Hardware Makers Unhappy With Tablet Sales

rocketjam writes "According to The Register, hardware manufacturers, tired of continued low sales of the much-hyped tablet PC, are beginning to speak out, complaining that Microsoft has not marketed the platform enough and has over-priced licenses for its Windows XP Tablet Edition. The predicted demand for the devices has not materialized; faced with the tablet's premium pricing, consumers have continued to opt for lower-priced notebooks."

Comments

ever tried to use one for serious work....?

[passthecrackpipe]

If you have ever tried to use a tablet, you will probably come to the same conclusion we have. They suck as a form-factor. They are undoubtedly cool, but in the long run, they really don't let you do any serious work.

I have worked with both the Fujitsu-Siemens as well as the Compaq tablets, have run Linux as well as Windows on both, and they simply get in between yourself and serious work.

The interface requires too much attention of the user, and the handwriting recognition, while pretty good on Windows, also requires too much attention. On Linux you would have to use some palm-type strok business, or even better, the excellent Dasher application.

Besides specialist applications, such as in hospitals for example, the form factor only really comes into its own during meetings, but it simply does not (yet) offer the simplicity of the two primary office tools: The humble pen and paper.

This is not a marketing or cost issue, it is a form-factor issue. They are cool, but all our demo and test models have their novelty worn off, and are currently going unused. At least we did not pay for them.....

Re:ever tried to use one for serious work....?

[Davak]

Even in the hospital setting, they are not all that great yet.

Several different physicians I know have tried the tablet form... only to switch back to a PDA or notebook.

The tablet seems perfect; however, the problem in medicine is the problem everywhere else... input. In increasing amounts history/physicals, progress notes, clinic visits, and orders are being inputted directly into the system by typing. The other predominate way is by dictation... which allows somebody else to type it into the system.

Tablet PCs do not speed up this process in any way. It's still quicker to type or dictate, than to use this format.

Many physicians use PDAs for all the same reasons most geeks use PDAs... however, very few of the reasons are related to medicine. Every medical student knows that a PDA allows for a quick reference on rounds to spice up one's knowledge. The tablet would allow the same info... in just a larger format.

Anyway, we docs wanted to love the tablet... it's just not practical enough... yet.

Re:ever tried to use one for serious work....?

[Lumpy]

Yes I have.

and in the right applications they are perfect.

Problem is that Tablet PC's are a vertical market. they always have been even from the very first one, the Dauphin DTR-1 I used in a chemistry lab in 1992.

Tablet Pc's have been around for over 10 years, and every time microsoft get's around to actually making a OS for it, they try to market it for everyone and that is a bold faced lie. Tablet pc's have very distinct uses. they are NOT for everyone.

and finally they are too damned big now. the dauphin I used to have back in the old days was the size of a large paperback book. easy to tag along when you made your rounds in the water plant checking systems,recording data, etc...

today's are too damned big. too delicate (I dropped that DTR-1 at least 90 times) and have not enough battery power because they are trying to make them laptops with a tablet screen. No you dont need a Pentium4 2.8 ghz tablet pc. a P-III 700-900 would be slightly overpowered, but use much less battery power so I could use that tablet all day.

Coolness aside. the tablet pc is designed for only specific uses because of it's input system. we will NEVER get handwriting recognition to work perfectly for everyone. It's much easier to get voice recognition working.

These companies and microsoft are completely at fault for trying to market something that is not for the general public.

It's like a christmas marketing campain for selling confines space equipment for home use...

"now safely go into your basement closet with ronco's confined space entry kit!"

Re:ever tried to use one for serious work....?

[yog]

The tablet as currently conceived by Microsoft and its hardware partners is not much of an innovation. What would be truly innovative would be simply to add touch screens to laptops. I don't know how many times I've watched a computer neophyte look at a dialogue box with a big, fat "OK" button at the bottom and not have the slightest notion what to do.

On the other hand, the Palm, followed by WinCE/PPC clones, achieved tablet PC status years ago and is the true innovator in this area.

Consider how far the laptop/desktop family is from being a true appliance, and how close the Palmtop family is.

To use a laptop, you must do the following steps:

- open the clamshell, locate the little power button and turn it on.

- watch as it comes to life; little LEDs light up, and after a minute or so you see the Windows splash screen.

- Wait until you see either a login screen or the actual desktop (depends on versions of Windows, how configured, etc.)

- Wait another minute or so while all the little proggies in the System Tray initialize and load. Watch Yahoo Messenger announce, irrelevantly, that it is logging you in.

- If you were savvy enough to understand "hybernation", you may have skipped a couple of these steps, but why should a user have to know the difference between hybernating and shutting down?

- Optionally, see one or two "Windows Update" messages pop up that you don't understand and aren't interested in.

- Now, find the application you are seeking--typically, your word processor, spreadsheet, PIM, or browser. It may be represented by a little icon among a sea of icons on the desktop, since you don't know anything about folders and other tricks to keep things clean. Or, it may be hidden somewhere deep in the Start menu; for example, Start->Programs->Adobe->Acrobat->Reade r (or something like that).

- Watch the application's splash screen announce its existence. Then, the application comes up. Now, at last, you can get to work, though you must play by the rules of the application.

- When you are done working, you can't simply close the computer; you must "save your work", a task which neophytes do not understand. You don't need to "save your work" when you turn off your television; it remembers what channel you were on last time. Yet, you must do this mysterious thing with your wordpro/spreadsheet or else you will "lose your work", something your long-suffering computer literate friends will angrily scold you about.

- Now, you shut down the system, either by Start->Shutdown->Turn off Computer, or by pressing power switch (in recent hardware and Windows versions) or by closing the clamshell (in recent hardware).

With the Palm/PPC, your main obstacle is finding your app amongst the icons. Chances are, you're using one of the apps bound to a hardware button anyway; just press Calendar, the thing pops on and poof! you're looking at today's schedule. No fuss, no muss. Just point at the thing you want, start writing on it, etc.

I believe the so-called Tablet PC will go away soon and we will, one hopes, see what little innovations it did possess finding their way into conventional laptops where they belong, minus Microsoft's hefty royalty overhead.

Glorified PDA

[norite]

These tablets just seem like glorified PDA's to me. I've never actually seen anyone using one of these breadboards. Personally,I'd much rather get a laptop.

Total cost difference is $200

[leerpm]

It says the total cost difference between a tablet and comparable notebook is about $200. Of that amount only $30-$60 is due to hardware, the rest is the extra software licensing cost. That is a $140-$170 premium for Windows XP Tablet Edition. To me, for a machine that costs a few thousand, even a $200 difference does not seem that much. Or maybe people just haven't gotten used to the technology enough to make it a worthwhile purchase yet?

It is sad, we have arrived in a day and age where it seems as though every new technology that comes around the block needs to make it big in the first couple years , or it is considered a failure. Real improvements in productivity don't happen that way. They can take many years before the returns are actually realized. The people who use the technology don't learn it overnight. In fact, it is only now that many companies are finally starting to see a decent return on their investments in technology in the late 1990's.

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[goofrider]

$200 my ass. Most tablet PCs average $2000. You can by a decent laptop somewhat under $1000, and it even has a keyboard!!!

Tablet PCs are not a bad idea, but it's just not worth the extra $700-$1000.

I personally wouldn't mind having a couple of those and run Reason and Ableton Live side-by-side. Tweaking knobs on screen in real-time using a stylus is much better than using a mouse.

But do I want to spend $2000 on a tablet PC? Or would I rather by 2 low-end laptops and a couple Wacom tablets?

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[kfg]

On the other hand, some new technologies fail because they were invented for marketing purposes, to drive sales, when people really neither want nor need the technology.

It happens.

Clipboard - couple bucks
Piece of paper- some fraction of a cent
Pen- Free if you steal it. Agree to take a survey at the mall and then just walk away
Functionality - overall superiour to a tablet PC, especially with the advancing state of OCR software

Tablets have two real functions, Filling out standard forms, such as you might do while taking inventory. PDA type devices have already taken this market. Tablets are too much, too late.

Ebook reader. When they get lighter, cost less then a book and ebooks are in open formats like ASCII.

Oh yeah, and when you can plug a keyboard into one and use it like a laptop.

People want better cheaper portable computing devices, not expensive crippled and useless ones.

KFG

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[Trelane]

It is sad, we have arrived in a day and age where it seems as though every new technology that comes around the block needs to make it big in the first couple years , or it is considered a failure.

Tablets have actually been around for a while. I remember lusting after the Linux tablets several years ago. Then Microsoft came in with its billions in marketing, and I've not heard of Linux tablets again (though I think they're starting to resurface).

Repeat with me: Just because Microsoft does something doesn't mean that Microsoft's the first!

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[kfg]

Certainly, but a good deal of that functionality really falls into the ebook catagory. Dictionaries, Encyclopedias, Quarterly reports and such. Bundle one with the OED and the Britannica and the deal and usefullness suddenly shoot up.

Certainly the ability to run a real database and grep text is a real advantage, but crippled without a real keyboard. Pen input devices are really nifty for making checkmarks and such. Much better than a keyboard or mouse, but they really are no match for inputing text and I don't think they ever will be. Not many authors write longhand these days. Fewer and fewer will even write a letter that way. Most still take notes that way though and type them into their computers later.

It works.

KFG

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[richg74]

It says the total cost difference between a tablet and comparable notebook is about $200.

I assume he's talking about the production cost. Certainly the retail price difference is more than $200.

It seems to me that the major reason tablet PCs are not selling well is that they are a solution in search of a problem. A tablet PC is bigger and heavier than a PDA; and, for that matter, a clipbboard. A notebook PC, of course, comes with a keyboard.

Personally, the only thing I can see that a tablet PC gives me over a notebook is the ability to do something I don't want to do -- write in longhand. I can type much faster than I can write; as a bonus, the result is legible, even to other people. And I can buy a notebook + PDA for the same or less money.

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[petsounds]

Well, I think the biggest market for tablets is for graphic designers who can design on-the-go with stylus in hand. For this purpose it is really useful. However, Microsoft seems to not be marketing to this audience at all.

Re:Total cost difference is $200

[edunbar93]

Personally, the only thing I can see that a tablet PC gives me over a notebook is the ability to do something I don't want to do -- write in longhand.

Unless, of course, you're standing up and trying to take notes. Or trying to take notes in mathematics or physics. These applications make trying to use a keyboard an exercise in farce. Also, you need something considerably larger than a palm pilot just to write out a single integral equation.

You could just use paper and a pen, that is if you don't mind searching the notes manually afterwards. After using computers for so long, I find it irritating to go back to paper.

Of course, since I'm not going to school anymore, there's no reason for me to have a tablet, and there are other (very large) flaws with the current design. Overall, these things need to be less like computers and more like palm pilots - fast, efficient, lacking a hard drive. I wouldn't even mind too much if the screens were monochrome, especially if it means a threefold increase in battery life.

Quit yer whining

[Quixote]

Here's a suggestion (offered free) to the tablet makers: why not support Linux on these tablets? If you remove the cost of the software, the price of the tablets will come down, maybe just enough to sustain the platform.

With the availibility of OSS, bitchin' about proprietary software makes no sense. (Oh no, not the Chewbacca defense!)

IMHO, all Linux needs is a couple of "success stories" where a hardware mfr opted for Linux and saved itself from ruin, and you'll have hw mfrs falling over each other trying to support the OS.

This isn't the first time

[AndroidCat]

They're surprised that Microsoft is waffling on a platform? 10 years ago Pen Windows was the latest greatest coming thing for tablets and was going to be real big any moment now. Microsoft's attention span didn't last very long when the market didn't happen. Microsoft waffled on PDAs too until that market picked up.

As for the price of licencing Pen, er, Tablet Windows, perhaps they should look around for alternatives? (Say, what ever happen to GRiD anyway?)

Sounds like sour grapes: "Wah, Microsoft isn't pushing our market enough! And they put a gun to our heads to make us use Windows!" Sell enough computers for Microsoft to care guys.

The "executives don't use keyboards" trap

[dpbsmith]

The tablet PC is partly driven by the same misguided notion that has driven many failed PC hardware and software developments: the belief, on the part of an older generation of CEO's, that there is something demeaning about using a keyboard.

Up to the 1980's, keyboards were associated with secretarial and clerical staff, who were paid less and ranked lower socially than executives. Executives had no skill in keyboarding and were proud of it. The mantra was "I have people to do that for me." The result, unfortunately, was that the decision-makers never got any gut experience in the feeling of keyboard interaction or the power and suitability of the keyboard as a human-interface device.

So, you have all those stupid fantasies of machines that you "will just talk to in English," and the continuing search for handwriting recognition.

Ever since all the bright young MBA's started using Excel and Powerpoint you'd think people would know better. Sure, the upper-mid-level people play the game of "my-laptop-is-shinier-than-yours", but I have still seen upper management eyes gleam at the idea of not needing to use a keyboard. They give lip service to the legitimacy of the keyboard, but in their hearts they feel that a high-ranking person should not be using one.

It's silly. A tablet PC is like a PC with a mouse but no keyboard (yes, I know there is a keyboard buried inside). It's an impoverished communications channel, and no matter how cleverly you design it, it will never be as comfortable, efficient, or powerful as a channel that includes a keyboard or a keyboard-like modality.

It would be far better to research improved, more convenient, more portable keyboard subtitutes (type in the air and let lasers track your fingers, or whatever) than to continue down the silly path of trying to express a human-computer dialog solely with a continous two-dimensional line.

Re:The "executives don't use keyboards" trap

[cmason]

A tablet PC is like a PC with a mouse but no keyboard (yes, I know there is a keyboard buried inside). It's an impoverished communications channel, and no matter how cleverly you design it, it will never be as comfortable, efficient, or powerful as a channel that includes a keyboard or a keyboard-like modality.[Emphasis mine.]

I disagree strongly. I can't argue to Microsoft's implemenation of TabletPC, as I've never used one, but you're talking about the tablet computer or pen based computer in general. I believe that, maybe because we all learn to use a pencil before we learn to type and use a mouse, the tablet is a fundamentally more natural human interface than the mouse and keyboard, for anything other than bulk text input.

I think tablets have a number of advantages:

• Closer - When using a tablet I feel as though I'm interacting directly with the machine rather than trying to command it through an intermediary.
• Faster - I believe I spend less time trying to position items using a tablet than I do using a mouse, particularly when performing novel tasks.
• Easier to learn - Have you ever watched someone (particularly an older person) use a mouse for the first time? Have you ever watched someone (particularly an older person) use a tablet computer for the first time? The difference is remarkable. Again, I think this is because the tablet models interacting with a piece of paper, in that, the feedback occurs directy underneath the input device, rather than at a separate location.

Three years of solid Newton (I took notes on it in college) use leads me to believe these things. I wonder if you have ever actually used a tablet/pen computer for more than a few minutes/hours?

-c

It's easier

[No Such Agency]

... than saying "well, we're making these things freaking expensive, and thus anybody looking at the bottom line (businesses, and home consumers) will think twice about buying one rather than a mid-end laptop". When your "core demographic" is toy-greedy executives and bleeding-edge hardware geeks, you don't sell so many units.

Make hardware CHEAP (and reliable), and people will buy it. It's that simple.

Re:They're just not useful

[Grayraven]

Just two small things: Reading and browsing the web.

I still don't get it.

[Chess_the_cat]

If you want to do serious work, you'd want a notebook. If you just want to jot down some notes or a phone number, you'd want a pen and paper or maybe a PDA. What is the point of this?

Friend: Let me give you my new number. Got a pen?
Me: Uh, hang on a sec. Let me get out my tablet. Just have to boot it up here...just a minute more. Okay. I've got to open Outlook... New contact...new number. Damn, it's not recognizing my handwriting. Wait, wait. Okay. Done. Now let me give you my number.
Friend: *writes it on back of hand with a pen that costs a quarter, never needs to be recharged, and fits in a shirt pocket*

Laptop Buyers Unhappy with Tablet Prices

[Brento]

BrentO writes: "According to Common Sense, computer purchasers, tired of the low-powered CPUs and high prices of the much-hyped tablet PC, are beginning to speak out with their wallets, complaining that they just don't want to spend two thousand dollars for 1998-era computing performance. The predicted productivity for the devices has not materialized; faced with the tablet's premium pricing, manufacturers are finally getting the picture."

Seriously, when I talk about buying computers with network admins, and ask them to name a price point at which tablets make sense, the number seems to be (normal laptop) + $150. As it is now, the price penalty is much stiffer, and you end up comparing low-powered tablets with high-powered laptops. Sure, you can get a $1400 Compaq tablet - but it's got less than half the CPU power of their $1400 laptops.

Re:Let me guess

[staed]

It's true what you say, but tablet style apps is under development for linux. 'jarnal' is a clone of Microsoft Journal, so you can all ready turn your expensive tablet pc into a notebook (as in pen-and-paper notebook) under linux.

Handwriting recognition is the big problem. It is gonna take a long time before the open source community has come up with one that's as accurate as the one in XP Tablet Edition. Sure, you've got plenty of great graffiti-style gesture recognition software, but no real working handwriting recognition apps.

Btw, I got my TC1000 for about half the price, so turning it into a small laptop and loose some of the features for a while might not be that big of a deal for me as for the ones paying full price.

And I have to admit I'm writing this under XP.

Re:Why is this MS's fault?

[putaro]

It's MS' fault because they developed the idea and evangelized it to the hardware manufacturers. This was MS' big push and it's a big fizzle. Makes you wonder if anybody ever really does good marketing or if people just get lucky sometimes.

Re:They're just not useful

[Bananenrepublik]

Have you ever tried to take notes in a math heavy lecture, using a notebook? Unless you're a TeX-wizard you'll have a hard time. With a Tablet PC I could enter the text on the Keyboard, and fill in the formulae with the pen. Very much like people did with typewriters in the pre-TeX days, when preparing books BTW.

Re:Little rich kids in Boston got tons of em

[rudabager]

Well ok... but my contention is that laptops dont have the storage or the heat management that desktops have. I have so many files (200+GB)I spend about an hour a week deciding what I can delete and what I cant live w/o. I see the need for a laptop, but only for making my work portable. What about games? The demands of videogames on proc and GPU are huge. Laptops cant keep up with that. They are fragile, and collect so much dust which cant be cleaned out. I could build a desktop for under $500 that a $1500 laptop wouldnt even come close to eating my tracks, especially if it was mac. Thoes things are way over priced. They dont make laptops that can match mid-level desktops. I figure that you would spend about 10 times more for portability in a laptop.

Maybe they're pitching them to the wrong market?

[Gldm]

Who's seriously going to want to write their word documents? I type about 5x faster than I can possibly scribble with a pen, and with fewer errors to boot.

But I'm dying to get one of these to draw on!

Maybe if they bundled some of the better pressure sensitive pens and photoshop and painter instead of office, they'd find that people were more interested in using them as digital sketchbooks. I know some people say the digitizers aren't up to it, but from what I've read on tablet pc forums, it depends on which one you get. The ones with the newer Wacom based digitizers are supposedly pretty good if you're using one of the decent Wacom pens, which are all interchangeable with the crappy ones bundled with the tablets.

Maybe they should try pitching them more towards art students, and maybe try to bring the prices down a bit. I wish apple would make one of the convertable flip-over type tablets because I'm betting they could get it right on the first try. It's probably the only way I'd ever consider buying a mac, but I'd buy one in a heartbeat if they did it.

Lose the mouse, but not the keyboard.

[ScottSpeaks!]

Offer me laptop with a stlus-optional touchscreen and a keyboard (hold the trackpad or keyboard-embedded nubbin), and I'll consider it.

Re:They're just not useful

[jbolden]

About 6 years ago I was a TeX wizard. There was no way I could keep up reasonably with a real time lecture using TeX. Even for a wizard there is too much intellectual overhead thinking about puntuational issues : will this equaltion be centered, centered multiline, inline...; did I close }, will TeX accept that symbol in index list mode, ..

Microsoft's trouble with Innovation?

[hethatishere]

Just another great example of Microsoft failing miserably whenever they attempt to Innovate. It just goes to show you having billions of dollars in your warchest still can't match the innovation of smaller companies and groups like Apple and some of the projects found on Linux. -First it was 1993 The Microsoft Home software series (180 Software titles that flopped) -Then it was Microsoft Bob. -The ActiMate Plush toys of '97 (They turned into something from a B Horror movie when they got low on batteries) -Buying out WebTV and bundling IE and MSN with it because it might actually take off and Microsoft would have no control over it. -PocketPC is still the minority in the handheld market, and is having major issues making inroads in the Corporate Markets. -The over-hyped Microsoft "Orange" SmartPhones were dropped by the carrier even before production began. -The XBox failed to produce profitability or market dominance as "expected." -Tablet PC's a new take on a recycled idea yielding poorly designed and fragile PC's with mediocre tablet software that is nearly impossible to draw or write in script with. -And of course Windows still sucks, forcing the majority of discerning computer users to continue using alternatives. With many countries switching or thinking about switching to Linux some of us should start changing our tune about the end of Apple to singing about the beginning of the end for Microsoft. And just like Apple, just because we sing it doesn't mean it has to happen right away. Microsoft just has too many fingers in too many pies to do a sufficient job at all the markets they have extended into. Think the last years of the Roman Empire where they had over-extended. And soon the trampling hordes of the Linux Visigoths will be knocking on Big Redmond's door.

FUD only applies against Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

Just like racism only applies against African-Americans.

Hope this lesson in Slashdot Correctness has helped.