ifconfig refactoring for FreeBSD

Dan writes "Based on Sam Leffer's suggestion, Bruce Simpson has been working on refactoring ifconfig(8). ifconfig is a FreeBSD unix utility used to assign an address to a network interface and/or configure network interface parameters. Bruce says that ifconfig has grown increasingly large and become unwieldy. Part of the effort has been to get a handle on all of the options that are currently supported so he has written a YACC grammar for it. He has uploaded some grammer, created a design document and also generated a PDF file you can view which shows you syntax diagrams for each part of the parse tree."

Comments

How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[Electrum]

While they are at it, they should add something to parse /etc/rc.conf and reconfigure all interfaces while the system is running. This is one area where Linux has an advantage.

Re:How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[zulux]

Hmmm...

Can't you just run /etc/rc.network and it will re-parse rc.conf?

Re:How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[changelingyahoo.com]

The quick answer is "Yes, you can." In FreeBSD 5 for instance you can change a line in rc.conf and then just rerun the script for the daemon that corresponds to it. It's a bit like the init.d scripts in Linux except with a big global variables file. In FreeBSD 4 you can do it as well, but if I recall the scripts in FreeBSD 4 often lump several daemons together into a single file so you might end up restarting more than one daemon. I may be wrong, though. Brian

Re:How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[Brandybuck]

Linux has an advantage in this area? Either you've been smoking crack, or I've been trolled. Go take another look at /etc/rc.conf. It doesn't need any special parsing, and reconfiguring network interfaces on the fly is simplicity.

Re:How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[phoenix_rizzen]

That's already in there: /bin/sh /etc/netstart

This reads the network settings from rc.conf and reconfigures the interfaces and routes based on that info.

Re:How about live /etc/rc.conf changes?

[Anonymous Coward]

Netstart is great if you are sitting at the machine, but if you face the possiblity of a screw up causing your ssh connection to die, ifconfig is a lot more exact. If I just need to add an IP alias or something like that there is no good reason to run netstart. I just ifconfig interface alias IP netmask and then edit /etc/rc.conf in case of a power outage or something.

Wondering what YACC is?

[a.koepke]

For those of you who do not know what YACC is all about

Its good to see something like this happening as ifconfig is not only used on FreeBSD but also on most (all?) Linux distros.

Ifconfig is just one of the many contributions the BSD projects have given to the Linux and UNIX community.

PS: To all those "bsd is dying" trolls, things like this show its not. Without the work of the BSD projects you wouldn't have some of the many tools you use each day.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[__past__]

Its good to see something like this happening as ifconfig is not only used on FreeBSD but also on most (all?) Linux distros.

They all have an ifconfig (even windows has, but it's spelled ipconfig), but a different one. The GNU version takes different arguments anyway - like for example none at all, which the FreeBSD version doesn't allow - so this will most likely not affect any Linux user in any way.

To all those "bsd is dying" trolls, things like this show its not. Without the work of the BSD projects you wouldn't have some of the many tools you use each day.

If the only sign of life of the BSDs would be a refactoring of one little command-line utility that has been around for decades, I think calling it "dead" would be a good approximation. Fortunatly it isn't. There are enough more interesting things going on the BSD world.

In other words, this is really one of the most boring stories ever, even considering the "let's duplicate the daemonnews slashbox" policy /. recently adopted.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

The GNU version takes different arguments anyway - like for example none at all, which the FreeBSD version doesn't allow - so this will most likely not affect any Linux user in any way.

You are an idiot.

user@hemlock$ ifconfig
rl0: flags=8843 mtu 1500
inet 192.168.1.5 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.1.255
inet6 fe80::248:54ff:fe85:5624%rl0 prefixlen 64 scopeid 0x1
ether 00:48:54:85:56:24
media: Ethernet autoselect (100baseTX )
status: active
lp0: flags=8810 mtu 1500
lo0: flags=8049 mtu 16384
inet6 ::1 prefixlen 128
inet6 fe80::1%lo0 prefixlen 64 scopeid 0x3
inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000
ppp0: flags=8010 mtu 1500
sl0: flags=c010 mtu 552
faith0: flags=8002 mtu 1500
user@hemlock$

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[CoolVibe]

The GNU version takes different arguments anyway - like for example none at all, which the FreeBSD version doesn't allow

Not true. From the ifconfig manpage in FreeBSD (actually DragonFly, but who cares. Dfly didn't change ifconfig):

The ifconfig utility displays the current configuration for a network interface when no optional parameters are supplied.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

no, he's correct.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[ctr2sprt]

In other words, this is really one of the most boring stories ever, even considering the "let's duplicate the daemonnews slashbox" policy /. recently adopted.

I think the issue here is that most Slashdot editors don't know or care about the BSDs, but they need to post some articles. Since they have no way of distinguishing between interesting news and uninteresting, they rely on other sites to assign importance. The effects of this are obvious: not a lot of replies, over half of them trolls, and people getting their BSD news elsewhere.

You heard it here first: The Slashdot BSD Section is Dying.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[overbom]

They all have an ifconfig (even windows has, but it's spelled ipconfig), but a different one. The GNU version takes different arguments anyway - like for example none at all, which the FreeBSD version doesn't allow

umm, no. ifconfig on freebsd with no arguments will run the equivalent of 'ifconfig -a'.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Pathwalker]

You might want to consider swapping out rl0 for a better card - read /usr/src/sys/pci/if_rl.c for details.

The RealTek 8139 PCI NIC redefines the meaning of 'low end.' This is
probably the worst PCI ethernet controller ever made, with the possible
exception of the FEAST chip made by SMC. The 8139 supports bus-master
DMA, but it has a terrible interface that nullifies any performance
gains that bus-master DMA usually offers.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

You might want to consider swapping out rl0 for a better card - read /usr/src/sys/pci/if_rl.c for details.


Indeed, if it were used for anything except slinging mail small lists I would bother. But it isn't, so it's fine. :-)

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[anthonyrcalgary]

el cheapo cards have their uses.

eg external interface on a NAT box where the cable modem's network port is 10 megabit half duplex.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[utlemming]

No, the problem is that when you actually submit an interesting BSD article for /., they ignore it. For example, how many of us BSD users knew that the BSD developers actually commented on the SCO suit?

"Your story just might not be interesting!

This last one requires a little explanation: if you submit a story, and we don't select it because we think it's not particularly interesting, we're not making a judgment about you as a human being. Deciding the interest level of a story is a very subjective thing, and we have to take into account not only the intrinsic interest of the story itself, but what else is happening that day. On a day when lots of things are happening, we reject some very good stories. But on a day when nothing interesting is happening, we may post something not really as cool.

This was taken from the /. FAQ

The conclusion that I have come to is that the /. editors just don't care about BSD. And the editors probably use the above quote to get out of anything us BSD users might find interesting. Mathmatically, it would be represented, "Linux == Interesting; BSD != Linux; BSD != Interesting" and since "BSD != Linux then BSD MUST be dying."

And I think that your absolutely right, about them not knowing what is worthy of reporting and what is not. When I first read the Refacturing of IFCONFIG, the thought that went through my mind was, "Who cares?" It really has no bearing on the useability of the OS. I think the real issue is that /. needs to put some one who actually uses BSD as an OS doing the editing. I think then, we might see some interesting.

Personally I think that the comment about BSD users getting BSD news elsewhere is pretty insightful. The only reason I read /. is because there are other technology issues which I am interested in and the Linux movement does facinate me. But nontheless, with the general bigotted spirit towards the BSD's, I can see why I, and most likely others go elsewhere.

A while back I fired off an email to address the concerns of us BSD users. The reply I got back from CdrTaco was essentially if more BSD users read /., then the trolls would be silenced with more BSD users moderating, and more /. stories would be about BSD, because there would be more submissions.

Well, I'll get off my soap box now, and wait till I get moderated down. Any bets on what it will be? Flamebait? Or maybe Off Topic. But moderators, if I can not be insightful or interesting, please vote for Flamebait.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

Fact: you are a troll who likes to dribble crap for his own pathetic amusement.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

And it is nice to see that freebsd moves on at last.
Linux users can use ip (iproute) for a few years now.
much cleaner syntax and more functionality.

so much for the "you are using the ip command ? well seems like linux is not unix anymore" bsd trolls...

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[edhall]

The ifconfig thread is interesting from a number of perspectives. Given that ifconfig is perhaps the command-line utility embodying BSD's decades-old networking legacy, it takes some courage to propose a radical reworking of it. Using a formal grammar rather than the ad hoc accretion of command-line options that 95% of Unix/Linux utilities use is another bold step. And opening the way to added functionality (one of the motivations for this project) adds to the interest. Sure, just looking at the surface it's easy to say "so they're changing some arguments to some crufty old Unix command -- ho hum." But it may well represent the initial step in a complete rethinking of how networking is administered at the host level. Even if it doesn't pan out that way, it's worth taking notice.

BTW, I don't moderate BSD stories any more. When I mod down the trolls, I tend to get slammed in metamod. (Talk about a hostile environment!) Hope springs eternal, though -- I keep thinking that /. will eventually start doing some housekeeping.

-Ed

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[a.koepke]

Now you see that is where your arguement falls to bits.

XFree86 is a product for Unix and Unix variants. XFree86 was developed during the 80's, a bit before the time of Linux.

Apache HTTPd started life as a series of patches to the NCSA HTTPd server which was available for most flavours of Unix, Linux being one of them. I wouldn't go as far as to claim it as part of any community since the software they develop is platform independant.

Now the Linux community does contribute code to these projects, just as members of the BSD and other communities do. I never said that we were doing more for Open Source than Linux was so I don't know why you are arguing a non-existant point. The Linux community has a much larger user base and more contributers. I think the BSD projects have made some great contributions to the Open Source community with many of them not even realised. One of the most prominent ones in OpenSSH, that was developed by the OpenBSD team and is now used on nearly all Unix variants.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

Linux users can use ip (iproute) for a few years now. much cleaner syntax and more functionality.

That's because Linux's ifconfig is a piece of crap, so Linux users have to move on.

Unix users use ifconfig because it is convenient and more or less uniform on Unixes.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

Justify your statements. So far it's all circular logic...

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[semanticgap]

The GNU version takes different arguments anyway - like for example none at all, which the FreeBSD version doesn't allow

When was the last time you used FreeBSD?

$ uname
FreeBSD
$ ifconfig
rl0: flags=8843<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,SIMPLEX,MULTICAST> mtu 1500
inet 192.168.1.10 netmask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.1.255
[snip]

FreeBSD has the best ifconfig of all Unices I've used. My favorite part is being albe to use the slash notation for the netmask, e.g. to add a secondary IP to fxp0, you can do:

# ifconfig fxp0 192.168.1.12/32 alias

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[chrysalis]

> you can do:
> # ifconfig fxp0 192.168.1.12/32 alias

Woah, impressive!

Have you ever used Linux?

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[jaxdahl]

I'm sure the Netgear FA 311 is even worse -- when it's in my server (epox 8k7a), it will not power off or reboot -- I have to pull the plug on it.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[TwistedSquare]

I have a netgear FA311 in my epox (8kha+), no problems like yours but I used to have a problem that often the network interface wouldnt work on boot (had to disable then enable the conn in win2k) and before that the drivers used to blue screen 2k (which is actually quite rare!) under heavy load of connections, though a patch fixed that.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Shanep]

The RealTek 8139 PCI NIC redefines the meaning of 'low end.'

I've heard that the C and D variant fixed a lot of issues and I've had great success with them.

However, I'd like to nominate a contender. Davicom. I've had some extreme difficulties getting some Davicom NICs working at all without dropping connection or extreme speed problems. Under Win2k SP4, Debian Linux and OpenBSD. Admittedly these were all on-board in two classrooms I was challenged with. So the problems may have been with the implementation of the Davicom chipset and the motherboard.

They would fail to complete unicast, multicast or directed Ghosting sessions. Replacing with RTL8139D's gave me what I expected, solid 100Mbit ethernet.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[semanticgap]

>> you can do:
>> # ifconfig fxp0 192.168.1.12/32 alias

> Woah, impressive!
> Have you ever used Linux?

ok, ok, so apparently you can do it on Linux too.... ... but do you still need eth:0, eth:1, etc for every secondary address?

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[chrysalis]

You must confuse with Solaris.

You can assign any number of addresses to a single interface without cloning it.

$ ip addr add 192.168.1.7/24 dev eth0
$ ip addr add 10.1.7.7/24 dev eth0
$ ip addr add 10.2.4.5/24 dev eth0 scope link

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

fact: you are a *BSD hippie high on cocaine and men's cocks.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[trybywrench]

awwwwww crap!!!! I use this chipset almost exclusively cause it has a cool little crab on the chip :P

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

you are a retard.

Re:Wondering what YACC is?

[Anonymous Coward]

>>Mathmatically, it would be represented, "Linux == Interesting; BSD != Linux; BSD != Interesting".

That would be a poor choice of representation. "Linux" and "BSD" are names of individuals (broadly), while "Interesting" is a predicate (name of a property). So either "Linux == Interesting" is a category error, or the "==" is used as the "is" of predication ("Linux is Interesting", i.e., "Linux has the property of being Interesting"). In this case though, since "!=" in "BSD != Linux" is used in the sense of identity and not predication, the argument equivocates on "is" and is not valid.

Using ifconfig w/out arguments

[RT Alec]

Starting with FreeBSD 4.x, ifconfig with no arguments simply lists all interfaces the kernel has found, and their configuration details.

%>ifconfig
de0: flags=8843<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,SIMPLEX,MULTICAST> mtu 1500
inet 10.0.254.254 netmask 0xffff0000 broadcast 10.0.255.255
ether 00:e0:29:37:09:a8
media: Ethernet autoselect (100baseTX <full-duplex>)
status: active
de1: flags=8c43<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,OACTIVE,SIMPLEX,MU LTICAST> mtu 1500
inet 10.1.254.254 netmask 0xffff0000 broadcast 10.1.255.255
ether 00:e0:29:37:09:a9
media: Ethernet autoselect
de2: flags=8c43<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,OACTIVE,SIMPLEX,MU LTICAST> mtu 1500
inet 10.2.254.254 netmask 0xffff0000 broadcast 10.2.255.255
ether 00:e0:29:37:0c:d6
media: Ethernet autoselect
de3: flags=8843<UP,BROADCAST,RUNNING,SIMPLEX,MULTICAST> mtu 1500
inet 10.3.254.254 netmask 0xffff0000 broadcast 10.3.255.255
ether 00:e0:29:37:0c:d7
media: Ethernet autoselect (10baseT/UTP)
status: active
lo0: flags=8049<UP,LOOPBACK,RUNNING,MULTICAST> mtu 16384
inet 127.0.0.1 netmask 0xff000000
wan0: flags=51<UP,POINTOPOINT,RUNNING> mtu 1500
inet 219.51.254.45 --> 219.51.254.46 netmask 0xfffffffc
%>

(the actual output has tabs to make the formatting a little prettier)

Refactoring?!?

[icklemichael]

Refactoring is meant to be about improving the design of existing code, in small controlled ways. This doesn't look like refactoring, just a rewrite of a section of it.

Either way I find it hard to appreciate why this is news.

GNU ifconfig - What?

[Anonymous Coward]

There is no "GNU ifconfig". Linux has it's own version which is probably based on an old BSD version, or, maybe written from scratch.

% ifconfig -V
net-tools 1.60
ifconfig 1.42 (2001-04-13)

You can tell it's not GNU because it doesn't spout on about the GPL everytime you run it.

Did he upload some speling, too?

[Mordant]

Just checking. ;>

What ever happened to "Small is Beautiful"?

[JohnQPublic]

A yacc grammar? That makes it official, ifconfig is now a contender for the ls Memorial Too Damn Many Options award. Other known entrants include ld, most X applications, and the ever-popular gcc.

Nice to see work on improving ifconfig

[nutznboltz]

Now if only the ARP interface could be improved too. Seems once the API for ARP was an ioctl() that was easy to use. Now try and write some code for *BSD to adjust the ARP table without going

• system("/usr/sbin/arp ...")

and you will see pretty quickly that it's much more complicated than any ioctl()

Conceptually, ARP table entries as routing table entries is great but the API is in need of some serious re-working or a library to hide the complexity.

Re:GNU ifconfig - What?

[Anonymous Coward]

btw, i got bashed by some bsd troll, cause we linux users tend to use the ip command, from the iproute package, nowadays... :)

nice to see that freebsd is moving along...

Cheapo = good

[JamesTRexx]

Even better, I use two realtek for internal interfaces and one 3com for the cable connection.
The 3coms don't like it when there's more than one in my firewall, the realteks work just fine. Only setting the macaddress didn't go well, so that's why the 3com on the outside.

Re:Cheapo = good

[anthonyrcalgary]

As long as no one pretends that they can keep up with the better cards, they'll be fine. There's just no reason to use anything better than a realtek on a computer where the system load doesn't matter (eg: dedicated NAT box) with a network that's slow to begin with.

BSD rocks!

[Anonymous Coward]

We use it all our web servers. Just look at Netcraft for longest uptime, every single machine runs on BSD. Who are these wierdos claiming BSD is dead? Stupid fools!

yhbt

[Anonymous Coward]

yhl hand

After the horse has entered and reaches a climax t

[Anonymous Coward]

After the horse has entered and reaches a climax

the head swells

(though it is more spongy then hard) into a fist sized mass as he ejacultates.

NOONE SHOULD ATTEMPT VAGINAL OR ANAL INTERCOURSE W

[Anonymous Coward]

NOONE SHOULD ATTEMPT VAGINAL OR ANAL INTERCOURSE WITH A STALLION

unless they have are experienced

in fist fucking or have taken a large dog in to the max ( IE knot and all). A horse has an enormus cock and could do serious damage to someone who is not prepared

Linux's iproute2+tc

[szap]

FWIW, Linux 2.4+ has a significantly different way to access and config the kernel's network interfaces using iproute2+tc (using the commands 'ip' and 'tc') that is cleaner than the ifconfig syntax, and supports more advanced routing features (all sorts of firewalling rules and, packets queues, for instance).

ifconfig is just the older, more compatible way to config the interfaces for those who grew up using older Linuxes and other Unices. You can do everything ifconfig + iptables using ip + tc and more.

So before anyone claims that Linux's ifconfig sucks and is too complicated, they've already made a better replacement for it, just needs more documentation and exposure.

Re:Linux's iproute2+tc

[chrysalis]

Please mod this up.

"ip" is definitely great and I really miss that command on BSD systems.

Not only it is way more powerful that ifconfig, it is also easier to use, with a very logical and comprehensive syntax ("ip route add default via 192.168.1.221")

Refactoring "ifconfig" nowadays sounds like a total waste of time IMHO. Hopefully Dragonfly will take a more modern approach.

Re:Linux's iproute2+tc

[df5ea]

You can do everything ifconfig + iptables using ip + tc and more.

Try to do ifconfig eth0 allmulti with ip.

Re:Linux's iproute2+tc

[jjgm]

"ip" is a well-structured command, although the interactions between iproute2 and ifconfig-based interface aliases confuse people (my usual advice is: one or the other).

"tc" is a complex elephant in considerable need of exposure to someone who both a) cares about qdisc and b) understands OS usability. ip & tc are hardly comparable. The "shapecfg" command is more intuitive, but communicates with a completely separate and underdeveloped kernel subsystem.

iptables then has another syntax to learn, just to drive home the point that these subsystems are not well integrated. You can't do everything iptables/Netfilter can in ip+tc; please don't claim this. Functionally, it's almost orthogonal. Fortunately, there are patches available that permit Netfilter firewalls to hook into iproute2/tc and vice versa.

It's not really a happy situation, and designing complex network behaviour for Linux is still an exercise in trial, error, patch integration, and hours of googling.

Stupid idiots in denial about great BSD

[Anonymous Coward]

BSD blows away Windows and Linux, Mac OS X is based on BSD. BSD is the most stable OS out there today, just look at Netcraft's longest up times! Face the facts you pathetic freaks, BSD is here to stay!

Re:Stupid idiots in denial about great BSD

[Anonymous Coward]

Fact: *BSD Is Dying

Very anrgy Linux heads out there

[Anonymous Coward]

.... can't accept BSD is a superior OS!

The 'trolls' here know it is a pro-them enviro.

[Anonymous Coward]

I keep thinking that /. will eventually start doing some housekeeping.

Notice how the trolls don't hit other BSD sites or the BSD mailing lists?

Here they can keep posting the same crap over and over and nothing is done.

More of the "Open Source is great so long as it is Linux" attitude. *sigh*

Re:the march of time

[Anonymous Coward]

You stupid ignorant fool, another freak in denial! LOL

Re:STRANGE ATTRACTORS

[Anonymous Coward]

>It is a fact: *BSD is dying Tell that to Yahoo you sack of sh*t!

Re:GNU ifconfig - What?

[serial frame]

Let's not give the GNU guys any ideas. ;)

YHBT YHL HAND, YOU SACK OF SHIT!

[Anonymous Coward]

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

haha. I can't believe you call that sack of overpriced Apple shit a "supercomputer"

no ECC memory
no redudant powersupply
not even sure if these things have RAID

and since its from Apple, you get a propietary, closed-source operating system running on their locked-down hardware

No thanks.

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

Go cry in a corner: http://news.com.com/2100-7337_3-5095026.html Mac-based system cost just over $5 million and is #3 fastest supercomputer in the world The other top machines cost $250 million.

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

no one serious would trust their data to that Mac cluster.

did you even read anything of what I said?

oh thats right, you're a knee-jerk "BSD RULES!!!!11!" luser

learn how to make proper links, btw

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

Learn how to spell you "loser"!

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

aww, you ran out of arguments so you had to nitpick my spelling

typical BSD luser - low IQ and prefers an inferior OS

Mac OS X is BSD based and is dying

[Anonymous Coward]

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Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

>low IQ and prefers an inferior OS

Is that why you use Windows?

FOAD! You have been reverse-trolled!

[Anonymous Coward]

YHBRT! YHL! FOAD! HASD!

Bwahahahah, you Lunix fuck!

Re:Mac OS X is BSD based

[Anonymous Coward]

Since it was directed towards you, you can answer it.

No YOU WERE TROLLED!

[Anonymous Coward]

You were double-reverse trolled, BSD fucktard!

Fact: You are dying.

Re:Smart people use FreeBSD

[Anonymous Coward]

BSD is for people who like to be on life support

ifconfig is pure BSD compatibility on Linux

[Anonymous Coward]

If you need yacc to parse a command line,
something is seriously wrong.

The ifconfig on Linux is a compatibility
wrapper. Native commands, like "ip" and
"ethtool", are more powerful and easier to
use as well. Through ifconfig, you can only
see an approximation of the true and correct
status of your network config. All the
advanced Linux concepts get brutally mapped
to BSD-style concepts. For example, Linux
lets you assign multiple IP addresses to a
single interface without using aliases.
Routing is different as well; the default
route, broadcast, and gateway are not what
you'd deal with in the native interface.

So a Linux user may as well delete ifconfig.
Using the native tools is much more sensible.