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Ghost In The Shell 2: Innocence
timbloid writes "I spotted on Ain't it cool news that Mamoru Oshii's new anime Innocence Ghost In The Shell 2's website is now open! The trailer is beautiful! But I can't help thinking a translated version is some time off from the 2004 Japanese release... Maybe it would be faster for me to learn Japanese?"
"Maybe it would be faster for me to learn Japanese?"
I think it's better to watch a film in the language it's created in. Who knows if the translation is correct? Isn't it better to hear the real actors, and listen to the sounds they make, as opposed to some translated version?
A large piece of the meaning and fluidity of a film is lost in translation.
I can remember sitting around a table of French friends of mine, not knowing a word of French myself, and it was still interesting to listen to them, like a fly on a wall. You don't know what's being said, but the experience has it's own merits.
There's something really cool about watching anime in Japanese that gives a kind of simplicity to the plot and idea of the film. Because you have no idea what's being said, you can kind of guess, and that adds some of your immagination to the mix. It delivers a kind of Zen, IMHO. And with the visuals in the trailer of Ghost In the Shell 2, who cares what language it's in!! Gimmie!! Gimmie!!
Why the hell is this rated Interesting and not Flamebait? Japanese animation isnt all about raping and sex no more than all American films is hardcore pornography.
There are some great and funny, not to mention hardwarming movies and series in this genre. Open your eyes, and stop being so discriminating.
It's a lot more fun smoking, drinking, and fucking until you have had your fill. When this happens you either grow up and go back to things that are more intellectual or you become a drunken bum who no one wants to have sex with anyways. Either way, you'll be back. There's no escape from the tentacle monsters!
I've been asked that before.
My personal preference of Anime is that I feel animation is a more solid medium to present a story. And japenese animation has historically been better than many of the US attempts. Likewise, Japenese animation is more likey to show the darker side of things: people die, blood is spilled, war, etc. Meanwhile, US animation is too "Disney-esque", pandering to the G-rated demographic, or trying to get kids to buy their merchandise.
Some people prefer black-and-white films, other like musicals, and I even know a few people that like silent films. It's just a preference on how the film is portrayed, and I personally like a WELL drawn animation so long as it has a good story and isn't some lame kids show.
In movies, you have wooden actors playing the lead roles because teenage girls think they are cute, and a bimbo playing the leading lady because she has big cleavage.
And most importantly, there are some things that actors can't do (mostly stunts). Sure, you can add special affects, but they sometimes don't look too special.
The settings are another benefit. Some of the greatly drawn anime has settings that you cannot replicate on a stage without it looking "tacky" or fake (CGI), and in some cases look almost heavenly. Lush forests, planet-scapes, buildings, some of it are works of art.
Animation CAN allow a story to be truly delivered the way it was meant ot be delivered. The character can look exactly like the author originally imagined him/her as. The stunts can look more fluid (all-be-it impossible to perform in real life). Essentially the entire film can be presented in a pure unadulterated form.
Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of bad animation out there. And, like anything else, it can be watered down to some fluff that only kids like (such as Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, etc). And the tentacle thing (while a stereotypical description of anime) occurs in more "shady" shows, it's not like its everywhere. You must just be downloading some porn like "La Blue Girl" or something.
All I ask is that some of you people not just label it as some kiddy-show or porn. There's a lot of anime out there that's deep and meaningful, all-the-while being beautifully drawn.
I think the biggest problem anime currently faces in the US is not translation, or people not liking sub-titles. It comes down to two things:
People expect anime to be childrens cartoons, because that's all american cartoons are (in general)
or
People look for a traditional western storyline, and they can't handle characters who are both good and bad, and stories that deal with multiple social issues, without offering panaceas at the end.
It takes a unique type of American to enjoy an anime, and until the rest of the country realizes the walls they have up, and takes them down, and appreciates anime for the beautiful deep art it is, anime won't be widely accepted.
What does this have to do with GITS? I would love to see that movie on a big screen, but unless I catch it at a local college, I've got no chance. We need to change American preconceptions so that we can watch our movies the way they were meant to be watched!
I often show friends the movie Princess Mononoke(sp?), and they say, "Wow, that was incredible!", and I tell them, "There are more movies like that, and a lot that are better than that." But no one has ever heard of it, because the american public can't understand or be bothered to try and understand an animated cartoon not aimed at children, or that doesn't hinge on humour. Sure, Pixar has gotten animation into the mainstream, but all of pixars movies are considered "Funny" and "child-safe".
Just my 3.5 cents.
Cash prize, guaranteed!
I agree, and the fansubs are better in quality and content than the commercial/licensed offerings. I suppose this is kinda like open source vs closed source (commercial). Projects where amatures do something for the pure love of it is done differently than something with a commercial agenda. It also applies to Ballmer's recent comment about how closed source is better because they have roadmaps and timelines. I say that because these timelines are set in place causes some of that something extra to be missing. There are bad fansubs, of course, but it is probably due to them wanting to release something before everyone else.
One of the better fansubs I've been fortunate to watch is Hikaru no Go. An anime about the game of Go--ancient master of Go comes back as a spirit and coexists within a boy. Lots of Go concepts are mentioned in passing in the series but I think the additional subtitle text explain them well.
Anime is not a genre, it's a medium. You can use it to tell good stories, or bad stories. You can use it to tell funny stories, or serious stories. You can use it to tell stories for kids, or stories no kid should ever be within 50 yards of. (Way to end a sentence with a preposition!)
There are people who will watch anime just because it's anime. Me, I watch good anime, because it's good.
Watch Grave of the Fireflies and tell me that anime not a serious artistic medium. After you stop crying your eyes out.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
More like the visual style and cinematic presentation than any sort of symbolic plot. The lobby scene from the matrix is influenced by the scene with the spider tank. The difference is that there's background symbology in the violence, as the spider tank mauls one of those taxonomy trees accidentally. Another similarity is the constant choice of night as a setting. If it's not night, its at least dark and rainy in GITS.
On the other hand, your plot summar of GITS is somewhat flawed. "The chick" hardly thinks she's ordinary. In fact, she's very consious of how different she is. I think thats one of the plot themes of GITS, how she gets a chance to be normal for a while at the end. Of course, both The Matrix and Ghost in the Shell owe a lot to a common predecessor, Blade Runner. But then, thats true for nearly every sci-fi movie since it was released.
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mon, this isn't flamebait...name one anime fan YOU know, moderator, who DOESN'T have a SINGLE tentacle porn /me raises hand.
Not a single one. I've seen a few, but they simply don't cut it for me.
The anime target consumer is a child. The reason full-grown adults in America flock to anime is unknown at this time.
The reason "full-grown adults"--which is, of course, a misnomer; we're really talking about 20-30 somethings--flock to anime is threefold.
Firstly, it's originaly targeted at or near the comparable market in Japan.
Secondly, a good portion of the anime watching crowd grew up watching imported animation from Japan, and so it's logical that they'd move on to more complex stories in the same medium.
Thirdly, anime's been a trendy thing on college campuses for years now.
And, of course, there's always that "do something that's not stupid but that mom & dad won't get" drive.
You know, I really hate this attitude. Just because you've seen it by fansubbers first, or they are doing it "for love," doesn't mean it's always better. I have seen fansub with atrocious spelling errors and mistranslations. I have also seen commercial releases with problems. In the past, you might have had a lot of folks doing fansubbing for the love of anime and to spread it, but these days, you have more and more groups who are fansubbing to gain notoriety. It's a real shame to see the anime community going this route.
Anyway, commercial releases offer quite a bit more for collectors than fansubs (or digisubs). First, there is the physical item. Yes, some will say I am living in the past, but collectors really like having a physical thing, at times. This is the same reason why some people still like buying albums instead of just downloading stuff.
Although the anime digisubs are getting larger and of higher quality, they still do not compare to DVD, IMO. I enjoy watching my DVDs on a nice home theater system, sitting in a comfortable couch. I don't want to be at my computer. Yes, I can run a line from the computer, but you also lose out on some of the extra control, etc (FF, rewind).
DVDs also offer things such as additional language tracks, optional subtitles, etc. Plenty of companies are releasing liner notes, and there are some extras that are obtainable only via direct interaction with the original licesne-holder.
I also think that your comparison to open source software is off. The only similarity fansubs have to open source is that they are both (generally) free. If they were the same thing, you're basically calling open source a bunch of pirates/hackers/crackers/whatever. A more accurate comparison would be if you found an example of someone creating their own anime and offering it for free.
Please note, I'm not saying all fansubbing is bad, but anyone who knows the "ethics" of fansubbing will know that there are quite a few people who are in clear violation of it.
Not everything in the world should be free. And I think if you have the attitude that everything should be free, you're either deluding yourself or just trying to ease your conscience for not paying for stuff you use.
If all you have are silver bullets, everything looks like a werewolf.
Just because you can download it doesn't mean you won't buy it. That, sir, is on your shoulders, and mine. I have downloaded things and subsequently purchased them, the quality of the downloaded version is seldom the same as the purchased version; even DVDR images tend to be transcoded.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"