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The OS Community Embraces IBM

Posted by michael on from the we-don't-need-another-hero dept.

Joel Dutt writes "IBM... 'the corporation known as Big Blue has seen its reputation in the global open-source community shift from suspect sugar daddy to knight in shining armor.' Newsweek has an interesting article in its latest issue, discussing the relationship between the open-source community and the corporate giant."

26 of 305 comments (clear)

  1. I swear I'm not trolling, but by justkarl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    hasn't IBM stood behind Linux for quite some time? They've always pushed hardware that is somewhat Linux specific.
    Not to mention, no dork I've ever met didn't like IBM. They make solid machines. Pretty good software. So what's the problem?

    1. Re:I swear I'm not trolling, but by AvantLegion · · Score: 4, Insightful
      So what's the problem?

      There isn't a problem. It's more of an "odd couple" pairing sort of thing.

    2. Re:I swear I'm not trolling, but by ValiantSoul · · Score: 4, Funny

      "They make solid machines"

      Not to mention heavy as hell

    3. Re:I swear I'm not trolling, but by b17bmbr · · Score: 4, Informative

      the final solution was finalized in 1942 at the Wanssee conference. The man who devised the plan was Reinhardt Heydrich. He was at the time #3 in the Nazi party, a fanatical hitler supporter, a deputy reichsfuhrer, and in charge of bohmeia and moravia (sudetenland). He was later killed by czech resistance members who flew in from england. he was killed by a bomb on a corner in prague. hitler responded by razing the city of lidice (http://www.lidice-memorial.cz/index_uk.htm).

      as for pencil/paper accounting, yes, it can and was done. keep in mind german fanaticalness regarding order. it was possible also because most of the prisoners went into ghettos, then later, to a final camp. (sorry to be so objective and analytical). the records were kept at each place. the germans checked in and checked out everyone who came and went. it wasn't like they let them leave or anything. now, did the nazis use ibm adding machines and stuff. hell, at that time, who wasn't?

      --
      My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.
    4. Re:I swear I'm not trolling, but by hugesmile · · Score: 5, Interesting
      Not to mention, no dork I've ever met didn't like IBM.

      I disagree. Way back in the early 80's when I was graduating from college, IBM was thought of by the "smart" tech crowd in VERY much the same way as Microsoft is thought of today. If there were a slashdot crowd in 1981, they would have bashed IBM left and right for monopolistic behaviors.

      The geeks were enthusiastic about Dec, HP, and later Sun.

      I remember my college interview with IBM. Our college had a bidding system to land the coveted job interviews with the campus recruiters. MANY Seniors bid ALL their points for the year to get an interview with IBM. (I wouldn't necessarily call these people the "smart" crowd.)

      I scooped up an interview slot for no bid-points when there was an interview candidate who didn't show. Even though I had deep-seated negative feelings toward Big Blue, I knew it could be a great job out of school. Toward the beginning of the interview, I asked the guy about the position he was interviewing for. "Oh, there's no position available. We just do these interviews for the P.R." I ended the interview, politely telling him what I thought of that! No sense in wasting my time. The 25 students that wasted all their interview bid points were furious when I walked out and told them!

      Of course, I got a "ding letter" a couple weeks later.

  2. IBM... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    10. I've Been Moved
    9. Idiots Become Managers
    8. Idiots Buy More
    7. Impossible to Buy Machine
    6. Incredibly Big Machine
    5. Industry's Biggest Mistake
    4. International Brotherhood of Mercenaries
    3. It Boggles the Mind
    2. It's Better Manually
    1. Itty-Bitty Monopoly

  3. Fighting evil everyday... by chrispyman · · Score: 4, Funny

    Well ofcourse they're well liked, I mean they fight off the evil SCOmonsters that try and terrorize the city everyday.

    1. Re:Fighting evil everyday... by PimpBot · · Score: 4, Funny

      City?!?!?! I thought there was only a cathedral and a bazaar!!!

      </joke>

  4. Not to be a troll by Stevyn · · Score: 5, Interesting

    But IBM is still a company. They may stand behind open source and believe in it's potential and power. However, they are still a company with shareholders and responsibilities. If something unforseeable happened in the near future and open source software didn't have the potential for them to make billions a year on it, wouldn't they adapt too?

    1. Re:Not to be a troll by The_Mystic_For_Real · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Open Source is not a panacea, requirement for life, or any sort of deity. Therefore, it seems foolish to treat it like one.

      Of course they are a company, with shareholders and the the desire to make a profit. So are Red Hat, VA Linux, and Mandrake.

      There is nothing wrong with a company supporting Linux, that's exactly what Linux needs to bring it to the attention of the general public. IBM has essentially been advertising Linux for a while now. They've put more money into Linux than pretty much anyone else has. This is what Linux has lacked: big money supporting Linux.

      --

      _____

      Thank you.

    2. Re:Not to be a troll by stevesliva · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Interestingly enough, this Newsweek article hints at a material impact to IBM's bottom line that I haven't heard mentioned elsewhere. IBM's support of Linux plus IT professionals' and CS students' love of Linux creates goodwill that translates into some tangible gain when the IBM, HP, Dell and Sun sales reps come calling.

      Everywhere else, the press hacks mention IBM's billions of dollars in Linux-related revenue, but they don't mention that an IT staffer told to buy Windoze servers from either HP or IBM might inexplicably favor IBM because they're a Groklaw reader.

      --
      Who do you get to be an expert to tell you something's not obvious? The least insightful person you can find? -J Roberts
    3. Re:Not to be a troll by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting
      But that's very doubtful. These are the guys who HP's been the Microsoft mouthpiece against open source since that June 2002 memo. Any lip service they give Linux is merely a way of not offending people while their actiions speak on behalf of microsoft.
  5. It still seems so strange. by bersl2 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    IBM---the mega-corporation to end all technological mega-corporations---seeing ANY benefit in Linux?

    Then Sun, when they're not against us, is with us.

    Finally, Novell sees positives in what we do.

    We've all shown the belief that Free software can be profitable. But seeing it in action is something entirely weird and unusual, but in a very satisfying way.

  6. Flashbacks by aelbric · · Score: 4, Funny

    Why do I half expect to hear one day soon:

    IBM: Linus, I am your father!
    (Queue Imperial March)

    --
    nos laetus epulor qui would domito nos
  7. Sun Jealousy towards IBM by gmajor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I am a frequent reader of Jonathan Schwartz' blog, and one of his constant themes/rants is that the open source community respects IBM more than it deserves.

    In my opinion, other companies (i.e. Sun) are jealous of IBM's unique position and would like nothing more than to ruin that relationship.

    IBM, while not entirely faultless, has taken a huge risk in tying some of its business and marketing campaigns to the success of Linux. Even while having AIX. I wish the same could be said for Sun. Glad to see it's paying of for IBM, in the form of profits and community goodwill.

  8. Show me the money by sql*kitten · · Score: 5, Insightful

    IBM, last time I checked, made something like 45% of its revenue from hardware and 35% from consulting. Software accounts for a paltry 15% (the rest they make from finance). IBM is not in the software business, really. They make AIX so they can sell RS/6000s. They make VisualAge so people can write desktop applications for DB/2 databases, and they make DB/2 so people will buy mainframes. The consulting part of IBM is fairly vendor-neutral; I've worked with them to implement BEA WebLogic on Solaris instead of WebSphere on AIX for example.

    Software is an overhead for IBM. It's a distraction from hardware and services. Open Source allows IBM to sell hardware and services without having to pay to develop the software to run on it and/or implement on behalf of customers. That's the reason, and the only reason, IBM is into Linux.

    1. Re:Show me the money by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      And they make Lotus Notes to irritate people all around the globe.

  9. Who else to go to? by ShatteredDream · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Sun: we build and get you to contribute to open source products to use as the foundation for our for-profit products and then let the "Evil Empire" get said open source project firmly in its sights. Sometimes we are going super hardcore for open source, othertimes we are terrified of it and attack it with wild-eyed zeal.

    HP: When we're not whoring to Microsoft, we'll be more than happy to sell Linux to our cutomsters, but then we'll go right back to our buddies in Redmond.

    Dell: We are such corporatist tools that if it is remotely risky we won't touch it with less than a 10 foot pole. We'll sell a few Linux boxes, but claim the way most families claim a gay cousin.

    Microsoft: I really hope no one has to explain this one to you.

    IBM: Linux lets us standardize and save money. We build on Linux a little, we save tons of money, thrash our competition and make tons of money. Invest over $1B today, and we make many times more than that. Not only that, but Linux is a great stick to beat Microsoft with.

    I wonder why IBM looks like such a good ally. Maybe it has to do with them seeing the growth of a robust Linux platform and community as the fastest way to them not only getting revenge, but being the preeminent IT company in the world.

    No company will actually side with OSS for altruistic reasons, but it isn't hard to guage motives. IBM's motives are the most sympathetic of all of the big IT companies to Linux. IBM sees guiding Linux into the big time as the best way to become a massive force unto itself. Most other companies like to ride the fence and only occassionally flirt with Linux which is the enemy of their ally, Microsoft.

    The problem with most OEMs IMO is that Microsoft is more than just a supplier to them. They don't have the business sense to see that dependence on Microsoft Windows means that they cannot act in their own interests if Microsoft makes the XBox2 essentially a real computer for John Q. Citizen. It makes them like a cheap fuck buddy, and when Microsoft is through with Dell, HP, etc they will be discarded as quickly.

    The only thing I personally wish that an OEM had the foresight to do, was for Apple to give a few million dollars to the OSI with a tacit purpose of working on the OSX port of open office and general open office improvement beyond that.

    --
    Click here or a puppy gets stomped!
  10. IBM is not your friend by consumer · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I worked at a large publishing company where IBM was pitching a new e-commerce system. They succeeded in concvincing our gullible CTO to buys their whole package, including proprietary hardware and AIX to run on it. When I suggested that Linux on Intel systems would be a better choice for a relatively low-traffic web service like this, they immediately starting running down Linux. They had nothing good to say about open source software in general, implying that the apache server they bundle is somehow a different species from the one anyone can download. In short, they like Linux when they can make money off it, and will rip it to shreds if they think they can sell you something more expensive.

    1. Re:IBM is not your friend by Blastrogath · · Score: 4, Insightful

      >In short, they like Linux when they can make money off it, and will rip it to shreds if they think they can sell you something more expensive.

      To be fair, you were talking to sales people. There are few sales people who don't have this kind of attitude.

      --
      "The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." -Plato
  11. Re:The enemy of my enemy by AvantLegion · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Make no mistake about it, IBM doesn't give a ripshit about "the community" or anyone/thing else other than the Almighty Dollar.

    You're right, but you completely miss the point.

    Free software has never been about "it's free but you must pay your way by worshipping the software ideals and community", no matter how much some may with that to be true. Free software has been about "use it, but keep it free" (and sometimes, "share your changes" as well).

    IBM is using free software as it has always envisioned to be used. Commercial use is not merely tolerated, but has always been a GOAL. The free software ideals want corporations to rely (and play by the rules of) free software, instead of creating their own non-free solutions for people to become dependent of.

    IBM is playing by the rules - not by being forced or threatened, but in good faith to the ideals and rules of free software.

  12. Typical major media take on linux by QCompson · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Open-source geeks are devout in their belief that software should be free to all..."

    "...and what the open-source community sees as a Microsoft front company bent on destroying their free paradise."

    Once again, the linux community is portrayed as a bunch of geeks pinching pennies, not worried so much about free software but rather free (as in healthy beer) software.

  13. Kudos to IBM for vision by cpu_fusion · · Score: 4, Insightful
    It's not often that a large company or organization manages to read the writing on the wall and adjust a business model accordingly. Just look at the RIAA, MPAA, Microsoft, etc.

    IBM realized that the software industry would change the most from the era of the Internet, unlike hardware and consulting services. A company expecting to make its bread and butter from software will be in a constant rush to stay one step ahead of thousands, if not millions, of unpaid software developers who write software for no other purpose than to have it the way they want. The Internet made it possible for those legions of volunteers to congregate internationally, as well as publicize and distribute for free.

    If only other companies had the vision to look that far ahead and make the hard decisions necessary to evolve.

  14. IBM and OSS by pfriedma · · Score: 5, Interesting

    What many people have failed to notice is that IBM provides more to the OSS community than just a corporate image. For the most part, the OSS community little way of inforcing the GPL or for that matter has very little force of it's own (both of these need to change) to protect itself from larger companies (MSFT, SCO, etc). IBM (and it's legal team, money, etc) provide an incubational service to the OSS community by offering a bit of corporate [legal/monitary/etc] power while we build some of our own.

    --
    Mak'tal shree lok'tak mek'ta sa'tak Oz! - Daniel Jackson
  15. foil my head by scottking · · Score: 4, Insightful


    "The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist."

    - Verbal, The Usual Suspects

    --
    scott king
  16. Rubicon of Open Source: IBM Supporting Linux by reporter · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The key point in the history of open source is IBM embracing Linux. Without the support of IBM, most commercial companies simply saw Linux as interesting software with reliability approaching a toy. Regardless of whether this perception is true, once IBM supported Linux and shipped mainframes with it installed, commercial companies were willing to entertain the idea of running Linux in their datacenters. These companies have faith that even if any problem with Linux arise, then IBM would surely fix the problem within 24 hours. Even if Linux were initially unreliable, IBM would ensure that it has 6 sigma reliability. Such is the reputation and commitment of IBM.

    The rest is open-source history.

    Interestingly, IBM's embracing Linux is one of the factors eliminating Sun as a viable competitor in the market for highend servers. 6-sigma Linux, backed by an army of free programmers and advice-givers, versus closed proprietary Solaris is tantamount to a battle between a F-22 (stealth fighter) and a Mig 17. No contest.