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Will Your Next Car Run Windows?
An anonymous reader writes "Microsoft is beginning to move into the automotive industry. Their 'Automotive Business Unit' is selling a custom version of Windows CE called Windows Automotive. Microsoft attended a conference in Detroit this week to promote their software."
Great - now I can crash my car even after I've already crashed it.
No more!!!!
Gives a whole new meaning to "SUV" and "crash test"...
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
The question is, though, do we need such things in our cars? Do we really need cars equipped with "home entertainment systems," if these cars will only be used for trips to the nearest shop or driving to work?
Man is a slave because freedom is difficult, whereas slavery is easy.
I would think Detroit has enough worries about bad perceptions regarding their reliability without adding this to it. There's a reason why it's called "WinCE"
"Wow. Now THAT'S a lot of angry Indians." - Lt. Col. George Armstrong Custer
i only drive stick, therefore i'll run linux.
Cogito Eggo Sum, I think therefore I'm a waffle
Please step on brake, gas, and clutch simultaneously to reboot.
Do I have to pay the M$ tax on my car.
Can I opt for a -$100 upgrade and use other certain free OSes ?
Answers in order: probably, and probably not.
sigh.
dave.
You know it's gonna be bad when the windshield turns blue all of a sudden...
In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
I really hope that doesn't get too widespread... aren't there Videos on the net about the BMW (with Windows) where you can't close the trunk anymore and other fun things like these? Of course, maybe BMW is to blame here BUT Windows just doesn't have the reputation for reliability that I'd want for an OS in my car... no matter how many licenses M$ has already sold, that does not proof that it's good.
~Squisher
It should be noted that I read recently (sorry no links but maybe others can chime in) that BMW is working with Apple to replace its Windows in Car solution with something from Apple.
;)
Will this only extend to the music portion of the car?
Or will apple oversee other parts like navigation etc..
It was not known according to the article, but the take away was BMW was not happy with their Microsoft solution.
So you next car might not have a steering wheel but perhaps a "Clickable scroll wheel"
Does anyone know of a open source project to control a Fuel-Injected engine? I have been thinking about how to set it up, and am not sure of the off-the-shelf hardware that would be needed. But since most engines just use a simple collection of sensors that return a given voltage it probably wouldn't be that hard. And feedback is done by sending X volts to device Y.
So anyone who knows of USB/PCI/Serial devices that can communicate this way on many (30 - 40) lines. Post them here, please!
I'd ideally want an embedded solution, but why not a PC-based solution. You'd just have to wait for the PC to boot before you could start the car.
I can see the confusion now...
Geek walks into auto dealer:
"I'd really like a car without Windows, please."
I'll turn into a supernova and burn up everything. Well I'll turn into a black little hole and you'll turn into string.
I truely don't understand geeks who claim microsoft sucks but still for example have an xbox at home. If you don't want to buy a car with Microsoft software on some device, tell the salesperson that you won;t buy like the car because it uses Microsoft software. It's that simple, really.
Okay, I'll admit, you're right. Let's refresh the "Windows-runs-on-xyz" joke pool:
* Will the Home edition be installed on Pintos?
* My car only goes 50mph after downloading SP2 at the pump
* There's a purple gorilla in the back seat reporting my every moves to bonzibuddy.com
* Do I call Redmond to get an activation code when I add a set of fog lights to my car?
* Steve Ballmer says piracy happens because cars are too expensive
and of course
* Does it run on unleaded Linux?
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
The article doesn't say _anything_ about wince running the fuel injectors, or the ABS, or air bags, or brakes, or steering... It mentions only annoying stuff that has no business being in a car anyway.... Having an in-vehicle DVD player itself is probably more likely to cause crashes than what operating system is being run on said DVD player. Yes, I'm old. I drive a 21 year old diesel truck with no electronics and 440,000 miles on the odometer.
What would happen if you clicked 'No' to the EULA? Would you have to return the car for a refund?
BTM
That was the turning point of my life--I went from negative zero to positive zero.
Clippy: you have made a left turn, a right turn, and pressed the brake, it seems you are trying to evade a road hazard.
Clippy: would you like to enable the road hazard wizard?
Driver: Hurridly presses the YES button on the steering wheel?
Clippy: Windows ME (Mobile Edition), has many new features, it now loads faster than ever...you can even shut down unresponsive programs without rebooting. Car now approaching cliff
Driver: WTF, hurry up!
Clippy: Thank, you for installing Windows ME. Would you like to run the AutoEvade Wizard.
Driver: Ithought I just did that, pushes yes.
Clippy: What type of hazard are you trying to evade?
- Pothole
- pedestrian
- CowboyNeal
- The hazard I am trying to evade is not listed here
Driver selects the last option, car is bouncing of the guardrain nowClippy: Windows ME has detected new hardware, and is unable to find a driver for it and must shut down.
Driver: Argrghehahahahahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh......$^@$^@^@^3cras h^C^C^CC^C^
"Not you again," I said.
"Sorry," he said, a little sheepishly. "I guess you know why I'm here."
Indeed I did. Microsoft's $300 million campaign to promote the Windows 95 operating system was meant to be universally effective, to convince every human being on the planet that Windows 95 was an essential, some would say integral, part of living. Problem was, not everyone had bought it. Specifically, I hadn't bought it. I was the Last Human Being Without Windows 95. And now this little man from Microsoft was at my door, and he wouldn't take no for an answer.
"No," I said.
"You know I can't take that," he said, pulling out a copy of Windows 95 from a briefcase. "Come on. Just one copy. That's all we ask."
"Not interested." I said. "Look, isn't there someone else you can go bother for a while? There's got to be someone else on the planet who doesn't have a copy."
"Well, no," The Microsoft man said. "You're the only one."
"You can't be serious. Not everyone on the planet has a computer," I said. "Hell, not everyone on the planet has a PC! Some people own Macintoshes, which run their own operating system. And some people who have PCs run OS/2, though I hear that's just a rumor. In short, there are some people who just have no use for Windows 95."
The Microsoft man looked perplexed. "I'm missing your point," he said.
"Use!" I screamed. "Use! Use! Use! Why buy it, if you can't use it?"
"Well, I don't know anything about this 'use' thing you're going on about," The Microsoft man said. "All I know is that according to our records, everyone else on the planet has a copy."
"People without computers?"
"Got 'em."
"Amazonian Indians?"
"We had to get some malaria shots to go in, but yes."
"The Amish."
"Check."
"Oh, come on," I said. "They don't even wear buttons. How did you get them to buy a computer operating system?"
"We told them there were actually 95 very small windows in the box," the Microsoft man admitted. "We sort of lied. Which means we are all going to Hell, every single employee of Microsoft." He was somber for a minute, but then perked right up. "But that's not the point!" he said. "The point is, everyone has a copy. Except you."
"So what?" I said. "If everyone else jumped off a cliff, would you expect me to do it, too?"
"If we spent $300 million advertising it? Absolutely."
"No."
"Jeez, back to that again," the Microsoft man said. "Hey. I'll tell you what. I'll give you a copy. For free. Just take it and install it on your computer." He waved the box in front of me.
"No," I said again. "No offense, pal. But I don't need it. And frankly, your whole advertising blitz has sort of offended me. I mean, it's a computer operating system! Great. Fine. Swell. Whatever. But you guys are advertising it like it creates world peace or something."
"It did."
"Excuse me?"
"World peace. It was part of the original design. Really. One button access. Click on it, poof, end to strife and hunger. Simple."
"So what happened?"
"Well, you know," he said. "It took up a lot of space on the hard drive. We had to decide between it or the Microsoft Network. Anyway, we couldn't figure out how to make a profit off of world peace."
"Go away," I said.
"I can't," he said. "I'll be killed if I fail."
"You have got to be kidding," I said.
"Look," the Microsoft man said, "We sold this to the Amish. The Amish! Right now, they're opening the boxes and figuring out they've been had. We'll be pitchforked if we ever step into Western Pennsylvania again. But we did it. So to have you holding out, well, it's embarrassing. It's embarrassing to the company. It's embarrassing to the product. It's embarrassing to Bill."
"Bill Gates does not care about me," I said.
Laugh What you're describing is Heel Toe Braking and it is used in auto racing.
Exactly what we've come to expect from Windows upgrades -- breaking a feature people have come to rely on.
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
It should also be noted that BMW is a high-end product, so they aren't necessarily concerned with licensing fees. So it isn't about money. One thing that BMW is concerned with - quality when it comes to their brand image.
I have owned BMWs for about 9 years now (and no, I can't afford new ones). But BMW is VERY strict when it comes to using their logos and even colors in anything. They are very brand conscious, because they don't want it diluted. They produce phenominal cars, and want to make sure that their brand is associated with quality. I was a little sad when I heard that they had chosen a Microsoft product for their vehicles for that very reason. I actually thought that Apple is a lot like BMW in some respects. They aren't the biggest car maker, they are somewhat of a niche product catering to a very specific customer, and they produce high-quality products. I think Apple would be a great choice, but I think a BMW-home-grown product would also be cool. (Hello? SuSE?)
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
The results have been less than rosey. One famous example is the Thai Finance Minister who was trapped in his BMW after WinCE crashed and immobilized the vehicle - doors, locks, windows, AC, everything.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
You could have it crash before it crashes.
Things to look forward to:
Reboot on the San Diego Freeway during rush
You turn off the ignition and it asks if you're sure you want to do that
You turn off ignition and it asks if you want to install patches before shutdown (then notice the next morning it's been stuck in a loop installing patches all night [this was the case with my laptop at work])
You can only hook up MS DRM stereos, installed by MCSE's
Blue Windscreen of Death
All the cars in the world get cracked and do syncronized driving or demo-derby
Yet another mandatory service you must have performed by a certified professional for $$$ (all repairs are insanely expensive now, if you haven't had wiring, eletronics, mechanicals, count yourself lucky!)
You keep getting passed by that commie nutjob in the the veedub running Linux, despite Ballmer insisting you should have more power.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Do we trust brake lines/brake fluid more than we trust data and power cables to a remote braking mechanism?
Absolutely, yes. When was the last time your brakes failed because of a problem in the fluid or brake lines? Now, when was the last time your car lost power because of a dead battery or alternator?
This drive to make everything xxxxx-by-wire is a recipe for disaster, plain and simple. It's ok for commercial or military aviation where the planes are rigorously checked every single day, checked at the start of every single flight, and scrupulously maintained. But passenger cars are not maintained this way, and never will be as long as they're privately owned. (Even if they were corporately owned, the company would probably skimp on maintenance to save a buck, since there's no FAA threatening them with severe penalties, and not such a certainty of people dying if something goes wrong.)
Cars need to have the simplest and most reliable systems possible, even if it prevents fancy integration features from being implemented.
Moreover, fly-by-wire controls make some sense in planes, because the old hydraulic systems added a lot of weight compared to the electrical systems. Cars aren't as large, so the hydraulic systems don't add much weight, and weight also isn't nearly as important a factor in cars as it is in planes.
You win. The thread is done now.
Great - now I can crash my car even after I've already crashed it.
You could have it crash before it crashes.
You can even crash it at the same time! Oh, the possibilities!
Actually, I guess we've exhausted all the possibilities.
Well, that was fun.
Accountability on the heads of the powerful.
Power in the hands of the accountable.
iPod Your BMW. Says Apple, this is "The first seamless integration of iPod and automobile."
Others had made similar homebrew iPod and non-iPod solutions before (and iPod and non-iPod after) Apple/BMW's solution.
At this point, it doesn't look like Apple has any official plans to unveil further integration of Apple technology with automobiles. Of course, Apple almost always "does not comment on unreleased products."
the JoshMeister on Security
Last year the Thai Finance Minister was trapped inside his BMW allegedly due to a software glitch. http://www.thaivisa.com/index.php?514&backPID=514& tt_news=325
But another report said it was due to an electronic failure..
http://asia.cnet.com/news/systems/0,39037054,39130 270,00.htm
Sorry, but this statement is straight up false. The WinCE kernel is based off of the Windows NT 4.0 kernel. Also, WinCE shares the architecture of Windows 2000.
Microsoft ripped out a large part of the OS functionality and replaced other parts. Most of the API is the exact same as Win2K, but a lot of function calls with eleven arguments under Win2K require to you pass nine of them as NULL or zero under WinCE.
Just imagine the security situation this chainsaw OS surgery has created. Think bluesnarfing is fun now? Try it when you can hijack the entire entertainment and navigation system of that expensive SUV that just cut you off!
Please step on brake, gas, and clutch simultaneously to reboot.
More like brake, gas, and passenger-side door lock simultaneously
At a recent computer expo, Bill Gates reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry and stated "If GM had kept up with technology like the computer industry has, we would all be driving $25.00 cars that got 1,000 miles to the gallon.
In response to Bill's comments, General Motors issued a press release stating: If GM had developed technology like Microsoft, we would all be driving cars with the following characteristics:
For no reason whatsoever, your car would crash twice a day.
Every time they repainted the lines in the road, you would have to buy a new car.
Occasionally your car would die on the freeway for no reason. You would have to pull over to the side of the road, close all of the windows, shut off the car, restart it, and reopen the windows before you could continue. For some reason you would simply accept this.
Occasionally, executing a maneuver such as a left turn would cause your car to shut down and refuse to restart, in which case you would have to reinstall the engine.
Macintosh would make a car that was powered by the sun, was reliable, five times as fast and twice as easy to drive - but would run on only five percent of the roads.
The oil, water temperature, and alternator warning lights would all be replaced by a single "General Protection Fault" warning light.
The airbag system would ask "Are you sure?" before deploying.
Occasionally, for no reason whatsoever, your car would lock you out and refuse to let you in until you simultaneously lifted the door handle, turned the key and grabbed hold of the radio antenna.
Every time GM introduced a new car, car buyers would have to learn to drive all over again because none of the controls would operate in the same manner as the old car.
You'd have to press the "Start" button to turn the engine off.
Since then they have made glossies for an automotive version (along side their PDA version, Smartphone edition etc), though it isn't apparent that they've got many customers onboard.
So long as they stay the hell away from brakes and engine control I'm not too worried.
Engineering is the art of compromise.