Linux Supporting G5 Liquid Cooling System

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Linux Supporting G5 Liquid Cooling System

Posted by pudge on Wednesday October 20, 2004 @04:07PM from the cooooooooool dept.

Sandor writes "Apple's G5 is selling well and this seems to have helped the development of the Linux kernel on the ppc64 platform: shortly after the shipment of the dual G5 with the new liquid cooling system, it seems that Linux kernel is going to support it really soon."

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Ah hah! by avalys · 2004-10-20 16:10 · Score: 5, Funny

So, this would be perfect for those moments when you're on a Mac and need access to a Unix system for some reason.

Oh, wait...

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The point by MacFury · 2004-10-20 16:28 · Score: 3, Insightful

Not to troll...but what is the point of running Linux on the Mac, aside from the "because we can!" which is a valid reason. :-)
1. Re:The point by Zachary+Kessin · 2004-10-20 16:44 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  I've wondered that as well. I have 3 computers on my desk, 2 run Mac OS 10.3, and the 3rd runs linux. I access the linux via VNC from one or the other of the macs. The thing is that there are a number of apps on the mac that are just better than anything else out there, at least as far as some of the things I want to do. I have never found linux apps that are as good as iTunes or iPhoto.
  
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2. Re:The point by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-20 16:53 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Cross platform compatibility. If you have an application for which you have the source code, it's advantageous to be able to run the OS on an arbitrary hardware platform. Whether that hardware be Alpha, MIPS, Sparc, POWER, PowerPC, x86, 6502, or whatever, if the OS will run on it, it's a relatively minor thing to take the source code and recompile (assuming it doesn't have endian problems or embedded assembly).
  This means that if you can get better bang for your buck out of PowerPC (aka Xserve RAID) hardware, you'll buy Xserves, throw the OS onto it, and start plugging away with your app. Next week, the best bang for buck might be Alpha -- so you buy the relevant systems from HP, throw the OS onto them, and start plugging away. The following week, it might be x86.
  Yes, in theory, any POSIX platform should be sufficiently compatible to do the job. In practice, however, POSIX compliance isn't enough.
  If you want OS X, it's there. If, however, your app is written for Linux (and it's the only app you want to run, or the others are all written for Linux) -- why bother modifying it so it'll work on OS X if it'll work with just a recompile on the PowerPC Linux ports?
  If you don't believe that the Unix market is so divergent, then I dare you: try downloading and compiling all the sources, from scratch, for some major package -- maybe KDE -- on Solaris. Or Tru64. Or HP-UX. Or AIX. It might work on Linux, but you'll have a royal pain of a time trying to get it to work elsewhere, unless it's been carefully written to not use Linux-isms. Believe me, I've been there, and it's not pretty.
3. Re:The point by fsterman · 2004-10-20 17:01 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Because I need to install Linux on an original All-In-One G3 (_right_ before the iMac, educational release only) for a server :) Can't do with OS X! Custom apps for Linux, especially Linux kernal extensions. PPC is a pretty powerful processor, clustering it with Linux is easier and less expensive than OS X. Uhh, and more :)
  
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4. Re:The point by fm6 · 2004-10-20 17:34 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  It's an obvious combination for somebody who prefers PPC architecture to Pentium, but doesn't want to deal with MacOS. Mac diehards would never concede that anybody can design a user interface better than Apple -- but some of us are thoroughly adjusted to an X- or Windows-style user interface, and don't find it worthwhile to retrain ourselves.
5. Re:The point by byolinux · 2004-10-20 21:48 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  GNU/Linux is free software. Perhaps you only want to run ONLY free software on a very fast, well engineered computer?
  
  That's a reason why.
  
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6. Re:The point by jcr · 2004-10-20 22:48 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  Mac diehards would never concede that anybody can design a user interface better than Apple
  
  That would be because only one company ever did, and Apple bought them for $400M.
  
  -jcr
  
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7. Re:The point by nathanh · 2004-10-20 23:15 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Last I checked, the Linux PPC kernel doesn't even support FireWire,
  
  Uhh, works fine for me. External firewire HDD hooked up to PowerBook G4 running Debian.
8. Re:The point by tverbeek · 2004-10-20 23:52 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  "And you can install KDE, Gnome, or whatever ...."
  
  So major hacking of MacOS is an alternative to replacing it with Linux. Fair enough. But that doesn't mean that nobody will prefer the replacement to the hacking.
  Oh, please! It's hardly "major hacking". Installing KDE on top of the X11 that comes with OS X is no more difficult (probably less) than installing KDE, X11, and Linux on the same Mac.
  If you prefer Linux over Darwin (which is what we're really talking about at this point) that's a perfectly reasonable preference. (I'm planning to use Yellow Dog Linux on some old Apple hardware I want to use as a firewall, simply because I know how to do it with Linux and I'd have to start at square one figuring out how to do it with a BSD system.) Trying to support that choice by complaining about the OS X UI which is rather easily replaceable is not.
  
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Horse shit by Erect+Horsecock · 2004-10-20 16:28 · Score: 5, Informative

The only thing apple will drop the warranty from if you install linux on it is the iPod. If you put linux on your mac and have problems with it they wont provide software support, but will still cover the hardware. ihbt

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1. Re:Horse shit by tverbeek · 2004-10-20 23:58 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Similarly, our Apple rep (showing off the insides of the new G5 iMac) explained that if you put a bigger hard drive in it, Apple simply won't cover the hard drive, and if the hard drive catches fire and melts the rest of the system they won't cover the damage. But the rest of your hardware is still under warranty.
  
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Re:Sweet by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-20 17:02 · Score: 3, Informative

I've had MANY problems running linux (be it Gentoo, Debian, or YDL 3.0.1... I've tried pretty much anything with a PPC or PPC64 port) on either the Dual 1.8 or the Dual 2.0 in the newer generations of G5s. I can't recall ever having gotten one to successfully boot from any ISO available online.

If YDL 4 is able to boot and install successfully, I'll happily go out and purchase a boxed set; I just want to test it first. Too bad it won't be 'released' for a bit :-\ I'm very anxious to get it working.
Re:VNC? by Bastian · 2004-10-20 17:05 · Score: 4, Informative

Why use VNC? Wouldn't this do the job just as well (or better)?
Re:Sweet by Monster+Zero · 2004-10-20 17:57 · Score: 5, Informative

I know that this is tangential to the upstream posts about problems with Linux on the Apple G5s, but I wanted to at least add the following:
My automated installs of SuSE Enterprise Linux 9.0 on the dual PowerPC 970 (G5) IBM JS20 Blades work very very well. One of my peers installed several from the CD media without incident as well (except the boot partion has to be of type PrEP) while I was working on setting up the infrastructure for the auto installs.
If you can get the academic discount and happen to have IBM PowerPC970 equipment, I highly recommend SuSE SLES9.
not hardware controled!? by bjarthur123 · 2004-10-20 18:24 · Score: 3, Interesting

do i understand correctly that the fans and liquid-cooling system are not controlled by hardware? so if your OS crashes or otherwise malfunctions, then your CPU could overheat? does this seem like a really bad way to engineer things to anyone else?
1. Re:not hardware controled!? by fyonn · 2004-10-20 18:57 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  I don't know for a fact, but I imagine the liquid cooled system works the same way as the fans do in the currn g5's. the OS software overrides the bios control. the bios control on it's own will run all the fans at maximum (loud) speed, so without software support for the cooling system in linux, it'll sound like a jet engine.
  
  dave
The real reason to pick Linux over OS X is ... by Nice2Cats · 2004-10-20 21:35 · Score: 4, Funny

... NetHack for OS X / Darwin only seems to come in the girlie man Qt version. Some things in life are simply more important than cool graphics, a consistant user interface, and easy to use multimedia apps.
Re:Noise by fyonn · 2004-10-21 00:08 · Score: 3, Informative

well, I had some overheating probs with my g5 once (apple fixed them for me) and I'd come to my machine in the morning, the screen was blank and the fans were on "jet fighter" mode, which implies to me that if the OS stops taking an active interest in the fans then the firmware will step in and solve the problem the only way it knows how (max out all the fans). certainly the machine was unharmed when I rebooted it, nic and cool in fact :)

how it determines this I don't know, and I suspect few people outside apple do (unless it's a technical document in the archive), but if osx finds some way to crash badly and lets the fans stop, or not go fast enough etc, then you'll have some comeback to apple. if it happens while you're using linux then I suspect you're SOL. however, I would imagine that if linux fails to control the fans properly then the firmware would again step in to save the day.

it might simply be a case of, if the internal temp gets too high then the firmware maxxs all the fans

the desktop g5 doesn't have quite as many temp sensors as I thikn the xserve does (cpu in and out, per cpu, drive bay, motherboard, exhaust and... umm think thats it)

dave
NSW Signature! by MarcQuadra · 2004-10-21 02:36 · Score: 3, Funny

dude! not fscking funny!

I'm sitting in the corner of a classroom full of kids checking out slashdot while a computer finishes imaging, and i checked-out your sig. You should really let people know that your sig-link has Work Unsafe images on it, not say "I made a funny".

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Why? by amichalo · 2004-10-21 02:56 · Score: 4, Interesting

is this like those other times when people have gotten linux running on their Palm or Xbox or clock radio?

I am not trying to flame but I just don't see the point - OS X is BSD. You've got X11. you can run all sorts of apps from the OS X command line (from apache to fink to vi) so what's the appeal of running linux?

All I coud figure is the desktop environment.

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Re:Noise by Lars+T. · 2004-10-21 05:37 · Score: 4, Informative

Hardware: Power Mac G5 Developer Note: Fan Controller
[...] If the FCU does not receive an update from the operating system within two minutes, it begins to ramp up the speed of the fans to full speed.

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