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Interview with EA Attorney
An anonymous reader writes "Kotaku has an outline of a discussion with one of the attorneys handling the EA case. It has some interesting details, including the fact that if the judgment is in favor of the employees it will likely force the entire game industry, at least in California, to start paying OT and Comp. "Depending on the nature of a positive judgment, other employers with similar job descriptions would most likely be required to start paying their employees by the hour and paying overtime" The article also hints that other game industry cases might be forthcoming."
I have to admit, I feel kind of sorry for EA. As I've said before, EA seems to sort of be the scapegoat for all of the world's corporate woes. Sadly, I don't think that this will spur change from the whole industry, but rather imrpove life at EA (as is the point). Unfortunately, I don't think that this type of action will have the same effect at another company for two reasons: first off, they won't have as much press, and secondly it won't be such a novel idea anymore.
My support still stays with the employees of EA and the other companies that treat their employees like this.
- dshaw
The problem is of course that if the employees succeed but the judgement is enforceable only in California, all the gaming companies will simply move their operations somewhere more condusive to their business practices.
Which is not to say that the employees shouldn't be pursuing the matter but simply that attempting to change the employer's practices through a state court action might not, in the longer term, have the desired result.
A second issue is would such a judgement set good precedent that applies to the software industry in California as a whole. It would seem likely that it would have a fairly 'chilling' effect on the development industry in California if it did.
I assume that EA will complain about having to do that to compete or something like that ("We can't higher more because it's too expensive!"), but that doesn't bother me either. Sure programmers in SanFran or the Valley or LA are expesive, but a big part of that is because they have to be able to afford those exorbitantly expensive homes there. If they would create a division outside of Madison, WI or Wichita, KS or some other nice city with more reasonable housing prices they wouldn't have to pay programmers so much. "In-source" to rural America (I saw an article about it the other day). When a small house costs 100-200k and not 1-2m, you don't have to pay your programmers nearly as much for the same standard of living. In fact, you can pay them less, and they can still have a BETTER standard of living. And it's not like a programming team can't be located anywhere. Surf instructors may not be able to do their job in Kansas (relative to CA), but a programmer's location doesn't matter that much.
It's one thing if EA specifically told employees the kind of hours they'd be working, but it sounds like they didn't, which is basically exploitation to me. Sorry, they sound guilty and this sounds like a good thing.
Of course, I'm not a big fan of EA in the first place. Just FYI.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
I worked for a company founded by some EA guys, and also for another electronic entertainment company (run by non-EA people); I know something about this industry.
When I got hired, they were always upfront about the killer hours. I agreed to them because I wanted the work. I didn't do it for money: I wanted to do the job.
I worked 2 weeks straight (didn't go home) at one place; this was OK with me. I worked 3 weeks straight at another place. All voluntary.
The company was amazing to me because of the tolerance of all kinds of oddities -- as long as we were on schedule. This was in contrast to other environments that were less productivity oriented, where dress and hours were regulated. This matters: in one environment, you don't have nerf fights and your pay and hours are constant, regardless of productivity. In another, you have fun, but you take the schedule risk.
If I was a manager and people started talking "comp time" and "exempt", I'd point out: no dress code, no fixed hours -- just deliver the results when you said you would -- or quit, please, so that the rest of us can get on with the project.
Really, if you want comp time and overtime, you'd better get a job at the Post Office or in a Detroit-area auto manufacturer. Working in games? Negotiate your pay as if you'll be working 12 hours, seven days a week when you are behind schedule.
Personally, if there is going to be a lawsuit, why not one over the mental suffering caused when the publisher kills your title, and you see that a year or more of your work is worthless? That's got to be one of the most devastating work experiences I've ever had -- not the long hours.
http://www.thebricktestament.com/the_law/when_to_
Which is exactly why EA will do everything in their power to end the case with an out of court settlement. Note to those suing EA: Please, don't settle! Take it all the way.
Do not read this sig.
Amateurs give their work away. Professionals get paid for it. If you're working overtime, especially lots of it, and you're not getting paid or comped for it, you're not a professional, you're an amateur.
Look at your bosses, the board, the executives, are they working for free? No, of course not, if they're working more than 40 a week, you can be sure they are getting compensated. I've been in the industry for over 2 decades now and I have learned that if you're not getting paid for your overtime, you are going to get F***'d bigtime. If they are promising you comp time, but don't put it in writing, you'll never see it. Same with ANY promises of ANY kind of payoff later on, unless it's in writing (and even then count your fingers after shaking hands) you won't see it.
In short, people who regularly make you work over 40 and don't pay you for it are SCUM. They're ripping you off, and they know it. I've worked on some of the most 'gee-whiz' crap ever to come out of DOD or private industry. They never asked us to work 'killer hours' without paying us. Why? Cause people who work 'killer hours' are less productive than those who work only 40. And after two plus decades in high tech, I can say that's definitely true.
Because, as the Moderation FAQ says, Overrated is for a comment that has been moderated out of proportion.
I assume you believe that the "overrated" category should only be applied to posts that have been moderated-a reasonable viewpoint but one I don't agree with.
It's not simply that I believe that (I do) but that the admins have explicitly stated that's its purpose. I guess they don't care too much about the abuse potential though, since it's a pretty well known loophole.
Just because you can post at 0, 1 or 2 doesn't mean your comment is worth it...
Of course not, but that's why there are mods like "Offtopic". The original post here was on-topic and not in any way redundant. It could certainly be disagreed with, but modding it down was just abusive, plain and simple.