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Voting Machines Vs. Slot Machines

dmh20002 writes "Being a Nevada resident and knowing people who write code for slot machines, I was aware of the stringent measures the state of Nevada uses to vet the security of slot machines. The Nevada Gaming Control Board audits everything about them, both physical and soft, for unintentional and intentional security holes. Hearing the hoopla on voting machines, the contrast was obvious. Slot machines are about money, which is more important than votes, apparently. Now the state of Nevada is looking at electronic voting machines and plan to apply some of the same safeguards. Just applying the Nevada technical standards for gaming machines and vendors to voting machines would be a start, since there don't seem to be any standards for voting machines. A funny/sad sideline is that in Nevada, every year or two a programmer or engineer goes to jail for exploiting slot machines."

14 of 299 comments (clear)

  1. I've actually programmed slot machines by elfuq · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Now that was a fun contract. However, yeah, the security restrictions were remarkable.

  2. Heh... by FortKnox · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Ever heard of 'the magic wand'? Or the 'coin whip'? The minute a slot machine with 'new security measures' is released, there are people that break it the very next minute. The way they keep things going? Good surveilence and good guards.

    Good luck putting cameras in every voting booth. People won't mind, right??

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    Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
    1. Re:Heh... by TheCarp · · Score: 5, Interesting

      And hence... diebold.

      If someone has enough interest they will break it. I supose thats really the morla of the story. And if you do come up with a way to make the voting booth secure... well then they will just run candidates in the two most major parties that are each kind of non-offensive in their own ways but when you boiul them down are basically exactly the same....

      Oh wait... they have been doing that for years.

      Anyone else tired of haviong to choose between the idiot sons of the rich?

      -Steve

      --
      "I opened my eyes, and everything went dark again"
    2. Re:Heh... by iocat · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Check out the economic theory called The Hotelling Effect -- if there are only two options, each will become more similar to the other in order to grab the people who are in the middle ground.

      A good example is a beach, X units long, with two snack carts on it. Assume one is at .25X and one is at .75X -- they each have access to .5X and will get half the consumers on the beach who want snacks (assuming people walk to the nearst carts, prices, selection and service are the same, etc.). Now say the first guy moves to .33X. He still gets everyone from 0 - .33X coming to him, but now gets half the people from .33X - .75X, stealing business from guy 2, who promptly moves to .66X to make up for it. Eventually they end up at .49X and .51X (or both at .50X if you want), glaring at each other, each still getting 50% of the business, any intermediate gains lost.

      And of course, the people at the ends of the beach get screwed. Now think of the snack shops as Republicans and Democrats. There ya go.

      --

      Dude, I think I can see my house from here.

  3. Sigh, Poor Programmer - Rich Casino by Pavan_Gupta · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Honestly, I felt pretty bad after reading about that computer programmer who had two daughters and stole $50,000 dollars. Yes, it seems crazy, but the guy admitted to everything and he had never been convicted of anything, and then all of a sudden he's in jail for at least 28 months. Poor guy, and his daughters -- I'm sure they were quite shocked.

    Sometimes, I think justice in the US may be too harsh. It's a bit out of place when you repent, and obviously don't have a record to show you'll continue with crime, but are still left to rot in a prison where raw grunts rape people. Oh well.

    Well, at least he made the casino industry quite rich. They must've been happy.

  4. it's a matter of who gets cheated by frovingslosh · · Score: 4, Interesting
    A funny/sad sideline is that in Nevada, every year or two a programmer or engineer goes to jail for exploiting slot machines."

    While it's worth noting because it shows the potential to cheat even in a closely watched industry (which the voting machine racket clearly isn't), one should note that programmer or engineer (who) goes to jail for exploiting slot machines is trying to cheat the casino. When the casino uses the software to cheat the player ist's a completely different issue.

    --
    I'm an American. I love this country and the freedoms that we used to have.
  5. Re:Audit trail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    And think about this. Every time you interact with the government, they want to see your ID, from a routine traffic stop, to buying a fishing license. The only time they don't ask is when I go vote in Maryland. What's up with that? They just ask for the name of whatever dead person your are pretending to be.

  6. Gaming Control Board: Corrupt? by handy_vandal · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The poster notes:

    The Nevada Gaming Control Board audits everything about them, both physical and soft, for unintentional and intentional security holes.

    And further:

    A funny/sad sideline is that in Nevada, every year or two a programmer or engineer goes to jail for exploiting slot machines."

    The sideline article notes that convicted slot-hacker Ron Harris was a gaming board official for several years, and that he provided "more than nine hours of videotaped statements concerning questionable activities in the control board and the gaming industry."

    Maybe Harris is covering his tracks by spreading dirt. Then again, maybe the Gaming Control Board is dirty. In any case, comparing voting with gambling makes me fear for my country.

    -kgj

    --
    -kgj
    1. Re:Gaming Control Board: Corrupt? by elton · · Score: 4, Interesting
      maybe the Gaming Control Board is dirty

      The Ron Harris case was not one of the board being dirty, it was of an individual being dirty. The other side of the coin is that there were few checks for Ron and he had a lot of trust. Shortly after this happened, Sandia National Labs came in and audited the Gamining Control Board for free. Turns out they were interested in the gaming industry since they are the only other place where EPROM use is so critical and they had interest in finding out how the board handled it.

      At any rate, Sandia produced a huge report that showed the Board's short comings including being understaffed in the Electronic Services Division. The Board took the report to the legislature and got a budget approved that allowed them to hire more engineers to work in the lab. They also implemented all of the procedural changes that Sandia recommended. So this actually improved the proceedures of the board. Similar to a new exploit found in the kernel, right.

      I got a job there shortly after the approval of hiring more engineers. The people that work for the Nevada Gaming Control Board are all honest, hard-working people. I don't work there any more, but I keep in touch with some of them. The consensus of those that knew Ron was that he had worked hard to build cases against slot cheats only to have their wrists slapped. He knew he could do a better job of it than they did. The only problem of course was that he abused the trust of the people because of the position he held. The judge made an example out of him. And rightly so, I think.

  7. Money IS more important than votes by Minna+Kirai · · Score: 4, Interesting

    If you look at things statistically, a little money is much more valuable to an individual than his one vote.

    Consider first the probability that one vote will actually change the outcome of an election: it's nearly impossible. Odds of 1/10e7 are typical. Mathmatically, a vote is just as bad an investment as a lottery ticket. (Which are, as they say, a "Tax on people who can't do math")

    Then consider the real difference choosing a different president or governor will make to your life: not much, really. The two dominant political parties have grown very similar to each other. They'll rarely try to make a significant change (and most changes they attempt will be cancelled out by the other party in the next election). So not only is a vote unlikely to pay off, but that payoff isn't likely to change very much.

    Thus, looking at all the possibilities, a rationally self-interested person will not waste his time voting. The hour+ it takes out of your day is actually much more valuable than the tiny chance that the vote you cast actually has a benefit to your life.

    This is why explicit selling of votes was criminalized: because if it were legal, the free-market would reveal how cheap each vote really is!

    PS. Having computed that voting is a waste of time, why do people still vote? Altruism. They vote not only for themselves, but also to share their wisdom with the rest of the country. And for more selfish reasons- like the feeling of success when your guy wins.

    PPS. Several mathmaticians have created alternative voting schemes (different from simple majority) which boost the chance that any single vote will change the outcome of an election. But the public, so far, has rarely been interested.

  8. BTW, I recently voted in Virginia.... by snatchitup · · Score: 4, Interesting

    and experience the problem/controversy. You can do a google on this controversy for more info.

    My experience went as follows. I stepped in the voting booth. It was a very nice touch screen layout.

    1/2 way through making my selections.. Up popped a message that my laptop battery was about to die, and that I'd better plug the machine in, etc. Well, I looked, and it was plugged in.

    It turned out that these were not very secure systems at all. The basic platform was Windows on a laptop running non-networked. Storing the data on each machine, to later be combined / counted.

    We're a long way from having anything better than punching a card, and eating chads. A hacker could easily do way more damage.

    In the above case.... I was at the voting place early. I was #14 in my precinct to vote.

  9. Re:Audit trail by segment · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Actually there are a shitload of rules in place to ensure the odds are high but the casino doesn't cheat you. Its pretty much regulated. As for the voting machines, they too have methods of making things secure, and a lot of research is done on the subject e.g:

    A public key cryptosystem and a signature scheme based on di.. (context) - ElGamal - 1985
    Receipt-free secret-ballot elections (context) - Benaloh, Tuinstra - 1994
    A practical secret voting scheme for large scale election (context) - Fujioka, Okamoto et al. - 1992
    Multi-authority secret ballot elections with linear work - Cramer, Franklin et al. - 1996
    Verifiable secret-ballot elections (context) - Benaloh - 1987
    Universally verifiable mix-net with verification work indepe.. (context) - Abe - 1998
    Designated verifier proofs and their applications - Jakobsson, Sako et al. - 1996
    Elections with unconditionally- secret ballots and disruptio.. (context) - Chaum - 1988
    How to prevent buying of votes in computer elections (context) - Niemi, Rendall - 1994
    Public-key cryptosystems based on discrete logarithms residu.. (context) - Paillier - 1999
    Some remarks on a receipt-free and universally verifiable mi.. - Michels, Horster - 1996
    Receipt-free electronic voting schemes for large scale elect.. - Okamoto - 1997
    A secure an optimally efficient multi-authority election sch.. (context) - Cramer, Gennaro et al. - 1997
    Receipt-freeness in largescale elections without untappable .. - Magkos, Burmester et al. - 2001
    An Improvement on a practical secret voting scheme (context) - Ohkubo, Miura et al. - 1999

  10. Re:Think Lotto machine by Linux_ho · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The only change needed would be to have the voters deposit their receipts in a ballot-box on the way out. Most places have laws which prevent voters from getting any kind of receipt for their vote. This is to try to keep politicians from being able to easily buy votes.

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    include $sig;
    1;
  11. That's not sad, its disgusting by daVinci1980 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    That guy wasn't just some programmer, he's the same guy who rigged the Keno game out in Atlantic city and got caught.

    Keno, as a refresher (and correct me if I'm wrong) is similar to the lottery, except that you have to choose eleven numbers, and in order to be a big winner, your numbers must match the ordering of the pulled numbers.

    In fact, it is so unlikely that anyone would match all 11 numbers in order that no one has done it in the history of the game. (Except this guy, who rigged the game).

    *ANY* other person who has the same amount of greed and exploits his position to gain his means deserves the same punishment.

    --
    I currently have no clever signature witicism to add here.