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Implanted RFID Tag To Replace Cash?
Kulic writes "Wired is running a story about using subdermal RFID microchips to pay for goods. Applied Digital Solutions are marketing the VeriChip as the world's only implantable ID technology. CEO Scott Silverman says they could someday replace credit cards, but a final product is a few years away. They are also receiving condemnation from some fundamentalist Christians who believe that this is the fabled 'mark of the beast' of biblical lore." waytoomuchcoffee adds a link to a similar story at CNet.
It'll not happen in the US. Waaaaaaaay too many fundamentalist Christians about. I agree with them on this one, not because it's the mark of the beast, but because I don't like the idea of something in my body being money. I still like the cred' stick idea from Shardowrun. Anonymous, secure and very convenient. Near impossible to counterfeit and no money to print.
But seriously, who is going to want a microchip embedded in their body just for paying for stuff. Apart from the odd wierdo, most people get completely creeped out by this kind of thing. There will not be a market for this, and unless some sinister government thinks for soome reason that it's worth forcing its citizens to use this technology it's just not going to happen, because nobody will use it voluntarily. I'm sure there are serious uses for this kind of technology, but payment systems just aren't one of them.
If I seem short sighted, it is because I stand on the shoulders of midgets
This elimiates the anonymous purchase. No more slinking into the adult bookstore for that copy of "Wendy the Whip" Quarterly (or whatever) that is purchased with cash so it doesn't show up on your bank statement for your wife to see.
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Seriously though, if you have absolute access to how someone spends their money, you essentially know everything about them. It becomes an extreme invasion of privacy making the technological hurdles somewhat minor in comparison to the social and political hurdles.
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Regarding the mark of the beast; given that this is an implantable device, I can't help but find it interesting that the "number of the beast" is also the Unix mode number for universal device access. Don't know if that means anything, but it is an interesting coincidence.
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A goal is a dream with a deadline
Just another example of people who think that just because something is technically possible and perhaps even practical in some cases, that is somehow automatically considered desireable.
Most people don't want this. Not now, probably not ever.
Credit cards have been around a long time too.. now wouldn't it be practical not to have to lug that heavy card around?
Why not have credit card numbers tattooed onto the card holder? That's been technically possible for a long time, and it could also be practical in some cases.
Would anyone suggest this? Why not? Same reasons.
Right now, if a mugger wants my wallet he can just take it instead of having to carve it out of my body.
It's the same as unremovable transmitter bands for children -- ie a horrible idea. If you're dealing with someone who is willing to kill or maim you to get money, the last thing you want to do is give them a reason to have to do it.
This is common sense.
The enemies of Democracy are
I'm a Christian, and I say bring it on! A Christian shouldn't have anything to fear! Any "body mark" that could be a *requirement* for global commerce just means that the Bible's predictions are right and the Christian can rejoice that the end is near. Yay!
Again, why should I be afraid???
Just to be clear though, I'm not saying *I'm* going to *sign-up* for one.
More specifically, stop treating us like ATM machines for coporations. What if I don't want to or like to spend money? What if I don't want to give my time (going to work), my dignity (begging for loans), my privacy (everywhere!) and now my very body to make if more convienient for companies to grab my cash.
This proposal is like someone who asks to fuck you before they've bought you flowers or even kissed you. At least have the decensy to lie to us that it's real purpose is "medical information" or "education" before swooping down on our wallets.
TW
What encryption? RFID as it stands has no challenge-response, it's just a static barcode readable by radio interference. When my number is stolen, do I get a new government-sponsored surgery to change numbers?
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Now why on earth would we worry. Strange that the text actually says in the hand or forehead, not on. I wish I could read the originals as they were written...
I'd say you should definitely refer to the originals (or at least a scholarly analysis thereof) before hinging anything on the semantic difference between "in" and "on".
It's the same problem that has all the Biblical literalists convinced that the earth is 6000 years old and it took exactly six twenty-three-hour-fifty-whatever-minute days to create the universe, because Ancient Hebrew the word for "day" could be translated several ways and somebody picked "day" instead of "era" or "eon".
Not that it matters in this case, because the meaning is clear regardless: Don't let anyone put identifying markers on, in, or up your body because they seek only to own you.
I think that's pretty good advice, no matter how sure you are the guy putting the mark on you isn't the anti-Christ.
The enemies of Democracy are
So now instead of handing a bloke with a gun my wallet I will have to hand in my hand to be cut off. No, thanks. Not smoking that one.
Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
http://www.sigsegv.cx/
ATM cards require confirmation in order to protect the contents of your bank account from someone who may have stolen or cloned your card. Credit Cards require a signature to ensure accountability and traceability. What do RFID tags do that makes them fundamentally secure?
Nothing, apparently. Not having to type in numbers or sign a receipt are touted as the advantages of the new system. Yet traditional cards could have easily forgone the secondary identification, simply by sacrificing the security we have come to expect.
By the proliferation of universal garage remotes out there, and RFID's lack of a challenge-response system, it's obvious that if you will be able to get within 3 feet of someone you can steal their identity without their knowledge. Without the secondary identification, the system is useless. With secondary identification, it's a credit card.
Furthermore, why implant? Everyone has to have their keys with them at all time... The speedpass route seems like the more intelligent and flexible way to go. Implanting could be convenient once all of the bugs are hammered out and it is accepted as a universal form of payment, but for a 1st generation technology likely to be upgraded quickly, why commit?
This reminds me a lot of the Dot Com days, when people attempted to sell anything that was possible, without even bothering to think if it should be done.
The ______ Agenda
The number of his name - that's your credit card number, above your name, right? The "name of the beast" - some formm of recognised ID with a corporate/government name on it? Sorry, fundies, you're too late - its already happened. Any attempt at a cashless society would appear to trigger this verse.
The Bible continues to say that the number of his (the anti-Christ) name is 666. I don't think it's the credit card number above your name.
So fundamentalists should abhor all banking and inist on cash transactions only (which avoids the usury the bible goes on about as well). In fact, notes have serial numbers and the "name of the beast" - the government - on them. So coins only. Cpuld make life difficult in this modern world.
Those who accept the mark will KNOWINGLY be pledging allegiance to the anti-Christ. I personally have nothing against technological advances. Believe me, though: no one will be fooled into taking the mark. All who take it will know to whom their allegiance lies.
which avoids the usury the bible goes on about as well
There's no point to forcing a cash-only society. The future has already been written. It's just a matter of time before it comes to pass.
When millions disappear from earth, it's not aliens, it's the rapture.
If it said that rape was ok in the bible it would most likely be socially acceptable at this point, as most of our societal rules have some roots in organized religion.
Viral software licensing is not freedom, it is in fact GNU/Socialism.
And I doubt Herr PolitzenFueher Ashcroft will have any chips planted in his body that the the Fatherland Security Department will find trackable. Nor his financial or demographic records. The Fatherland Security Act deems dissemination of such information, such as addresses or social security numbers of the Reich leaders as de facto terrorism with all the throw-your-ass-in-a-torture-chamber non-prison laws applying.
I'm not exagerating. Remember about a month ago when some people started skywriting personal information about (Ashcroft?)to prove a point about privacy? They couldn't give a whole number because that would have violated the Fatherland Security Act and they would have been yanked from public life for thirty years.
This is not funny.
>>For example devout Christians hate murder,
:)) and may be more likely to believe the stereotype.
> but didn't have much to say about Hitler did they?
> >and devout Christians hate rape.
>wow, such high principles. doesn't apply to not getting 14 year olds pregnant with the "son of God" though...
You forgot about the
UDAP.
Uniform Distribution of Assholes Principle: Assholes are distributed uniformly throughout the population.
Therefore, given a large enough group, that group will have some assholes. Assholes are generally louder and more obnoxious and try to troll people who aren't part of the group, so you notice them more when you're not in the group. Most fundamentalist Christians are perfectly ok. There are some assholes, simply because there are lots of fundamentalist Christians.
Not understanding the UDAP is the reason why so many people attacked Islam and Muslims in the US after Sept 11. They think that because some Muslims are assholes, all Muslims are assholes. When in reality, it's just that some of the Muslim assholes are now coming after the western world instead of causing trouble at home. It would be like saying that all Americans are evil if people like Timothy McVeigh had gone overseas to attack other countries as private citizens.
The UDAP can also be generalized to the UDFP: Uniform Distribution of Flaws Principle, which states that flaws in the human character are uniformly distributed throughout the population. Therefore, stereotyping works because given the statement "All (Group) are (Flaw)." There will be a member of group Group that has flaw Flaw, and in fact the listener may have observed this on one occasion (since flaws are pretty common.
Best. Comment. Ever. Enjoy!
First we must ask ourselves why people are even considering such technology? Is it convenience? Is it something else? The proponents of this technology tout things like security and convenience. The security is for those who want power - they want a way to know where the people who can threaten them are. I'm not talking about with weapons, either - I'm talking about with power, with ability. They attempt to get more mechanisms of control into society oh so subtly by making it "convenient" to do things. Think about this though - is it really faster to pay by credit card like the commercials say? They always say you need ID for checks, but I would hope to goodness they check ID with credit cards as well! So personally I think the convenience and security aspect is a farce.
The most secure financial situation, oddly enough, is a physical one - where there is actually hard currency. The reason? You actually have to posess the currency to use it. It's a whole lot more difficult to rob a safe than it is to tell a computer to move some numbers around (part of this difficulty is psychological - the rest is physical. You actually have to go somewhere and transport the currency. You have to get it, have something in which to carry it, and you have to get it to where you want it. Vastly different than computer crime - sit in a remote location, no immediate threats...you see what I'm saying, right?). Sure, with cash, you might get mugged. And if you're obscenely wealthy, you need a good place to store your cash. I think the financial gurus overlook the fact that posession is the most enforcable type of security (assuming, of course, you have a big enough stick to fend off any would-be theives).
I think the concept of sticking something unnatural in my body just to participate in commerce is fundamentally wrong, independent of my religious beliefs. Rather than just complain about this, here are some reasons:
It is segregatory: it automatically divides a population into the "priviledged" and "non-priviledge", the group who "works in the system" and those who "go against it", etc. etc. It's not like humanity needs any more reasons to focus on differences between people.
It is a "rite of passage". It may be arguable that "commerce" is an inherent right of people - if you're born, you have the ability to contribute to society and probably will get the resources and toys you want in exchange for that ability. Requiring some "entry" into this arrangement (either chip, or other form of ID) can only serve to cause more social rifts. Think about the present taboo of "illegitimate children" and how this will be exacerbated by "hey you don't have an ID chip! Why not!?!"
It objectifies people. One major problem I see today is that people forget that relationships are more important than things. The general population today is more and more selfish (I've mentioned this before) - look at all the "it's not my fault, it's theirs!" lawsuits. Look at how everyone is basically saying "let me do my thing how I want - but I'm going to tell you you can't do things how you want". When people are simply consumers and potential threats and all that jazz, we take something away from humanity.
I guess to summarize, and before I get much more too wordy with this, it seems that this is another example of being able to do something and not considering if it should be done. There are far more implications than mere ones of faith, though those may not be least important.
Somehow I feel as if all my deliberations on this have been random thinking, and I almost h
"There are a dozen opinions on a matter until you know the truth. Then there is only one." - CS Lewis (paraprhase)
I think people should stop personalizing this to John Ashcroft. It's not just him, or this administration. It's our entire corrupt government. Get rid of Ashcroft and they replace him with an idealogical clone. Elect a Democrat president and they replace him with an Democrat idealogical clone.
As long as we continue to allow our government to swill from the keg-o-power, it will continue to encroach on freedom and maintain a life of its own. This is historically axiomatic. America will eventually become tyranical if the people don't act to stop it before they loose that power completly.
It's no accident (though perhaps coincidence) that someone is developing a way to use RFIDs for commerce. It is money that is the source of all governmental power. When someone takes your money and gives nothing, they are taking away the time you spent earning it. Money is very much more important than people seem to understand, and in a society that is wealthy enough that even the poorest often have enough to buy luxuries, few seem to understand that taking it from you is not diferent than going into your pantry and taking the food from your shelves, or taking the tools from your shed, workbench, or desk.
Haven't you heard? Taking money from us isn't a *privilege* the corporations have, it's a *right.* Supporting them with your money isn't your choice, it's your duty. If you don't like it, too bad. They have enough resources to buy whatever legislation it takes to get you to comply.
This proposal is like someone who asks to fuck you before they've bought you flowers or even kissed you.
No it isn't. When someone asks for a quickie, you can say no. You don't have an option here. You're a consumer, not a citizen. You're a source of revenue, not a human being. So bend over already! And don't forget to buy some flowers this time.
Ph-nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn.
I can't wait to go wardriving for people's personal account info. Fun! Also, I can't wait for the future where when I get robbed, instead of just losing petty cash, I lose my entire account and I get my hand chopped off too. Even more fun.
But seriously though, why don't we all just have credit card size cards that require a pin to use, and instead of giving out an account number to sellers. It gives out a RSA signed transaction using the card's private key, and public x509 cert (issued by visa of course). And it does this through a connector on the edge that has a male on left female on right jack so you can just hook two cards together, or jack your card into your bank to get more cash. Doesn't this make a bit more sense. You can have cards that only carry a certain amount for petty cash.
Occam's razor is the blind faith in the natural selection of least resistance and in universal oversimplification. -- EF