"DVD-Jon" Demands Compensation

orzetto writes "Jon Lech Johansen, known as DVD-Jon, and aquitted in a trial in Norway, after being accused of infringement for making a GUI for DeCSS, is now demanding that Norwegian Oekokrim pay for all the time and money he has lost to the trial, claiming 150,000 NOK (about 17,500 euros)."

Comments

FYI

[Omega1045]

That is about $22,000. I would want my money back, too.

Re:FYI

[dabadab]

As this was a criminal case, he got a free defender from the Norvegian state.

Re:FYI

[m0rphin3]

Lawyers are much cheaper in Norway.

Plus he got one appointed by the state, so they're footing the bill. You don't have to pay for your own defence.

If it had been a "private" (IANAL) lawsuit, like his neighbor suing him for playing loud music or whatever, he's just a kid with a minimal income so Norwegian law would grant him a free defence.
Not 'pro bono', the state would pay for his lawyer, so even poor people can get high-profile attorneys.

What he's asking for is just some compensation for lost income, the hours wasted in court,etc.

Re:FYI

[IdleTime]

He could actually pick and choose laywers and no matter who he chooses, the state will pay an already agreed upon per hour fee for the lawyer.

Norway has a pretty good system to ensure that you as a civilian can get a fair and decent trial despite your lack of money. I.e no big corp can push you over in the judical system. The law is trying to be fair in that area.

Re:FYI

[EinarH]

As far as I know the free lawyers are decent. Of course there is always someone who should not have become lawyers but overall most of them are good.

In criminal cases the state normally pays all the cost on behalf of the client. You can pick your own lawyer and usually you will get the lawyer you picked if the lawyer is available. Most of the folks charged with murder pick one of the "top guys". They normaly charge a bit more than what the state pays as a standard fee so you have to pay the extras by yourself. Nothing compared to what US lawyers charge though.

And the stakes are lower in Norway. Even if they had found DVD-Jon guilty, ---> maximum 2 years and maybe the equivalent of about $20,000 in fines.

Re:FYI

[dabadab]

Well, the Norwegian system is different: basically all lawyers are "public defenders", so you can have a pretty well-known lawyer as your defender for free (as in paid indirectly by your taxes :-) )

Re:FYI

[vidarh]

Yes, usually they are good. Norway doesn't have a system of public defenders employed by the government, but a system where lawyers are remunerated on an hourly basis (with some limits) and where most lawyers will accept cases as public defenders. There are occasionally cases where lawyers are unwilling to accept cases at the government rates, but it's rare.

If you are uncomfortable with the lawyer allocated for your defense you are always legally entitled to choose your own lawyer, and in most such cases the lawyer you choose can then be paid by the government at the fixed hourly rate.

This system also cover civil lawsuits if your salary and savings are below certain levels. In many cases you can get the government to cover your lawyers fees as a plaintiff in civil cases as well, provided the case meets certain criteria and your salary and savings are below the threshold.

Personally, I once got a publicly allocated defender as I was being drafted (Norway has compulsory military service) and refused to accept their denial of my application to be exempted.

The case never went to trial (I got it thrown out of court :)), but the lawyer I was allocated was actually one of the most prominent lawyers in Norway, with 30 years experience in similar cases. He took time to read all the documents, talked to me on the phone, had a very relaxed meeting with me in his office, not worrying about how much time we spent. I'm sure not everyone has as pleasant experience with their publicly allocated defenders as I had, but in general I think the system works fairly well.

(ObDisclaimer: IANAL)

Re:FYI

[JGski]

> Are the free lawyers actually any good in Norway?

Well, in his case he faced Double Jeopardy (illegal in the US... at the moment, who knows with more Patriot Acts in the future) and still was cleared, twice. Either his public lawyer was pretty gosh darn good or the prosecution's case was spectactularly bad even with the laws that were on the books.

Re:FYI

[vidarh]

You get a good lawyer by a) hoping you get a good one because a good one was available and was assigned the case by the government as part of the public defender system, or b) if you get one you don't like you shop around and find a good one that is available and ask him to take the case for government rates (which are quite high) which he likely will.

This is the way "socialism" works in Norway (a country generally far more left wing than the UK)

There are occasional cases where lawyers hesitate to take cases at government rates, but few lawyers would be able to charge hourly rates much higher than what the government pays as part of the public defender system anyway, so it doesn't happen often.

As for your characteristic of the UK health system, I know there are types of surgery for instance where you have to wait, but based on experience to people close to me you can often get surgery very quickly too. The system is far from perfect, but it's good enough that private health insurance in the UK is usually offered as "incremental protection" where you go to a private hospital only when the public hospitals have too long waiting lists, and where you will usually rely on public hospitals for emergency services etc. because their quality in general is at the same level as the private hospitals for all but the most specialised procedures.

Re:FYI

[Eccles]

I don't know what's more cowardly; that you fought tooth and nail to escape military service, or that you did so at taxpayers' expense.

"I had other priorities in the '60s than military service." -Dick Cheney, 1989

Hey, if it's good enough for the U.S. Vice President...

Re:Should quit while he's ahead.

[/Wegge]

Is that possible in your jurisdiction?

In Scandinavia (and I expect that holds for the rest of europe as well), you're elegible for compensation for wrongfull arrests and/or accusation from the police. They have no ways of countersuing.

Re:It's not the USD value, it's the purchasing pow

[orzetto]

150,000 NOK in Norway have definitely less purchasing power than their countervalue in dollars in the US or any EU country; AFAIK the only country more expensive than Norway is Iceland, and maybe (some areas of) Japan.
I think this is mostly about principles than money, 150000 is not really a bunch. My 54-sq. meters flat (here in Norway) is worth 840,000 NOK, and I got quite a deal at buying that. Iceberg salad is 20-30 NOK for about half a kilo. A half liter of beer at a pub can range between 40 and 70 NOK. And I didn't yet mention anything with more than 10% alcohol in it!

Re:It's not the USD value, it's the purchasing pow

[Jhan]

That doesn't matter at all. Does the 150,000NOK have the same purchasing power in Norway as 20,000USD has in the states? If not, the comparison is completely worthless.

Unfortunately, prices in Norway are extremely high, mostly because of all that oil money causing inflation. This more than offsets the current weakness of the USD.

The reason that the amount is so low is quite another; in Norway damages are strictly based on the actual money lost (well, and to a lesser amount things like emotional damage). If you asked for american-style amounts ("I'm suing for $300.000.000!"), you would be laughed out of court.

Jon used a public defender, so his costs weren't that high.

Re:DVD-Jon is not a hero

[orzetto]

Be this true or not, I don't know, but:

1. it has been posted as Anonymous Coward;
2. the author of the page states:

   [...]But because i'm afraid of flames i won't tell you my name.

Sorry, unless there is somebody real behind this, this link is just FUD.

Another thing: all the defense of Jon Johansen ws based upon the fact that he did not program DeCCS, but only a gui for it. Had he programmed DeCCS, the outcome might have been different.

Re:It's not the USD value, it's the purchasing pow

[arcade]

A half-litre beer cost 25NOK at a student pub (run by students, for the student societies), 29NOK at the cheapest regular pub I know about, and around 50NOK (say 45-60) at most others. At least in Oslo, where I live.

To rent an apartment.. well, that really varies depending on where in Oslo you live. Say between 2500 and 10000, most student get apartments for around 2500-3500NOK/month

Bus ticket: 30NOK if paid when you get onto the bus (in oslo), 20NOK if you've got a prepaid ticket.

Hamburger: Depends on where you buy it. 37NOK for a Big One, 75NOK if you buy yourself a good one at a REAL Hamburger-kiosk.

Coca Cola: aprox 10NOK for a 0.5 litre bottle. Aprox 15NOK for 1.5 litre bottle.

Loaf of bread: really depends on the type of bread. Between 10 and 25 NOK

Cinema ticket: 75 in Oslo.

Re:You win, don't pay

[Asprin]

The idea is called "Loser Pays" and it has been proposed many times as a solution to frivolous litigation. MANY states have considered bills in the legislature that propose implementing some sort of "Loser Pays" system, but it has stiff opposition because lawyers don't like tort reform limiting their income, especially if they are also individually liable for damages as some plans propose.

Google should help you find out all it.

BTW, politically, such proposals almost always come from the Republicans and are opposed by Democrats since attorneys tend to donate and lean to the left. That's not important information, but I think it's fun to point it out and tweak the many leftists here on the /. [*tweak!*]