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Infinium Labs Countersues HardOCP

loftydog writes "Gamespot is reporting that our favorite console manufacturer has thrown down a gauntlet in Florida. Seems they didn't want to play in Texas with HardOCP. Turns out that SCO doesn't have a corner on the lawyer market after all, and we'll see something from Infinium, even if it is an overpaid suit."

23 of 199 comments (clear)

  1. Funny... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...none of this would have happened if Infinium Labs had actually shipped a working product on time. Mudslinging or "legal relief" won't make them ship it quicker either. As far as I can tell, HardOCP has been more than reasonable with its assertions... more sites should have the guts to expose the true colors of the companies they cover.

    However exciting the infinium technology allegedly is, I temper any enthusiasm for that product with the reality that they're entering a market full of big boys who don't like to share their toys. Whoever gave them venture money to go head-to-head with Sony, MS, and Nintendo should have their head examined.

    Who cares if the product is interoperable, etc. As long as the big guys can sell their consoles below manufacturing cost via lucrative licensing deals, there is NO way that a small startup can compete. IMHO, the right thing to do in this case is Infinium giving what little cash they have left back to the investors and crawling back under the rock they cam from.

    This is going to become all the more ridiculous as the 970-based next gen consoles come out. I just don't see a way to outperform that kind of horsepower...

    1. Re:Funny... by The+Only+Druid · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You seem to have grossly misunderstood the situation: HardOCP ran a well-researched and edited peice that demonstrated a variety of grevious failures in Infinium's progress towards their console including but not limited to listing times when Infinium missed deadlines, blatantly lied about what resources they had, blatantly lied about what backing they had, etc.

      Infinium, meanwhile, hired perhaps one of the most incompetant lawyers I've ever heard of: their lawyers have presented paperwork including spelling errors, grammatical mistakes, clearly innapropriate egotism (i.e. emotion isn't supposed to appear in any legal documents except for Judge's decisions), etc.

      --
      "Stumble before you crawl"
  2. Credit where it's due. by RandoMBU · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I have to give credit to HardOCP for not backing down in the face of ridiculous threats. They posted a factual article that painted an unflattering picture, because the fact's ARE unflattering. I know Florida is home to some of the worst judicial decions ever but here's hoping they get this one right.

  3. Re:$42 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Litigation expense 320,000
    Development costs 259,407

    I guess this pretty much says it all?

  4. Re:Stop Pretending You're A Real Company by SendBot · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Read the news of the day that goes along with the next comic. Tim Roberts posted this on his forum, then retraceted after a PA reader grabbed a screenshot.

    "Actually, that is not what the comic portrayed. It actually meant they were upset that we wouldn't sue them and they ended with outright slander saying that I can only have an orgasm if I kill a dog.... very funny... love it... they want the publicity and traffic driven to there website like is happening to hardocp...

    The Penny Arcade guys were nice enough to call us in the beginning and tell us they didn't mean any harm and would be putting us through the gaming console initiation process that all of the past consoles have gone through with the hard core techies.

    Tim"

    Gabe claims they've never spoken with him.

    See for yourself

  5. Re:Truth NOT a defense to libel by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's in Rhoad Island, where this suit will not be taking place, and further more the plantiff still must prove that the statement was made with malicious intent. Hardly, "quite possible." Technically possible, theoretically possible, not out of the realm of possibility. Sure.

    Further more, there is the matter of being a public entity or figure, which requires a higher standard.

    HardOCP has a number of true statements, presented as part of an opinion and asks their readers to draw their own conclusions, to their individual benefit, about a public corporation, and relatively public executives in it. They have this won barring any unforseen changes to our code of laws.

    In short, yes, Infinium might win, but NASA also might have faked the moon landings with the help of the guys who faked the faking of the Loch Ness monster and Big Foot to divert people's attention away from their preparing to make OJ Simpson the first human on Mars, while arming him with only a powerbook to combate the vast alien hoards. Their chances are only slightly worse than a Sharpton and Keys joint ticket taking the White House.

  6. Re:Stop Pretending You're A Real Company by EulerX07 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The best part about this is Gabe posted alink to the alexa graph comparing both sites.

    Infinium's traffic is so low it doesn't show up on the graph except for the days when it was linked to by PA.

  7. Remeber what the press did to the N-Gage? by xyu · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If they ever do decide to release the Phantom (not likely), all this negative press is likely to harm sales similar to what happened with the N-Gage.

    1. Re:Remeber what the press did to the N-Gage? by spinozaq · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Release it? Have you not be paying attention? There is NO business, NO development, NO engineering and certainly, NO manufacturing. It's a scam that makes a few people rich and the expense of some other people that are richer.... ahh the american way... You act like they have a warehouse full of consoles rearing to go once the lawsuit pans out... The real story is they never got INTO the design phase... that would... of course cut back on the size house the CEO could buy.

    2. Re:Remeber what the press did to the N-Gage? by cgenman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Right. And remember Nokia's response? They sold what they had, and got right to work on building a superior version that addressed the issues that everyone was complaining about.

      Now I gave Nokia a lot of flak for their horrific original design, but to take such overwhelming criticism and respond by addressing everyone's complaints is admirable bordering upon heroic. And they'll get a superior product out of the other side to boot, which still will integrate well into their other product lines.

      Indrema, on the other hand, has responded to criticisms by suing everybody in sight. This is not the way to get customers, this is the way to shut up people who are blowing your cover. Nokia handled the (well deserved) response to the N-Gage elegantly and should be given a second chance in the market. Indrema has taken their (well deserved) criticisms terribly, and on the slight possibility that they aren't a scam their failure in the market should evoke no sympathy.

  8. New legislation required by Baron_Yam · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It seems to me that companies like SCO and Infinium are abusing the American legal system. They are playing silly buggers with the law in order to extract wealth from the economy without actually providing a service or product of value in return.

    In the not-so-long run, this is damaging to innovation and fair competition which will in turn damage the economy.

    It's probably time for Americans who are aware of the issue to start lobbying for new legislation to target this kind of behaviour - removing the financial rewards and administering punishment to the responsible individuals.

    But hey, that's just me... I'm not even an American.

    1. Re:New legislation required by BobTheLawyer · · Score: 3, Insightful

      you need one simple change: a rule that the loser of a court case must pay the winner's costs.

    2. Re:New legislation required by Swanktastic · · Score: 3, Insightful

      you need one simple change: a rule that the loser of a court case must pay the winner's costs.

      Of course, then the pendulum has gone too far in the other direction. Let's say I have a beef with some company that I believe manufacture's a faulty product. If the company wishes to nip in the bud a series of class action suits, they may just outspend me. I get stuck with a bill for the millions they spent on defense if I lose... This isn't how the legal system here is supposed to work.

      I agree with you though-- there must be some repercussion for abuse of the system... I happen to think that blatant abuses should be punished somehow- be it fines or community service.

    3. Re:New legislation required by fbg111 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The problem is, America's IP laws are (were?) one of the keys to our industrial dominance. They provided the guarantee to entrepeneurs that if they came up with a new product and took the time and effort to develop and market it, then they wouldn't have to share the financial reward with parasites who simply copied their idea. Entrepreneurialism is the key to America's dominance, and patent laws are what ensure that potential reward is worth the initial risk. Other coutries, notably Japan during their westernization in the mid/late 1800s, even copied our IP laws, to great success. The problem is that in the software industry, it seems that disparate researchers tend to come up with the same solutions/ideas without copying each other. Yet patent and copyright laws protect whoever patents or copyrights the IP first, even if they weren't the first to derive that particular IP. This drives corporations to patent every patentable idea, even if they don't yet know how to incorporate it into a product. Then, another researcher at another company independently contrives the same idea or solution, but b/c it's already been patented by someone else, he can't use it. How you solve this problem without slaying the goose that lays the golden egg, I'm not too sure, but that's one of the main problems as I see it.

      --
      Flying is easy, just throw yourself at the ground and miss. -Douglas Adams
  9. Re:Read the brief, and damn is Infinium sad. by Cliffy03 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Someone should point out this to KB's Lawyers.

    "Infinium leases office space in Sarasota, Florida and Richardson, Texas under operating leases that expire in 2009 and 2007, respectively."

    Now which document do we listen to, a court filing or the SEC filing?

    --
    In Soviet Russia, Nigel makes plans for you!
  10. Amazingly little at stake by shoppa · · Score: 1, Insightful
    An online gaming/hardware 'zine vs a company that doesn't have any products.

    I do appreciate that there are issues regarding journalism which must be defended, and it's great that HardOCP is standing up for its rights. But this isn't exactly the Pentagon Papers or 9/11 at stake here. When all is said and done, the only people to have gained anything will be the lawyers.

    1. Re:Amazingly little at stake by The-Dalai-LLama · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't want to get hysterical and overdramatic, but I think this is an issue of freedom of speech.

      The greatest thing about the internet is its ability to put real power in the hands of the average citizen. Look at the Russian motorcycle chick's Chernobyl photos to see an example of just how much potential there is for the average person.

      I don't know, but I imagine that Hard OCP has its roots with some average guys who thought it would be cool to put out a gaming review and news site. Simple, not much at stake, no big deal.

      Except that these guys and their little gaming site brought forth some information that exposed a company that could have been (may still be?) on the way to screwing over average guys like me.

      A fairly small site (I'm sure they're big in gaming circles, but they're not CNN or even Hard Copy) harnessed the power of the internet to do this, and it's power that we all have access to. What's at stake here (and I know that this particular lawsuit seems ridiculous) is a precedent that could potentially scare off the average person from attempting to use the power that is at our fingertips.

      I can't afford a lawyer to defend against this kind of stuff. The threat of legal action would probably be enough to deter me: I can't afford to risk my home or my car over a BS lawsuit that I wouldn't have the money to even try to mount a defense against.

      The Dalai Llama
      stepping down from his favorite soapbox...

    2. Re:Amazingly little at stake by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Heh, right. 'cause the MPAA is almost out of business, and Diebold isn't still selling voting machines? /. is not a barometer of the public interest.

  11. Infinium Labs wasn't at GDC by Animats · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Infinium Labs website, under "Special Events", says they were going to be at the Game Developers' Conference this week. I didn't see an Infinium booth there, and they're not on the exhibitor list or the booth map.

  12. Surprisingly good for HardOCP by cgenman · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Hard OCP actually comes out on top of all of this, in my accounting. They get A: Slashdot traffic several times, B: Penny Arcade traffic several times, and perhaps most importantly C: an iron clad precedent if anybody else tries to muscle them into submission. HardOCP is going to come out of this as a force to be respected.

    And for this, they have to hire an intelligent intelligible attorney who can argue that water is wet.

  13. Phantom seems an appropriate name for this procut by olivercromwell · · Score: 2, Insightful

    From the Cambridge English Dictionary: phantom [Show phonetics] adjective [before noun] describes something that you imagine exists or that appears to exist, although in fact it does not: Although she had to have her leg amputated, she still feels as though she's got a phantom limb. They discovered it was a phantom organization set up for the processing of drug profits. UK Although she grew bigger and felt ill, she later discovered it was a phantom (US false) pregnancy. I think this aptly describes the Phantom concole. I wonder if Mr. Roberts is aware of the irony. Or did he chose this name for his "phantom" product knowingly, thinking it a good joke to play with other people's money? I just re-read the HardOCP article, and I can see why this guy is suing. He is hoping the threat of legal action will scare us all into quietude, and allow himn to continue parting people from their money with promises of rich rewards to be generated by his revolutionary technology. It reminds me of the old fable: The Emperor's New Clothes. LOL

  14. Infinium not at Game Developer's Conference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I got back from the Game Developer's Conference (GDC) last night, this is where us game makers go to learn the latest programming tricks & hardware. This is also where hardware makers go to gather support for their new products. Sony was there recruiting developers for PSP & PS3 as was Microsoft for Xbox 2, video card & peripheral makers show up to try to get people to support their titles, even Nintendo (who tends to snub the developer community) has a small booth. Yet one hardware company getting ready to roll out a major product was conspicuously absent from GDC this year. That's right Infinium was totally & completely missing; this absence really does indicate that this is just a vaporware product designed to scam investors out of their money.

  15. Re:Slightly offtopic... by scm · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "I just want to know, after all this ranting, is where IS that $100M? If the company is WORTH that, don't they have to have assets that you can sell at $100M?"

    No, and that's the magic of the stock market.

    Basically, company stock value is a combonation of assets and perceived future earning power. Investors are betting on the hope that the company will be sucessful enough to make their investment return a good profit (raise the stock value).

    Many overly ambitious bets on future value is exactly what caused the high tech bubble.