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Ukraine Holds 4th Largest Programmer Population

andrewuoft points out this BusinessWeek article on the budding technology sector of Ukraine; the article points out that Ukraine has -- "after the U.S., India, and Russia -- the fourth largest number of computer programmers in the world" and that "Even today, scientific institutes each year churn out some 50,000 science or technology graduates. Not surprisingly, Ukrainians don't see why their country can't become a big player in the global technology market, like India."

6 of 301 comments (clear)

  1. Quality Not Quantity by derEikopf · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What the future of technology needs more than anything is the reversal of the quantity philosophy. More is not always better.

  2. Re:speak for yourself, object. by derEikopf · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Indeed, that is where people like Linus Torvalds make an odds-defying explosion into mainstream computing. However, there is more to my statement than just programmer population. Quality also refers to program quality. Not half-assed buggy software that was hurriedly released because of a dealine, and then half-assed patches and updates that were also released on a deadline.

  3. This is not serious! by Simonetta · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Should we seriously believe that The Ukraine has more computer programmer productivity and output than:

    China - 1.3 billion people and a booming economy with millions of students studying technology?

    Korea - where 1/4 of the people have at-home broadband, and like China, has millions of people working in the technology industry?

    Taiwan - where nearly everything technological that isn't specifically designed to kill people who don't shop at the Baby Gap is designed, programmed, and manufactured?

    Japan - With the world's second largest economy and a world leader in electronic R&D and embedded-systems computers?

    I think some second-rate journalist got an all-expenses-paid government tour and spent a lot of time with Hot, Available Ukrainian Brides-to-be
    and then wrote up this wild fantasy of Ukrainian computer mastery in order to get invited back on next year's government tour.

    We must not take these snow-jobs seriously.

    1. Re:This is not serious! by antoy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Get a hold of yourself.

      Have you ever been to Ukraine? I haven't, but I've been to Romania, a neighbouring country with the same mindset regarding computer programming. I was there for BOI (the Balkan Olympiad in informatics) and let me tell you that Romanians kicked our Balkan (and in other times international) asses. I'm not going to chalk this up to training and practice because they were awfully talented guys (and it would like I'm bitter, which I am not), but they *do* have an excellent education system which, as I've heard, would teach them about graphs and minimum spanning trees while we were being taught on using MS Paint on Windows 3.1.

      Is it a rich country? From what I've seen in Iasi, it's not. Do they know how to get there? Somebody in their Ministry of Education sure does.

  4. Contradicting the popular opinion by DataDragon · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've just gotten done reading the initial reaction of trolls and jokes about this.

    Ukraine does have quality engineers, does have better economics and less corruption than other CIS countries, and has been a considerable supporter of US interests (e.g., they dropped one of the highest levels of troops into Iraq for support. Even though, honestly, a country like that couldn't afford large military action, they did so anyway and I might add- with a level of political push considerably lower than others.)

    They are a society with European heritage, a large number of the population understands English, German, French, Italian, etc.) and for most Americans travelling to a typical "outsource" destination, Ukraine is both a familiar and not-so-culture-shocking destination (Compared, say, to China or India, for most Americans)

    I cannot say they don't have drawbacks, but I've researched the area heavilly and found that the people are much like the USA glory days -- preferring "Handles" and such, for fun mostly, and their display of individual pride. Here in old Silicon Valley, I'm corporate Borg. Getting sick of it.

    The organized crime aspects, well, I've had many discussions about that as well-- software isn't really their target, though. In most cases, its usually "competition" that drives the hostilities, and likewise, the vast majority of such cases are non-violent... just annoying (phone turned off, electricity cut, etc.) Like anywhere in the world, if you don't want trouble, don't start trouble. Respect goes a long way in those cultures.

    Personally, I'd jump at the chance to go to Ukraine myself. I think it would be rewarding and fun to help cultivate not only the economic flow, but to work with the people there.

    For those who are more politically inclined about how the Ukrainian air is going, the present Presidential Elections in Ukraine are showing a huge outpouring of support for the new candidate that wishes to bring Ukraine into the EEC.

    There aren't that many CIS countries that can say they are trying quite as hard to embrace the Westernized world by cooperation and with as little grandstanding as Ukraine is doing.

    Anyway, they aren't so bad: Wikkkipedia on Ukraine and they can ROCK too!

    Peace out. :)

  5. Skills by pipingguy · · Score: 3, Insightful


    I used to have a defineable, pretty unique skill. I can draw stuff as a draftsman on paper. My unique "skill" was pretty much killed by widespread CAD adoption. This major change didn't just affect me, it screwed quite a few hundred thousand other people that had decades of experience and knowledge.

    This is not really a problem as it will only take two or three generations of designers to adapt to the new technology. Death will eventually solve this problem.

    I could elaborate, but it's probably pointless to do so in this forum where computerization=cool.