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Diary Illuminates Einstein's Last Years

b00le writes "Several sources carry versions of this story about the diary of Johanna Fantova who shared much of the last years of Einstein's life (and cut his hair) and witnessed his kindness and poltical activisim. The diary does not seem to have been translated from the German yet, but the site has extracts. According to this, Fantova tried to publish the diaries herself and of course failed to find an agent."

47 of 166 comments (clear)

  1. So why by GFisher · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sorry for the ignorance, but why 'of course failed to find an agent'?

    1. Re:So why by Emperor+Igor · · Score: 3, Informative

      If you read the article, it appears to be for lack of trying on Fantanova's part. She didn't make it widely known enough that she had one, it says.

  2. is this real? by BobTheLawyer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    perhaps I'm being over-cynical, but I can't help wondering if this is a hoax.

    Einstein calling Heisenberg "a big Nazi" is surely too funny to be true. The mistake mentioned in the article (reporting Einstein phoning his sister several years after she was dead) doesn't sound like the sort of mistake a real diarist would ever make.

    thoughts, anyone?

    1. Re:is this real? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This is possably why she failed to find a publisist.

      They check the document before publishing it. Were as newspaper's push anything they have to the public.

    2. Re:is this real? by BuddieFox · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Einstein calling Heisenberg "a big Nazi" is surely too funny to be true.
      Why would it not be true? Werner Heisenberg did a lot of nuclear research in germany during the second world war, research that was meant to lead to a german atom bomb.
      I dont think just because Einsteing was Einstein everything he said every day had to sound poetic and/or thouroughly thought thru, maybe he just spoke his mind occasionally? :)

    3. Re:is this real? by Karamchand · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But Heisenberg never did this because he was a Nazi, he did it because he chose to stay in Germany instead of emigrating. Read a Heisenberg biography.

    4. Re:is this real? by Chemicalscum · · Score: 4, Interesting

      In fact Einstein said "ein grosse Nazi". I thnk it just about accurately sums up Heisenberg who had been active in the Bavarian extreme right even before the Nazi's came to power.

    5. Re:is this real? by BuddieFox · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I am aware of that. I am also aware that he did not sympathize with the nazis and only did his work because he had to. But nonetheless, he _did_ the work. There are stories of Heisenberg having to fake nazi sympathies in letters to friends because the nazis read everything he wrote, something that caused a lot of his old friends to think he really did sympathize with the nazis at the time and take offence.

    6. Re:is this real? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Was that biography you read written after the Allied victory, or collected from his letters by someone who didn't have a vested interest in his image. I'm not knocking his contributions, where would physics humor be with out him, but the real truth is almost always more complicated than the one people want remembered.

      He made a lot of progress towards a German atom bomb. Could he have made more? We probably can never know the answer to that question. But from the progress he did make, there's little room for doubting which team he played for. Maybe he was the Nazi physicist equivalent of Tyrell Owens in lederhosen. One of his options was to burn all his research to the ground and try to escape. It says something that is was an option he, perhaps wisely, didn't excercise. At best we can say he was hoping for the best and hedging his bets.

    7. Re:is this real? by spellraiser · · Score: 4, Interesting

      This is from the article:

      In close succession, Einstein received visits from physicist Werner Heisenberg, who led the Nazi German A-bomb effort, and Aage Bohr, son of physicist Niels Bohr, who became Heisenberg's rival. Fantova recounted that after the visits, Einstein called Heisenberg "a big Nazi" and commented that Bohr was more pleasant but spoke constantly.

      From the context, it seems clear that Einstein is referring to Heisenberg's demeanour, perhaps also his expressed opinions and world-views. Heisenberg's past is not the issue here. Einstein was stating his personal perception of Heisenberg, as established from his own acquaintance with him.

      --
      I hear there's rumors on the Slashdots
    8. Re:is this real? by Welpa · · Score: 5, Informative

      Actually, this is not so unbelievable. Heisenberg apparently did believe that Germany would win and was working on developing the atomic bomb for Hitler.

      There has been a lot of attention devoted to a meeting, in 1941, between Heisenberg and Niels Bohr, a Danish physicist, in occupied Copenhagen. There has even been a play about it, called "Copenhagen".

      You can read some documents about the meeting here .

    9. Re:is this real? by Wirr · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well, speaking as a German, I think it is highly likely that he said that.
      Namecalling isn't only an American pasttime.
      And calling people Nazi's is one of my nations favorites pasttime.
      And just after the war it was bound to happen even more often - especially if you consider that Heisenberg wasn't exactly on the left side of politics, neither before nor after the war.

    10. Re:is this real? by IceAgeComing · · Score: 2, Interesting


      "ein grosse Nazi"

      I doubt he would have butchered the German language, so where did you find this "fact"?

    11. Re:is this real? by Bananenrepublik · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The mistake mentioned in the article (reporting Einstein phoning his sister several years after she was dead) doesn't sound like the sort of mistake a real diarist would ever make.Well, the German word "Schwester" can mean any of "nurse", "nun" and "sister", so it's not totally unlikely that either Johanna Fantova misunderstood Einstein or the person finding that mistake misunderstood Mrs Fantova, as Einstein, being ill, certainly had to deal with nurses.

    12. Re:is this real? by he-sk · · Score: 2

      Simple. Ein großer Nazi. It's easier if you have a German keyboard in front of you.

      --
      Free Manning, jail Obama.
  3. And... by jwitch · · Score: 2, Funny

    ...it was slightly cheaper than Newtons diary...

  4. Bed Head by DeanFox · · Score: 5, Funny



    If she is the one who cut his hair, I wonder what her writings must be like. Einstein, even on portrait day, looked worse than I do on my worst bed head day. It took so long to transcribe her notes because of her shaky hand?

  5. Big Nazi Comment by Cmoll · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Very interesting... I wonder how true it is. I have my concerns with the "Big Nazi" comments. From many published reports, Einstein was a bit on the touched side on social issues, but this seems a bit questionable. Having access to the "full diary" should prove the authenticity of the whole thing. I have my doubts about it, and getting excepts only raises my suspicions.

  6. As in everything else.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    the people in charge of knowing better don't.

    Film executives don't know anything about film or movie goers. Music executives certainly wouldn't know music if they heard it, but they understand large boobies and good skin. While a perhaps surprising number of female models look like male heroin addicts. So literary agents don't know something worth reading when it's already largely written and walks itself into their office. I'm sure we could all turn to another NetOps ForceCenter book which Tom Clancy probably outsourced to a prison labor camp in North Korea.

  7. one of Einsteins better ideas by jacquesm · · Score: 4, Interesting

    was a UN with teeth. Violate the charter and we'll come after you. Much more effective than the current talking sessions, which no violator ever takes serious. Now *that* would improve the world.

    forget the e=mc^2 stuff :)

    1. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by Emperor+Igor · · Score: 5, Interesting

      That's debateable. A UN with teeth would basically be a world government instead of a world forum. I don't think it's bearable for most countries to have laws primarily influenced by the values of other countries.

    2. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by JohnnyCannuk · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well that may be true, but I suspect the people of Rawanda wouldn't have given a tinkers cuss about that kind of BS. Instead of relying on the good graces of the US, UK, France etc the UN could have just gone in and stopped the slaugher of 800 000 innocent people. Lt Gen Romeo Dallaire, who headed UNAMIR at the time, pled with the UN and the Security Council to allow him to conduct offensive operations to at first prevent the genocide by capturing weapons and then to rescue people and stop the killing once it had started. But on at least 3 occasions the US, the UK and France VETOED such action. And the rest is, unfortunately, history.

      Given the choices like that, I think having a little "world government" isn't so bad. Maybe not to the extent you seem to be afraid of, but the UN should have WAY more power than it does now.

      --
      Never by hatred has hatred been appeased, only by kindness - the Buddha
    3. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by RCO · · Score: 2, Insightful

      ... and conscience.

      --
      'And all the monkeys aren't in the zoo Every day you meet quite a few...'
    4. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by Emperor+Igor · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think the main problem is the disproportionate power the five main nations in the UN have. It should be set up far more like the American House of Representatives where each country gets a proportional vote based on some statistic or mix of statistics.

    5. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by forgotmypassword · · Score: 4, Funny

      Yes we can name it "The People's Republic of Chin... er UN"

    6. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by MenTaLguY · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You can't just have "a little" government (of any kind). It's all or nothing.

      And a World Government would suck because for the first time in history, if the government isn't being nice to you, you have (in the absolute sense) nowhere else to go.

      --

      DNA just wants to be free...
    7. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by JohnnyCannuk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Or maybe because the US refused to pay its dues.

      No, in the case of Rawanda EXACTLY 10 years ago, the UN had armed troops on the ground that were ready, willing and able to go after the weapons caches and the genocidaires but were ordered not to by the Security Council, led by the US, the UK and France.

      As for the dysfunctional africa because of a post-colonial past being the foault of the UN I don't see it. The French had military advisors and soldiers on the ground supporting the Goververment of the dictator that planned and started the genocide. The Belgians turned tail and ran like simpering dogs when they lost soldiers in action (imagine that!). All outside the UN or without their approval. Only Canada, Ghana, Senagal and a bunch of useless Bangledeshi's stayed to try to do anything, under the authority of the UN.

      Don't be surprised that you think the UN is corrupt and inept when it is the government of the US that undermines it in every way possible. This is called a self-fufilling prophesy.

      --
      Never by hatred has hatred been appeased, only by kindness - the Buddha
    8. Re:one of Einsteins better ideas by JohnnyCannuk · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Well, perhaps "world government" is a bit strong. How about giving the UN enough just to police what power and influence it already has?

      The Yanks are always whining that they don't want to be the "world's policeman" but then won't pay their UN dues or allow the UN to take over that role for them (but I suppose that would require them to support the International Criminal Court and the International War Crimes tribunal).

      Imagine a UN with the recources and logistics to prevent the next Rawanda or to actually capture indicted war criminals in Bosnia or to have enough troops and weapons to deliver aid to Somolia without the US getting it's hand dirty...

      Not a world government, but an international body with some teeth, like NATO or TANZAC.

      --
      Never by hatred has hatred been appeased, only by kindness - the Buddha
  8. Einstein's childhood by AtariAmarok · · Score: 4, Funny

    Please see Young Einstein for some amazing revelations about our favorite frizzy professor's childhood in Australia.

    --
    Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
  9. The successful de-politicization of Einstein... by dpbsmith · · Score: 5, Interesting

    One of the more interesting things about society in the United States is the way in which "dangerous" ideas can be neutralized and forgotten without actual censorship. Jack London, Helen Keller, and Albert Einstein are good examples of people whose political opinions were successfully submerged in the popular consciousness by elevating the non-threatening aspects of their life and work.

    An example from the right rather than the left would be Charles Lindbergh.

    I remember being surprised by my discovery, in the sixties, that a) many people of my parents' generation at least recognize the tune and words of The Internationale, that virtually nobody from the sixties generation does--not even the real lefties--and that people from my parents' generation were largely unaware that people from the next generation don't know it. A song and a political emblem, into the memory hole without benefit of telescreens.

    1. Re:The successful de-politicization of Einstein... by IceAgeComing · · Score: 3, Interesting

      political opinions were successfully submerged in the popular consciousness by elevating the non-threatening aspects of their life and work.

      A couple highly personal observations:

      * Einstein's genius was in part the ability to envision abstract relationships, possibly at the expense of understanding human relationships. He had a (perhaps overly) simple vision of a simple and just social order. I admire it and share in his probable wish that people could lead simple, straightforward lives and help the less fortunate along the way.

      * Journalism, in its attempt to be sexy, has tried to make Einstein sexy. Humanitarianism is about as un-sexy as it gets, which just kills my own idealism by the way. So of course we don't know about that part of his life. Instead we are left thinking about how he helped bring about the very sexy Atom Bomb.

    2. Re:The successful de-politicization of Einstein... by Pentagram · · Score: 4, Informative

      Jack London, Helen Keller, and Albert Einstein are good examples of people whose political opinions were successfully submerged in the popular consciousness by elevating the non-threatening aspects of their life and work.

      And that's pretty sad. Helen Keller in particular: the part of her life where she first managed to overcome some part of her disabilities is remembered, but the campaigning work she did afterwards is forgotten. It's just about the most patronizing thing I can think of.

      With respect to Einstein, I think that he earned the right to have his views heard (though not automatically agreed with of course!) In that spirit, here's Einstein on socialism.

    3. Re:The successful de-politicization of Einstein... by br00tus · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Einstein's most famous political essay was probably "Why Socialism?, which appeared in the first issue of the Monthly Review.

      The first thing he addresses in it is what someone here already responded, why does it matter what an expert (or genius) on physics thinks about political matters? His first answer is that since physics is a physical science, e.g. a "real" science, while economics is a social science, pretty much anyone can have an opinion on a social science and have it be of possible equal validity since there's no scietific method of finding a "correct" answer. He also says that the violent, predatory nature of the existing system intrudes on a scientific study of political economy (for example, property "rights" are enforced by...force). His second answer is that this is a social-ethical question more than a scientific question. So in other words, he dismisses the notion that there are experts in economic or social matters whom one can objectively say know more than the average person. It would be like a theologian telling an atheist he understands the nature of the universe better than the average person.

      As far as socialism, it never really made much of an inroads in the USA. If it's dealt with it all, it's said that it's "big government"...which sounds more like good old American New Deal Democrat liberalism. It's kind of like Plato's cave, the only reference to the body of socialism would be the shadow of liberalism. Einstein came from Europe where socialism was quite a big thing (as was communism) in the 20th century (in the east and the west - the largest political party in France was communist until 1956, Italy practically elected a communist government in 1976 losing by 5% of the vote, Germany's parliament was majority socialist and communist prior to Hitler, Spain had an anarchist/communist war against fascism in 1936 and was under a military dictatorship for decades afterward, and so on and so forth - socialism, anarchism and communism dominated Europe in the 20th century alongside fascism and Christian democrats). Einstein was steeped in these politics in Europe and had a much more intimate understanding of them then most Americans would. I've found most Americans think they know a lot about 20th century European history and the political philosophies of socialism, communism, anarchism, fascism and so forth, but they really don't. For example, you always hear how the USSR "forced" Hungarians to be communist. You'd never have known Hungary had had a bolshevik revolution in 1919, which lasted until Romania invaded. Of course, Russia had some influence on eastern Europe, but the US could be said in many respects to have "forced" France and Italy to be capitalist - especially Italy - the post-war elections were a total fraud, and as late as 1976 there were secret plans drafted by the USA to have NATO invade Italy if they voted communists into power in the 1976 election, which nearly happened. I don't know which is more disturbing - that Americans know so little about all of this, or that they know so little about all of this but think they do know all of this.

    4. Re:The successful de-politicization of Einstein... by sg3000 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > And that's pretty sad. Helen Keller in particular: the part of her
      > life where she first managed to overcome some part of her
      > disabilities is remembered, but the campaigning work she did
      > afterwards is forgotten. It's just about the most patronizing
      > thing I can think of.

      Great comment. My history professor in college referred to this as "chaining to a pedestal". Elevating one aspect of a person (or group of people) with the intent to suppress another aspect.

      --
      Insert simplistic political, ideological, or personal proselytization here.
  10. One of his famous quotes... by akaina · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...was "I live in that solitude which is painful in youth, but delicious in the years of maturity."

    It's surprising that someone so respected would need to chase a carrot like that. It sounds like that solitude extended indefinitely. Maybe extreme genius demands solitude.

    Any thoughts?

    --
    Remembering that you are going to die is the best way I know to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to lose.
    1. Re:One of his famous quotes... by IceAgeComing · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's surprising that someone so respected would need to chase a carrot like that.

      I'm not sure I get your metaphor. This is how I view Einstein: more comfortable around equations than people. A logical mind finds that people are complex AND annoyingly difficult to understand at their core; equations are complex but are at least a fixed target.

      Both can be extremely interesting, but I suspect Einstein ultimately chose solitude because he found most people frustratingly difficult to understand.

  11. Re:MODS This is all true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Here is the rest of the story. I linked to only one the first time. Sorry.

  12. "On the touched side" means "socialist" now? by ianscot · · Score: 4, Interesting
    "From many published reports, Einstein was a bit on the touched side on social issues"...

    What exactly does that mean?

    It fills me with deep apprehension to see how people who might otherwise rail against "PC revisionism" will dismiss something like Einstein's various social causes, putting them in a basket like "he was a little 'touched'" to keep them at a safe distance. Heisenberg had worked for the German war machine trying to develop an atom bomb. Do we not think Einstein could possibly have strong feelings about that? Whether this diary's legit or not, that particular point doesn't seem over the edge to me. Over-candid, maybe -- as might happen in a diary...

    It' ain't just Einstein (who was an avowed socialist by the way -- boo!). A worse and weirder thing has happened with Helen Keller. Helen Keller was a hell of a woman; Winston Churchill called her "The greatest woman of our age." We've made her a curiosity, a freak show -- because we're airbrushing out her entire adult life so that she's safer for fifth-graders to read about. Okay, so these two people were socialists, and I'm not. (I'd be more of a Keynesian, along the lines of Richard Nixon, economically.) Opinions far from our own aren't inherently nuts, and we don't have to be scared of them -- do we?

    --
    "Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
  13. no kidding by Wah · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Werner Heisenberg is the father of the Atom Bomb.

    Just in an alternate universe.

    Yea, the Nazi's won in that one. Churchhill tripped once as a teenager and hit his head a bit too hard on the pavement. He was finally killed by the SS when they marched through London. No, not in Parliament, on the street. He was a bum.

    It's quite an alternate universe, let me tell ya.

    --
    +&x
  14. did not sympathize? by obtuse · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Heisenberg's motivations are still arguable. After the war, an amazing number of people suddenly "did not sympathize" with the Nazis, although they worked diligently and enthusiastically for them. Heisenberg may have been a "big Nazi." Wasn't Einstein personally acquainted with the man, and in a position to form a legitimate opinion based on evidence we may not have seen?

    Personally, I think Heisenberg was probably sabotaging the Nazi effort, but none of the evidence is compelling. He was such a convincing collaborator that it's hard to tell.

    Heisenberg's actions may have intentionally slowed down the Nazi pursuit of the atom bomb, or perhaps he was actually trying hard, and just wrong or (un)lucky. All these men were perfectly fallible.

    We're responsible to everyone for what we do, and who we pretend to be and. We're responsible only to ourselves for who we are.

    Fiction is a good arena for the unknowable. Kurt Vonnegut's _Mother Night_ is a lovely book about these very problems and even the movie is great.

    --
    Assembly is the reverse of disassembly.
    1. Re:did not sympathize? by AchilleTalon · · Score: 4, Funny
      Maybe that's what we should call:

      Uncertainty principle of Heisenberg

      --
      Achille Talon
      Hop!
  15. Godel (and Einstein) were mundane... by 1iar_parad0x · · Score: 5, Interesting

    On a tagential, but seemingly related note. Hao Wang's book "A Logical Journey: From Gödel to Philosophy" is a similar type of book. It's really more of a historical source, not a book. The author merely collected and recorded facts based on Godel's life. Godel and Einstein spent 20 years together at the Institute for Advanced Study. Often times they would take walks together and they seemed to be good friends. Also, Godel seemed to have had an active interest in cosmology, prehaps presceint of the rigourization of cosmological models in the post-Einstein era.

    Godel lived a rather mundane life. He was no Feynman. He was quiet. While Einstein seemed to enjoy, if not ask, to be treated as a scientific god, Godel seemed to hate such exclusion. Often times, mathematicians and philosophers feared to even talk to the great Godel. Even Von Nuemann (who seemed to have little respect for Einstein [see Ulam's autobiography]), referred to Godel as the greatest philosopher since Aristotle. Facts, as found in Wang's book, such as Godel's fondness for "chicken and biscuits" or Godel spending Sunday mornings in bed reading the Bible are mundane. However, these men were mundane. They're world was completely of the mind. Often these men quirks are the only really interesting things about them. They were virtually indisguishable in public. In fact, in Martin Davis book, "The Universal Computer" Davis' wife exclaimed, upon first seeing Einstein and Godel together at Princeton, that see had seen "Einstein and his lawyer".

    In the case of this woman's diaries, I'm more concerned she deified Einstein, thus tainting her view. I believe the publishers may have been right in this case. Her diaries probably read more like notes. They probably would have requried some extensive work or further research before being worthy of a book.

    --
    What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean my sig is repetitive? What do you mean....
  16. I nitpick so you don't have to. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative
    "This political persecution of his associate was a source of bitter disillusionment," Fantova wrote, of the effect on Einstein of the persecution of Oppenheimer by the house un-American activities committee, led by McCarthy.

    I really wish the Guardian would check their facts before printing mistakes like this. (It has to be an editorial mistake by the Guardian, since someone alive at that time would have known better.)

    The House Un-American Activities committee was a committee of the House of Representatives. Joseph McCarthy was a Senator, and as such, would not have even been a _member_ of a House committee, much less its leader.

  17. department by sharkdba · · Score: 2, Funny

    from the never-has-the-topic-icon-been-more-fitting dept.

    Actually it has.

    --
    The purpose of life is to find the purpose of life.
  18. They Wrote Books by toddhisattva · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Which in Einstein's case is unfortunate, as his The World as I See It clearly shows him to be an idiot savant: untouchable at mathematical physics, but laughably and tragically stupid about nearly everything else.

    Heisenberg's Physics and Beyond is, on the other hand, a brilliant chronicle of the development of quantum physics. Heisenberg's disgust at faculty loyalty oaths and other trappings of National Socialism is clear. Heinsenberg also records the brilliance and humor of his colleagues, like Wolfgang Pauli, "There is no God and Dirac is His prophet!" Heisenberg is quite gracious to Einstein, so it is sad Einstein couldn't rise above his petty bitterness to all things quantum (what a cranky idiot savant).

    Since this is Slashdot, there is of course no need to urge folks to read Stan Ulam's Adventures of a Mathematician. Y'all got it next to Feynman on your shelves, right?

  19. Same situation, different era by bluetrident · · Score: 2, Interesting

    As I read the posts here, it strikes me that now is no different, it's just a different group that the public hears. The scientists, poets, playwrights of earlier times were the celebrities of that era. They were looked up to and listened to. That's why so much of that history is tied to political leanings.

    Just as the celebrities of our time are just as outspoken. Actors, actresses, musicians--their comments on Bush, Iraq, Blair.

    It's just a different era and those that have the public's ear are not those same 'lofty' thinkers as they were then. Torvalds, Gates, or Jobs might have political leanings you've never even thought of, but it'll probably never make it to the press. It's just not what the public wants anymore.