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Apollo 11 Launch Tower Rescue Effort
SaveTheLUT writes "Florida Today has this story about the disposal of the last remaining Apollo Launch Tower - the one which launched Apollo 11 to the Moon in July 1969. The campaign to save the tower has also appeared on InsideKSC, CollectSpace, Space.com and there is to be a TV article about it on Central Florida News 13 channel on Monday morning. The Space Restoration Society has created an on-line Petition which has already managed to gather more than 2000 signatures to save this piece of America's history since NASA announced the disposal of the tower early last week."
I would rather see NASA devote money to building new towers and new space crafts that will get us to deep space with large payloads, then to see them spending money on saving this.
If these groups are truely interested in this, They should put their money where their mouths are.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
There's just over 2000 signatures on their petition. If there aren't ten times that many by lunch, I'm going to lose all faith in Slashdot.
The bigotry of the nonbeliever is for me nearly as funny as the bigotry of the believer. - Albert Einstein
The program has been dormant for so many years that a lot of the infrastructure, institutional knowledge, etc, has been lost. NASA will essentially have to start from scratch. Sean
Simply because we don't have anything today that can do that. The shuttle can't land and take off from the moon.
Also, the 15 years includes Mars, not just the moon. I personally don't see any reason to go back to the moon. What else is there to learn about it that requires us to risk human life?
The capsule is already in the smithsonian, so I think this is a bit overboard. Honestly, what is the advantage in saving the tower? If they pay for removing it and putting it somewhere else, then I say go for it. If it'll cost NASA more to save than destroying it, I say 'bring on the TNT!'
Good quote, too many chars. Seriously, the slashdot 120 char limit sucks!
If they don't want it, don't just bitch and moan - pony up some cash (collectively, presumably) and buy the damn thing. We shouldn't force government agencies to keep large, expensive, hazardous equipment around for notstaligic reasons. That's what museums are for. Its the same with some "classic" buildings - for example, when the Dr. Pepper plant in Dallas was going to be knocked down by a developer, he offered to sell it back the "outraged community" for the bargain price that he paid for it - so that the new owner could do with it as they saw fit and, presumably, not demolish it. There were no takers. Funny how when its someone's money rather than just their signature, that support for these vague initiatives just dries up...
Besides, what would you do with it? Other than try hard to keep your liability insurance paid up while not letting anyone get to close to it, of course...
You're special forces then? That's great! I just love your olympics!
It's one thing to save the Saturn V, or the Apollo crew module, but why does anyone find the tower significant? It's a bit like trying to save the construction elevator for the Empire State Building, long after the building is gone.
I understand that the tower has certain sentimental value to the astronauts. After all, their craft sacrificed themselves to send astronauts into orbit, or to the moon. The tower is all that's left of those glorious machines. But isn't that like keeping a death grip on a ring or hair locket long after a spouse has died? Physiologically, one has to accept the fact and move on. Doing otherwise would only be detrimental to the individual.
Shouldn't the astronauts let go of the tower and spend their time instead promoting one of the hundreds of high energy propulsion methods available? Wouldn't the best testament of the Saturn V be a thrust into space rather than shaking our heads and saying, "it was fun while it lasted?"
NERVA, GCNR, Nuclear Salt Water, Orion, Daedalus, Fusion rockets, terrawatt laser launchers, etc., etc., etc. We have the technology for crying out loud. Let's make the Saturn program proud. Let's go forward!
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I'm all for saving American History, but this shouldn't be NASA's job. This sort of this is the responsibility of institutions like the Smithsonian. Nasa should be spending its money on new projects. I know I'm nostalgic about the glory days of the space race, but eventually NASA will become overburdened with this sort of thing.
"You never know when some crazed rodent with cold feet might be running loose in your pants."
-Calvin
The article says the thing is causing some serious environmental hazards. I know they keep the Saturn moon rockets, and the other rockets sitting around in the visitor's centres at Kennedy, and here at Johnson in Houston, but it looks less an issue of space and more of keeping the thing from poisoning the land around it. If a third party wanted to house and restore the thing, that's one issue, but I don't think it warrants just signing a petition and telling NASA "Hey, find a way to save this." NASA has already been under so many budget cuts, I don't blame them one bit for dismantling it. The structure will always live on in photographs and film, and it's not as if it will ever launch again.
I think a better testament to the history of space exploration would be to quit using the 20 year old shuttle fleet and start doing some real innovation again, rather than hanging on to a big chunk of rusting steel and paint to make a monument that honestly, not too many people will even bother to go see.
My Webcomic: Asylum on 5th Street
This is a piece of global history.
I've signed the petition as I'd like to see anything that remains of the Apollo program preserved.
Worst
there are some things that are just not worth saving,
especially when they cost many millions of dollars. This
is like somebody doing spring cleaning and refusing to
toss out that favorite letter jacket from high school.
Think about it: $40 mio is what they want to raise.
Yet two (failed) Mars probes - Polar Lander and Climate
Orbiter cost $165 and $125 mio. Its time we stop all this
nostalgia bs - there is plenty of video, tech specs and
what not already. If you want to contribute something to
the space efforts, make it something that pushes things
*FORWARD* not back.
Get rid of the thing. The whole areas waterways are so cool. The banana river, etc. Don't let it contaminate the water. Spare the redfish, sea trout, manatees and dolphins. It's amazing drifting down the nearby barge canal by the canaveral locks and watching the dozens of dolphins feed and manatees bob up and down. The place doesn't need any more contamination and pollution than it already has. It a beautiful span of land and water. Have you ever seen wild boars on the shorelines before sunrise?
Let NASA sterilize it and scrap it. Don't sign the petition.
Please. Nobody pays attention to those things. If you want anyone to give a damn, take the time to write a letter. Submitting your email address to a website is not meaningful political speech.
Unfortunatley we can't keep everything due to the cost of safely maintaining it. I'm all for preserving the tower, but are you really willing to pony up the money to do it? I for one would rather see my tax dollars spent on new exploration, rather then maintaining a monument to the past.
I keep my datebook in a pocket spiral bound notebook I picked up in a drugstore for $.69. I find it superiour technology for the task. Pen ready and everything.
Sometimes we use our technology because it's there, not because it's really ideal for the task.
Comes to that I keep the exact same model slide rule the astronauts carried on my desk. If you know how to use one it's still sometimes faster and easier than a calculator or a computer, and the batteries never wear down.
It also keeps me a bit sharper than I might otherwise be. Slide rules require an understanding of mathematics to use. I quote from my user manual:
"When people have difficulty in learning to use a slide rule, usually it is not because the instrument is difficult to use. The reason is likely to be that they don't understand the mathematics on which the instrument is based, or the formulas they are trying to evaluate. "
I don't recommend that people dispose of their calculators, but I do think it would be instructive if everyone at least learned a bit about using a slide rule. It has a way of showing whether you really understand the the math you're doing, or whether you're using the calculator as a crutch for said understanding, as opposed to using it as a tool.
KFG
An Environmental Impact Statement, including assessment of impact to known or potential historic resources, will need to be filed if any of the following are true:
- Federal funding will be utilized
- A federal permit will be required
- The site sits on federal land
It seems to me that at least two of the above apply.If the tower is deemed to be eligible (or on!) the National Register of Historic Places, steps will need to be taken to 'mitigate' the impact to this structure. The preferred way is to leave it in place (eliminates impact entirely); alternatively, a HABS (Historic American Building Survey) Recordation might suffice, wherein a comprehensive documentary effort, including the drafting of detailed architectural drawings, is undertaken.
Unless they've already taken this scenario into consideration and are prepared for the associated costs and potential delays, perhaps NASA will back-burner the effort to dismantle the tower; or maybe public opinion of the tower's contribution to our nation's historic heritage will help convince them to shelve the idea.
I am not a number - I am a free man!
OF COURSE everything is documented! But what do you do with a schematic that calls for a core memory, General Radio connectors and 93 ohm balanced transmission line?
You have to build the factories to build core memories, re-tool to make GR connectors, and figure out who will make that cable!
"Just use modern stuff" you say? Do you have any idea what is takes to make something space-rated? Who's going to take responsibility for changing things on a 40 year old design that worked?
Save a historic building? Sure. I can see the economic and cultural benefit to a community. Save a launch tower? I see huge ongoing expenses and very little benefit except to a few museum goers who would just as easily be served by a photo. There are more important, more valuable pieces of space history to preserve. Aren't there?
This is an important piece of our space exploration history. As long as the cost to restore and preserve it doesn't cost tens of millions of dollars we should save it.
Just imagine the thrill your children, grand children and further down the line would have if they could stop by this tower just before they take their journey to the Moon, Mars or beyond and think "Wow this is where it all started".
Ohana means family. Family means nobody gets left behind or forgotten.
There is little left of the Apollo hardware in its original form. While there are three Saturn Vs still in existence, they are lying on their sides in museums, leaving little real impression of how big the Saturn 5 truly was compared with today's spacecraft. (They are in Houston, Huntsville, and Titusville.) Not until the fiberglass replica was erected in Huntsville (where one of the original rockets still lies to this day) did I really comprehend its size, even though I am a space buff and intricately familiar with many of the details of this vehicle, including the size specifications for it (and today's Space Shuttle.)
The Vehicle Assembly Building, transport crawler, and launch pads still exist but today service the Space Shuttle (and the original red launch towers have given way to the much shorter gray Shuttle towers), leaving only the VAB's sheer size to give a hint of what once was.
I believe this is important to keep. We once took pride in the fact that we could send people to touch the Moon if we chose to. We need to remind ourselves of that, and of the fact that we one day will do it again.
i am a soviet space shuttle
If you want to save it, raise the money to haul it off and put it on display somewhere. Anything less is meaningless.
Wtf. "America's history"?! _WORLD_ history!!!
The tower is part of american history. I've heard americans say so many times that they have no history as you're a (relatively) new country. For (insert name of your religous idol here)'s sake, try and keep something to show the kids and grandkids rather than adopting the "paid for it, used it, now let's scrap it" attitude that seems so prevalent in the world today. Just my 2 pence worth (that's the UK currency, btw (We helped you go to war with Iraq for some reason). Buy an atlas and look at it if you've never heard of the place)
"I'll starve my cold, and I'll feed my fever to you"
Personally, I think a more fitting monument would be to get NASA cleaned up and getting us back into space...
"Dogs and cats, living together...it's mass hysteria!"
So it was the last thing Armstrong stood on before be went to the moon. Wow. Should we also cut out the last piece of ground he stood on and move it to a museum? Or how about the vehicle he drove to the pad?
The tower is not an engineering feat unto itself. It has no historical value other than "there was a big rocket sitting next to this at one time, but we can't show you that because it's gone."
For what it's worth, I do wish we had real flight vehicles to display. If the Apollo 11 Saturn V still existed, I'd be the first to say "let's restore it!" But it doesn't, and saving a little bit of scaffolding is not going to bring it back. A much better testament to the hard working men and women of the Saturn program would be to go forward into space. Even Von Braun wanted an Orion to take us to the planet Saturn. (Boosted into orbit on top of a Saturn V, of course.) For all the bad rap people have given him, he wasn't stupid. He knew that the chemical rockets couldn't manage manned interplanetary missions. But they could handle getting things to orbit where a space economy could begin.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
I keep my datebook in a pocket spiral bound notebook I picked up in a drugstore for $.69. I find it superiour technology for the task. Pen ready and everything.
Hard to grep a dead tree though.