eBay Scam Victim Strikes Back

jcomeau_ictx writes "Justin Spence doesn't take lightly being scammed out of $1155 for a laptop he never received. The seller, Salvatore Wise, Jr. of Philadelphia, is growing openly more hostile over the webpage Justin produced exposing his and his wife Michelle Heinlein's scams to the world. So far Justin has documented $6841.00 total lost to this crook, but the total is more likely in the tens of thousands. " As it goes along it just gets more and more bizarre. My favorite part is when "Sal" says that all the earlier messages were sent from a different Sal, but you can tell them apart because the true Sal always writes his emails in italics.

Comments

So whats ebay doing?

[stecoop]

This is a long and complex story. I dont blame either party but since I'm more intrested/concered in what eBay is doing to thwart crimes.

eBay?

[jawtheshark]

Well, I never understood the craze about ebay. You're dealing with unknown untrusted people, giving them money in advance (as I understood) I just can't trust anyone on such sites. In case I want something I'd rather buy it new. If I can't afford something new, I just won't buy it.

So, buying anything in those priceranges is taking a huge risk. I'm not saying that these scammer should get away with it (they should be thrown in jail), I'm just saying that I prefer not to take risks.

Re:eBay?

[Pharmboy]

Well, I never understood the craze about ebay. You're dealing with unknown untrusted people, giving them money in advance (as I understood) I just can't trust anyone on such sites. In case I want something I'd rather buy it new. If I can't afford something new, I just won't buy it.
So, buying anything in those priceranges is taking a huge risk. I'm not saying that these scammer should get away with it (they should be thrown in jail), I'm just saying that I prefer not to take risks.

I have eBayed since 98, and have sold tens of thousands of dollars worth of stuff, and bought thousands of dollars worth as well. Never directly ripped off. Of course, I only buy from people with good ratings, use a credit card/pay pal only, and take other precautions, but still its safer than buying from a flea market.

Re:eBay?

[savagedome]

I just can't trust anyone on such sites

You are absolutely right about the risk part. eBay is a risk to begin with. That's the risk you are taking for the low price that appealed you at the first place. However, I disagree with "anyone" part. eBay has millions of users and probably a miniscule percentage are the crooks. But even miniscule percentage of a million adds up fairly quickly and we see stories like the current one.

I have a personal upper limit on buying stuff from eBay. If I want something, I place the maximum bid (which eBay automatically increments on your behalf) and be done with it. If I win it, I get it otherwise forget about it.

Personal anecdote: The most expensive thing I bought off of eBay was a Nikon FM3A camera. The price I was bidding was close to USD500. I was a little shaky to bid that and so I did some research (aka Googling). Found a similar post on a photography forum (under a similar name) that was a month older than the eBay listing. The words and sentences used in both the posts also were fairly similar. Also, a little more power Googling narrowed it down to someone in a specific university. So I wrote a question to the seller and phrased it in such a way that it would make him atleast hint at the university. He replied back with the kind of answer I was expecting and right away I placed my bid. I got the camera and am happy.

Moral of the story: Have a personal upper limit on bidding amount and do some Googling!

low ticket items

[bludstone]

This is why you only buy SMALL TICKET items off of ebay.

Im talking dvds, videogames, maybe hdds. If you get ripped off, the loss is minimal.

I thought everyone knew this already :)

Re:Credit Cards

[kemapa]

Isn't there some special online protection plan that can remburse you in case of an online purchase fraud? Why don't people just get one of these cards specifically for ebaying.

Yes, several credit card companies offer plans that "prevent" online fraud (and many other types of fraud) by refunding your money in the event that you are a victim of fraud. In this case, however, this would not have been possible because the seller mentioned in this slashdot article would not accept credit card payments / paypal. Furthermore, all the credit cards with fraud protection that I have seen have a limit to how much they will cover in a year's time or how much you can claim at once. Your fraud protection might have a $1000 a year limit and a maximum of $300 per fraud. Meaning, with expensive items you don't get great protection anyway.

What I really wish for is an offline protection plan that can crack skulls in case of an online purchase fraud.

Re:Big Nasty Guys With Guns

[avandesande]

Almost any crime associated with USPS is a federal crime...

Re:Credit Cards

[ryanwright]

They stick with their 'venue' status

A bunch of bullshit, too. I bought a $10 item and the seller added $20 for shipping (I expected $15, but whatever, I'll pay his overcharge), but then tacked a $20 "handling fee" on top of that! This was NOT mentioned in the auction!

eBay has a rule about this, so I complained to them, but they refused to enforce it because his auction said "seller pays shipping and handling". They also kindly informed me that if I didn't pay, my account would be subject to disciplinary action. I asked, "So, the seller could make up whatever number he wanted - $1,000, perhaps - and if I didn't pay, you would trash MY account?" The response: "Yes."

When I complained further, they pulled the "we're just a venue" bullshit, and compared themselves to the classifieds section of the newspaper. But they're not "just a venue". They have proactively taken steps to remove troublesome users and to create a large base of rules governing transactions. The fact that they go around slapping people who don't pay, no matter what the circumstances, proves they're not "just a venue."

eBay pisses me off. I still use it, because there aren't any other choices. But they're a bunch of asshats. Either you're a venue or not. Either you enforce rules or you don't have them at all. You can't have it both ways.

(I ended up paying half the seller's extortion fee and letting him keep some of the items in the lot that I didn't need, and making a note to never, ever bid on anything that doesn't have all shipping & handling costs clearly listed in the auction.)