Slashdot Mirror


Kazaa Launches Legitimacy Campaign

Beolach writes "The Washington Post has an article on Kazaa launching a $1 million advertising campaign promoting itself as a legitimate media distribution tool. From the article: 'The campaign is the latest push by the Kazaa file-sharing service and its parent company, Sharman Networks, to counter a multi-million-dollar legal and lobbying effort launched by music, software and movie firms convinced that peer-to-peer (P2P) services are a major source of online piracy'."

25 of 252 comments (clear)

  1. Piracy by Stephen+R+Hall · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Kazaa is a major source of on-line piracy - they cannot deny this. However, P2P file sharing does have legitimate uses, and the tool cannot be blamed for what it is used for. Rat poison can be used to kill people, but that is about how it is used, not what it is.

    1. Re:Piracy by Davak · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Oh... I see the anti-gun, anti-weapon, anti-rat poision people eating this thread up. (groan)

      However, more than actually trying to plead their case, it sounds like Kazaa is just trying to build support for their service. The ads are encouraging users to be cheerleaders for the service:
      The ads invite readers and Kazaa's estimated 60 million users to "join the revolution" by proclaiming their love of Kazaa to "politicians, journalists, record labels, movie companies and friends." They also exhort the entertainment industry to embrace the "revolution" or get left behind as technology passes them by.

      Use your money to educate people about copyright laws.
      Use your money to compensate artists.
      Use your money to change the laws regarding digital distribution.

      Use your money to promote an actual positive idea... We don't need wasted ads encouraging people to be cheerleaders for a service.

      They should just say:
      "Tell your lawmakers that you want free copyrighted material or you won't vote for them."

      That's just not a very tasteful way to promote your service, IMHO.
    2. Re:Piracy by Simon+Lyngshede · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Not many belive that Kazaa has a legitimate use. I understand that you could use p2p to distribute Linux or something, but that it hardly what Kazaa was designed for. Most of the stuff you legitimately distribute with Kazaa would be better of using websites, ftp or bittorrent.

      P2P has legitimate uses, Kazaas current business model does not. Don't protect Kazaa to defend P2P networks, Kazaa only use is the distribution of illegally copied material. Could someone give me a something that Kazaa could be used for which wouldn't work better via http, ftp or Bittorrent?

      I don't think you can compare Bittorrent and Kazaa, because Bittorrent originally was designed to solve the problem of distributing legal material in a way that wouldn't overload a server. I understand that Bittorrent can, and is, misused to distribute copyrighted material. My argument is simply that Kazaa was not really design to solve a similar problem, they always been in the business of distributing copyrighted material.

    3. Re:Piracy by j-turkey · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Currently, the community is too fragmented to offer such a truce

      Sure -- because I don't trust the IP owners with my stuff. If I buy a car from you, I will neither give you a spare key nor access to my garage. If I buy a book from you, I will never allow you to insist that I only read it under the light that you specify. So why should I allow other IP owners to watch me to make sure I don't run away with this IP? I'm a private person and will never agree to that kind of treatment.

      and the likely outcome is that P2P will become regulated

      I kind of doubt that P2P (in general) will ever be regulated more than it already is (normal copyright law). P2P, as a whole, has far too many legitimate uses to be regulated. Especially with a decentralized system (like BitTorrent). These systems allow for any schmuck with a computer and Internet connection to distribute massive amounts of data without the associated costs...a "power to the people" kind of thing.

      Essentially, I agree that something's gotta give -- but I don't think that P2P (as a whole) will ever be regulated. Even if the major commercial networks are regulated, there will always be decentralized networks -- even anonymous ones (like Freenet), and if those are ever regulated (which I doubt they ever will be), new ones will be created in their place.

      --Turkey
      --

      -Turkey

  2. It's legit. The users are iffy by Dancin_Santa · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sharing files is not against the law.

    Distributing copyrighted works is.

  3. There's a reason why they're convinced by Tim+C · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The various P2P networks are a major source of online piracy.

    Now, I'm not saying that that's all they're used for, or that they don't have legitimate uses (distribution of Linux iso images is one that springs immediately to mind), or that the various lobbying groups should succeed. But I can't see how anyone can deny that P2P is used a lot by pirates, both casual and probably organised.

    Of course, so is ftp, http, etc, and I'm not saying that they should be banned either. I'm just questioning the tone of that part of the summary, is all.

  4. Re:Kaaza and the War on Copyright Violations by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If you think taking what cannot be legitimately considered yours with compensating the creator is not immoral, you are working with a completely different set of morals than most people.

    There's a reason people view using Kazaa as "a little bit wrong" and it has to do with their conscience.

  5. Stats Explosion by Davak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The MPAA estimates that file sharing has cost the film industry more than $1 billion in the last year.

    I estimate that the MPAA overestimates 125% of the stats that they estimate.

    Because somebody watches a pirated movie does not directly mean that anybody lost money over it. Money is only lost if that person would have paid money but instead watched it for free.

  6. Possibly good news by heironymouscoward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Apart from the question of who is actually financing this and what they hope to get from it, the idea is good.

    The next year will see a massive publicity campaign from the top 5 music companies as they try to exaggerate the impact of p2p ("try" is what I mean, cause I believe the impact is really huge), in the hope that this will allow them to merge into 2 or 3 companies.

    Without some anti-publicity, it means a lot more of the "hacker pirates stealing music" stories. Kazaa are not my choice for a champion, I'd prefer someone like Michael Robertson of mp3.com fame. But it's a start.

    --
    Ceci n'est pas une signature
  7. Copyright is not a given by CrystalFalcon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They should just say:
    "Tell your lawmakers that you want free copyrighted material or you won't vote for them."


    That's just not a very tasteful way to promote your service, IMHO.

    You seem to believe that copyright is a God-given impeccable right.

    It isn't. It is a man-made construct that can and should be changed if society as a whole benefits from another model.

    Of course, with any change of order comes fierce resistance from those who will lose from the new order. That has always been the case; already Machiavelli knew this.

    1. Re:Copyright is not a given by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Perhaps.

      But if there are sixty million of them, and there are some thousands losing money over it, then I'd say that the aggregate benefit damn well outweights the aggregate loss.

    2. Re:Copyright is not a given by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      To answer that question, ponder this:

      Before music was copyrightable, was any produced?

    3. Re:Copyright is not a given by PyromanFO · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I think you're a bit off base here. Copyright addresses the problem that producing the original work requires significantly more effort than duplicating that work once it's been created. That was true then, and it's true now -- it can take months or years for an author to write a book, but even the old Guttenberg press could print a vast number of copies with ease.

      The problem is copyright doesn't address this problem properly. The argument goes that people won't have enough incentive to create nonrivalrous goods if they aren't given a monopoly on distribution. Economists generally abhor monopolies (real economists, not MBAs), however with copyright it was considered necessary. This has been shown to not only be a false assumption, but that the solution doesn't even efficiently address the problem to begin with. There are very few artists today who wouldn't create artistic works if there was no copyright, in fact several are kept from doing so because of copyright, they can't remix, add or subtract from any work without everyone's permission. They would be creating new material, but can't. Before you chime in with "they should quit being ripoffs" keep this in mind. To paraphrase, "Good artists borrow, great artists steal" Everything is a remix to a certain extent. This doesn't even take into account that the monopoly on distribution is usually signed over to the publisher, giving a handful of publishers a government granted monopoly over an industry.

      Second, the wealth of software released under the GPL or another open/free software license shows that there is plenty of incentive to create easily copied works without having to control distribution. Sometimes you just have to scratch that itch, or you need an alternative. The same applies to art, fanart, webcomics, fan fiction, places like the SA.com forums show that there are plenty of people willing to create art that don't feel they have to control the distribution to make it worth thier while. Occasionally you just want to write/draw/model something, it doesn't matter what. Copyright does nothing but stifle this kind of development.
  8. Ban All Communications by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I mean when you really think about it... We should ban IRC as well. I mean even though you can talk over it, you could trade files. FTP is really a rude protocal as well, since 0day warez (I hope i spelled that right) also resides on these evil ip's. Piracy is going to happen, whether it be a neat package, or a barebones one.

    I think Jim Carey once said "SomeBody has to Kill the BabySitter" applies here :)

  9. Won't work by Zigg · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sharman's been playing the "us vs. the recording industry" game way too long to try to create any impression of legitimacy now. Maybe if they'd made a concerted effort (and not just a hide behind enough legalese to cover their asses) from day one to discourage copyright infringement, they might have a shot at it.

    But they didn't, and they don't. And if they had, they certainly wouldn't be in the position they were today as the household name in file "sharing".

  10. Re:It's legit. The users are iffy by gnu-generation-one · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sharing files is not against the law...
    Distributing copyrighted works is.


    Sometimes... if you're not the author, if you're not a librarian or a lawyer, if the copyright is valid in your country and hasn't expired, and there's no implicit permission or explicit license... and if you do actually make copies, rather than distributing the same copyrighted work that you received...

    Why do people make out that copyright is so simple as the DRM people say it it? It's a complex subject, and contains more information than you can contain in a 1-bit "copyrighted? Y/N" flag.

    This text I just wrote is copyrighted. Your browser just copied it. Why? because there's implicit permission.

  11. Re:But... by shione · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The same way --- more features and no spyware.

  12. Re:Weak argument, IMHO by Psiren · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Just like the primary function of P2P networks are to allow sharing of digital content, regardless of copyright.

    Umm, no other method of sharing files deals with copyright issues either. P2P isn't unique in this respect, it's the same as everything else.

  13. It's like LSD by tgt · · Score: 4, Insightful


    Kazaa is a lot like LSD:

    1. Designed by scientists in search for cure.
    2. Found to be useful in getting high.
    3. Agencies experimented with it to see if it's suitable for their own evil needs.
    4. Although some legitimate (medical) uses were possible, it was determined to be a drug and thus declared illegal and prohibited for any use.
    5. Still wanted by end users and therefore still around in pure form or in variations.
    6. Variations, shall we say, vary, therefore it's very difficult to say which is original stuff and which is not.

    Like it or not, but it's there and it's not getting away easily. Some publicity sure helps.

    --
    I like my outfit, it's inexpensive, but cool -- April Ryan
  14. Re:Weak argument, IMHO by Decameron81 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I don't think your comparison is a fair one as killing someone is far more serious than copyright infringement (even they are giving more importance to the latter recently). While preventing homicides is a good reason why personal freedom should be limited in some way (ie. you can't buy guns), I don't think the same should be applied to copyright infringement (ie. you can't use programs that let you share material).

    "I personally believe that the concept of copyright needs some serious overhaul; when 50 million people believe something is right and some 10,000 believe it is wrong, then by the laws of most countries, it cannot be wrong for a long time more"


    I'm not sure about this. My bet is that the problem is caused by ridiculous costs for media. People don't have the money to buy all they want to have.

    To me, the solution is either find a way to make people loose faith in their p2p system to get copyrighted material (corrupting copyrighted files comes to my mind, and it would probably cost less than all of what they're doing right now) or offer them some really good alternatives that will make them reconsider sticking to the laws (easy ways to pay for a great low cost service of media distribution).

    Just my 2 cents,
    Diego Rey
    --
    diegoT
  15. Not a weak argument... by khenson · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It is exactly the same argument as "guns are not made for killing people" - and both arguments are correct.

    Blaming a gun for a murder is senseless and sophmoric and blaming a file distribution technology for piracy is as well. People have "warez" ftp sites where piracy occurs, does this mean ftp needs to be abolished? How about the internet in general?

    It is a simple mathematical case of failing to find the common denominator. People pirate files using ftp. People pirate files using http. People pirate files using P2P. Do you see the common denominator here?

    People kill with knives. People kill with vehicles. People kill with guns. People kill with clubs. Did you find the common denominator in this one?

    In case you missed it - the answer is "people". If you want to stop piracy you have to make "people" stop doing it - not disable or outlaw the technology and if you want to stop murders you have to make people stop killing each other, not outlaw or abandon guns, knives, etc.

    But that's not easy, is it? It's easier to abolish guns than address the *REAL* problem of dealing with people. It's a cop-out.

    reminds me of a story: One night a woman is on a street corner looking for something when a man wanders up. He can see the lady's distress and asks what the problem is. The lady tells him that she lost a hundred dollar bill and is looking for it - so the man starts helping her look. After a bit of searching he asks the lady where she thinks she may have dropped it and the lady responds by pointing down the street through the darkness a block away. Puzzled, the man asks the lady why she is searching here? Pointing to the overhead streetlamp above them the lady responds "because the light is better".

    We cannot, as a society, try to find the answer to problems where it is easiest to look because, quite simply, the answer simply isn't there. It is far more difficult to find the "answer" to murder is in people, the "answer" to piracy is in people. A far more daunting fix may be in order but it is the correct one. Anything else is as futile as looking for lost money in a place where the light is better.

  16. Oh Good by Insipid+Trunculance · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I have used Napster,gnutella,Morpheus and Kazaa lite.Why?Not to get anything that is legitimate but copyrighted music.Not because i dont want to spend any money but because i cant get here in london what i want.

    I dont have a problem if i want to listen britney boobs and company.their music is everywhere.

    But good flamenco and jazz is impossible to get.most of it is simply not available anywhere.

    so what am i doing ? violating the rights of the artists or am i keeping their legacy alive, some of those artists long dead.

    --
    Wanted : A Signature.
    1. Re:Oh Good by IM6100 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      But good flamenco and jazz is impossible to get.most of it is simply not available anywhere.

      And using a P2P to get it completely obliterates the small market for it, making it even less likely that you'll ever be able to get it on commercial pressings.

      So unless the flamenco and jazz artists themselves choose to begin distributing their works directly through P2P means, you're destroying their distribution method.

      Yeah, I know that in your personal case, you figure you can bend the rules and if not that many other people do so it'll all work out okay. But what kind of moral base is that for a whole culture to adopt??

      --
      A Good Intro to NetBS
  17. Not "piracy", maybe not "stealing" by Glass+of+Water · · Score: 3, Insightful
    definition of piracy, (via gonze):
    CITE 18 USC Sec. 1652
    01/26/98
    TITLE 18 - CRIMES AND CRIMINAL PROCEDURE
    PART I - CRIMES
    CHAPTER 81 - PIRACY AND PRIVATEERING
    Sec. 1652. Citizens as pirates

    "Whoever, being a citizen of the United States, commits any murder or robbery, or any act of hostility against the United States, or against any citizen thereof, on the high seas, under color of any commission from any foreign prince, or state, or on pretense of authority from any person, is a pirate, and shall be imprisoned for life."

    it's also not quite clear that making an exact duplicate copy, where it does not degrade the original, is "theft".

    it's infringement of copyright. just like when people used to tape albums for their friends, just on a different scale.

    --
    There are no trolls. There are no trees out here.
  18. Re:Weak argument, IMHO by W32.Klez.A · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Just because there is no central authority moderating the content on the network doesn't invalidate the 'p2p has legitimate uses' argument. In fact, I think it strengthens it. Instead of a central authority that can censor and control things that it disagrees with as well as what might be illegal, it simply can't control and lets the userbase decide was gets to be heard and seen.

    Then again, we're talking about the Kazaa network, and I'm pretty sure it'd be easy enough for them to block certain filenames/CRCs/Filesizes.