EU Agrees to Share Airline Passenger Data with US

securitas writes "The European Union has agreed to provide the US government with detailed airline passenger data. The agreement allows the collection of 34 pieces of data per person and limits storage of the data to three and a half years. 'The United States originally wanted to collect 60 pieces of data and keep it for 50 years.' Previously, the EU had objected to the plan because it violated EU privacy legislation, the data-protection directive. The plan is similar to the CAPPS II passenger profiling system. The data may be used for 'secondary purposes' other than anti-terrorism measures if requested from US Customs by other law enforcement agencies."

Comments

What's new?

[Tune]

EU legislation is one thing, but most major European airlines have freely shared ALL passenger info with the US authorities for almost two years, despite questions and objections by various political bodies. The message is clear: If you care about liberty, privacy and those sort of things and you're not an American, than just stay out. Thanks to the 9/11 attacks, the Bush administration now has world-wide carte blance to invade anyone's privacy.
</Rant>

--
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable -- John F. Kennedy

Re:What's new?

[fuzzybunny]

Good point you make. Unfortunately, that's not entirely an option for a lot of us.

Bush aside (a lot of this horseshit's been going on for years before he entered the picture--think "war on drugs", "encryption export controls", etc.) there's a long-running problem a lot of Europeans have with the dichotomy of "US the beacon of liberty and progress" and US home of John Ashcroft & his ilk."

I'm a US-Swiss dual citizen living in Europe--I've seriously considered giving up my US passport due to ideological concerns. I haven't done so, as I have a lot of close family in the US, whom I like to see, and stand to inherit some property. Sort of a conundrum, no?

Likewise, it's not much of a choice if you live in a country which has something like biometric identification in its passports mandated by the US departmen of . What if I never wanted to enter the US, but maybe decided to head over to France for the weekend? Tough cookies, please place your retina here.

Re:What's new?

[misterpies]

Firstly, what's crime to do with it. It's not a crime to be a communist, but they won't let a foreigner into the US if they have been. Now they'll be able to screen out anyone who fits into their perceived profile of a threat. You're a vegetarian and a member of Greenpeace? Must be one of those anti-capitalist protesters.

Second, you don't know what's going to be a crime in the future. One day you're donating to a Pakistani religious charity, the next day you're supporting terrorism. The law ain't static.

Re:Source of all that data?

[Tune]

> How can they get such information, and why do they? This is a concern even before they start making it available to anyone.

Inaccurate data gathered by sloppy / unlawful means could make US customs using
the date all the more dangerous.

--
To know that you know what you know, and that you do not know what you do not know, that is true wisdom -- Scooby Doo
[...] as we know, there are known knowns, there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know. -- Donald Rumsfeld
(Whatever)

Re:Sheesh

[the Man in Black]

The right to privacy would be a double-edged sword. I can see corporations claiming right to privacy on business data and the like. I don't think that corporations should be viewed as "citizens" under the law anyway, but that's me.

I still, however, maintain that a constitutionally guaranteed right to individual privacy (encompassing medical information, all activities in or around a home or residence, purchases and other financial information, and library rentals) would do more good, especially under our current neo-Draconian administration, with it's flagrant disregard for the individual.

Sorry, that almost turned into a political rant. *goes to get more coffee*

Re:Source of all that data?

[fuzzybunny]

I've read a few articles expounding on this; the point wasn't _just_ that it violates a principle of privacy and sovereignty, but also puts forward the question, "do you realize exactly what kind of data airlines collect on you?"

Think about it. Dietary habits, travel patterns. Possibly medical history. What else? What do you think ticket agents are writing on those screens you can't see during checkin, when they're frantically typing away? I don't know, do you? The consensus appeared to be that airlines keep some pretty quirky stuff on file about you, including the occasional nasty comment.

What kind of information do you give away when signing up for frequent flyer programs, including that airline miles credit card? Bang, there go your spending habits.

Not sure I'm comfortable with Uncle Sam having that as a matter of routine.

Re:I've canceled by US trips

[Anonymous Coward]

Took you long enough. I stopped visiting US last year, and I know many other Canadians who don't go there anymore (starting from as far as 2 years ago). It's just too much of a hassle with their "Patriot Act" and all the privacy invasions.

It's too bad, the US is just shooting themselves in the foot by discouraging us from spending our money there. The ironic part is that I saved a lot of money from my days of working in US (before they discovered terrorism), and now I get to spend it all in Canada, Europe and other countries, just about anywhere except where I got it from.

Re:My experience

[YrWrstNtmr]

What conclusions could they possibly draw from my verbal answer to "What is your annual income?".

They don't care about your actual income. They're just looking for a range, and if you can give a valid answer.

For instance, a Turk comes to the US, purporting to be an American, and is asked his job and his annual income.
He might hem and haw for a few seconds doing the conversion in his head (strike 1)
And he may well be off by a factor of 10 or 100.

"Job?"
"computer programmer"
"annual income?"
[let's see...in Turkey, that's 57,000,000,000 lira - in US$ that's...] "4,000!"(strike 2)

"Right, buddy...lets go."
57 billion TRL is ~$40,000