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Are We Alone in the Universe?
cynic10508 writes "CNN is running a story about how ours might be a unique solar system. Of the 100+ systems currently known to contain planets, all contain seemingly only gas giants. However, this may be a case of current technology and techniques being unable to detect planets similar to Earth." There are also
BBC and Space.com stories.
Its too early to say there are none or few rocky body systems out there. First off, we haven't even come close to surveying a representative portion of the sky, and second, we don't yet have good enough technology to detect small planets. If we were 500 light years away from our system, we probably wouldn't be able to detect earth.
Moo.
"... this may be a case of current technology and techniques being unable to detect planets similar to Earth ..." Yeah, exactly. If the only way you have to detect planets orbiting other stars is to look for the gravitational effects of large, massive planets orbiting close their stars, then is what you're going to find.
It occurs to me that a useful way to think about these "hot Jupiters" may be as failed double stars, not planets equivalent to our own gas giants. And we already know that double stars are more common than singletons like the Sun. (Er, I think -- someone please tell me if I'm wrong.)
One thing that frustrates me about the articles I've seen on this subject is that they don't explain why formation of big, close-in gas giants precludes formation of Earth-like planets farther out. Accretion disks are really, really big; surely parts of them can clump into gas giants while others slowly form smaller, rocky planets?
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
Cheers,
Erick
http://www.busyweather.com/
Those factors may mean nothing. We don't know the exact circumstances and timeframe for life to begin. What if our situation is unique or we are the first? You can't build any assumptions from a sample size of one.
There's probably a good chance that there is other 'life' out there. But what about 'intelligent life', that would be more rare, we might just be an evolutionary fluke. Now try this: What are the odds of intelligent life existing out there at the same time as us. How long have we been around since radio was invented? 100 years? How much longer can we survive before we blow ourselves up? What if every other intelligent civilization never invented radio, or they did and then invented nuclear weapons, but didn't survive their cold war. If you actually think about it, we can be very VERY rare.
Yes we're alone. And even if we weren't, I don't think another race is just going to drop in and say, "Hi".
Take a look at any of the alien visitation movies we make. Aliens come to Earth. Aliens attack humans. Humans unite (that's the truly unbelieveable part of these movies). Humans destroy all Aliens.
What species in their right minds is going to come to a planet who's inhabitants immediately imprison and disect anything remotely extra terrestrial?
WTF are you talking about? Most people cant really comprehend the true size of the universe but feel that on the scale we do understand its almost impossible for there not to other life out there somewhere.
We have been looking for "life" outside of our planet for quite a while with nothing even approaching a hit
Five billion years of evolution for this planet alone, any you consider your lifetime a significant timescale? We have barely begun to even scratch the surface of exploration at this stage. You may ultimately be correct and we are alone but to base that assumprion on what we have done so far is truly premature.
I agree though though that if we did encounter intelligent alien life in the next few years the problems would be manifold.
Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
What truth?
There is no dupe
and it would be seen as a threat
As it should be but if anything it would make people fight against each other even more. Religion fuels a lot of our current social problems. What the hell is it going to do when we fight intelligent life that wasn't created in what our cultures felt was "God's vision"?
You're absolutely right - there's no doubt that we are Very Rare.
...
But on the other side of that coin, the entire Universe is Very Large - and the vast majority of it is completely unmapped / unexplored (from our perspective) to any reasonable degree.
I'd argue that our two "Very"s cancel each other out nicely.
The odds of us being fairly Unique? They're probably pretty high. But the odds of us being COMPLETELY Unique?
And plus your argument of timing is very good. But I'd argue that the finding artifacts from a long-doomed alien civilization would be almost as tasty as finding the civilization itself.
Certainly if they were already gone, at least we wouldn't have to worry about forming (and maintaining!) good relations with them.
...Also, I didn't know Buggalo could fly.
From the article: Either way, it is time to start thinking about the possibility that our system is unique or at least unusual, Livio said.
:)
OK. Perhaps this is true but ultimately I wonder; so what? Even if another M class planet doesn't exist what's the big deal? Even in that model of the universe that doesn't exclude the idea that there may be other life forms. It also doesn't end the possibility of human expansion. While it is possible it's also trivial on many levels.
And with the rate we're going it gives plenty of time for other planets to form...
Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
Being a Christian myself, I'll take a crack at this.
My personal belief is that believing the Bible does not preclude belief in other life forms. In my mind, the book of Genesis clearly shows what God's hand did in our world, our solar system, our planet, etc. However, nowhere in the book of Genesis does it specifically say He didn't create life somewhere else. While it does say He created man in his own image, that does not mean it was impossible for Him to create life elsewhere in a different or similar form.
Though I don't think many other Christians share my viewpoint...
Proudly supporting the Libertarian Party.
The CD analogy isn't that good. The universe could be infinite, or big enough, in size allowing for anything to happen multiple times.
The meme police, They live inside of my head
Well if religion's brought up, I feel I must chime in with my islamic 2 dinars. As to the problem from a Christian perspective, which I for obvious reasons don't share though (raised Catholic mind you, and my Dad's a minister currently), what I wonder would be what does that say about Christ being God's unique son, whose atoning sacrifice is supposed to save humanity? What about all the other supposed species of beings out there who probably have not heard of Jesus? Are they all damned? Why would God only send his "son" down to one species. If one then thinks "well maybe He incarnated amongst them too" that definately throws the Christian doctrine in bind, about Jesus being unique and all, and rather relativizes the whole thing. Plus, multi incarnations (reincarnations?) definately seems to be drifting far out of accepted Christian orthodoxy.
;-) The imam (for us shias, one of the twelve successors of the Prophet Muhammad) says something like: Do you think yours is the only Adam God has created, rather, He has created thousands upon thousands of other Adams, and yours is but the last.
Anyway, that's your faith, I can only really comment best on mine. I'm a shia muslim, and in the corpus of our traditions, there are a number of references to there being many other Adams out there, other worlds with living beings. Like one that goes something like (don;t have the exact reference in front of me, Im at work
There are other traditions like this, and the Quran does mention a plurality of worlds. Since we don't believe in the Christian paradigms, original sin, Christ being the incarnation and son (we believe in him as a human prophet, not a god-man), the atonement through crucifixion, etc., these concerns wouldn't really affect our theology.
That said, I'm not holding my breadth for us to soon, or even ever, make contact through means of technology. The universe is a mighty big place, our galaxy being only one many many more. Add to that, the enormity of the ages since it was created, who knows where or even when to look for other beings as us or otherwise? But as we say, God knows best....
I suggest you read some Ed Babinski. An excerpt from one of his works:
... let's get to the big questions. The biggest one is, "Are there intelligent beings elsewhere in the cosmos?" The cosmos as it is presently known, contains over 50 billion galaxies, each galaxy containing between 100 to 200 billion stars. Recent advances in telescopic magnification have allowed astronomers to detect rings of matter and planets that circle stars other than our own. It is conceivable that intelligent beings exist, or have existed in the distant past, or will exist in the future, on planets other than the earth. Are we the only intelligent beings who have evolved in the cosmos' vast dimensions of space and time?
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/ce/4/part1.html
Even a "Biblical creationist" might find himself unable to believe that we are the only intelligent beings "God created" in a cosmos of countless blazing stars and (who knows how many) planetary bodies? So much cosmic "real estate" going to waste. Doesn't sound very "purposeful" does it?
Yet, if intelligent beings exist on other planets, how are they going to react to the "Biblical creation account?" Are they going to believe that the cosmos was created in "six days" as measured from one planet's perspective, the earth's? Such beings might well wonder why the cosmos wasn't created based on the length of a "day" on their own planet, rather than ours.
Neither are they going to believe that five out of the "six" days of creation, or, five sixths of the "creation period" was focused solely on the earth, during which its seas, dry land and sky, and the plants and animals on it, were created. The "rest" of the cosmos with it's 50 billion galaxies, and it's unknown multitude of planets, including the one these other beings live on, took only "one day" out of "six" to create? They'd be on the floor laughing at such earth-centered viewpoints in the very first chapter of the Bible. Only one planet, the earth, took five sixths of God's creation time to complete? No intelligent being inhabiting another planet is going to believe that!
Or, how about this for a "worst case" scenario after meeting a technologically advanced being from another planet: (Being from another planet speaking with Billy Graham's son) "So, you say, five sixths of God's `creation time' was spent on your pitiful little planet full of natural disasters and turmoil and idiocy, and God only spent one sixth of that time creating the rest of the cosmos, including what was to become our vast pan-galactic civilization whose history stretches back before the first pitiful little Biblical book was scrawled on goat skin parchments?"
Hence my next big question, ARE THERE CREATIONISTS ON OTHER PLANETS? Do they quote from a book somewhat like our earth-centered book of Genesis? And, supposing that the name of their planet is "Zontar," does their book read something like this...
In the beginning God created the heavens and ZONTAR, and the spirit of God moved on the face of the waters OF ZONTAR and God said let there be light, and there was the first evening and morning. And God separated the waters and caused dry land to appear ON ZONTAR, and there was a second evening and morning. And God made the land bring forth green plants and fruit trees ON ZONTAR, and there was a third evening and morning. And God made TWO GREAT LIGHTS, one to rule the day ON ZONTAR, and one to rule the night ON ZONTAR, and he made the stars also, and set them in the sky to light ZONTAR and for signs and seasons, and there was a fourth evening and morning. And God made animals ON ZONTAR, and there was a fifth evening and morning. And God made beings IN HIS OWN IMAGE, and he visited them in the garden where He and they left slimy trials as they moved and talked to each other via their antennae, and there was a sixth evening and morning. And on the seventh day God "rested" from creating the heavens and ZONTAR.
Of course, we earthlings, being raised on the Bible, would know that God
Pathetic humans! Prepare to write down the recipe!