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Thinking About the SnitchCam

Saint Aardvark writes "From Dan's Data comes a fascinating look at the consequences of tiny, wireless video cameras: "Right now, it's hard to prove that (for instance) riot police really beat the crap out of innocent people at a demonstration....Live streaming video from multiple cameras operated by lots of people at the same time, though, will be a different matter. Even without cryptographic jiggery-pokery, it'll be practically impossible to get away with even minor editing-room spin doctoring, if thousands of people around the world have the original footage on their hard drives." "

14 of 383 comments (clear)

  1. Vote! by BWJones · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Even without cryptographic jiggery-pokery, ..... Say, wha?????

    Seriously though, this does raise an important point, however, the real issue is not "is there evidence available", rather it is: "can we get access to the evidence?". There are lots of instances where the facts exist, it is just obtaining access and recent efforts as part of and independent of the revised Patriot Act will make it even harder for the general public to 1) have access to evidentiary information 2) remain anonymous when contributing evidentiary information and 3) avoid prosecution for retaining evidentiary information that might be "determined" sensitive.

    Remember to VOTE!

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  2. Torn by Enigma_Man · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Between the need to keep myself safe from injustice by documenting/recording everything, and massive invasion of privacy by documenting/recording everything...

    Can someone reason me out of this conundrum? Is there a way to have my cake and eat it too?

    -Jesse

    --
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    1. Re:Torn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Can someone reason me out of this conundrum? Is there a way to have my cake and eat it too?

      Sure, the problem is with eating your cake and having it, too.

      More seriously, my personal, non-legally-binding view is there has to be a clear, legal separation between areas with an expectation of privacy and areas considered "public." If a cop or a stranger can legally observe you from somewhere, then it doesn't matter if you replace a human with a camera.

      Within a person's home, you have the legal right to tape what you want but strangers do not and the police need a warrant. If you tape a cop beating you up and you show it, that is fine, if cops secretly tape you without a warrant they should be punished.

      Finally, a uniformed cop on duty in a public area (i.e. not in a restroom or in his own home) should have no expectation of privacy, since the uniform itself is a public display of his authority. By wearing it he consents to observation by the general public, so if he drags a motorist out of a car and starts pounding on him there should be no assumption that he won't see his sorry a** on the local news.

  3. It often hard to prove the Cops are innocent by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hey cops get accused of things all the time. It seems to me these cameras might cut both ways.

  4. Wehw! by MouseR · · Score: 5, Funny

    For a moment there, I read SnatchCam.

    1. Re:Wehw! by Faustust · · Score: 5, Funny


      I read SnatchCam too. But only for the articles...

      I swear!

  5. it will do shit-all by Pandora's+Vox · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In Quebec City, 2001, I shot 3 hours of DV footage. People getting surrounded and beaten up. An elderly woman having a cannister of CS-555 lobbed at her. It did nothing. Some of the footage was even plyed on tv. I guess it's not brutality if no-one's bleeding, right?

    -Leigh

    1. Re:it will do shit-all by francisew · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I might have been there (Quebec City), and have a similar tape. I especially love how riot police beat up mainstream journalists *first*, and then go after other people.

      I asked one of the cameramen that had been hit in the head with a baton how often this happened, and why this was done... He told me that it was very frequent. The cameraman being hit wasn't newsworthy. But once hit, the cameraman would have to retreat, leaving the police unattended by mainstream media to do as they wished.

      It's funny how things get misreported, even when the reporters themselves are getting injured before protestors cause trouble/damage.

      Then again, I have seen the odd protestor break windows for kicks in Montreal. In particular, people who don't seem to be interested in the protest at all, but who enjoy the havoc created.

    2. Re:it will do shit-all by francisew · · Score: 5, Informative

      Honestly, the people I saw causing trouble seemed to just be bored.

      Literally people who were walking down the street and decided to take advantage of the chaos to break things.

      They really didn't seem to need any motivation for causing trouble other than opportunity.

      I know that this is highly stereotypical, but most of the people who caused trouble were young punks. Literally kids dressed in punk outfits. People who live off the street. I have known lots of peaceful, respectable punks, but the majority of the people that I have seen causing trouble at protests have also been punks.

      The police provoke in a much less subtle way. They throw tear-gas into peacefully assembled crowds. They bring in riot police and advance on the crowd, beating them back. They have no need for 'agents provocateurs', because they don't get in trouble for openly provoking unrest.

  6. Rodney King by Norg · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It certainly could prove useful, but as the Rodney King tape proved, the context often does not get put into play with videos. It's not entirely certain that even 50 people will get the context of a situation recorded. I think the real bonus will be the hesitation of police to react with force in protest situations where everyone has a video outlet. A downside would be their hesitation to react with force when necessary.

  7. ... how amazing and awful ... by ninjagin · · Score: 5, Insightful
    The article combines aspects of two of my favorite books: The Artificial Kid (Bruce Sterling) and 1984 (George Orwell). I've recently re-read both of them. The amazing thing is that the snitch-cam concept may supercede so-called "reality TV". The awful thing is that people will inevitably use it to not only validate the conformity of others, but as a vehicle for a snitch-based cash income.

    When I was in London a couple years ago, I knew that I was on-camera everywhere I went and I felt safer. Part of that was because I knew that policemen were watching. I think that if I knew that the people watching and analyzing my behavior were just people with an axe of one type or another to grind, or goody-two-shoes types that want to force their morals on everyone, I'd feel less safe rather than more safe.

    Curiouser and curiouser, and doubleplusbad, methinks.

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  8. Re:Yah, that will be the primary use... by DoomHaven · · Score: 5, Funny

    Wait, that's not a legitimate use of cameras?

    --
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  9. "Open" systems are easier to legitimize by csoto · · Score: 5, Insightful

    With apologizes to Dr. Stallman, I'd like to point out that information systems to which everyone has access to the information it manages/monitors/etc. are less prone to abuse by bureaucracies or governments. Take "red light cameras," for example. These are foisted on municpalities under the auspices of "public safety" (e.g. fewer red light runners, ergo fewer intersection accidents). However, since the operation of these systems is typically obfuscated, these systems invariably become nothing more than revenue generators. Yellow lights are shortened, in order to increase the "catch." Never mind that this "forces" people to "run the yellow" and thereby increase the likelihood that there will be a ROW-induced collision.

    If everyone had some way to monitor exactly what these cameras saw, exactly how the lights were timed, etc. it would be dissected in public enough to prevent these sorts of scams. The same goes for "safety" cameras in public. If you saw exactly how much of an invasion of privacy a given camera amounted to, you would bet there would be fewer of them, and those that are allowed would better meet the specified purpose (instead of "once it's there, nobody will notice we're not looking just at what we said we were").

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  10. See "The Miami Model" by aristus · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It's a movie produced by some folks who were at the 20 Nov 2003 FTAA protest in Miami. By my count it shows 14 felonies commited by police officers, including refusing to identify themselves, shooting unarmed & non-violent people (in the head), random pepper spraying, etc etc and so forth. The raised fist of today usually has a camera in it.

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