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S. Korea Claims N. Korea Has Trained 600 Crackers

Posted by timothy on from the hey-that's-not-cool-man dept.

maggeth writes "The Financial Times is reporting that North Korea's military and intel services have trained as many as 600 computer hackers specifically for attacks against South Korea, Japan, and the US. South Korea claims that the north has a five-year university program for hacker training and cites recent attacks on government computer systems. The South Korean defense ministry claimed in the report that 'North Korea's intelligence warfare capability is estimated to have reached the level of advanced countries,' and that the caliber of the North's hackers is high. So far it appears that these specific attacks are based in China, although it is not clear if North Korea is using Chinese networks or if China is involved."

23 of 535 comments (clear)

  1. If true, the stakes are now higher. by mind21_98 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I seem to think N. Korea's using this as a tool to gain leverage in talks. Then again, if they do have six hundred trained people ready to conduct cyberwarfare and have no qualms doing it, we could very well be screwed. In any case, it's probably not in their best interest to go through with it.

    --
    US businesses that currently accept chip and PIN/signature
    1. Re:If true, the stakes are now higher. by killapenguin · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Why wouldn't they go through with an attack? A cyber-attack has the benefits of causing no bloodshed but could potentially cause anything from a minor headache to millions (if not billions) of dollars in damages if launched properly.

      Also, it's pretty interesting that the attacks on S. Korean computer systems seemed to be based in China. If this were indeed true (doubtful), this would cast doubt on dubbya's assertion in the debate that bilateral talks with N. Korea will alienate China, which is supposedly imposing some kind of leverage on N. Korea.

    2. Re:If true, the stakes are now higher. by zhenlin · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Not quite the article, but perhaps North Korea itself is using this as a FUD tool. I saw it yesterday on NHK news, so it should be an official statement from South Korea...

    3. Re:If true, the stakes are now higher. by Riktov · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Anyone with talent *and* internet access will be busy looking over their shoulders because they'll naturally be on the "highly susupicious" list at the Ministry of Culture

      In the DRPK annyone with internet access at all is already part of the state's techno elite and de facto an agent.

      The only place a North Korean hacker is not going to stick out, or the only place he can afford to live, is China.

      Why not South Korea or Japan? And goverment agents can probably afford to live anywhere.

    4. Re:If true, the stakes are now higher. by Ziak · · Score: 2, Interesting

      As for not putting secure data onto a computer thats connected to the internet, I don't belive they would do it, I know the US goverment puts it on a SIPRnet and as TSiprnet, The SIPRnet you need a Secret clearance, and the TSiprnet you need a Top Secret clearance, both unless your a born U.S. Citzen you can not obtain... and getting the T/S clearance requires a hefty investagation to get it I belive the cost is about $5,000 for it to be done, and this has to be done every 5 years or the clearance drops to a Secret Clearance that then degrades again to nothing after another 5 years. With that being said the computers are stored in Vaults and the lines are encrypted, along with them being in lockboxs where the lines are, now if where doing all of this you don't think the S. Koreans would atleast do some of it?

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    5. Re:If true, the stakes are now higher. by joshmccormack · · Score: 2, Interesting

      One of the major expenses the N. Korean gov. has is supporting it's military - 3rd largest standing army in the world, and they're actively building/developing weapons, such as nuclear missiles. It's not that the whole country is poor and so people are starving. The country is starving b/c huge amounts of money are poured into the military.

      And don't think that N. Korean agents just hang out there. They spread out. N. Korea has been known to kidnap foreign nationals (Japanese, for instance) to train their agents to mix in in other countries, and they periodically get caught, at least in S. Korea.

      And just in case you think N. Korea is an ok place that just has a different philosophy, read up a little on the extermination and enslavement. Did you know N. Korea was at one time one of the most fertile grounds for Christian missionaries? Know how many Christians there are in N. Korea now? And they didn't move away when it was made clear they weren't wanted.

  2. Interesting... by ncaraballo · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Interesting since they seem to lack alot of technology up there. Have you seen satellite pictures? Seoul looks like L.A. while North Korea is pitch black. A very poor and low tech country last I heard.

    1. Re:Interesting... by millwall · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Interesting since they seem to lack alot of technology up there. Have you seen satellite pictures? Seoul looks like L.A.

      Intereting that you use L.A. as an example of how a high tech area looks like.

      The first time I went to L.A. I was surprised how low tech the area looked like to me, especially with regards to the electricity and telephone lines blocking the view of the sky and the lack of modern public transport.

    2. Re:Interesting... by lombre · · Score: 2, Interesting
      the only reason they can't grow all the food they need is because the best farming land is reserved for opium

      the highest estimate for north korean opium farms is 7000 hectares. Since they have 1,200,000 hectares of farmland this is not the reason for their food shortage.

      note: the original fields where created by the Japanese during their invaison period so it interesting that NK is a big supplier of opium based recreational products to Japan now.

    3. Re:Interesting... by G-funk · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The current worldwide consensus seems to be "pretend that there really isn't a problem, and hope that I'm out of office by the time it reaches the crisis point."

      That's pretty much the most insightful thing I've read here in a long time, and pretty much sums up what's wrong with democratic capitalism as we have it at the moment.

      --
      Send lawyers, guns, and money!
  3. Hacked by Koreans by CdBee · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This may be purely coincidental, but some months ago a friend pointed me toward the official website of North Korea out of amusement (its very much a dictatorial-regime website)

    Seconds he and I both received warnings from our firewalls that we were under attack by a variety of means. The originating IP addresses were in Seoul.

    Based on that, I wonder if the South Koreans have/had compromised a North Korean web-server.

    --
    I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
  4. ddos as the equivalent of a nuke? by Underholdning · · Score: 3, Interesting

    You don't need 600 persons to commit cyber crime. You need one script kiddie with 600.000 zombie windows machines, since I reckon the most effective type of eWAR is ddos. Hacking one machine isn't nearly as effective as nuking an entire infrastructure using a distributed dos.

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    1. Re:ddos as the equivalent of a nuke? by ctr2sprt · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Just as a point of reference, 600k Windows zombies can push, in sum with 100% efficiency, about 17GB/s. That sounds like an awful lot, but the data center where I work can nearly do that. Furthermore, 600k home computers users with broadband is a lot. It can take over 24 hours to nmap 700 computers on a LAN, and you'd have to cast a truly enormous net: to infect 600k computers you'd probably need to scan twice that many; and to get that many actual computers, you'd have to scan - being somewhat optimistic - twice that many IPs. So you'd be conducting an nmap on some 2.5 million IPs. Possibly over a slow trans-Pacific link from China or NK. Even working in parallel, it's take weeks or months, and you've only got one shot. Once you launch the DDoS, at least two thirds of the boxes you hacked are going to be taken offline/patched/etc. Certainly you'll be able to reinfect some of them (and it'll be faster cause you know they're there), but you'd be lucky to keep half.

      No, targeted hacking is a much, much bigger concern, because there are many Internet sites which centralize a lot of information on a small number of machines. At a certain scale, it becomes easier to hack a single, well-protected machine than it is to hack a large number of poorly-protected machines. Especially considering the dubious benefit of a one-time massive DDoS, it'd be far more effective to crack Amazon.

  5. Scary by codepuke · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This is an incredibly interesting avenue. If an 18-year-old script kiddie could write MSBLASTER, just imagine what 600 of North Korea's best could do. I guess this could be considered a miniature version of our NSA, all be it controlled by the world's worst dictator. I think this calls for the US to get serious about consumer electronic security, mandating smart cards for online banking etc. Let's not make it easy for them...

  6. Re:Just cut the cables. by salvorHardin · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Firstly, it isn't that simple, as the whole point of the internet was that you could nuke certain parts of it, but basically, it would still continue to function. So you cut the link to China/North Korea, or you blackhole the address range. So they route out via someplace else.

  7. compare Korea with Iran by Jacek+Poplawski · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Someone asked here "is there North Korea Linux Group". This is interesting question. I am active member of ORKUT. I was really suprised when someone from Iran added me as friend. I was even more suprised when I realized how many people from Iran are in Orkut. Country which is called "part of Axis of Evil" has Free Internet Access - greatest invention ever. What about North Korea? Nothing. There are no people from N.Korea in Internet. You can find official websites or information about N.Korea, but you can't concact with anyone. You can't talk with people from N.Korea. It is one big prison. Even Iran is heaven in compare to N.Korea.

    1. Re:compare Korea with Iran by ghostlibrary · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > I was even more suprised when I realized how many people from Iran are in Orkut.

      Or how many sponsors of the Anasair X-Prize were Iranian, for that matter (the Ansaris are Iranian!) Guess the axis of evil 'accidentally' sponsored the first commercial astronaut in the US. How... evil?

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      A.
    2. Re:compare Korea with Iran by KjetilK · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well, yes, Iran has probably among the more vibrant blogging communities in the world. I follow a few Iranian blogs regularily. Hoder is a good starting point. And authorities are cracking down on it, pissing all the kids off. Iran is strange, on one hand, the majority of the people are highly educated, they understand democracy, and there are lots of good people in higher positions, in universities, for example. So, if one were to start a democratic revolution in the Middle East, what one should do is start cooperation with the progressive forces in Iran. Contrary to Iraq, you could actually come with a lot of support to people without aiding the mullahs. A good example of this is the CERN /Iran collaboration. With these forces gaining status and strength in society, a peaceful transition to democracy would be imminent. Many of these leading figures is of the clear opinion that current US policy has been a severe setback.

      --
      Employee of Inrupt, Project Release Manager and Community Manager for Solid
  8. In other news... by retards · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Iraq has weapons of mass destruction according to former exiles now running the country.

    This is just FUD by South Korea against it's arch enemy, and even if it isn't, so what? How many crackers are employed by the CIA? The Mossad? MI5? Or even the RIAA & MPAA?

    It amazes me that the general public of Western countries and their allies are so goddamn afraid that these absolutely piece of shit countries that can't even feed their own populace are any threat to anyone save mentioned populace.

    ANY Western country could kick serious ass in Afghanistan, Iraq or North Korea (though not with zero casualities). These countries have no tech. None. How hard is it to drop fire one 'soldiers' with AK-47s and sandals?

    They are the human wool pulled over our eyes to keep us from looking at our own corrupted civilzation and political system.

    Rant over.

  9. Economy measure? by jcr · · Score: 2, Interesting

    That's got to be cheaper than a nuclear weapons program...

    -jcr

    --
    The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
  10. no problemo by blooba · · Score: 2, Interesting
    this one's easy. all that nk had to do was teach some nk teenager decent english, and then smuggle him into the states as a foreign exchange student from sk. in the states, he'll hang out with the hackers at school, infiltrate their "clubs", and learn the tricks of the hacker trade.

    when this spy returns to nk, he teaches a few classes on what he learned in the states, and voila, 600 "trained" nk hackers.

    or, teach a bunch of nk teenagers english, and let them loose on the uncensored internet. let them cruise the chat rooms where the hackers hang out. they can learn a lot just by making a few choice contacts on the internet. they can also learn a lot just by studying the materials currently available on the internet. like /. for example!

  11. South Korea's annual cyberwar warning by BMcWilliams · · Score: 3, Interesting

    South Korea has regularly issued warnings like this since 1994. What the South Korean government fails to note is that its own military has nearly 200 "computer training facilities" and had trained more than 200,000 "information technicians." What's more, because North Korea's IT infrastructure is very centralized, it's particularly vulnerable to physical attacks.

  12. This is SO William Gibson by tjlsmith · · Score: 2, Interesting

    The obnoxious govt. sweeps their raggety-ass country for any kids with math ability - ships them off to a miraculously clean facility in the ass-end of nowhere - teaches them to use the sparkly porcelain toilet, gives them real food, clean cloths and a warm bed, then after two days of this heaven explains to them that they are going to learn certain stuff here - they don't HAVE to of course, they can go back to their previous barefoot in the cold manure lifestyle any time they want. Being BRIGHT kids, they catch on right away. The thing about countries like this is they can build ONE (1) awesome facility as good as anything anywhere, if they like. It would not be hard to find committed communist academics to teach there - (I remember working at a company with this British kid with a Masters in Comp. Sci. who was a *pathological* Marxist) But it all goes tits up. Lessons start. Math, intro to computers, and lots of political indoctrination. Pretty soon they are on the internet and the sun rises. There's another world out there. Sure, the govt. erects a firewall but, and think about it, these guys are trained to go THROUGH firewalls, right? That's the whole point right? Right? It HAS to go wrong. It HAS to! If the school does it's job they can't stop these kids from surfing the net. If they can't surf the net, they will be infective. They discover Slash Dot. They discover CNN.COM and the BBC. They discover they have been lied to all their lives. Then - they discover PR0N - and there's no going back. Some of them will work for the commies anyway. Others will start cudgeling their brains for a way to get out of NK. Planet Hollywood for them. If the commies are smart they'll start to shop these kids around to troublemakers everywhere the way terrorists do - Irish ex-Green Berets wind up teaching demolitions to Hammas so the IRA can get RPGS for his services (this actually happened) You could wind up with a cynical, atheist, chain smoking ('Destroy America except for Marlboroughs') skinny NK Hacker School grad on site in LA supporting El Quida. Its SO William Gibson.

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