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Black Holes No More -- Introducing the Gravastar

Posted by Cliff on from the yet-another-cosmic-theory dept.

Mark Eymer observes: "From the Space.com article: 'Emil Mottola of the Los Alamos National Laboratory and Pawel Mazur of the University of South Carolina suggest that instead of a star collapsing into a pinpoint of space with virtually infinite gravity, its matter is transformed into a spherical void surrounded by "an extremely durable form of matter never before experienced on Earth."' While these objects may abound in the universe, they also say that our entire universe may reside within a giant gravastar." This new theory attempts to fill holes in the currently accepted concept of the "black hole".

12 of 670 comments (clear)

  1. It's turtles all the way down! by Gothmolly · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "While these objects may abound in the universe, they also say that our entire universe may reside within a giant gravastar." That statement makes no sense - its saying that everything that exists or can exist, exists inside something else. Where does THAT exist? This sounds a lot like the Skinner Constant, or Finagle's Fudge Factor. (the number in engineering, which when added to, subtracted from, multiplied or divided by, gives you the right answer).
    +1 karma to anyone who gets the title of this post

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    I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
    1. Re:It's turtles all the way down! by pr0t0 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Memory fading, but I'll be close...

      The title comes from the retelling of a story in Carl Sagan's Broca's Brain where a 17th century philosopher/physicist (which one I can't remember) is giving a lecture on how the Earth moves in the Solar System, floating in space. A woman stands and claims the theory is ridiculous. She states everyone knows that the Earth rests on the back of a giant turtle. To which the scientist asks, "Well then, what is the turtle resting on?"

      Her reply? "Very clever young man, but it's turtles all the way down!"

      It's a great book.

      Sig: I'm sorry but your opinion seems to be wrong.

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      I'm sorry, but your opinion seems to be wrong.
  2. So the real question is.... by Alan · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So what's on the outside of this giant gravstar we're in? :)

  3. Re:where is the peer review? by soapbox · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Per Thomas Kuhn's theory on the structure of scientific revolutions, real changes in the way we understand science always start out as a crackpot theory. see the Reciprocal Systems website for more. My Uncle is an adherent of this theory, and he has some uncanny evidence for why it is applicable to real physics, large and small.

    While conventional thinking won't get you put in a nuthouse, nor will it solve the dilemmas of physics. Even physicists say this.

  4. Old news by HarmlessScenery · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Almost identical story appeared 2 years ago:
    CNN version

    Maybe there's a time dilation effect near a Gravastar? ;)

  5. Re:ah.... by Fishstick · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...and each gravastar holds an entire universe which holds a finite number of gravastars each containing yet another universe and so on...

    kind of like the russian dolls metaphor, eh?

    Question: why would we assume that there is ever an outermost gravistar that holds the universe and then ... nothing? Wouldn't it be easier on the limited human intellect to just assume that the gravistar->universe->gravistar-> encapsulation is infinite in each direction?

    Reminds me of Farnsworth's "universe in a box" experiment where each universe held a number of boxes each leading to a parallel universe in which Farnsworth had created a number of boxes which each holding a parallel universe ....

    "Good news, everyone..."

    Ow, my brain has just been subjected to a paralyzing blow -- think I'll take the rest of the day off and drink vodka tonics until the throbbing goes away. ;-)

    --

    There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
    Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.

  6. Nearly two years old... by damien_kane · · Score: 3, Interesting

    At the top of the article:

    Thick-Skinned Gravastars Vie to Replace Black Holes, in Theory
    By Robert Roy Britt
    Senior Science Writer
    posted: 09:52 am ET 23 April 2002

    Now c'mon, I can understand someone being dumb enough to post something from April 2003 and think it's news, from from 2002? And editors accepting it, damn...

  7. Re:ah.... by mahdi13 · · Score: 3, Interesting
    ...and each gravastar holds an entire universe which holds a finite number of gravastars each containing yet another universe and so on...
    That is very similar to the Microverse theory where if you we to shrink small enough (or grow) you will eventually pass through the limit of the current Microverse into another one.

    This may also help explain how the Wormhole theories work between Black Holes and White Holes (Black being an entrance and White being an exit)...maybe the White Holes are exits from another Gravistar? Thus crossing dimensions...
    OOhhh...I want the movie rights! =)
    --
    "Some things have to be believed to be seen." - Ralph Hodgson
  8. if we're in a gravastar... by fudgefactor7 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...then how do they explain that our universe seems to be accellerating in its expansion? Unless all the matter and gravitational forces are centered on the "shell" of the bubble...which seems to defy all current theories. Should not the bubble collapse inward upon itself as each section of the shell pulls on opposing sections?

    The gravastar seems more weird than a generally accepted black hole.

    1. Re:if we're in a gravastar... by ozzee · · Score: 3, Interesting
      ..then how do they explain that our universe seems to be accellerating in its expansion?

      Ah... If this theory is true, then there are more than 4 dimensions. If you look at some of the string theory stuff, you'll see that it's quite possible it's inside a new "brane" (a special case string than is a mem'brane'). This is but one answer.

      It's also quite possible if you look at the universe, we are not "expanding" at all, in fact it is just as likely that we are imploding. (that faint sound you hear is the "BIG SUCK", not the big bang after-all !)

      Some of the "dark matter" observations may be explained by this kind of theory.

  9. The "other side of" the same gravistar. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So what's on the outside of this giant gravstar we're in? :)

    The "other side" of the same gravistar.

    It's like "what's beyond the north pole" on a sphere.

    On the surface of a sphere there is no "beyond the edge". Inside a kliensphere there is no "beyond the rim", because there is no rim.

    Imagine the space in the universe is the 2-D surface of the water hanging from a dripping faucet. You're on the new-forming drip. Then the drip comes lose. The surface you're on closes into the surface of the drop. In 2-D there IS no beyond - you need an extra dimension for that.

    Now consider a dripping faucet in 4-space, where the "surface" of the 4-D drop is the 3-D space of our universe.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  10. This isn't really a "new" idea... by rjoseph · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Emil has been working on this for years, and he's presented it at numerous conferences over the past year or so, including one I attended in Santa Fe over the summer. Check out this article, published Jan. 22, 2002 as well.