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UK Trains Take WiFi Route To Connectivity

Posted by simoniker on from the last-train-to-netcentral dept.

Randy Sparks writes "The BBC is reporting that one of the UK's largest train operators, GNER, is to offer Wi-Fi net access on its trains. What's interesting is how this net connection will be achieved - by a combination of networks provided by multiple mobile phone connections or even digital TV Internet, provided from ground stations the train passes by. It'll cost UKP4.95 per hour for train goers, although First Class Travellers will get it free..."

36 of 236 comments (clear)

  1. Oblig Jokes by beacher · · Score: 4, Funny

    Quake players and their rail guns...
    Tunnelling
    Rail driving?
    Say, didn't you just hit a badger? There goes our proxy server!

  2. Cheap WiFi by prat393 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Make sure you sit next to the first class car! You just might get free access. "Warsitting", perhaps?

    1. Re:Cheap WiFi by canavan · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd suspect that some sort of access credentials will be printed on the tickets, so you may have to go dumpster diving instead - or just ask someone who's not going to use it anyway.

    2. Re:Cheap WiFi by VertigoAce · · Score: 3, Informative

      That'd be great if these systems were encrypted, but they generally aren't. I know the Dallas/Fort Worth airport has two wireless internet access services (T-Mobile and something else). You can pull out your laptop and connect to them immediately, but any requests bring you to an info page. One of the services let you find out tourist information along with airport info (flight info, services, etc) for free. To get access to the rest of the net you have to pay. It probably uses some sort of software firewall that keeps track of your IP and mac addresses. Normal WiFi hacking isn't going to do you much good in this case.

  3. Its GBP! by Krik+Johnson · · Score: 5, Informative

    Why do people keep giving us the wrong currency symbol? GBP is the international standard code for pounds, not UKP! For another thing, slashdot dosen't allow pound signs either. Stupid stuck in 1997 website deisgn that dosen't even have valid HTML 3.2!

    --
    I have a fetish for traffic cones
    1. Re:Its GBP! by Zocalo · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Probably for the same reason that we use ".uk" as our ccTLD despite the "official" ISO standard being GB - because the average joe in the street uses "UK" in preference to "GB". As do the media and the government for that matter. The only common place we use the "GB" ISO code I can think of is on those stickers that go on cars travelling abroad.

      Also, bear in mind that the full name of this green and pleasant land is "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland". Given that the "GBP" is also the currency of Northern Ireland, "UKP" is actually more accurate.

      --
      UNIX? They're not even circumcised! Savages!
    2. Re:Its GBP! by rikkus-x · · Score: 5, Informative

      Official ISO standard for what? Great Britain is an island. The United Kingdom is a country. Northern Ireland is a province, England and Scotland are Kingdoms, Wales is a principality.

      People usually talk in terms of countries, so what are the ISO people using Great Britain for, I wonder?

      Rik

    3. Re:Its GBP! by NickFitz · · Score: 4, Informative
      'Great Britain' is a geographical area including some (but not others) of the islands that are near the main island on which England sits.

      Not quite.

      Great Britain is, as you say, a geographical term, but it refers to the largest island of the British Isles - the one comprising the majority of the landmass of England, Wales and Scotland. The British Isles also include Ireland, containing Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland, as well as all the smaller places like the Isle of Man, the Shetlands, and so forth . The name of the country (i.e. the political entity, or state) often referred to as Great Britain is actually called the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

      Personally, I usually refer to my homeland as Britain, as even though it's the greatest country in the world, that isn't saying very much when you consider the competition in this hellhole of a human-vermin-infested planet. Damned by faint praise about sums it up.

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  4. Through the rails or over the power lines? by Snover · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Excuse me for being so grossly ignorant of the workings of such things, but why don't they either use broadband-over-power and then have wifi routers within the compartments or send the traffic through the rails, rather then try to aim satellites at things? Seems silly to create a new infrastructure when the existing one can be used.

    --

    [insert witty comment here]
    1. Re:Through the rails or over the power lines? by samael · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Seen the huge sparks that fly about whenever a train goes over even slightly mismatched power rails?

      I suspect that there would be altogether too much interference.

      --
      My Journal
  5. Dupe by Inda · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I call dupe.

    November 30th, 2003.

    First UK On-Train WiFi Service Launches Monday

    --
    This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.
    1. Re:Dupe by linuxci · · Score: 4, Informative

      I posted that original article, that was when the GNER service was a trial, now it appears the trial was successful and will be rolled out in the entire fleet.

      GNER is the only decent train company in the UK, it's the only one that still offers a smoking carriage, it gives regular travellers a loyalty card like many airlines do, in has a proper restaurant service and I've not had too many problems with their timekeeping.

      The only thing I can say bad about them is that they used to sell bottled real ales in the buffet car, but they stopped doing those October last year, now you've got only canned mainstream beers which ain't the same. GNER are usually good at listening to feedback so if you're a regular traveller and miss the guest ales then email them and let them know. Vist www.gner.co.uk and click on the 'contact us' link, then select customer relations.

  6. This seems better than GPRS by karikasper · · Score: 3, Informative

    Here in Estonia we have GPRS-based connection in trains. Haven't tried it myself, but I've been told it's quite slow and sluggish.

  7. Expensive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Thats about 8USD to you! No suprises that the pricing is expensive, rail travel is more expensive than air travel in the UK sometimes!

  8. Excellent by vedli · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This is really great news. When I go and visit my girlfriend in Edinburgh I have to do without an Internet connection for up to 3 hours; clearly far too long for anyone :-) With regards wireless networks in general, I know that when wi-fi network cards are in ad hoc mode you can stumble across other cards in ad hoc mode but is there any way to communicate with them? For example, not only being able to tell another card is present, but ask the owner of the card if they want a game of Quake?

    --
    (http://www.e-consort.co.uk)
  9. Cool, Spammers now have rolling hide outs :) by Wacky_Wookie · · Score: 4, Funny

    Why not buy up a whole carriages worth of space and set up your office on a train going between say, Bristol and london, or Manchester? Sure beats sitting in an office all day. If you worked the shifts out correctly, your staff would have a choice between living in two citys (or any stop in between).

    Of course that bring up the obvious joke:
    In Soviet Russia, the office commutes to YOU!

    I think the view from a moving train would be much nicer then a static office window anyday!

    1. Re:Cool, Spammers now have rolling hide outs :) by Wacky_Wookie · · Score: 3, Informative
      GNER don't operate in Bristol, or Manchester... Bristol is on the West Coast line which is Virgin Trains territory.

      Ya, I know, I live in London.

      But the BBC commented on the fact that other Operators were going to interduce the same survice soon. If Branson fails to get the same thing added to Virgin's trains with-in six months of GNER doing it, I'll send my e-mail address to the top five spammers :)

      I was not intending for my comment to be Moded funny anyway, I was hoping that the idea of moblie offices would actualy spark some interest, but it looks like most people took it as mobile SPAM offices, and i only ment that to be a humerious title.

  10. A whole new spectrum of excuses by JosKarith · · Score: 5, Funny

    "We're sorry this train is late, but there are the wrong type of interleaves on the pipe..."
    (For the benefit of those who don't have the pleasure of living in the wettest place on earth British Railways used 'Wrong leaves on the track' as an excuse for late/cancelled trains for years...)

    --
    'Don't worry' said the trees when they saw the axe coming, 'The handle is one of us.'
    1. Re:A whole new spectrum of excuses by AGMW · · Score: 3, Funny
      ... and shortly after the "leaves on the track" incident, there was a case down in Kent somewhere where some guys had robbed a sub-post office and been chased onto the tracks by the police. The announcement came of the tannoy ...

      "We apologies for the late running of the 07:25 service to London Bridge. This is due to thieves on the line."

      Laugh! I nearly got to work on time.

      --
      Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
      handmadehands.co.uk
    2. Re:A whole new spectrum of excuses by NickFitz · · Score: 3, Funny

      Some years ago, I was on a train whose conductor explained in great detail why we were going to sit at Nuneaton for an hour, finishing with:

      "Once again, we apologise for this delay, which is due solely to the incompetence of the driver."

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  11. Thames Trains Reading to Paddington has this by mccalli · · Score: 3, Funny
    Can confirm that I've noticed testing going on for this. On my morning commute from Maidenhead station into Paddington (on the Reading route) my Powerbook has been picking up a wireless network called 'TEST' for a few months now.

    Cheers,
    Ian

  12. Expensive. VERY. by superhoe · · Score: 5, Interesting
    5 GBP PER HOUR?! Here we go again..

    Rapidly increasing network access on-the-go is a really cool thing. I was excited and waiting for it when it was first announced.

    Now I've already got over my disappointment - f.ex. GPRS service is charged based on traffic here, and it's damn expensive. 100 megabytes and if you exceed that, it's 2 euros/megabyte. So, what's 100 mb/month good for? Definitely not for using graphical WWW on Opera's mobile version. Well, I then check my emails with GPRS. Same thing I could do with GSM data previously, phh.. Dunno, people all around seems to be generally richer than me because they are eagerly waiting for this new EDGE thing to come and increase transfer speeds to 200k or so.

    I'm not waiting for it eagerly - correct me if I'm wrong - at least in Europe, it's most likely going to feature similar stupid pricing which renders it useless to most non-corporate users. I'll join the hype about wireless access on-the-go at the very day when I can afford to use it effectively.

    --

    -el

  13. nice idea but... by kefa · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I currently use GPRS extensively on trains (admittedly in the London area where reception is relatively good) with no real speed issues. I'd be hard pushed to spend 4.95 GBP on GPRS connection charges during a typical journey.

  14. Already have this for free in Scandinavia by Zo0ok · · Score: 3, Interesting

    On the train service from Copanhagen to Gothenburg (Oslo) we already have WiFi - free of charge (-:

  15. Priorities by Cleggmeister · · Score: 4, Insightful

    However, it was also announced this morning that major operators have deferred the safety recommendations made following a major rail crash some years ago. An independent inquiry recommended the installation of digital radios to help prevent drivers overshooting red signals. This announcement from the operators means that the recommendations will not be actioned until 14 years after the inquiry published its findings. To rub salt into that wound, there is also involvement from OfCom (UK communications regulator) over the sharing of such frequencies, with concerns that such radios may operate on similar frequencies to public access services. And the goveernment seem surprised that its public are reticent to give up their private cars?!

  16. Used it last november by tomrud · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I tried this (or similar) on the train from Stockholm to Karlstad last november.

    I got i little box with an antenna and connected my ethernet port to the box. I got an IP-address via DHCP, but I'm sorry, I didn't check if it was a public or a NAT-address.

    Anyway, I got full Internet access as far as I could tell. I could create a SSH-tunnel to my work and use it to read my email (and to do anything I usually do through SSH. It was a little bit slow, thou. I had urgent things to do for my employer, so I didn't have the time to really explore it's limits.

    It didn't have any stupid requirements for operating system and was usable with my GNU/Linux laptop.

    You can find some (commercial) information about it here: http://www.linx.se/templates/Page.aspx?id=3108

    --
    For a nice date: Call strftime(3C)!
  17. Great for British Trains by L-s-L69 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    As you can post your complaint as you sit in the delay. Cant wait for Virgin to get this, I could invite the entire carridge to complain with me.

  18. Re:Why is WiFi so expensive everywhere? by Cleggmeister · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It is not disputed that these costs are prohibitive to the "public at large", however I would guess that the majority of users would be corporate, hence offset the costs via expenses. This, unfortunately, is indicative of the UK comms industry. Only of late are the providers packaging their products for domestic consumers as opposed to corporate users. Maybe in five years time the UK will have reached the level that most developed countries already enjoy.

  19. They're not the first. by Sandman1971 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This isn't news. Via Rails here in Canada has been offering wi-fi on Via 1 trains on the Montréal-Toronto or Montréal-Québec City routes here for months on a trial basis.

    --
    It's better to burn out than to fade away
  20. The cost by Mr_Silver · · Score: 4, Insightful
    It'll cost UKP4.95 per hour for train goers

    Given that your battery will go flat after no more than two hours, it's only going to cost you about a tenner anyway :o)

    Of course i'm ignoring the fact you might have a spare battery - but also I think that Virgin Trains are the only ones at the moment to offer power points in their trains. First class only.

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  21. Pah! IP over trains protocol is the way to go by 91degrees · · Score: 3, Funny

    You'll get much better bandwidth if you simply take the data by train. Even with the delays inherent in English rail.

  22. All very good, however by youngerpants · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I have to do a lot of travelling for work, I have used WiFi hotspots almost everywhere I needed it, but whenI have used my laptop on trains before using GPRS, and I think this is a great move and a step in the right direction.

    However, the one area where this always falls over is with power. Our batteries are just don't last long enough. I have a brand new Dell D600 (finally gave up on my Thinkpad T21) and the battery will give me 1 - 1.5 hours max.

    As long as the trains also offer power outlets so I can keep the charge going I'd happily pay for the connectivity

  23. Brand Communications by AndIWonderIfIWonder · · Score: 4, Informative
    At the WLAN event in London on the 6-7 April, this is exactly what Brand Communications said they are going to be doing. In fact a quick look around their website turned up this press release from 1st December giving some details.

    The press release states "The latest trials were held on route between Edinburgh and London Kings Cross and achieved realistic data rates and speeds, with over 18 GigaBytes of data being sent to and from the train."

    I got the impression from the people on the stand that they will be using WiMax to get the signal to the train passengers, and then standard 802.11b inside the carriages.

    If it all works out it should make train journeys a bit more interesting, but there goes my excuse to get out of doing any work.

  24. Rail travel is often more expensive... by blorg · · Score: 3, Interesting
    ...than flying with the likes of Ryanair who often do free or 0.99p deals. The train however goes from city centre to city centre, rather than circa 1 hour outside each city; I'm thinking London Stansted to "Glasgow" (Prestwick) here. When you factor in taxes and the exorbitant cost of the Stansted Express it's not always so cheap any more.

    Fast rail travel (like they have on the European continent) is far more comfortable than flying. When you factor in airport distance, check-in times, etc, it's also quicker than flying on most domestic-length routes. Look at Eurostar's dominance on the London-Paris route at the expense of the airlines. It's also far more environmentally friendly than short-haul flights - in Spain you can get a discount on an AVE/Talgo ticket within 48 hours of flying into/out of the country, to persuade you to use the train rather than a connecting flight to your ultimate destination.

    Offering WiFi is definately another value-add that will increase train use - you can actually spend that 4-5 hour journey *working* (or whatever) rather than spending approx the same amount of time getting a train to the airport, check-in, hanging around, short flight, another train. Now if they can only get those leaves off the track and introduce high speed services...

  25. Review of the experience by TonkaTown · · Score: 3, Informative

    Martin Little took the WiFi train and reviewed the journey for Mobitopia back in December 2003.

    Not altogether positive, GPRS may well be quicker for many people.

  26. WiFi on trains in North America by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    There are several rail providers in Canada and the US that are trialling WiFi access. VIA Rail is currently offering it for free on the Toronto to Montreal run. There are trials running down in California as well as other places. Check out PointShot Wireless for more. (No, I dont work there.)