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Starting A Digital Art Program With Open Source

An anonymous reader writes "We are running mainly Windows on our HS campus with the exception of Macs in the visual arts department, and are just beginning to get into the process of teaching using computers in the area of art. What recommendations do you have for starting a program? I am looking fo apps that will be able to be used on both our Macs and on our PCs in the Library etc., and specifically I am looking for a program (curriculum, not software) for teaching digital art concepts using the FOSS tools that are out there. I am aware of Gimp, Blender, and Inkscape, but have not seen any curriculum per se. Any help?"

61 comments

  1. Open-source revolution? by mintrepublic · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If this kind of thing catches on, i.e. open-source OSes and other software, it could mean huge savings for schools. This might free up funds for like a shop class for geeks, where students learn how to assemble computer hardware, solder things, and resolve hardware conflicts.

    1. Re:Open-source revolution? by clifyt · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Then again, it might backfire.

      How many artists want to use an app that is more in line with geeks than actual true artists. I've got good friends that make their entire living with this stuff. I've shown them things like Gimp and they just scoff -- and its understandable why they do so.

      F/OSS software is generally software designed by geeks for use by geeks. I've seen a LOT of great sutff come out of it, but almost always, the person on the other end has been a techie first and foremost and an artist second.

      I'm on the other end...I'm an artist first and foremost, and a geek secondary. I run a programming / research office for my university, but I still make more money through music activities. And I use a Mac for my personal needs -- why? because it was set up to be invisible to the end user. To a techie? its a bit infuriating at times because you can't do everything you want to do, but to others its a godsend if you can afford one (that and I generally have a terminal window open at all times so the interface doesn't get on my nerves so bad :-)

      If the goal is to engage geeks -- this is a good idea. if its to engage others, I'd stay away from most Free and Open Source apps.

      BTW -- I cut my teeth in 3D using POVRay on a 486DX (it was soooooooo slow on the SX), so I hope I'm geek enough not to be considered a troll.

    2. Re:Open-source revolution? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      How many artists want to use an app that is more in line with geeks than actual true artists.
      How do you know whether you are a geek or a "true artist"? You seem to imply that you are a "true artist" more than a geek because you make more money being a "true artist" than being a geek. Is this really what you meant to imply?
    3. Re:Open-source revolution? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The implication that I got was that he majored in art and minored in computers.

    4. Re:Open-source revolution? by tverbeek · · Score: 1
      How do you know whether you are a geek or a "true artist"? You seem to imply that you are a "true artist" more than a geek because you make more money being a "true artist" than being a geek.

      I consider myself a "true geek" more than a "true artist". It's just a bit of self-assessment; the fact that I make more money doing geekstuff than artstuff just reflects where my strengths lie, and which skills get the most development.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    5. Re:Open-source revolution? by Ogerman · · Score: 4, Insightful

      F/OSS software is generally software designed by geeks for use by geeks. I've seen a LOT of great sutff come out of it, but almost always, the person on the other end has been a techie first and foremost and an artist second.

      Hah! That's a joke. It takes just as much time to learn Photoshop and Lightwave as it does to learn Gimp and Blender. People sometimes scoff at the new generation of F/OSS graphics software because it's not what they're used to. But I find it just as difficult to use Photoshop after years of using Gimp, so I can understand where they're coming from. The key is educating the next generation on F/OSS tools from the beginning so that we can finally move away from the rip-off proprietary standbys. At the rate that Gimp and Blender are improving, there will soon be no valid technical reason why they cannot be used even for the most professional of tasks. As for the UI side of things, it would be an interesting project to develop an alternative Gimp interface designed for current Photoshop users. It's more about familiar layout than anything. In the grand scheme of things, both free and non-free software needs a lot of work to improve in the HCI area..

    6. Re:Open-source revolution? by davidbailey · · Score: 1

      Hah! That's a joke. It takes just as much time to learn Photoshop and Lightwave as it does to learn Gimp and Blender. People sometimes scoff at the new generation of F/OSS graphics software because it's not what they're used to.

      The criticism of clifyt in this thread is very valid.

      From someone who has worked with artists and layout specialists, and who is familiar with everyting from Photoshop, Quark, Illustrator, DreamWeaver on both Windows and Macs, to vim and gimp on Linux (I run Gentoo), let me assure you that it's a whole lot more than just a learning curve for the OSS. There are features that are completely missing, and other things that need to be done that are simply too hard and error-prone to ask the average user or artist to do.

      Ever try to do GUI page-layout in OSS? That's a laugh. The likes of Pagemaker and Quark just don't exist... TeX doesn't count unless you want to code. Scribus is an interesting program, but it is hardly stable and took me hours just to get a working PDF that I could take to a printers to print out.

      How about GUI HTML layout? Again, not much there to compare with the features of DreamWeaver. Some who make web-pages with a text browser may scoff- but try utilizing the HTML-savvy search and replace capabilities where DreamWeaver can intelligently search through attributes in tags, or using the GUI to do a complex mock-up while watching it generate nice, clean HTML that can easily be edited later. This functionality just doesn't exist in OSS. Quanta is interesting but it isn't WYSIWYG yet.

      Even simple things like getting fonts working is far harder in Linux than it needs to be with font servers, X fonts, postscript vs. other imaging models, font config, gnome fonts, etc. Yikes! And I thought getting Windows fonts working used to be hard!

      Don't even start me on the fact that there IS NO workable database OSS GUI (no, web PHP interfaces don't count and neither do command-line interfaces). Yes, I can code in raw SQL (I've worked with MSSQL, MySQL, and PostgreSQL), but more often I open FileMaker Pro in Wine to build those quick databases with interfaces I want users to be able to manipulate (like our Marketing department).

      The problem with OSS is that those who create the objectives of the project are also those who code the project. This leads to one mindset when designing interfaces and it isn't for the graphic artist!

      Apple and others who are good at interface design understand that you have one group of coders working on the back-end code and a whole other group of coders working on the interface, and even then, only with strict UI guidelines and a bunch of non-technical testers to make sure you've got it right.

      After all, the techies can just drop into a bash shell when we need to get something done that the GUI can't do, right?

  2. python gimp by Apreche · · Score: 4, Informative

    I know that python is pretty well integrated into the gimp. It should not be very difficult to make some sort of integrated tutorial type stuff.

    --
    The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
  3. Shameless Self-Promotion by 3)+profit!!! · · Score: 5, Interesting

    If you're doing any pixel art on the Mac, you can use Pixen. It's doesn't really compare to something like the GIMP for large-scale images (it starts getting slow for images greater than about 300x300, especially if you have multiple layers), but for icons, isometric-style stuff, and other pixelly art, it's the best open source tool for OS X that I know of. (Of course, I'm one of the developers, so I may be a bit biased...)

    1. Re:Shameless Self-Promotion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      OT, but hey, so are you. I've found copying and pasting to be so buggy in Pixen that it's almost unusable. Though I do like the idea of the program.

  4. GiMP is like Data by insomnyuk · · Score: 0, Troll

    While fully functional, GiMP, like Data, can be extremely annoying, and if you are drunk and don't know what you are doing, will probably just end up fucking you.

    1. Re:GiMP is like Data by fracex · · Score: 1

      Well I guess THe GIMP is out for high school students, because they're ALL drunk and don't know what they're doing. (Disclaimer: I'm a high school student)

    2. Re:GiMP is like Data by lachlan76 · · Score: 1

      I am too, but I ran out of beer, so I know how to use the GIMP ;)

  5. Personally... by glk572 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I like to approach art education form a goal oriented standpoint. I can speak for learning blender, and the tutorials are pretty good, I would start by walking them through the building a castle tutorial, and then pretty much set them free. Have them come up with a project, I would highly suggest starting with a building, as it is much easier to deal with than modeling living things.

    I for one don't like Gimp, although it is a powerful tool, it lacks some of the most powerful and useful tools available for photoshop. Look into a site license for photoshop it is really not as extravagantly expensive in an educational license as the commercial ones.

    As for a pre-made curriculum, I suspect that you're SOL. It should be pretty easy though to adapt existing self learning tutorials for your students.

    Tutorials are at:
    http://www.blender3d.com/cms/Tutorials.243.0. html

    For learning 2D I would suggest a brief intro to vector drawing, using Illustrator, or my personal preference AutoCad. I come from a technical drawing background and find that AutoCad is my favorite vector drawing program, although it is very-much overkill.

    After vector drawing I would introduce them to photo manipulation, take inspiration from the fark.com photoshop contests. Give the students a photo to manipulate and have them show their work to the class.

    I would suggest that you use the format of assigning work and teaching skills on monday, free work for the middle of the week, and then on friday have the students show their work to the class and discuss their experiences.

    Here at WWU in my department all design majors are required to take a course called "Introduction to Design Communication," this is a basic overview art course that teaches drawing, painting, illustration, and drafting. This was easily my favorite class I have ever taken. It is formated with the professors sharing their design work with the students, and teaching their personal techniques. The goal is to get the students up to speed so that they can begin to develop their own style.

    Just remember that there is not right way to do anything in art. Start by showing the students how you work and let them use that as a launching point.

    I would highly suggest the following Books/Films:
    Technical Drawing by Frederick E. Giesecke et. al.
    Shrek DVD bonus feature on the making of.
    mindfields and all it's great making of info (http://www.artificial3d.com/mindfields/)
    Any textbook on mechanical perspective (can't think of one off the top of my head)
    The Blender book
    and of course the Blender tutorials mentioned earlier.

    Technical Drawing gives a great deal of information on mechanical drawing and is a great foundation of knowledge for the instructor to have. The Shrek DVD bonus features are a great source of inspiration for beginning artists, and also shows the students that even the pros make mistakes. Mechanical perspective is critical to understanding how we perceive depth and should be taught to students as they learn 3D modeling. Mindfields is fabulous as you can see the film and then get an in depth tutorial on exactly how it was made.

    I would have to say that 2d image manipulation is much more intuitive than 3d modeling, and should be taught as a tool to rather than a goal. I would suggest visiting my own website, even though there isn't much there (they now only allow sftp now so I can't upload form dreamweaver (I'm lazy)) it has some stuff that wile time consuming is actually quite easy to do.

    if you're interested in talking about cg art education my aim id is "glk572" and I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

    So to sum it up teach a foundation of skills that will allow the students to achieve their own goals. Have the students discuss and show their work. Focus on results and not methods.

    --
    Well art is art isn't it, but then again water is water; and east is east; and west is west; and if you take cranberries
    1. Re:Personally... by parasew · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I can totally recommend Blender, as it not only has a good 3d-engine for animation, it also has a complete scripting environment, making it possible to create user-interaction schemes.

      I wanted to post additional Blender Tutorial links:

      i found a collection of Tutorials, the Blender Classroom Tutorial Book or a list of Blender Tutorials found on the net.

    2. Re:Personally... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting
  6. Solve the flawed alpha method by Zareste · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Something I think would make some noise in the computer art world is if you came up with a blending method that doesn't have the gray-out flaw.

    What I mean is, with the current alpha method Photoshop (and nearly all programs) uses, every time you blend two colors at any transparency level, you lose saturation. The colors average each other, which makes them lean toward gray.

    Just as a demonstration: Make a pure blue square (0,0,255), then on a layer above, make a yellow square and put it at 50% opacity. What color do you get? Gray, because 0,0,255 and 255,255,0 averages to 128,128,128, while it should be 0,255,0. You're not only losing saturation, but also luminosity. This doesn't happen in real life. When you mix blue and yellow paint, or put a blue glass in front of a yellow glass, you get green.

    I give an example here: http://www.deviantart.com/view/11426654/

    And Photoshop has no blending method to fix this. I tried everything. It's really an annoyance that every time I smooth colors out and get averages, I lose saturation and brightness, and have to re-saturate everything afterward. I think that if blending worked by averaging the HSB instead of the RGB, it'd be a bit tricky but the color would blend the way it does in reality and not begin to turn gray.

    --
    I am NOT a number! I am a - oh wait, I'm number 761710. Look! 761710!
    1. Re:Solve the flawed alpha method by Zareste · · Score: 1

      Crap. Just now I realize the subject was more about education. Well, it's good to get the information out anyway. Guess I'll have to go back to making my own program.

      --
      I am NOT a number! I am a - oh wait, I'm number 761710. Look! 761710!
    2. Re:Solve the flawed alpha method by TheClassic · · Score: 1

      I'm definitely interested in this topic. Not for any particular reason, I just find it interesting. Its on my list of things I'd like to work on, but will probably never get to.

    3. Re:Solve the flawed alpha method by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It'd be great if someone applied a solution, since my C# programming skills are naught. I'd imagine the popularity of whatever program used it would be pretty good. A lot of artists don't realize the slip-up exists and I've noticed the harmful effects it's had.

      It'd also be great if Slashdot didn't have the 'time out' flaw that causes people to have to post as Anonymous Coward every time some troll mods them down.

      It'd also be great if I realized this wasn't actually an article about making a program before giving that speech.

  7. Processing by FrenZon · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I strongly recommend at least giving them the opportunity to be exposed to processing - I've had the fortune of sitting in on one of the classes at UCLA by one of its creators, Casey Reas, and the students in there (from art courses all over, most of whom had no prior programming experience) were all digging into it like rabbits into a carrot sale. Beautiful to watch.

    Some students won't like it, that's a given with any programming subject, but those that do will thank you endlessly for it.

  8. Why computers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "[T]eaching using computers in the area of art" sounds like this is intended to be an art class. Why not just hand out some pads and pencils? What do you need the computers for?

    1. Re:Why computers? by tverbeek · · Score: 1
      "[T]eaching using computers in the area of art" sounds like this is intended to be an art class. Why not just hand out some pads and pencils? What do you need the computers for?

      (What do you need pads and pencils for? Let them scratch stuff in the dirt.)

      He didn't say it was just "an art class"; he said it was a class on how to use a particular tool (computers) for art. Kind of like you can teach a class on using oil paint for art, using charcoal pencils for art, or using pieces of wood for art. By high school most kids with any kind of competent art program in their school system have at least experimented a little with traditional media. And digital media are important to add to the list, especially since they are displacing traditional media in so many areas.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    2. Re:Why computers? by sakusha · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Precisely. Let me tell you a little story.

      I entered Art School around 1975, about the time I started building my first microcomputer from a kit. I majored in drawing and photography, but dabbled with computers and took a lot of computer classes. The compsci department treated me like crap, I was just a dumb artist (yeah, a dumb artist that switched majors from Honors Chemistry/PreMed). But I was the first person to exhibit computer graphics and primitive computer animation at my art school. The art school Dean was very conservative and considered drawing/painting, printmaking, and sculpture to be the only valid areas of study. Even the new Photography department was considered the Black Sheep of the family, it was not art, merely technology. I got kicked out of art school during my senior year, they got fed up with me. I used to go around telling my professors that I was sick of drawing with charcoal, that technology hadn't changed since Paleolithic Man dragged a burnt stump out of a campfire and scratched it on a cave wall, I wanted a NEW artist's studio, more like a mad scientist's laboratory with bubbling beakers and sparking coils.
      So I went to work, and spent many years working in prepress, computer graphics, etc. To my utter astonishment, as new computer tools like Photoshop were released, I consistently found that my traditional art school techniques (i.e. my darkroom classes) were the most valuable training I could have taken in preparation for these programs. I consistently got better results than the computer geeks around me that had no art skills.
      Back around '92 when the recession hit, I decided to go back and finish my BFA. And to my astonishment, my old art school was only then just installing its first computer classroom. By that time, I had seen and done about everything in the computer graphics field, I completely abandoned doing computer graphics and focused on oil painting. And when I finished my degree, I found my CG work was much stronger. Anybody can push around pixels (or paint, for that matter) but it takes artistic skill, training, and practice to understand why an image has to be THIS way and not THAT way. If you have no ability to plan out what kind of result you want, you will have no way to create the work. You will be randomly wandering through the program trying to figure out why you aren't getting results.
      I continually assert: there is NO image you can create with a computer that can't be done with conventional tools. It may take an infinitely larger amount of effort, but it could be done. The fundamentals of art production have not changed with the introduction of computers. This is why it is easier to train artists how to use computers than it is to teach computer experts how to be an artist. Artists always know what they would like to create, maybe they have dreamt of artworks that were beyond their capabilities before computers, but they still have ideas about how they would go about creating the artwork even without a computer. The same cannot be said of computer geeks, they cannot see how an artwork could be created without computers.
      The moral of the story: artists need to study art, not computers. They need paper and pencils first, and computers last. My old Photo professor said that a true artist can make art despite his tools, a great photographer could take great photos with a pinhole camera, but a crappy photographer couldn't take great photos even with a great camera. Great art tools like computers are useless in the hands of someone with no artistic training.

    3. Re:Why computers? by glk572 · · Score: 1


      Computers are not displacing traditional media in art. Computers supplement not replace. That's just like saying that pencils displaced charcoal. You get a different result. There is no way that computers will ever overtake traditional media, the interaction between pigment, surface, and light just can't be replaced. You can simulate the results but you just can't get the tactile feedback, the feel of the paint, as you get with watercolor. I make heavy use of pencil, ink, watercolor, AD markers, and yes computers. However in the context of this type of class a single day refresher on perspective drawing would be more than enough to get everyone up to speed.

      I do agree that computers are an important tool for artists to learn to use. But in high-school you really don't have the repertoire of technical (drawing) skills that you need to be efficient at 3d modeling. I feel that being a good draftsman is critical to being a good modeler.

      I make heavy use of blender, aside from auto-cad and photoshop I spend the most time in blender and have for years now, it's a wonderful program, I've referred many of my artist friends to it. It has a steeper but shorter learning curve than maya, and still gives great results. It would be definitely worth taking a class on in high-school.

      --
      Well art is art isn't it, but then again water is water; and east is east; and west is west; and if you take cranberries
    4. Re:Why computers? by tverbeek · · Score: 1
      Computers are not displacing traditional media in art.

      I'm not trying to argue that digital media is "just as good as" or a one-for-one replacement for every other media. Oil painting and charcoal drawing aren't going to vanish from the earth any time soon, and are still unique artistic media. But in certain segments of the professional world, digital tools most definitely are displacing traditional media, as surely as word processors have displaced most typewriters, photography has displaced most newspaper illustration, and drum machines have displaced more than a few skin-pounders:

      The entire process of coloring and lettering comics is now done digitally, and publishers are experimenting with using digital processing of penciled art to eliminate the pen-and-ink (or brush-and-ink) stage as well. Some artists are using 3d modeling software to do their backgrounds, and some are even doing fully-digitally-rendered art. Or they're doing all their drawing on tablets, such that they may never touch pencil and paper.

      I know several professional freelance illustrators (magazines, brochures, etc) who do all of their work digitally.

      Architectural "artist's renderings" (especially in the latter stages of development) are done with modeling programs instead of pens and pencils. Likewise with industrial product and furniture designs, interiors, etc.

      Photography is increasingly becoming digital photography, with the chemical and optical darkroom techniques being replaced by digital processing.

      Graphic designers used to hand-letter or hand-transfer type in roughs and mock-ups; now they're using outline fonts on computers. (I found a whole box of old Letraset materials in storage at the college where I work, and I can assure you that none of our current students are being taught how to use that stuff.) And when was the last time you saw an ad rough done up in pastels?

      The Metals & Jewelry department were I work has a device that takes digital 3D models and "prints" them in a resin of some kind as a physical object which can them be used for casting, instead of sculpting the originals by hand in some other material.

      The entire animation industry has been turned upside down by digital media. The tools of Toy Story and Shrek (and even mixed media like Beauty and the Beast) have definitely displaced to a substantial degree the tools of Snow White and Looney Tunes.

      In short, I can walk the halls of my college and find students in nearly every department being taught the use of digital tools and processes to do things that once would have been done using some other "traditional" craft. Some of the things they're doing have no antecedent, so they're not "displacing" anything, but a lot of the digital work being done is simply the 21st-century way of doing something that used to be done with pencils or paint or plaster.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    5. Re:Why computers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Absolutely.

      This should be the same in whatever field you are in.

      Many people don't get the fundamentals they should get when studying in an area, and assume that knowing how to use a tool is itself a means to an end.

      You need both fundamental knowledge and creativity. Computers are nothing more than tools to help translate creative thoughts into tangible forms.

      The more intuitive it is to the artist (or architect, musician, doctor, analyst, you name the field) the better.

    6. Re:Why computers? by Butt · · Score: 1

      The moral of the story: artists need to study art, not computers. They need paper and pencils first, and computers last.

      Absolutely!

      But there's no reason to use a camera at all when with enough time with the pencil you can do a perfectly adequate representation of a scene.

      And there's no reason why you should use a high-level programming language when you can do everything with enough time in assembler, where you'll learn the true meaning of programming.

      Look, the question was about digital arts, which is an entirely different domain than drawing still lifes, in much the same way as you don't compare geeks writing code for embedded microprocessors with those who develop enterprise databases, even though its "still programming".

      Artists' imaginations are also constructed by their tools, and the institutional dimensions of art have been radically transformed since the introduction of new media (not that new media has been directly responsible for all those changes). Oil paints are not some kind of "natural medium" for art, they're the product of a specific social history (and set of economic relationships). I agree with you that students need to develop high-level skills in thinking about how images work, how they will be percieved and how to manipulate their form, but there's absolutely no reason this "craft" can't be developed in the digital arena. In fact, I would assert that the art made by my students with good digital chops is on the whole more thoughtful and effective than the work of those with painting chops. There are good and bad students in both camps, of course, but to put forward your kind of aesthetic fundamentalism is just silly, even if it does seem "insightful" to those who've never looked at a contemporary art magazine.

  9. Don't put the cart before the horse. by sakusha · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Budding artists don't need to wrestle with poorly constructed software like GIMP, they need skills that can actually EARN MONEY, they need to learn apps with the most acceptance in the field, which means Photoshop/Painter, XPress/InDesign, Illustrator/Freehand, Dreamweaver/GoLive. And since the graphic arts industry is still predominantly Mac, they need Mac skills.

    1. Re:Don't put the cart before the horse. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Speaking as a graphic artist, the parent poster makes a tremendously valid point (except for the Mac thing, any idiot can learn what they need to know about a Mac in 20 minutes): while there is undoubtedly a vast array of open source applications that can be used effectively as tool for teaching kids the conceptual foundations of graphics arts, attempting to do so is a conflation of two seperate tasks. The two fundamental tasks that a teacher of beginner graphic design students needs to accomplish is to give the students an understanding of the basics of image making (color theory, typography 101, et c.) and knowledge of how to use industry standard software. The typical path these days is to use computers to teach the former, assuming you'll get a good jumpstart on the latter by doing so. Using software that is NOT industry standard, however, forces students to learn a second set of software in order to learn what could be taught with ink, acetate, and paper. It's a waste of your students time. Not to dis GIMP, but if you think you can find work knowing GIMP and not Photoshop, you're ill-informed.

      IMHO, If you can't afford Adobe Creative Suite licenses, spend what money you do have and buy a simple printing press and some silkscreen stuff and have your students work physically. They'll be far better designers for it (perhaps better then people who learned digitally), and no more ill-prepared for real-world digital work then had you taught them on GIMP. Don't sweat the lack of spftware skills, staff design jobs are rare these days, so your students will need a computer and all that software anyhow to work freelance. If they have the boxes and software at home, they can teach themselves easily enough. The ability to learn software intutitvely is clutch anyhow. You won't be around to keep your students job skills viable when some new application pops up in a year anyhow: they either can teach themselves, or they can't compete with the people who can. Simple as that. And if they can't learn whatever new application pops up, I'll bet they'll be psyched you taught them how to silkscreen.

    2. Re:Don't put the cart before the horse. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (except for the Mac thing, any idiot can learn what they need to know about a Mac in 20 minutes)

      Oh bullshit. If that was true I wouldn't get people asking me every day stupid shit like "Uhhh, do these (G5's) have CD drives? How do I eject my disk? How do you restart? Where do I find the printer?"

      Funny that most of them are l33t hax0r PC users.

    3. Re:Don't put the cart before the horse. by ultranova · · Score: 1

      (except for the Mac thing, any idiot can learn what they need to know about a Mac in 20 minutes)

      Oh bullshit. If that was true I wouldn't get people asking me every day stupid shit like "Uhhh, do these (G5's) have CD drives? How do I eject my disk? How do you restart? Where do I find the printer?"

      Because you are available. In my experience, if I'm not present, people will figure out how to do things on their own (on a PC). If I am present, they won't bother thinking even for a second, but just ask me instead.

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

  10. Sorry, but by FLEB · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm going to have to agree with many of the above posters. The area of graphic arts/design is very "industry-standard" based. If you're looking to teach people that will go out into the digital art world, you'll probably need to suck it up and go for the same old package of commercial sofrware, or you'll be doing your students a disservice.

    To agree with another poster, don't base your curriculum around the software, especially with software that isn't big already in the design world. The fundamentals can, and should, be learned with good ol' pencil-and-paper sketching. Then, once the thought process is done on paper, teach "Now you have your idea, how do you make it happen with x software?"

    That said, I think people going into 3D should be forced to scratch out at least a few scenes in POV-RAY*... but then again I'm just a masochistic bastard!

    * May not be FOSS... they have their own license, IIRC, and I really don't care enough to look it up just to qualify my postscript.

    --
    Information wants to be free.
    Entertainment wants to be paid.
    You just want to be cheap.
  11. Trail blazing by tverbeek · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I wouldn't hold out much hope of finding a curriculum based around Libre software, because what's out there generally isn't very suitable for learning digital art. The GIMP is the granddaddy in this segment, and only just reached the point (with 2.0) where I'd even show it to a creative professional, out of embarassment. GIMP 1.x was practically a poster child for poorly designed, counter-intuitive interfaces. 2.0 is probably OK for newbies to digital painting to explore with, but if you build a good intro class around it, you'll probably be the first.

    I do tech support for an art school, and I also picked up a BFA there, so I have a pretty good sense of the kinds of tools needed to teach digital media effectively. I promote the use of Libre software here as much as anywhere else I've worked, but I have to admit that there's little use for it in the classrooms (except for mainstream officeware like OOo and Firefox). Macromedia's apps and Photoshop Elements aren't Gratis or Libre, but they're fairly inexpensive for schools, and meet the rest of your requirements (e.g. cross platform, curricula) pretty well.

    I'm setting up one of my old Macs for sale to a student, and in trying to "add value" with some free apps they'd actually have use for, the best I could come up with was GIMP (which I'm sure they'll delete and replace with a cracked or educational-licence copy of Photoshop) and WordPress for blogging.

    Libre stuff might be OK if you're just trying to help high school students get their feet wet, but if you're trying to prepare people to do this stuff as professionals, you need to teach them the software the industry uses. Employers don't want someone with digital-paint-program vector-drawing-program experience; they want someone with Photoshop and Illustrator/Freehand experience. (They'll usually settle for Windows users, but they'd rather have someone who knows his way around OS X.) And freelancers are going to want to be proficient in the best tools they can afford, and that's also going to be commercial software.

    I think what you're doing is a great idea, and I don't want to discourage it, but it's definitely going to be an uphill battle. Best of luck, and if you pull it off... please share what you learn from it!

    --
    http://alternatives.rzero.com/
  12. Commercial tools, OpenSource curriculum? by gobbo · · Score: 1

    I recently developed curriculum for a 3rd year university course titled Digital Media, and while we (team of two) did our best to deal with fundamentals (resolution, file format, etc.), we had to think of

    1. hands-on learning of tools in a reasonable amount of time
    2. students who want to get jobs with these tools
    3. the available training materials outside of the course
    4. the equipment in the lab ...which turned out to mean that we wound up building the whole course around learning Photoshop, After Effects, Pro Tools, and Final Cut Pro (yeah, Mac platform).

    These programs have consistent (enough) interfaces, integrate well, and these tools are what the students demand. Had we been using PC's, it would have been Premiere (shudder).

    I kept thinking while doing it... why isn't there open source curriculum to pick up and run with? MIT didn't have anything (at the time) that we could use. Had I more power locally, I would have forced the issue with our course.

    1. Re:Commercial tools, OpenSource curriculum? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Such a degree exists at SIT in New Zealand.

  13. You have it backwards. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
    We are running mainly Windows on our HS campus with the exception of Macs in the visual arts department, and are just beginning to get into the process of teaching using computers in the area of art. What recommendations do you have for starting a program?
    This is exactly the wrong way to do things. You should not be looking to buy equipment first and then shoehorn your program onto that. You should be looking to hire a computer-savvy art faculty member first. What he teaches will largely dictate the resources you need.
  14. Waste of time and effort by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    as someone who went to an art school, art school students want to get a JOB and part of what they pay for is the ability to use the TOOLS that EMPLOYERS require.

    Until you see all those OpenSource apps on requirements of employers you are working a pipe dream.

    And that is not going to happen because almost every open source graphics applications is really horrible interface wise and buggy.

  15. Try Multiply, and try cyan by tepples · · Score: 1

    When you mix blue and yellow paint, or put a blue glass in front of a yellow glass, you get green.

    Mixing pigments works more like componentwise multiplication. In this case you get black. Now try multiplying cyan (which many non-technical people call a shade of "blue") with yellow, and you'll get green.

    1. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by tverbeek · · Score: 3, Interesting
      "When you mix blue and yellow paint, or put a blue glass in front of a yellow glass, you get green."

      Mixing pigments works more like componentwise multiplication. In this case you get black. Now try multiplying cyan (which many non-technical people call a shade of "blue") with yellow, and you'll get green.

      Speaking as someone who has actually done this, I can tell you that when I mix blue paint - even a warm, definitely-not-cyan blue like ultramarine - with cadmium yellow, I get a shade of green. A fairly dull one and a fairly dark one, but still green. If I want black, I mix that ultramarine with an equal quantity of burnt siena (a dull warm orange)... the result is deep, dark, and neutral. But you are sort of right: mixing a cool blue like cyan with yellow will get me a brighter green.

      You're making the mistake of trying to apply the CMYK color scheme (which works fine with transparent inks and dyes) to the pigments in paint, and it simply doesn't work. Paints use a third system of primaries and secondaries, in which the mixing complement of yellow is violet (not blue), the complement of cyan is scarlet (halfway between red and orange) instead of true red, and the complement of magenta is a warm, yellowish green. It's similar to CMYK, but not identical. So what you learned in first grade is still technically correct: in the RYB system, blue + yellow => green.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    2. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by tepples · · Score: 1

      In that case, you probably just need to ditch your Photoshop and get a paint program that specializes in simulation of natural media such as grade-school paint.

    3. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pardon - it's Zareste - Slashdot apparently supports troll-mods wholeheartedly so I had to post this from somewhere else since one of my posts got a bad moderator modding it.

      First somebody out there needs to take a look at the simplest observation (blue+yellow=green) and fix the fact that multiplying and averaging RGB gives you the wrong colors, as denying something so astoundingly simple is hindering CG media as we know it. I can't find any programs that go by the color spectrum we have here in reality.

      So why is it so hard to put a yellow glass in front of a blue glass? Who's telling people to believe it makes black? I feel like Galileo rolling the different-sized balls off the Leaning Tower; it's so simple that only a colorblind moron wouldn't realize it.

    4. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by HughsOnFirst · · Score: 1
      "So why is it so hard to put a yellow glass in front of a blue glass? Who's telling people to believe it makes black? "
      Photographers most likely.
      It's called photoshop because it behaves like the world as known by photographers, who manipulate (3 colors of) light.
      Painters have a different model of the world and manipulate it with paints which behave in both subtractive and additive combinations. In addition, two paints which look identically colored can behave very differently when mixed with a third color. That's why painters use hundreds of pigments and refer to them by their material (often chemical) name rather than by their color.

      I studied both painting and photography at the graduate level, and you have to think about them differently. It's sort of like thinking about light waves in some contexts and photons in others when you talk abought light.

    5. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by Zareste · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't trust a photographer who couldn't identify the color green. In fact I wouldn't trust anyone at all who looked at the color green and called it black. If something this essential can evade someone in any field of art, then they're in the lowest league of artist there is.

      --
      I am NOT a number! I am a - oh wait, I'm number 761710. Look! 761710!
    6. Re:Try Multiply, and try cyan by HughsOnFirst · · Score: 1

      Ok, here is a thought experiment
      Imagine a filter that only passes blue light,
      say a filter that passes light with a wavelength between 380 NM and 500 NM with a peak at 450 NM
      Imagine a filter that only passes yellow light,
      say a filter that passes light with a wavelength between 550 NM and 650 NM with a peak at 600 NM
      Imagine a sandwich of the two filters.
      What do you think gets passed?

      Now imagine mixing a beam of light that passes through the blue filter with a beam of light that passes through the yellow filter. It will look to you (assuming you are a human male without inherited red green colorblindness, or you are a human female) like it is green, even though there is no "green" light whatsoever.

      This is something that painting or photography students learn the first week they use color.

  16. 2D is not 3D by miyako · · Score: 1

    One of the first things that I noticed is that the poster asks about both 2D drawing/manipulation and 3D modeling. While it's true that both are 3D art, I would highly suggest not lumping these together into the same group. 2D and 3D are are hightly seperate (thought often complementary) skills, and should be learned seperately. I would suggest teaching 2D art first, and then have a second class to do 3D modeling, perhaps with an introduction at the beginning on creating textures and such.
    For 2D artwork, GIMP is a pretty solid program that should do everything a beginning student would need, and features that should work to teach students most of the initial concepts they'll need to work with 2D computer artwork, such as dealing with transparency, layers, brush types, filters and plugins, scaling, rotating images, adjusting brightness/contrast/balance, etc. The only problem with using GIMP is that photoshop is pretty industry standard, and it works differently than GIMP. This shouldn't be a problem though if you stick to teaching concepts that are applicable with any digital art program.
    For 3D artwork, I've heard a lot of good things about blender, but I've never used it personally. If you are using Macs and Windows PCs, then look into the maya personal learning edition. I'm not sure if the license on it would allow a school to use it on all their machines for teaching, but I would venture to guess that it would, or that they would allow it if you talked to them. The only problem with this is that Maya, along with just about any other 3D modeling software, has a really complicated UI and might just be too much to try to teach.

    --
    Famous Last Words: "hmm...wikipedia says it's edible"
  17. computes and art. visual programming in realtime by parasew · · Score: 3, Informative

    From my opinion as a student of computer arts/digital arts, the first thing you have to ask yourself is how to include the computer in your artistic work.
    I can recommend the Book "Composing Interactive Music" from Todd Winkler, as I found it not only interesting for re-thinking how to use Computers in artistic installations, but also how to completely rethink computer interaction.
    Winkler proposes a framework of 5 stages which i think can also be adoped for any digital works, not only music.
    The book is inteded for composers working with max/msp, a visual programming language where object boxes can be "patched" together; this style of working shows fast results, as this kind of software is working "realtime", meaning you get constant ouptput of the things you are doing or the parameters you are changing.
    I am working with this kind of "patchable software interfaces" for more than five years now; and this is also teached on the University of Applied Arts in Vienna/Austria, where I am studying.
    If it comes to interaction (sound-visual, sound-dancers, graphics-interface, whatever) in the field of artistic work, these tools such as
    PD Pure Data (windows/mac/linux) - Audio/Video/3D (GEM,Framestein) -opensource-
    Cycling74 max/msp (windows/mac) - Audio/Video/3D (also see Nato and Jitter) -free 30days demo-
    Native Instruments Reaktor (windows/mac) -commercial, but has education pricing-
    vvvv (win) -free-
    are used from lots of the people around.
    there are hell lots more, you might want to take a look at the audiovisualizers.com tool shack, or pawfal.org for example.

    For some visual examples and also works, you might want to take a look at
    http://www.harvestworks.org/maxreel/
    http://puredata.info/community/ (mostly audio)
    talking chair (vvvv+hardware)
    http://www.realtimearts.net/

    or you might also want to take a look at the department of digital art in the university of applied arts/vienna.
    currently we are a group of people trying to bring opensource and arts together. there are also workshops and lots of projects going on: http://5uper.net

    for sure there are also "standard" programs teached, which are good for working with business and advertising companies -- but if we are speaking about digital arts, that's going beyond the standard approach of software use. at least for me.

  18. Don't put the [money] before the [love] by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Budding artists don't need to wrestle with poorly constructed software like GIMP, they need skills that can actually EARN MONEY..."

    But, but, we're suppose to be doing it "for the love"(1)

    (1) Yeah I know. It's a BS argument that shows up when outsourcing, or copyright gets mentioned. Only the players change.

    1. Re:Don't put the [money] before the [love] by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sounds like the title for an awesome movie! can we get michael j fox to star in it?

  19. Why computers?-Social Flailing. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Great art tools like computers are useless in the hands of someone with no artistic training."

    Amen!. Guess what happens when the talentless can't come to terms with the truths in your post?

    1. Re:Why computers?-Social Flailing. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Guess what happens when the talentless can't come to terms with the truths in your post?

      I know this isn't the answer you're looking for, but they are the ones who tend to work the hardest and succeed.

  20. My Magnet School by dave1g · · Score: 1

    www.neisd.net/data/ is where I went to Highschool, they did 2d, 3d computer art as well as many other things, im sure the teachers there would be helpful to you. however they are using comercial software but the ideas will be mostly usable in any software package

  21. More to the point.. by sakusha · · Score: 2, Insightful

    After criticising the entire concept of using computers to teach art, I decided to look at the problem from another angle. I pondered what free "software" (like books) would be of actual, practical value to students and their instructors.

    Students need to learn how to draw and paint, the techniques have not changed much since the Renaissance. Not surprisingly, many of the best art instructional materials are long out of copyright, and are freely available. For example, you can feel free to reproduce Leonardo da Vinci's "Lessons on Painting" or Andrea Pozzo's "Perspective in Architecture and Painting" as they both date back to the 17th century.

    You would be surprised at the amount of free instructional materials that art supplies vendors will give you, just for the asking. Of course they have a financial incentive to attract new artists to their products, but hey, an oil painting lesson sheet works the same with Windsor & Newton oil paints as it does with Holbein oil paints.

    Artists tend to learn best by example, by viewing other artists' works. Any computer with a browser might be helpful in sampling artworks, but ultimately, no video display can show the subtle nuances of an artwork sufficiently for a student to understand them. So again, computers won't be much help. A trip to the local museum would be much better.

    Artists are also a good resource. I know many artists who would be glad to talk with students and give their advice, even for free, if someone would just ask them. My university often got internationally famous artists (I mean REALLY famous artists) to come to lecture at my art school, merely by offering them room and board and a relaxing stay at our laid-back campus. This cost the school essentially nothing. I asked my professor who got my favorite painter to come and lecture, how she convinced someone like that to come to our school for basically no money. She said, "well, I ASKED him and he said yes."

    So I hope I've offered a few areas to investigate for free study materials. Every art instructor should already have ideas about what materials are suitable, they wouldn't be much of an artist if they didn't.

    BTW, I should tell you about a book I read way back when I was a newbie art student. I found a book in our university's art library, commissioned by IBM in the 1960s, describing how computers could be applied to the Arts. There wasn't really any such thing as computer graphics as an art media back then, so the book focused on odd applications, the one I remember best was a computer search that could attempt to fit broken fragments of archaeological pieces back together. They managed to even reunite two pieces of pottery from different museums, now the two pieces together were worth far more than the sum of the parts. But I digress.. what really got to me was an extensive statistical survey of art students and professors, the data all crunched on vintage punchcard mainframes. The survey was an attempt to find out what exactly do students LEARN in art school. The statistics were clear, and the conclusion astonishing (to me at least). There were only 2 things that students really learned in Art School:
    1. How to dress like an artist.
    2. How to act like an artist.
    Art students learned this merely by copying the dress and behavior of their teachers. Actual learning of technical skills were so statistically insignificant that they could not be measured. The survey concluded that if you just act like an artist, you will be considered an artist. Perhaps this survey revealed more about the limitations of the minds of IBM statisticians.

    1. Re:More to the point.. by sakusha · · Score: 1

      Darn it, I forgot my best anecdote.

      I studied with Nam June Paik, who surprised me by declaring the World's Greatest Artist's Tool to be the Manhattan Yellow Pages. He said that if you wanted to know something to help you make some artwork, all you had to do was look it up in the Yellow Pages, phone up someone and ask, and they'd tell you everything you needed to know. No matter how obscure a subject it is, there's always some lonely expert out there, just dying to talk to someone about his specialty, if someone would just phone him up and listen to him.

    2. Re:More to the point.. by tverbeek · · Score: 1
      There were only 2 things that students really learned in Art School:
      1. How to dress like an artist.
      2. How to act like an artist.

      Then I must not have learned anything, because I still dress the same as I did before art school (mostly the very same articles of clothing), and I don't think I act any differently. I'll have to go ask for my money back. {smile}

      The main thing I did learn (which I suspect the folks with narrow black ties, hornrim glasses, and pocket protectors at International Business Machines didn't know how to quantify) was how to think like an artist. That was far more important than the techniques I also learned.

      --
      http://alternatives.rzero.com/
    3. Re:More to the point.. by sakusha · · Score: 1

      Precisely.

      In my photography classes, the professors used to talk about "seeing" photos (a term that goes back to Ansel Adams) but they were really talking about the mental process of visualizing the photographic image you wanted to produce.

  22. a true artist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I consider myself a "true geek" more than a "true artist"

    i like to think of myself as a true artist, but people keep telling me "don't quit your day job"

  23. Use LiVES ! by Salsaman · · Score: 1

    For video editing, you could use LiVES. I am the author of this application, and I am willing to help in any way I can with implementing this as part of your curriculum.

  24. create your own. by michaelbuddy · · Score: 1, Informative

    First off, if you are wanting to teach, set aside time when you've learned the program to create some multimedia tutorials. Get camtasia studio and record tutorials, export them to flash. It's better and fast than writing a book with screenshots.

    If you are wanting some linux movies, check out xvidcap.

    It's a great idea to promote and use open source software. Some might say that those skills will have no marketability because the apps are open source and not industry standard. However, when teaching an art class and including computers, all you have to do is emphasize "Now this is free so you can use it at home. Photoshop is what most people in business use, but the same principles apply." Kids will remember that and they will pick up the right app if they are really interested in that field.

    Save the money by using OSS and buy some really nice digital cameras for everyone to use. Have the kids go out and capture the world. They'll love it. Then bring the pictures into gimp, try different things from contrasts to layermasking, and painting. Create meaningful collages. If they learn the gimp, they'll pick up photoshop, and then freehand, etc. They'll be fine. I'd recommend gimp over photoshop elements any day.

    Here are learning links I've found on blender. This is really a cool program to teach, but I know it will be difficult for some people to pick up. Teach them how to create a text object, write their name and render it with different light setups. Future filmmakers will really appreciate it I think.

    http://www.bl3nder.com/tutorials/ http://www.ctr.co.at/swf/3ds_max_1_zb1_num_calc.ht m http://www.blenderama.com/index.php?id=276 http://www.vrotvrot.com/xoom/tutorials.html http://blendedmind.i8.com/tutorials.html#tutorials http://www.blender.org/modules/documentation/htmlI / http://www.tutorialguide.net/software/blender/ http://www.blender3d.com/cms/Tutorials.243.0.html http://www.tltsu.ru/archive/blender/BlenderTutoria lPart3_.pdf http://project-blender.onlinehome.de/ http://www-users.cs.umn.edu/~mein/blender/ http://www.ingiebee.com/Blendermania/tutorial_list .html http://renderosity.com/ http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/0 4/30/217225 http://www.geocities.com/paulthepuzzles/aardvarks. html http://blender.excellentwhale.com/ http://www.selleri.org/Blender/ http://www.swissquake.ch/chumbalum-soft/index.html http://www.elysiun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=11202 6#112026 http://vrotvrot.com/xoom/tutorials.html http://www.linuxgraphic.org/section3d/blender/page

    --

    ...::----::...

    I am in no way affiliated with this sig.

  25. if youre contemplating CAD... by coeus_theoi · · Score: 1

    ... look into a program called RHINO made by ROBERT MCNEEL & ASSOCIATES. i use it on my prototyping and fabrication projects as it is relatively tiny compared to AutoCAD and has less clutter. it is efficient enough to work on my old dell latitude, while still putting out high-quality renders. the product is cheaper than AutoCAD and offers plug-ins which put it on par with cinematic rendering software like MAYA and 3DSMAX. Just starting out, Id say RHINO beats AutoCAD all on its own in terms of price, efficiency and computer performance.

  26. Re:computes and art. visual programming in realtim by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Thanks for this post, which is actually talking about using *computers* for doing art. Especially when it comes to computer art is much more than just pretty pictures. Gimp and Blender, as useful as they are, often are used basically just as replacements for pencil and paper. IMO that's not all you can do with a computer in the field of art(s).

    The only piece of FLOSS software you mentioned is Pure Data, which is a prime example of the way I envision computers to actually enhance what arts can be in the digital age. Pd actually *is* used by artists big time. Just check out the website for the first Pd convention which happened about a month ago.

    The whole week was crammed full with art projects of all kinds: art installations, concerts, dance performances, hacktivism - everything done by using Pd and its various extensions.

    More FLOSS art action currently happens at the piksel meeting.

    The people working on and with these tools are not just geeky hackers, they foremost care about art, but see computer and code as a way to do their kind of art. They are Hackers And Painters.