TiVo Bug Shuts Out Many Series 1 TiVo Owners?

Didion Sprague writes "A bug in recently released DirecTv/TiVo software is allegedly causing major chaos with many TiVo users -- forcing many users over the past few days to upgrade their Series 1 Tivo boxes to newer, Series 2 models (which retail for $79). Apparently lots of folks on the TiVo Community forum and DBS forums are frustrated and angry. The bug has apparently been reproduced and causes the video stream to freeze when a combination of factors are met. DirecTv has been offering users who complain a $79 credit -- but hasn't admitted the problem, let alone offered up a timetable for a fix. The problem only occurs with the DirecTv TiVo boxes -- not the standalone models."

Comments

Details on how to reproduce:

[Otto]

First, get the 3.1.0c software.

Then Dan Collins posts this tidbit of info that might help somebody figure this one out:

I spent some time this morning trying to force the problem to occur, and finally was successful. The ONLY scenario that reproduced the problem on one of my Hughes Series 1 was as follows:

-A recording must be executing on at least one tuner
-Signal quality must degrade to the point of causing severe digital artifacts WITHOUT a loss of signal lock
-The poor signal quality must persist for at LEAST 15 seconds
-The signal must then cut out completely on BOTH tuners
-The recording must STILL be going on when signal is restored

I was NOT able to reproduce the problem when any one of these factors were missing. For example, if the recording ended before signal was restored - no problem. Or, if I just pulled the coax out of the receiver jacks and then reconnected - no problem.

The result was that, after meeting all of these conditions, on at least one of the tuners, after channel acquisition, the A/V would play normally for a second or three, then the video would freeze, while audio continues. Invoking the OSG, or pressing info would "unfreeze" the video for a second or two. This leads me to believe that it is NOT a problem with the state of the MPEG decoders, but rather a problem confined to the software itself.

So, this seems to be a rather specific set of conditions that must come together to cause this problem.

BTW: I reproduced the problem by installing variable resistors in the coax feeds and gradually increasing the resistance until signal lock was lost.

Re:Details on how to reproduce:

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, the two signals are transmitted slightly differently. They are different MPEG-ish streams, and while the video is encrypted, the audio is unencrypted.

There's other data streams as well (guide, DTV housekeeping - aka hacker check, etc), so it's not one big signal operating on one transponder - it's possible for some channels to come in fine while others are dead (the PPV channels generally operate on the hottest transponders, for some odd reason).

Re:Not as big a deal as story suggests

[mabu]

f you haven't plugged it in for 6 mths, how are you getting tv schedule updates? If I leave mine unplugged for more than 2 weeks I run out of data and it stops recording. I guess I could do it by time but then it is just a basic vcr.

The DirecTV Tivo gets program schedules via satellite. The only thing you need the phone line for is software updates and PPV stuff. If you don't use PPV, you probably never have to plug it in.

Although, it's not a bad idea to do the updates. I finally let mine phone home and the next day I saw some new features, but I like the idea of waiting until the mainstream has evaluated a patch before applying it, at least in a case like this where it's less likely to be a security issue.

Re:Not as big a deal as story suggests

[hawkbug]

Ok, in this case Sony SAT-T60 (and other DTV gen 1 tivos) needed this new upgrade to resolve guide issues about acuiring data, and some other closed captioning issues. I have the Sony SAT-T60, and I know a lot of other people who also have it, and are having this problem. You said:

"This appears to be an isolated issue that has only affected a small number of owners of much older Tivos (and in reality, ones that probably have a bunch of weird hacks). I'm sure Tivo is going to fix it, and the bug seems to be so obscure, it's probably wise of them to wait before even acknowledging it, especially when there's a chance the bug isn't related to a standard Tivo setup."

I guess if you call rain an isolated issue, you don't live in Seattle or any other place where it rains a lot. For the majority of people who own these boxes, this is an annoying issue that I hope they resolve quickly. And for the record, it has NOTHING to do with "weird hacks" as you put it. The problem 100% does exist with a standard Tivo set up, so don't minimize the effects of the problem for all of us who actually have to deal with it until Tivo fixes the issue.

Re:Not as big a deal as story suggests

[Anonymous Coward]

I think it's a big deal.

30+ pages on the TiVo foums. People replacing their TiVo boxes. DTV sending out refurbs.

I recall one post suggesting it to /. as a story a while ago and it was rejected. Now they picked it up.

I've had it happen to both my TiVo boxes a few times and they have never been modified or hacked. Not even 30 second skip software functions. The warranty sticker is still on them.

One is a 3 year old Sony and the other is a 2 year old Philips. I'm not totally sure on the age. I was an early adopter with the Sony ($400) and picked up the Philips when Circuit City first put them on sale for $99. SAT-T60 and DSR7000R are the model numbers I think.

The video will freeze while the audio continues. Anything that is recording at the time will be weirded out as well. Restarting the machine fixes it for a while. Seems to happen when storms roll through and the DTV signal fades.

They've been fine since their last reboot 4 days ago. No storms since. Forecast has a few coming up though. I live in north central Indiana.

I hope DTV fixes it soon. From some of the posts in the forum, the refurbs would be unacceptable to me.

It's a big deal to me because for the first time since I've owned them, my TiVos are unreliable at recording shows. Bad QA on DTVs part I think.

Nice to see /. finally picking up the story though.

Re:Lifetime service

[Jonathan_S]

I'd lose that Lifetime Service if I upgraded them to a Series 2 unit.

Actually you wouldn't. When DirecTV took over the DTiVo service from TiVo (the same time the monthly fee dropped to $4.95) they modified how the lifetime service works. You can't buy lifetime anymore, but for everyone who already purchased it that service switched from being tied to a specific receiver to being tied to the DirecTV account.

So as long as you don't cancel your DirecTV account any DTiVos you have will have lifetime service (possible limit of 8 per account), even if you remove your original DTiVo from the account.

MythTV - better than TIVO if you're a geek

[poopie]

I'll second that.

MythTV is great and it's extensible - if you want to build your own PVR and you like Linux, then you'll like MythTV. It's not necessarily cheaper than a Tivo up front, but it's more flexible and extensible if you're into that sort of hacking thing ;)

Having just completed a MythTV box that now "owns" my TV, I can say it was more complicated, cost more, and took longer than I expected. I can also say that I'm very happy with what I have and what I can do with it, and the potential to add new features and functionality.

Installing MythTV takes some time. I recommend using one of the distros/guides below. Following these, most clueful people should be able to get MythTV running.

See:

MythTV Homepage
KnoppMyth - bootable MythTV
Jarod's Fedora/MythTV Homepage
Debian MythTV howto
Gentoo MythTV howto

Re:Lifetime service

[walt-sjc]

Go on the vacation plan. It doesn't cancel service - just suspend.