Bluetooth for Homebrew Robots?

MacGod asks: "As an extra-curricular for my university, I am working some other engineers to try and design a RoboSoccer Project (please don't wipe out our server if possible), with the hopes of entering the RoboCup tournament in the near future. We are currently using some low-frequency Abacom RF communication modules, but would like to able to go to BlueTooth if possible. However, I have found it nearly impossible to locate any suitable BlueTooth modules. We'd really like something that could be put onto a breadboard, and that would come with sufficiently detailed instructions that we'd be able to implement it without being BlueTooth experts. Any suggestion on homebrew BlueTooth solutions, Slashdot?"

Comments

Bluetooth modules for use with mobile robots

[CaptainDrewle]

Bluetooth modules for use with mobile robots

Re:Bluetooth modules for use with mobile robots

[MacGoddess]

Have you seen this thing? Its board mountable. Most likely requires real hacker skillz.

http://www.circuitcellar.com/PSOC2002/winners/h9 .h tm

I can email you offlist, with my bluetooth links and research if you are interested. My buds and I are building a robotic society for our grad thesis. BT is high on our list of prefs for comm. between the robots.

usenet

[RobertTaylor]

comp.robotics.misc has a few useful posts.

this post's author could be someone to ask?

Try froogle next time...

[loucura!]

Google's froogle feature is pretty cool, I found board-mountable bluetooth modules in less than 10 seconds (I had to resort by price).

Here's a Site that sells the modules.

Bluetooth lego robot

[code_echelon]

Here an interesting project that uses Bluetooth. Lego Robot.
Also here is a good overview of Bluetooth. Overview.

why bluetooth?

[duber007]

If you're having trouble finding something to use, maybe it's not the way to go......like other posts state, the range and BW are limited.....I'm using a nice little device from Honeywell - ROC09352XMS which is a radio-on-a-chip device for my thesis... All you need is a microcontroller with an SCI interface (i.e. just about any PIC or 68HC11 device, which most people have some knowledge of), a power supply and an antennae - everything else is self contained - and it can range from 300-900Mhz, up to 19.2kBps.....at $26US a piece, not very expensive either.....

Re:why bluetooth?

[nuntius]

Here's the data sheets.

Bluetooth Modules

[c_oflynn]

Hello,

There do exsist small bluetooth modules, but not for what you want really. Bluetooth is fairly complex, and for small robots you'd be far better off designing your own protocol. And its more fun that way ;-)

But if you are dying for bluetooth, Google is your friend:

http://www.national.com/appinfo/wireless/LMX9820 .h tml

http://www.wirelessfutures.co.uk/products/prod_p ro _wlsc.html

I think there are others out there - I've heard of them before.

Cornell Big Red

[vectra14]

we, believe it or not, tried bluetooth for our vision->robot communication. my advice: try something simpler to just get your basic system running.

for example, we used Radiometrix RPC's for 4 straight years.. they are really limited but everyone uses them because their problems are well known in the league. all i can say is, good luck .. and drop us (site) an email if you have specific problems..

-sergei (cornell robocup 2003,2004)

(sigh... /me watches this comment be ignored.)

CSR and Siemens

[foog]

I'm doing some work with Bluetooth, using the CSR modules, "Casira" programmer, and the Bluecore programming tools. For simple stuff like headsets and RS232 links, you can run all the necessary code on the module.

For stuff based on CSR silicon, if I were doing things over, I'd go with the Siemens dev kit for their Siemo or Siemo2 modules. Same tools, more or less, but you're working with modules right away that you can spec into a final product. I didn't find them until I was looking for prequalified modules based on CSR's chipset...

Wi-Fi Robotics

[Jennifer E. Elaan]

Personally, I wouldn't. Wifi has outrageous power demands (as is seen by how quickly it drains my laptop batteries), and increases the requirements of the host processor. For big robots that can afford an onboard laptop, this might be fine. For smaller ones running on PC104, you might manage. For microcontroller-based robots, forget it.

Mitsumi WML-C09

[ccvqc]

We just started using some development kits for FPGA design from Celoxica Ltd. They came fitted with the Mitsumi module given in the subject. The interface to the FPGA consists of just 5 pins, Rx, Tx, RTS, CTS, and Reset. Celoxica provided a Handel-C demo that transmits info between the parallel port and the bluetooth module, but we haven't had a chance to experiment with it ourselves yet. Tune in later this semester! The Celoxica docs for the board refer users to the Mitsumi web site for details.

I have some pictures of the board on the coure web site. The bluetooth module is just above the "Rev B" sticker in the first picture.

Re:bluetooth distance

[Locutus]

just having a few products doesn't mean much. Try doing a little research and you'll find the Bluetooth spec support 3 classes/ranges:

Class 1 = 100m
Class 2 = 10m
Class 3 = 2m

with corresponding power demands. All of which are still close to 1/4 the power of 802.11 devices.

LoB

802.11b

[Edward Faulkner]

Depending on your platform, it may be a lot easier to use 802.11b. I've built mobile robots around Ipaqs and Geode single board computers. Since both have pcmcia slots, adding wireless is simple.

How about a Bluetooth or WiFi enabled Aibo?

[Anonymous Coward]

Have you considered using pre-existing hardware, such as the Sony Aibo? Their are a few models which migh meet your needs without any hardware development costs on your part.

They have never been marketed in the US. (Japan only AFAIK), but the 311b and the 312b models are both bluetooth enabled. They could be imported from Japan if you can find them and are willing to pay the shipping.

On the otherhand, the 2xx series Aibo's have an internal pc-card slot intended for a specific form factor wifi-card (Orinoco chipset 802.11b cards work with built in driver). The card has to be completely contained inside the robot, so anything but the smallest of protruding antennas will be too much.

You might also be able to write your own bluetooth driver if you can find a bluetooth card that fits.

Sony even has an open-r SDK for programing the Aibo's (and according to Sony, future consumer robots) although their are alternative SDK's such as the Tekkotsu framework available.

By using Aibo's you could also make use of some of the existing Robocup codebase (which Sony has Opensourced). Why start from scratch if you don't have to? ...Unless of course your goal is to develop a superior (hardware wise) robot for robocup. ...in which case, nevermind. :-)

Check out Zeevo

[QuasiEvil]

http://www.zeevo.com/

They make a cool Bluetooth SoC that includes not only the RF chunks and necessarily Bluetooth hardware, but also an embedded ARM7TDMI processor core and flash, all on the same chip.

The only problem is getting them to talk to you. I'm an EE for a $20 billion/year Fortune 500 that's currently working on a Bluetooth experiment, and the damned rep won't even return an email to myself or one of my fellow engineers. So all I have to play with is a module I "harvested" from another prototype device from another group. Arg!

Bluetooth module supplier

[spagnitz]

blue tooth modules for small runs, prototyping here: http://www.flint.co.uk/products/index.php?manufact urer=all&sg=&section=Communications+and+Wireless&r ange=Bluetooth+Radio+Systems&pID=000000904 " * The ISM is a Bluetooth Class 1 Module designed to plug into a host motherboard for evaluation purposes or small production runs, it can then be transferred into full volume production with the minimum of design requirements avoiding any lengthy design cycles and lowering design costs dramatically * Bluetooth 1.1 pre-qualified Class 1 - +6dBm * Fully pre-approved - no Bluetooth or RF knowledge required from integrator * Data transfer rates up to 200,000 bps * Range in excess of 100 metres open field * Stand-alone module with integral TDK ceramic antenna providing excellent interference rejection - ideal for noisy environments * Very simple integration with existing embedded application * Hayes AT style command protocol - no Bluetooth knowledge required * Serial Port Profile & Audio Profile on module * Serial Port Profile removes need for Bluetooth pairing, alternatively, security features such as PIN and pairing can be added simply by configuration through the S registers * Bluetooth activity displayed via 2 LEDs * All I/O lines accessible via S registers using the AT protocol * AT Command Set - behaves like modem - Bluetooth stack is made intelligent * 100m range, but low power - achieved with CSR 2nd generation leading BC2 silicon chipset and TDK ceramic high gain antenna * Fastest implementation - because no Bluetooth knowledge is required, applications are very fast to develop - excellent time to market * Interoperability - utilities available to integrate with PC's, PDA's and mobile phones * No microprocessor or extra Flash- fully implemented within virtual machine, full Bluetooth stack embedded in module - no external stack required " list price was 129.00