code communications for. Using USB drivers blows chunks if the driver for the USB->RS232 is written poorly (which I've found to be the case with some of the off-the-shelf adapters).

    9. Re:Bring back the serial port! by ikkonoishi · · Score: 4, Funny

      The fun part comes when the only way to get data off a computer is to hook a serial port up to a usb adapter up to a firewire adapter up to a cyber-link to your brain up to the vast alien mind net in order to play pong with our new alien over lords in the year 30001!

      Now that is the ultimate hack.

    10. Re:Bring back the serial port! by tds67 · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Maybe an online petition to bring back the RS-232 is in order :)

      Yes, and the same goes for the 1.44Mb floppy drive. Dell is trying to obsolete it, and Ford Motor Company went along with it and bought PCs from Dell without floppy drives.

      Why do PC and PC part manufacturers keep pushing for changes that should in fact be demand (or lack thereof) driven?

    11. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Merlin42 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Look at the pics at:
      http://epia-center.de/modules.php?name=News&file=a rticle&sid=202
      In particular the first pics shows two connectors next to the vertically mounted battery. They don't seem to be mentioned in any of the specs so I am going to guess they are for connecting an RS-232 or possibly also a parallel port.

      --
      Thoughts on tech, Software Engineering, and stuff
    12. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Eccles · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The problem is that sure, it saves space on the board, but it takes up more space overall.

      If, and only if, you need an RS-232 connector. I haven't used one in nigh-on 10 years, and I bet that 98%+ or more of the computing world hasn't used one in a long time either. You have specialized needs, don't blame the rest of the world for not wanting to pay for something they don't use just to save you a couple of cables. Heck, this thing doesn't even include the keyboard and mouse connectors still on most PCs sold.

      Now what you could call for is a teeny connector (say, the size of the plugs digital cameras have) to which a break-out box with an RS-232 connection can be added, which allows you to skip the USB conversion, boot from it, yadda yadda.

      --
      Ooh, a sarcasm detector. Oh, that's a real useful invention.
    13. Re:Bring back the serial port! by trippinonbsd · · Score: 2

      They should at least have the serial header on the board so you can have a serial backplate if you wish.

    14. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Chanc_Gorkon · · Score: 2, Interesting

      While this is true, in this case, if you REALLY need a Serial Port, I am sure a Mini-PCI expansion port has been or will be developed. The arguement for on board Serial Ports is getting really small. Also, don't even think of using these MB's in a server. You buy SERVER Mb's for this and they usuall DO have a serial port. There's also a new protocol coming out soon which will let you serially connect devices with out need for device drivers. It's based on USB and for the life of me I canot figure out why

      --

      Gorkman

    15. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Zathrus · · Score: 3, Informative

      hey just don't come with serial anymore, which makes remote maintenance of headless machines something you'll only be doing with your trusty legacy notebook...

      Or with a USB->serial dongle, which are pretty much universal now and bug free.

      If you're trying to do magic with the serial port (e.g. - trying to raise specific lines in order to talk to some esoteric device -- been there, done that) then it may not work, but if you're using standard interfaces then they work just fine. Really. They've improved the hardware and drivers since they first appeared and a lot of the issues with the first generation stuff is gone now.

      It's a bunch of hardware that very few use, and slashing costs and razor-thin margins dictate that un-needed components will eventually be eliminated.

      Eventually, but I'd be surprised if that was widespread in less than 5 years. Quite a few people use the hardware, actually. There's a freaking ton of keyboards and mice out there that use PS/2 ports, legions of switches and UPS's that rely on serial, and a few bazillion printers that use the parallel port. Hell, there are still printers available that only do parallel.

      The Abit MAX series hasn't been the runaway favorite that Abit was hoping for. In fact, much of the community it targets - the high end case modders/gamers/geeks shun it because of the lack of older interfaces. After all, it costs nothing extra to get a different board that has just as many IDE controllers, USB ports, firewire, etc. and still has the legacy stuff on board. So why castrate yourself?

      The BTX form factor still shows the legacy connectors present in the sample motherboard, and so they're likely to continue for at least one more generation of MBs/cases. I'd bet they'll be in the successor as well.

    16. Re:Bring back the serial port! by ninewands · · Score: 2, Informative
      Quoth the poster:
      The arguement for on board Serial Ports is getting really small.

      You obviously have never had to use a PC as a serial console for a headless server.
      --
      utter rubbish
    17. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Directrix1 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Are you talking about a computer or your sex life?

      --
      Occam's razor is the blind faith in the natural selection of least resistance and in universal oversimplification. -- EF
    18. Re:Bring back the serial port! by Demodian · · Score: 2, Interesting

      This *assumes* there is something automatic about the serial port support over USB in the BIOS that hides this layer. Otherwise, you have to rely upon code to talk to the USB interface. Again, the issue would be "embedded" designs, and not something that you rely on a device driver or API to use.

  5. Re:Specs... by sl0ppy · · Score: 3, Informative

    From the Website:

    The secret of Nano-ITX is the Nano-BGA (Ball Grid Array) package, which has allowed VIA to squeeze a 1Ghz C3 CPU into just 15mm square

  6. Wonderful! by Doesn't_Comment_Code · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I can't say how many times I've wanted to make a small, embedded controller system, but couldn't do it. Most projects need the ability of pc, but can't handle the space requirements for a desktop sized box. These little babies aught to make my life much more fun, and possibly fully automated.

    --

    Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
    1. Re:Wonderful! by Doesn't_Comment_Code · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Oh yes, one more thing I forgot to write...

      I wonder what kind of power supplies they will release to drive these. I assume a standard power supply will work... but it seems wrong. The power would take up more space the entire workings of the computer. Anyway, for my embedded projects, I really hope they follow with some tiny power supplies.

      --

      Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
    2. Re:Wonderful! by Trigun · · Score: 3, Informative

      There are solid state external power supplies, (usually 55 watt) for sale, and many low-profile cases ship with these as well. You can even buy ones that will run off of a car cigarette lighter. It's only 5 and 12 volts to run everything you need.

  7. Re:Specs... by mopslik · · Score: 4, Informative

    I guess we would see the 800Mhz and 1 GHz Via C3 chips to start

    While not the full specs, the screenshot page says...

    The secret of Nano-ITX is the Nano-BGA (Ball Grid Array) package, which has allowed VIA to squeeze a 1Ghz C3 CPU into just 15mm square.

    So, yep.

  8. So please please can we have.. by adeyadey · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Genuine cheap DIY clone portables/laptops with interchangable parts - if a component fails, you dont have pay the earth to replace it? Anyone have good links/experience on that? :-)

    --
    "You lied to me! There is a Swansea!"
    1. Re:So please please can we have.. by stratjakt · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This isn't offtopic you dopes.

      These things, afaik, can run on DC power - so running off batteries shouldn't be out of the question. They'll certainly fit in a laptop sized case. SODIMMS, laptop HDDs, half-height CDroms and stuff can be had.

      As I see it, what keeps the DIY laptop scene from existing is the LCD video interface - there's just no real standard way to do it. Won't someone start mass producing laptop shells, complete with LCDs, inverters, and interface board?

      I wonder what the Dells of the world would do if people could cobble together their own laptops. I read somewhere that portables are fast becoming the biggest chunk of the box brands profits.

      --
      I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
    2. Re:So please please can we have.. by riedquat · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The mini-ITX still needs a normal ATX power supply (+/- 5V, +/- 12V) - generally you will get a solid state power supply that takes 12V as an input which takes up a bit more space.

      I can't even see the power connector on the nano-ITX - if that runs straight off 12V that's great.

  9. Drive bay mounting? by Max+Romantschuk · · Score: 4, Interesting

    12 by 12 centimeters (120 millimeters) is the same size as a CD... I wonder if one could squeeze one of these machines into one or two drivebays... I could definetly use a nice little dev box inside my regular box!

    --
    .: Max Romantschuk :: http://max.romantschuk.fi/
    1. Re:Drive bay mounting? by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 2, Funny

      12 by 12 centimeters (120 millimeters) is the same size as a CD... I wonder if one could squeeze one of these machines into one or two drivebays

      File the corners and punch a hole in the middle : you won't even have to replace the original CDROM drive to fit in inside your PC.

      --
      "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    2. Re:Drive bay mounting? by DragonWyatt · · Score: 4, Informative

      here ya go:

      TerraSoft's briQ

      Been around for a long time, based on powerpc (350 or 800mhz G3, or 500mhz G4), 168pin DIMMs, VFD display included, and runs linux to boot!

      --
      Don't sweat the petty things. But do pet the sweaty things.
  10. Woohoo! by CausticWindow · · Score: 5, Funny

    Now I can make that ammo canister pc come true. I could even make Linux run on my MP5!.

    Or what about using a US marines trooper helmet as a webserver! Or maybe I can equip a clip with a fileserver.

    W00t. My Death/Linux dreams have finally come true.

    --
    How small a thought it takes to fill a whole life
    1. Re:Woohoo! by LookSharp · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Roll your own notebooks!

      Where is the power circuitry? To run from/charge a battery?

      The controller to run a native LCD?

      Be sure to include some room for converters to step down the big IDE down to notebook harddrives and optical drives.

      Oh and that "1 GHz C3?" It has roughly the computational power of a Celeron 600.

      Feel free to invest $1200 in making one of these into a notebook with an LCD, but I'd just assume spend $1000 on a Dell 2GHz and plenty more expansion and connectivity options.

  11. Woohoo! by Flabby+Boohoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Roll your own notebooks!

  12. more info by klocwerk · · Score: 4, Informative

    Mini-itx was 17x17 centimeters, this is 12x12, so 5cm (or about 2 inches) smaller than a mini-itx.

    The RAM slot looks like it takes laptop ram, not stadard desktop DIMMs.
    The cpu is a 1Ghz C3 processor, hardwired in (no upgrading that once purchased).
    3 sound jacks, ethernet (mini-itx vias are 10/100, i assume this is), 2 USB, video out, PS2 keyboard jack, and a TV output. mouse would have to be via USB.

    I love my mini-itx server, which is completely silent running, this thing is even tinier, but with a 1ghz cpu i'll be interested to see if they can make a fanless model. the 1ghz mini-itx boards don't passively cool without gluing on a Zalman flower heatsink.

    [/itx-geek]

    --

    "You worthless post!"
    -Shakespeare, 2 Gentlemen of Verona, 1. 1. 147
    1. Re:more info by grub · · Score: 3, Informative


      Mini-itx was 17x17 centimeters, this is 12x12, so 5cm (or about 2 inches) smaller than a mini-itx.

      You're looking at it wrong: Mini-ITX 17^2 = 289 cm^2, this board 12^2 = 144 cm^2. It's just less than half the size, quite a feat.

      --
      Trolling is a art,
    2. Re:more info by NFN_NLN · · Score: 2, Funny

      the 1ghz mini-itx boards don't passively cool without gluing on a Zalman flower heatsink

      Does this mean the heat sink will take up more volume than the actual motherboard?

    3. Re:more info by FlexAgain · · Score: 2, Informative

      ...<snip>...), 2 USB, video out, PS2 keyboard jack, and a TV output. mouse would have to be via USB.

      Actually, it looks like the connector that you think is a PS2 keyboard port is actually an S-Video connector (vs composite video from the Phono above).

      So, you'ld probably need a USB Keyboard as well.

      --
      Actually it is rocket science...
  13. Mirror here! by bazik · · Score: 5, Informative

    Mirror!

    --


    --
    One by one the penguins steal my sanity...
  14. Size by Txurlo · · Score: 5, Informative

    Actually, that's exactly the size of a CD jewel case.

    Pretty nifty, huh?

    --
    Txurlo
  15. Re:Call the office for fair trading! by Doesn't_Comment_Code · · Score: 4, Funny

    1 centimeter = 1x10^-2m, 1 nanometer = 1x10^-9m.

    FALSE ADVERTISING.


    But they never specified their units. They only used the prefix nano. But they never said nano-whats. Their unit of distance could be root acres, or astronomical units, or in this case, the unit of measurement is 12cm*10^9

    Heh heh, the devil is in the details my friend.

    --

    Slashdot Syndrome: the sudden, extreme urge to correct someone in order to validate one's self.
  16. Better pictures here by EriktheGreen · · Score: 5, Informative
    Better pics of a nano-itx board from VIA

    Google - it's not just for breakfast any more.

    Erik

  17. More more info - Re:more info by bazik · · Score: 5, Informative


    According to this page, the shown Nano-ITX board got the following details:

    - VIA CN400 Chipsatz (FSB 200 Support)
    - 1 GHz VIA C3
    - VIA VT8237 Southbridge (support for S-ATA)
    - Mini-PCI on the back (maybe for WLAN)
    - 1x SODIMM RAM Slot
    - 1x S-ATA (one Channel)
    - 2x IDE (ATA 133)
    - TV-Out
    - 6-Channel Sound
    - DOC (disk-on-chip)
    - Size: 12x12 cm
    - CPU-Size: 15x15 mm

    --


    --
    One by one the penguins steal my sanity...
  18. Dang it... by QwkHyenA · · Score: 3, Informative
    mini-PCI and SODIMMs would be sweet! Had I only known I'da waited. Instead I bought from Axion Tech the CL series VIA EPIA Mini-itx mobo. This little jewel has dual LANs & 4 serials! Read it! FOUR serials!

    That's room for console access, small serial LCD & serial GPS unit. Hmmm..That's one extra serial slot! w00T. BTW, Axion is cheaper than Idot.

    --
    LFS. Have you built your system today?
  19. Re:12cm^2 by temojen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    12cm * 12cm == 144cm^2

  20. Slashdotted... by jargoone · · Score: 5, Funny

    I got a connection refused when trying to connect. Here's an ASCII-art mirror of the motherboard:


    []

    Man, that's small!

  21. Re:12cm^2 by dbavirt · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Who modded the parent insightful?! Can I get modded up for quoting numbers from my calculator? 2 + 2 = 4 7 * 8 = 56

  22. Re:VIA eh by Tisephone · · Score: 2, Funny

    Yeah! Everyone knows a CPU's quality is directly proportional to the amount of heat it dissipates. And you can't even soft-boil an egg on a C3, let alone fry one... what a piece of junk.

    Can't wait for the Prescott!

    --
    "Neque enim lex est aequior ulla, quam necis artifices arte perire sua."
  23. Re:No SATA??? by sxpert · · Score: 2, Informative

    RTFA you idiot, what do you think the small blue connector here is ?

  24. Worst legacy PC item is still there. by Cheetahfeathers · · Score: 5, Insightful

    They haven't removed the worst offender of the old legacy PC, however. The BIOS is still there. PCs need to ditch BIOS and go with something decent like openboot. Also, console on an out of band management line needs to be stardand, so you can administer things remotely or when the network is down.

    It doesn't need to be legacy serial, though that's what everything else uses. Put it on USB for all I care. Just make sure I can get to the system outside the network, and boot/reset/configure it from there.

  25. Ask Slashdot: cases? by TClevenger · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Interested in making a set-top box for the living room using a Mini-ITX board. I've done some searching, but most of the cases are rather, well, PCish. What's your favorite ITX enclosure? Looking for quiet (or no) fan, something not so PC-looking, external power supply fine.

    Thanks.

  26. Wrong font size by bluGill · · Score: 4, Funny

    Nice ascii art, but the font size is wrong leading me to get a wrong impression of the size. However it is easy to convert. There are by definition 2.54 cm to an inch, so the 12cm board = 4.72 inches - lets round that to the nearest quarter = 4.75. By definition there are 72 point to the inch, so you need to adjust your browser to a 342 point font. Note that I'm assume that your monitor properly scales fonts to actual size, odds are it does not (generally only macs try, and not all of them get it right), but that is implimentation specific.

    I rounded the inches measurement up a little because in most fonts [] does not take up all the pixels it could, and thus isn't exact size. I'm hoping this adjustment brings us to a better average. (likely width still a little small, hight a little big)

  27. The portables revolution... by CommieLib · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think that what this kind of stuff is leading to is a lot of really clever things being done with portables. The AutoPC failed, for example, but unleash thousands of hackers who will try a thousand different ways of making it useful for themselves, and something useful will come out of it. Maybe even a business model.

    With something this small, I'd be tempted to wire together thermometers, maybe a cheapo sonograph (is there such a thing?), and whatever else I could fit into a small box and build My Very First Tricorder.

    --
    If your bitterest enemies are people who hack the heads off civilians, then I would say you're doing something right.
  28. Not so good! by FrostedWheat · · Score: 4, Funny

    You might loose your computer down the back of the sofa!

  29. The BEST line from the article: by Asprin · · Score: 2, Funny


    The BEST line from the article:

    "Click on a picture to enlarge it - probably beyond life size..."

    --
    "Lawyers are for sucks."
    - Doug McKenzie
  30. Re:Ask Slashdot: cases? by LookSharp · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Is this for PVR and/or DivX/XviD playback?

    If so, I recommend an Asus Pundit small form-factor system. Mine has a nice TV tuner ($50), and a Celeron 2.0GHz which ran me all of $67. It has a very nice case, runs quiet, sits well with your entertainment center, and is about three times the CPU power of the C3 1GHz. The way I look at it, this barebones plus a $70 processor is still less expensive than a $100 Mini-ITX case with a $179 1GHz EPIA board. The form factor on the Asus is proprietary, but exceptionally flexible, functional, and not much larger than mini-ITX. I've been very happy with mine!

  31. Re:Tiny MB With Multiple Ethernet Ports? by The+Other+White+Meat · · Score: 2, Informative

    This board has two USB 2.0 connectors.

    Buy a LinkSys/D-Link/etc. USB ethernet adapter, and you are set to go. They are supported in Windows AND Linux.

    --

    --- Generation X: The first generation to have SIG lines inferior to their parents... ---
  32. Re:Tiny MB With Multiple Ethernet Ports? by RedDirt · · Score: 2, Informative

    This company makes several models targetted at routers/firewalls: Soekris Engineering

    --
    James
  33. Re:Tiny MB With Multiple Ethernet Ports? by CyberKnet · · Score: 2, Informative

    Via does. It's the EPIA-CL. When the mini-itx link comes back online, scroll down the page and you'll find it.

    --
    Video meliora proboque deteriora sequor - Ovidius
  34. dude, imagine hot-swap servers by donkiemaster · · Score: 2, Interesting

    where you have a beowulf or other cluster and you just jam a bunch of these babies into a big raid array like box and then when one breaks you just pull it out and replace it with another and you don't miss a beat! hey you geniuses, someone get on this.

  35. correction by GunFodder · · Score: 2, Funny

    SPDIF can be transmitted optically over Toslink fiber optic cable or electrically over RCA coaxial cable. Real professionals prefer AES/EBU transmitted over balanced XLR cables.