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Ringworld's Children

ppanon writes "When Larry Niven's Ringworld's Children came out in June, I picked up a copy and it's been sitting on my shelf since. I had been hesitating to read it because I didn't want to be disappointed by it as I had been by some of his other solo novels in the last decade (Destiny's Road, The Ringworld Throne). But being home with a virus this weekend, and having run out of new Anime DVDs to watch, I thought it was time to catch up on some reading. I looked at Niven's book and thought, 'Might as well, I can't feel much worse.' As I got further into the novel, my problem wasn't that of feeling worse, it was forcing myself to put the book down when I felt I needed to rest again." Read on for the rest. Ringworld's Children author Larry Niven pages 284 publisher TOR rating 8.5 reviewer Paul-Andre Panon ISBN 0765301679 summary excellent page turner

The Ringworld is like a small slice of a Dyson Sphere, a massive ring with radius slightly larger than 1 AU, spun to simulate gravity on the inside with thousand mile-high side walls to hold atmosphere. In the second Ringworld novel, The Ringworld Engineers, it was revealed that the Ringworld was probably created by Pak protectors, a species cousin to humans with three phases in their life cycle: juvenile, breeders, and protectors. Protectors are extremely territorial, competitive, and intelligent, and will go to any lengths they can to protect and provide competitive advantage for their descendants, as identified by a keen sense of smell. While protectors normally cull out any significant genetic divergence from normal (picked up by changes in smell), a failure in the food supply caused all protectors in the Earth Pak colony to die. Breeders evolved sapience and became homo sapiens.

Something similar has somehow happened on Ringworld and, in the third book, after decades exploring the Ringworld, our hero, Louis Wu, decides to replace the current insane master of the Ringworld, Bram, a protector created from a vampirical species also evolved from the original Pak breeders. Even insane, Bram is still many times smarter, stronger, faster, and tougher than any human, so Louis and his cohorts don't have much of a chance taking him on. Humans and all Pak-descended Ringworld species can still turn into (misshapen/modified) protectors if exposed to tree-of-life root, but Louis is too old to make the transition to protector himself (besides, he likes breeding). He carefully creates another protector, Tunesmith, and, with the help of others, they manage to kill Bram.

Ringworld's Children picks up a few months after the end of the Ringworld Throne. Louis comes out of the autodoc that has been repairing the severe damage he suffered in the fight against Bram. He's also young again, thanks to Carlos Wu's one-of-a-kind nanotech autodoc, after tinkering by the hyper-intelligent Tunesmith. Tunesmith has been busy soaking up all Known Space knowledge, including advanced Puppeteer knowledge from the completely intimidated Hindmost, the former leader of the Puppeteer race and Louis' erstwhile employer. He's also been working on cleaning up some of the mess left by Bram (tens of centuries or more of overdue Ringworld repairs - Bram was a lousy housekeeper, too). More urgent however is the Fringe War, a cold war in the remote asteroid belt at the far edges of the Ringworld system (similar to our Oort Belt). Most of the major species of Known Space have at least a few ships there. The ARM (the UN's police/military forces) and the Kzin have substantial war fleets. All the factions want to learn the Ringworld's secrets. Those fleets have antimatter weapons that could destroy the Ringworld as collateral damage and, for perhaps decades, they've been in a Mexican standoff, but deployments and movement patterns indicate all antimatter hell could break loose in the near future.

Louis' puppet strings are now held by Tunesmith, and since Tunesmith takes some pretty big calculated risks without explaining their rationale, Louis likes it maybe even less than when those strings were held by the Hindmost. Even if they get past the immediate emergency, Tunesmith's likely long-term plans for Louis are far from appealing. He has to figure out how to permanently escape from Tunesmith and the Ringworld without getting blown up by the Fringe War or triggering an apocalyptic attack on the Ringworld. His only chance at escape from Tunesmith's vastly superior intelligence is that Tunesmith is heavily distracted planning on how to deal with the Fringe War.

In earlier ringworld novels, when Louis and his co-explorers made first contact with native Ringworld population groups, they would play the "God Game," first getting their story straight and consistent before conning the natives to obtain knowledge or food. That dialogue technique is used here again, including when Louis uses it by himself to figure out scenarios he can use against Tunesmith. Part of my mind was a little distracted, thinking "Is this how Niven works out the plot outline of novels, before fleshing out individual scenes or chapters?" But the rest of my (virus-addled) brain was racing along trying to figure all the possibilities where Niven or his characters might be going. Even so, Niven still managed to completely surprise me once near the end, because I'd let myself get distracted and miss a couple of the better hidden clues.

Along the way, Niven ties up a lot of loose ends and answers a lot of questions, about the Ringworld and about some other phenomena in the Known Space universe. The plot has few slow points, and almost none in the second half of the book, hiding fairly well Niven's slightly-less-than-usual weakness at character development. This novel should earn Niven another Hugo nomination

If you're a recent SF reader and can't handle the lack of ubiquitous computers or the ESP/Psionics that dates some of Niven's more famous and popular 60's and 70's era stories (when the Amazing Randi hadn't yet debunked Uri Geller and most others of his ilk), you may find his Ringworld stories more palatable. Pak don't need or want computers on the ringworld, and there's passing mention of psionics only because of the conventions established in other Known Space series. If you like older 60's or 70's-vintage Niven stories because of the imaginative aliens, environments, or inventions, you'll almost certainly enjoy reading this book. Finally, if you've liked any of the other stories in the Ringworld or Known Space series and were left wanting more, you need to read this book.

You can purchase Ringworld's Children from bn.com. Slashdot welcomes readers' book reviews -- to see your own review here, read the book review guidelines, then visit the submission page.

27 of 187 comments (clear)

  1. Larry Niven's Known Space by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Is one of those series of books I think should be made into movies. Mono-filiment weapons, impact armour, Pak Protectors, Pearson's Puppeteers, the whole shabang!

    I would love love to see Louis Wu on the silver screen. Such a coherent universe filled with POSSIBLE (kinda) technology. I just love it. And books like Lucifer's hammer and the Smoke Ring series are some of my favorites.

    1. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by east+coast · · Score: 4, Insightful

      one of those series of books I think should be made into movies

      Wish nothing of the sort! I can only imagine Hollywood's greasy hands on Niven. They'd shread it to the point that besides the minimal plot line there would be nothing left. And that's even being optimistic... Most screenwriters think that putting their own spin on a story makes it better. These people normally think wrong.

      --
      Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
    2. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by HiThere · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Good books usually make lousy movies. And sometimes poor books make good moives. The two media do things very differently.

      (OTOH, I stopped watching the Tolkien Trilogy after the second movie. If you found that tampering with the plot acceptable, then disregard the previous paragraph.)

      --

      I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
    3. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by Xibby · · Score: 3, Informative

      According to Cinescape, Ringworld is being turned into a Sci-Fi Channel mini-seriies. Time will tell if it makes the cut...

      --
      I'm going to go back in my box and will think within the limits of my box: MS Sucks Linux Good I read too much Slashdot.
    4. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by techno-vampire · · Score: 3, Interesting

      One thing that can keep Hollywood from mucking up the movie is for the author to be one of the people financing the film, and Larry's got enough cash to do exactly that.

      --
      Good, inexpensive web hosting
    5. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by techno-vampire · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Yes, it would be a great film, but it will never happen. The film makes a strong point, and one the film people don't want made: when you get right down to it, most people really aren't going to behave themselves if they think they can get away with it.

      --
      Good, inexpensive web hosting
    6. Re:Larry Niven's Known Space by plover · · Score: 3, Insightful
      [ WARNING: PERSONAL MOVIE OPINIONS AHEAD ]

      Stephen King did that, and any movie he's made where he was personally in control of the screenplay kinda sucked (at least in my opinion.) The Shining, The Running Man, The Shawshank Redemption, all directed by other people were big Hollywood hits. The movies where he was more involved (in order to be more true to his books,) such as The Langoliers and The Stand, just weren't as gripping as far as movies go. I mean I liked them, just not as well as the ones that had another person's vision putting them on the screen.

      An author obviously has his or her ideas for screenplays as far as the story goes, and what a vision of it may be, but that doesn't necessarily mean that authors have the "eye" required to make a great movie.

      Not that we could, but I'd really like to see a Phillip K. Dick movie made by his own hand. Any of his stories would do. I'd love to know what went on in that brain of his. But that doesn't mean it would be a commercially successful movie. Now, compare that to some of Hollywood's best science fiction movies that were adaptations of his novels: Bladerunner, Minority Report, etc. Hugely successful, incredibly entertaining, but not necessarily true to every word he wrote.

      Obviously, Larry can afford to take a chance and make his own movie. But that doesn't mean it's going to be a great film. Yes, Hollywood filmmakers can screw up a good story, but some of them can also spin a great movie from a good story.

      --
      John
  2. New covers? by beeglebug · · Score: 5, Funny

    If so I just know i'm going to have to to buy the first three again so they don't look stupid on the shelf together...

    1. Re:New covers? by dwhitman · · Score: 5, Funny

      > If so I just know i'm going to have to to buy the first three again

      Ringworld, the directors special cut edition?

      Ringworld was one of the first SF novels I bought as a kid, when I ran out of material at the local public library. My copy is a first edition where Niven's got the world rotating backwards during Louis Wu's attempt to stretch out his birthday via teleportation. The newer printings have all been digitally reworked to cover up the mistake.

      I'm pretty sure that in the newer printing Nessus fires the tasp at the exact same time that Speaker to Animals is swinging the variable sword, but I'm too cheap to buy a copy to check.

  3. Growing up, Niven and Pournelle ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...were my favorite authors. Starting with Lucifer's Hammer, then Oath of Fealty, The Mote in God's Eye, and all the rest -- I'd purchase their co-authored novels in hardback when I could, which I did with very few authors.

    Unfortunately, after Ringworld Engineer's, Niven's solo output seems to have fallen in quality and I went with David Brin for my hardback book-buying :) I'll still pick up this latest one, I just hope it is better than Destiny's Road.

  4. Publisher's Weekly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative
    I just read a review in publisher's weekly that said this was Niven's worst ringworld book to date -- the characters are flat, it can't be understood without religious attention to the earlier books, and the infodumps are too dry.

    Now I'm so torn -- WHO TO BELIEVE?!?

    1. Re:Publisher's Weekly by mykepredko · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I'm a big Niven/Ringworld fan and I've read (and re-read all the books). I would say Ringworld's Children is somewhere in the middle of the books - although there is a plot point that really pissed me off.

      The book is probably is the best thing that Niven has written in years (take what you will from this) but it's nowhere as good as the original "Ringworld" or his other early/mid '70s novels like "Protector" or "A gift from Earth".

      The story does move reasonably well although I found that with this story Niven got a bit too deep in the minutia of the engineering of the Ringworld and what happens when it is punctured.

      Cryptic Spoiler Warning: What I considered to be the logical continuation in the story arc did happen but Niven wimped out and changed things back to the way they were. If you are a fan of Ringworld and Niven's "Known Space" series, you can probably guess what I'm talking about.

      This reversal killed the book for me; up to this point the story progressed nicely (although a little flat due to the technical descriptions) and I was looking forward to future books with the change.

      If you're a big Niven fan and have read all the Ringworld books, then it is probably worth buying the paperback.

      myke

    2. Re:Publisher's Weekly by abb3w · · Score: 3, Interesting
      I'd disagree with that assessment; Ringworld Throne was worse. However, it definitely requires reading all three of the earlier Ringworld books first, and if you haven't read all of Niven's other Known Space material (including Kzin Wars stuff from him and his guests), there will be lesser references (EG, "Sheathclaws") you won't get. The infodumps are no dryer than needed for protectors conversing in a hurry, and while some of the minor players lack depth, most of the characters are as well developed as Niven ever manages.

      Snuggle up to your local librarian to borrow the hardcover, perhaps buy the paperback when it comes out, or the hardcover when copies start hitting clearance prices in B&N and the like (which is the only reason I bought Ringworld Throne-- I decided it was worth four bucks in hardcover to fill in the hole in my Niven collection). It's Niven, so it's not bad, but he's not on my short list of hardcover purchases these days. (Bujold, Brust, Laurell Hamilton, George RR Martin, and Modesitt-- the last of whom I don't recommend usually, but his work suits some of my tastes.)

      It felt a trifle skeletal, but he's got a universe of details to juggle consistently, so I can sympathize with his restraint in not making a larger book.

      --
      //Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
  5. I'm gonna read it... by mocular · · Score: 5, Insightful
    even if it has been a decade or two since he wrote a novel I could really get into. I became a real SF fan reading Niven in the 70s, so I have to at least try to be loyal.

    I still re-read Beowulf Shaefer stories every now and again. I almost have them memorized, but still think they are some of the best SF ever - in an `old friend` kind of way.

    Ringworld was really great at the time. But the sequels fell into the Asimov trap of trying to tie everything in Known Space together after they were written with obvious discrepencies.

    And, alas, I just can't stand to read fantasy. Whenever there is a plot problem, BOOM! magic happens. Niven's hereditary luck fell into this fantasy trap and it hurt his work.

    Here's hoping Niven's back to the good stuff!

  6. Read on for the rest? by dR.fuZZo · · Score: 4, Funny

    "As I got further into the novel, my problem wasn't that of feeling worse, it was forcing myself to put the book down when I felt I needed to rest again." Read on for the rest.

    But I wanted to hear about what he thought of the book.

    --
    -- dR.fuZZo
  7. Known Space Movie by Tmack · · Score: 4, Informative
    Its been discussed off and on, details here, even though that site hasnt been updated in a while (last year by the looks of it). The movie rights for Ringworld have been sold, but as of yet not much has come of it. This was also brought up in the Slashdot interview with Niven.

    Tm

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  8. Niven follows hard science... by Plural+of+Mongoose · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Unlike many SF writers, Niven _tries_ to follow 'hard science' whenever possible; to wit - when college students pointed out the ringworld was unstable as first presented, he wove that fact into subsequent stories, as well as the 'attitude jet' solution.

    That's why I gotta admit I was dissapointed at his focus on 'good luck genetics' as the series progressed. A weak hook for a writer who usually does better.

    --
    The last fucking thing you want is my undivided attention...
  9. Good review by 14erCleaner · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I agree completely with the reviewer's assessment. This might be Niven's first worthwhile novel in a decade or more. I was a rabid fan of the Known Space stuff (and also of most of the Niven/Pournelle collaborations up to the mid-80's at least), but sometime in the 1990 time frame Niven really lost it. Maybe too much success, or too much mystical/magical BS, but I couldn't really stand his work for a while. This novel, on the other hand, was a really good read. I'd recommend it to anybody who likes "classic" Niven stuff.

    --
    Have you read my blog lately?
  10. Niven is dead by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 3, Interesting

    _Ringworld_ and _Ringworld Engineers_ were some of the best SF I ever read, even ruining the chances for lesser writers to be taken seriously as they scuttled in Niven's shadow. But _Ringworld Throne_ was so bad that I threw it across the room in mid-read: the "Ringworld thrown" pun was its most entertaining feature. I expect that _Ringworld's Children_ is another cashin on Niven's famous brand. Just like Herbert's Dune books #3+, Asimov's Foundation books #3+, and every other sequel written years after the original success, inspired by formulaic publishing profit more than the ideas. I haven't read any other book written by Niven since the early 1980s that are even close to his first decade or so of "Known Space". If any one of those has escaped your reading list, track it down first, before wasting time on a writer past his prime. He's become a complete creature of LA, wallowing in sequel money, gasping for a breath of talent or inspiration.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  11. Re:Haven't been able to get into Ringworld by Plural+of+Mongoose · · Score: 3, Informative

    Lucifer's Hammer!

    Niven and Pournelle at their finest!

    --
    The last fucking thing you want is my undivided attention...
  12. The luck gene by devphil · · Score: 4, Informative


    only briefly appears in the Ringworld series, and then only to nudge the plot along. It plays very very little role in Children. Good thing too, because he tried to make it play too much of a role in Throne.

    He has one other short story using the gene. It's the "future-most" of the Known Space series, set centuries after the Ringworld quartet. The lucky humans have learned about the manipulation, and how to make use of this uncontrollable unpredictable power.[*] It's an amusing story, but not up to Niven par.

    He said it would be the last story focusing on the gene, because it creates characters more powerful than the author. Likewise, while the Pak are some of his most interesting and popular creations ever, it's incredibly hard to write good stories when the characters are more intelligent than the author or the readers.

    [*] For those new to the books: just because you're lucky doesn't mean you have any say over what the luck does to you or those around you. Say, you break your arm in a three-car wreck, and while you're in the hospital, you meet your future spouse. Lucky for you overall, not necessarily so much for others.

    --
    You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
  13. Re:Haven't been able to get into Ringworld by MadMorf · · Score: 4, Informative

    So to you Niven fans out there, if I want to read more Niven what (if anything) is actually worth reading?

    Try "The Smoke Ring" and "The Integral Trees".
    He manages to paint a totally believable world in a very unlikely situation.

    Also, "The Mote in God's Eye" and "The Gripping Hand" are two of my all time favorites...

    The "Tales of Known Space" series (of which Ringworld is only a part) are great stories, IMHO...

    I don't much care for his "Gil of the ARM" stories, but that's just me...

  14. *bzzzt* by devphil · · Score: 4, Interesting


    I expect that _Ringworld's Children_ is [uninformed wanking deleted]

    Fortunately for all of us, you're wrong. Children is nothing like Throne. Niven lurks on some mailing lists; he's well aware that the 3rd one was a disaster compared to the first two. He knows exactly what people did and did not like about it. He took it into account when writing this one.

    In fact, in the prologue to Children, he gives credit to one particular mailing list for giving feedback.

    But actually reading the book would be too hard for you, I guess, so you just move straight to the flaming.

    --
    You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
  15. Being Old by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 3, Interesting
    I like the fact that I was able to read and enjoy both Ringworld, and the rest of Known Space, near to the time frame they were written. They may be dated now, but so am I (or at least I've just dated myself). I still remember feeling how it might have felt like to stand on the floor of the Ringworld myself when I first read it. I've never had that feeling from any of the following books, but still remember it fondly. I feel sorry for modern readers who may never have that experience.

    I'll certainly read this new book at some point soon, though it is too much to hope that it can fully rekindle my first encounter with Mr. Niven's writing.

    Sometimes there's an advantage to being older.

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
  16. Re:Interview responses by Sloppy · · Score: 5, Informative
    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
  17. Do I know for CERTAIN that it's impossible? by Plural+of+Mongoose · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Erm, nope.

    However, in any good book / movie / story / date on a friday, there is one important element:

    Suspension of disbelief

    Without that, you got nothing!

    I have a hard time believing in a 'lucky' gene.

    --
    The last fucking thing you want is my undivided attention...
  18. My Best Memory of Mr. Niven by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 3, Informative
    My favorite memory of meeting Larry Niven was sitting next to him at a banquet table during a SF convention, and having him pronounce the names of all his species (up to that time), and a couple character names to boot. And he did it too.

    (In "Kzinti", the "K" is silent.)

    --
    "It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."